NewsMax: New documents prove WMDs, ties to Al Qaeda

http://www.newsmax.com/scripts/printer_friendly.pl?page=www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2005/11/16/122915.shtml">New Documents Reveal Saddam Hid WMD, Was Tied to Al Qaida

Recently discovered Iraqi documents now being translated by U.S. intelligence analysts indicate that Saddam Hussein's government made extensive plans to hide Iraq's weapons of mass destruction before the U.S. invasion in March 2003 - and had deep ties to al Qaida before the 9/11 attacks.

The explosive evidence was discovered among "millions of pages of documents" unearthed by the Iraq Survey Group weapons search team, reports the Weekly Standard's Stephen Hayes.

In the magazine's Nov. 21 issue, Hayes reveals that the document cache now being examined contains "a thick stew of reports and findings from a variety of intelligence agencies and military units."

Though the Pentagon has so far declined to make the bombshell papers public, Hayes managed to obtain a list of titles on the reports...

Topics headlined in the still embargoed Iraqi documents include:

*snip*

• Chemical Agent Purchase Orders (Dec. 2001)

*snip*

• Denial and Deception of WMD and Killing of POWs

*snip*

• Correspondence from to regarding information gathered by foreign intelligence satellites on WMD (Dec. 2002)

*snip*

• Secret Meeting with Taliban Group Member and Iraqi Government (Nov. 2000)

*snip*

• Possible al Qaeda Terror Members in Iraq

*snip*

While the document titles sound stunning enough to turn the Iraq war debate on its head, Hayes cautions that it's hard to know for certain until the full text is available.

It's possible, he writes, "that the 'Document from Uday Hussein regarding Taliban activity' was critical of one or another Taliban policies. But it's equally possible, given Uday's known role as a go-between for the Iraqi regime and al Qaeda, that something more nefarious was afoot."

*snip*

A part of me hopes desperately this is just some right-wing bullshitting. (I mean, it's NewsMax.) Another part realizes that the ultimate embarrassment would be for Bush to declare "We have proof of the WMDs", they go to the places the documents say they were stashed, and it turns out that under threat from the UN and/or US they were disassembled.

That being said, I would not terribly mind being wrong. the logical part of me grudgingly concedes it would be better for Bush to (shock, horror) have been right in this instance, in there actually being a point to all the death. My pride is not more important than the families of those soldiers, and those Iraqi civilians, who have died.

If it is true, I just hope the left can weather the political storm.

I am sure if you go back into the "news"max archive you will find other sensational claims that never panned out.

Read it again, the part after the link this time. :p

I don't think many of us here wouldn't have predicted that something similar to this would come up.

Remember the only way out for Bush is to be proven right...one way or the other...or, more appropriately, by hook or by crook. Mostly crook, I suspect.

They're bastards who will do anything to win, I know. But if (and it's a very big if) they're right...

Whatever they can find to fit their reasoning.

Rp

No way is NewsCrap-to-the-Max going to scoop anybody with a story this potentially explosive (pun intended).

That being said, it looks like you might think George W. & his flying monkeys might not have been lying.

Any more thoughts on your reasoning?

How did you track that target?

Read it again. I'm saying that while politically speaking it would be absolute murder for the rational side of the Force, if if if this turns out to be true, then at least all the families of the people who've died thus far would have some very, very, very cold comfort in that it wasn't completely pointless.

My entire post was wrapped up around the idea that we are sitting back and enjoying the MSM, and more of the country's population, finally starting to catch up and questioning the motives of the war. But considering all that's happened--4000+ US soldiers dead*, over 100,000 Iraqis killed, and probably something like a million wounded or maimed--for us to get this point, there shouldn't be enjoyment, just grim vindication.

And if, by some horrific twist of fate, it turns out that Bush was right, our egos are not as important as the truth.

That is all.

*Back in the earlier days of the war, a source--I cannot remember who, believe it was linked from Bartcop--said that the actual number of US dead could be twice as high as the official numbers say, as they were only counting, in those days, the soldiers who had been killed pretty much instantly.

Yes, I read your post again. I'm just amazed that anyone could hold out hope at this late date that these war deaths might not be in vain.

I guess that's because 1/3 of my HS graduating class (and 2 of my family members) died in the last crap war. They all died in vain. Every last one of them. And it's happening again.

Despair is arrogance.

"Confidence is the sweet spot between despair and arrogance" is one of my favorite quotes.

Here's the whole quote:

"Confidence is a sweet spot between arrogance and despair. Arrogance involves the failure to see any flaws or weaknesses, despair the failure to acknowledge any strengths. Overconfidence leads people to overshoot, to overbuild, to become irrationally exuberant or delusionally optimistic, and to assume they are invulnerable. That is what induces people to become complacent, leaders to neglect fundamental disciplines, investors to turn into gamblers. But underconfidence is just as bad, and perhaps worse. It leads people to underinvest, to under-innovate, and to assume that everything is stacked against them, so there's no point trying."

Call me arrogant, but I'm confident that George W. Bush is a damned liar.

If you understand there's an excellent chance that you will lose, be killed, etc., whatever, worry is not unexpected. Despair comes of certainty, that your fate is sealed. Even if everything seems to be turning against you, to assume a loss is to essentially say you know the future. Thusly, arrogance.

That was the philosophy behind The Long Defeat. The elves fought and fought and fought though it seemed a foregone conclusion that they would lose, though they could leave without a casualty if they wanted to, because not even Galadriel could see the future for certainty, and they might yet win it.

And they did.

That's literary, not historical, but I think it serves.

for outing herself.

Sign me up, I'm a believer!

Commission Report, which seemed to disprove both of those ideas.


On Edit: Sorry, replied to wrong message.

Lie faster than your opponent can possibly answer. They want the initiative at all cost. They can't play defense and they know it.

take on all comers from all sides anymore. They are too busy watching their own backs, and they have enemies from WITHIN their own party.

Ya can't circle the wagons very effectively when some of your number are consorting with the folks attacking the wagon train!

"We've had no evidence that Saddam Hussein was involved with September 11." - G.W.Bush 9/18/2003

And any 'new' evidence is going to be treated with enormous skepticism- or should be, like the man holding the bloody ax, over a body of a child chopped to pieces, saying " he tried to kill me- i had to protect myself"!!.


How many lies does a man have to tell before people stop listening???
Trust is something easily lost, and almost impossible to rebuild.

Um ... no. WMDs prove WMDs. New documents prove nothing ... except that there's a possibility of another forgery scandal. Isn't it convenient that they happened to find new documents that address EVERY issue BushCo is currently being pressured on? There has been no "proof" for over two years, then suddenly - *poof* - there's written "evidence" that parallels the GOP talking point checklist. Nothing was left out. Every question being asked by Bush's critics is answered completely by these new documents. :eyes:

If these alleged documents were authentic or relevant, you can bet they would have trumpeted them at the time.

Though I doubt, given the searches that were done and the evidence that was reviewed, they would have been able to miss these, or what they support.

Think about it. If Saddam actually had WMD, he would have used them. But Bush knew he hadn't and so couldn't. Apart from the troops in Kuwait reacting to the arrival of a few desultory missiles (non chemical) at the very start of the invasion, how often did we see US and UK troops advancing in full protective gear?

Moreover, if there were hidden WMD, why aren't the resistance using them now?

Paperwork is easily forged (and to make matters seem more plausible, a cache of planted WMD here or there might easily be planted).

And, yes, there are chemical weapons in Iraq. The US military are using them.

This report comes from the weird world inside Cheyney's head.

a bit!!!

New documents, my ass!! Newly created documents, more like!

Brought to you by the CHALABI FOR FEARLESS LEADER Document farm!!!

They have been trumpeting WMD charges for years. Stephen Hayes wrote an entire book on Iraq ties to Al Qaeda, many of the allegations were not supported by the 9/11 Commission or the Duelfer Report.

I think the public would just laugh. They've lost their credibility - suddenly finding Iraqi documents "proving" bush was right all along isn't going to get it back for them.

There's always "new" claims from the usual RW sources making these claims. They spew tham faster than they can be debunked. My question is always the same:

If this isn't total BS then why isn't even the WH pushing it? It's not like they have high standards.

pieces like the David Kay Report, the 9/11 Commission Report, etc.) claims that are being made by Newsmax? I am not trying to argue for them in a round-about way, nor am I trying to leap out at straws to protect my ego. If this becomes a major topic of discussion, I would like to know the facts for the opposition as well.

That one's worth a chuckle... not even worth my outrage.

And the bottom-of-the-barrel wingnuts are like Wiley E. Coyote.

Im' SERIES!

(NewsMax - Front-runner in shark-jumping PR.)

And to think these people believe their own lies.