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rusty quoin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:25 PM
Original message
God Damn America?
I didn't highlight anything, because I thought all of it was important.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_dallas_b_080419_god_damn_america_3f.htm

June 1963 to June 1965 I was pastor of First United Methodist Church in Fort Deposit, Alabama.

Lowndes County, Alabama, had at that time about 1,900 whites of voting age and around 2,100 registered voters, none of them black since Reconstruction. Yet there were over 6,000 blacks of voting age. A county Registrar told me they had one black farmer come to register, they handed him the forms to take home to complete, and advised him strongly not to bring it back, which he did not.


Black maids in Mobile at that time were being paid $6.00 a day, plus lunch and bus fare. Black maids in Fort Deposit got $1.50 a day and "tote," meal left-overs.



My wife hired a maid but we told her there was no way we could pay her less that $6.00 a day. She replied that she could not accept that. "If I did, the word would get out and I'd be the one to pay, not you. They'd take it out on me."


A black woman working as a maid five days a week could make $390 a year. If she worked 6 days a week, she would earn $468 a year. If she could not work and had three children, Alabama welfare would pay her about $500 per year.


In the local barbershop one Saturday, one farmer asked another why he had fired his new maid, since that maid had a reputation for being a hard worker. The former employer responded, "She wouldn't f-k me. Ain't about to have a nig-r work for me who won't f-k."


A man who served on a jury bragged that in a case where a black man had shot and killed another before over 100 witnesses the jury did not even retire to deliberate the verdict. They returned a "Not Guilty" verdict with the side comment, "Send him back to kill some more." Justice in Lowndes County and a number of other counties in Alabama depended on the race and social position of the plaintiff, that of the defendant, and that of the victim.


One week I learned a local member of my church (who never attended it) had sat in his car in front of the church with a machine gun because he had heard a rumor that a busload of blacks were coming to that church that past Sunday.


At that time, in the 1960s, peonage still existed in the rural South. A black tenant farmer in Lowndes County, according a group of whites there, had planned to sneak off and move to a tenant farming position in a nearby county. The landowner heard, rode on horseback to the tenant's house, called him out to the porch, and shot him in cold blood with a shotgun with impunity.


A white, married deputy sheriff was reported to have shot and killed a young black man because he had asked the deputy's black "girlfriend" for a date.


Before Bloody Sunday at the Edmund Pettus Bridge in Selma, I got a call from a Justice Department attorney. He asked if I would come talk to him and his partner in Selma about the conditions in Lowndes County. (The longest stretch of the Selma-Montgomery March was to be through Lowndes County.) I readily agreed to meet them, at his direction, at the Selma Holiday Inn at midnight Saturday night. "Don't go to the desk and ask for us. Don't park in the lot on our side of the motel, but on the opposite side, and come knock on our door."


I talked with them, told what little I knew about the County. As I readied to go home, one said to me, "If word gets out in the community that you talked with us, call the FBI. But don't call the Montgomery office (35 miles from my parsonage). Call the Mobile office (150 miles away), and ask for this specific agent. We know you can trust him."


The FBI agents at that time were often in collusion with the Ku Klux Klan and some Klan groups used the money paid to their self-chosen FBI informant to purchase weapons and dynamite.


The urban centers of the South and the North have a large number of black residents, many of them only one generation from Black Belt Southern counties, if not themselves from them. While urban areas tended to be less brutal, degradation and abasement was an everyday experience for blacks both North and South. Black boys from early childhood were constantly cautioned never to look a white woman in the eye. Black girls were reminded daily never to be alone with a white male.


The degradation, the brutality of those years are seared in the collective memories of the black community. Vestiges of those days still remain in the patterns of some whites toward blacks.


To add to these tragedies, the same, if a little softer, patterns of behavior were visited on poor whites, especially the tenant farmers and their families. Even worse, the poor whites were often convinced by those in power that their debased station was caused by blacks. As Will D. Campbell has asserted, "The white power structure stole the blacks' labor, but worse, they stole the poor whites' minds."


Also, the same sentiments, even the same words as those excerpted from Rev. White's sermons have been expressed for years on TV and radio by white preachers condemning America for allowing abortion, for permitting use of alcohol, for prohibiting King James Version readings in public schools, for teaching sex education, and endless other issues. We treat those as normal and understand from whence they come.

I would, as a white Southerner, amend Rev. Wright's words: "God has already damned America!" We saw and pretended we did not see. We heard and said nothing. We whites attended superior schools with textbooks while blacks in rural Alabama had only 3 months education a year, and that only to the 7th grade with no books. We ate the fruits of better education, of higher wages, of superior positions, and we were silent.


If God is just, S/He has already damned America!



Dallas A. Blanchard

United Methodist Minister (Retired)

Professor Emeritus, University of West Florida

11542 Clear Creek Drive

Pensacola, Florida 32514


850-968-6909


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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:28 PM
Response to Original message
1. K&R!!!!!!
:kick:
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:34 PM
Response to Original message
2. Rec'd! nt
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sorrybushisfromtexas Donating Member (416 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
3. K & R
At my small SBC church in Texas most of the congregation walked out because a black nurse pushed in our only wealthy member in a wheelchair and our member asked her to sit beside her.


I was 9, I am 58 and it still is a vivid memory.

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Bluzmann57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
4. Another rec
and it seems that some things haven't changed a great deal in some ways. The repubs are peddling fear against non caucasians to this day.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
5. There are no words. K and R. nt
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roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #5
65. Jim Crow sucked beyond words. African-American kids owe their
grandparents a HUGE debt.
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panader0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
6. Rec'd powerful stuff
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bluerum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
7. We all turned an looked away. And now all we want to do is forget. But every time
someone points out that it was wrong, it was IMMORAL AND WRONG what happened, it makes us remember. It doesn't matter if they are white or black or brown or a man or a woman. If they make us remember we get angry. We get angry and the hate comes back. And we want them to go away. So we can continue to look away.
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RufusTFirefly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 09:48 PM
Response to Original message
8. K & R: The GIGANTIC elephant in the room
Edited on Sun Apr-20-08 10:00 PM by RufusTFirefly
Until America acknowledges the full extent of its longstanding (and ongoing) racism, we as a country cannot fully heal.
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santamargarita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 11:02 PM
Response to Original message
9. God Damn The Republicans Who Did This To OUR Country!!!!
K&R
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DirtyDawg Donating Member (594 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. These weren't Republicans...
...these good-old-boys called themselves Democrats. Of course all that changed in the 60s and 70s. First they voted for Goldwater, then in 1980 they listened when Reagan told 'em they could be Republicans and never again have to feel guilty about what they and their daddies did to their black help.
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santamargarita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 08:06 AM
Response to Reply #10
16. True, but I never considered these racist bastards Democrats!
They are traitors to this country just like every republican!
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #10
34. Today they would be Republicans
Many of them switched parties in the 60s and 70s.
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NOLALady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:13 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. Oh MY.
The Republicans had a lot of help from the Democrats.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 08:46 AM
Response to Reply #9
20. this predates party.
this is nothing compared to the disproportionate sacrifice that was paid by africans (not yet accepted as americans) to build this country in the first place. for 300 years the trees bore strange fruit.
thomas jefferson is quoted as saying- Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just.

i can only reflect that god is make believe. or doesn't give 2 shits about america. how else would we exist today?
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nichomachus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 11:47 PM
Response to Original message
11. It wasn't just the south
In 1959, I was in high school. I entered a speech contest put on by some local service organization. The city I lived in, about 50,000 people, had very few blacks at the time, probably about six or eight families -- and they were pretty well known.

One of the other contestants was a black female high school student whose family lived about a mile from mine. They lived in a nice neighborhood. I don't know what her parents did, but they seemed to be about the same economic status as my family.

During a break in the contest, my folks were talking with the black student's mother and she mentioned that they might have to leave early because they needed to take the bus home. We offered them a ride, since we lived so close. They accepted.

Later, some other friends suggested we go to a local hotel restaurant, one of the nicer places in town at the time, for "coffee and dessert." We asked the black students and her mother if they'd like to come along.

The mother hesitated for a few seconds and then said "Oh, we can't do that -- black people aren't allowed in there."

I almost fell over. I had no idea. My parents were also surprised. Of course, we didn't go. We took the student and her mother home, as we had said we would.

This wasn't in the south. It was in Massachusetts.
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raccoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #11
50. Thank you. nt
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SeattleGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:37 AM
Response to Original message
13. Excellent article!
And oh, so very true!

K&R!

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ClayZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 07:10 AM
Response to Original message
14. K and R
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GOPBasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
15. Incredibly powerful. K & R! n/t
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Apollo11 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 08:31 AM
Response to Original message
17. I agree with Obama's decision to condemn Pastor Wright's statements.
Edited on Mon Apr-21-08 08:36 AM by Apollo11
It is not easy for me to understand why some people believe that there is a "God" who influences events on Earth.

Nevertheless, I cannot see how this story proves that it is OK for a preacher to say "God Damn America".

I agree with Barack Obama's decision to denounce a number of Pastor Wright's statements.

we've heard my former pastor, Reverend Jeremiah Wright, use incendiary language to express views that have the potential not only to widen the racial divide, but views that denigrate both the greatness and the goodness of our nation; that rightly offend white and black alike.

I have already condemned, in unequivocal terms, the statements of Reverend Wright that have caused such controversy. For some, nagging questions remain. Did I know him to be an occasionally fierce critic of American domestic and foreign policy? Of course. Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in church? Yes. Did I strongly disagree with many of his political views? Absolutely - just as I'm sure many of you have heard remarks from your pastors, priests, or rabbis with which you strongly disagreed.

But the remarks that have caused this recent firestorm weren't simply controversial. They weren't simply a religious leader's effort to speak out against perceived injustice. Instead, they expressed a profoundly distorted view of this country - a view that sees white racism as endemic, and that elevates what is wrong with America above all that we know is right with America (...)

As such, Reverend Wright's comments were not only wrong but divisive


http://www.barackobama.com/2008/03/18/remarks_of_senator_barack_obam_53.php
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butterfly77 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #17
38. We don't care...
this isn't an issue...But,this is for me

The past two months, the actions and words of Hillary Clinton have gone from being merely disappointing to downright disgusting. The debate last week was the final straw. I've watched Senator Clinton and her husband play this game of appealing to the worst side of white people, but last Wednesday, when she hurled the name "Farrakhan" out of nowhere, well that's when the silly season came to an early end for me. She said the "F" word to scare white people, pure and simple. Of course, Obama has no connection to Farrakhan. But, according to Senator Clinton, Obama's pastor does --
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cyndensco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #38
53. Her use of Farrakhan SHOCKED me
And her mention of Hamas' message was equally as reprehensible.
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Kitty Herder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 08:32 AM
Response to Original message
18. K&R
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 08:39 AM
Response to Original message
19. Harriet Beecher Stowe said it best at the end of Uncle Tom's Cabin:
This is an age of the world when nations are trembling and convulsed. A mighty influence is abroad, surging and heaving the world, as with an earthquake. And is America safe? Every nation that carries in its bosom great and unredressed injustice has in it the elements of this last convulsion.
322

For what is this mighty influence thus rousing in all nations and languages those groanings that cannot be uttered, for man's freedom and equality?

O, Church of Christ, read the signs of the times! Is not this power the spirit of HIM whose kingdom is yet to come, and whose will to be done on earth as it is in heaven?

But who may abide the day of his appearing? "For that day shall burn as an oven: and he shall appear as a swift witness against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger in his right: and he shall break in pieces the oppressor."

Are not these dread words for a nation bearing in her bosom so mighty an injustice? Christians! every time that you pray that the kingdom of Christ may come, can you forget that prophecy associates, in dread fellowship, the day of vengeance with the year of his redeemed?

A day of grace is yet held out to us. Both North and South have been guilty before God; and the Christian church has a heavy account to answer. Not by combining together, to protect injustice and cruelty, and making a common capital of sin, is this Union to be saved,—but by repentance, justice and mercy; for, not surer is the eternal law by which the millstone sinks in the ocean, than that stronger law, by which injustice and cruelty shall bring on nations the wrath of Almighty God!

http://www.iath.virginia.edu/utc/uncletom/utfihbsa45t.html
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sinkingfeeling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 08:49 AM
Response to Original message
21. One of the reasons I proudly have this bumper sticker on my cars:
"God FORGIVE America"!
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jjr5 Donating Member (317 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #21
24. I think Americans need to forgive one another though
Or else the wrong doing will continue.
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murielm99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #21
64. That is a far better message.
Rather than being the elephant in the room, we need to acknowledge the pervasiveness of racism in our society, and try to renew ourselves through our shared values (the rights enumerated in the Constitution). We have to forgive ourselves and move toward a better future.

I like your bumper sticker.
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
22. K&R n/r
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mcollier Donating Member (887 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. Not This Time...The plan to change Washington...
The relentless attempt of the "Powerful" to create distraction, separation and division by use of racial suggestion is the oldest tool in the art of war
against ordinary people. Rise above this, look to something new, something better, something real, something good.

Recognize the ability of Barack Obama to bring people of all backgrounds together for the betterment of our Country and our World...
Unfortunately, the same tool of racism is being used to try to destroy what we see can be....

Hard working Americans who have done their homework love this plan...

Please read: http://www.barackobama.com/pdf/ObamaBlueprintForChange.pdf

The special interest hate this plan, and that is why the media is telling you not to consider Obama....
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 09:24 AM
Response to Original message
25. This should have 3x as many recs as it does.
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Window Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 09:39 AM
Response to Original message
26. I have a neighbor who's up there in age. He saw his father lynched as a child in the South.
K/R.


:kick:
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wowimthere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
27. Wow! Terrific post. Truth isn't pretty.
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Irishonly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 09:57 AM
Response to Original message
28. K&R
Powerful. It's one of the most powerful comments I have read.

I grew up in Des Moines. When I was in elementary school a black girl also attended. Her mother started a Girl Scout group. The first meeting I was there and no one else came. In time about three or four other girls came. As a child I didn't understand why.

When Rev King was assassinated my parents grieved as did the nation. My mom told me about her trip to the south in the 1940s and how shocked she was how blacks were treated. My mom was not one to keep silent and her friends spent most of their time dragging my mom out of places before she got into too much trouble. Although there are a lot of incidents affecting my life, these two have always stood out.
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proReality Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 10:00 AM
Response to Original message
29. K&R
Bravo Rev. Blanchard!!!
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kentj44 Donating Member (110 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 10:27 AM
Response to Original message
30. i know you won't
believe this but i listened to the tape at least 100 times and what i'm hearing is the pastor saying god damned america,there is a difference in the way the message is heard.
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L0oniX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
31. Most excellent.
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greyghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
32. K&R!
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
33. K&R and Forwarded
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SaveAmerica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
35. I can't wait until the time when more Americans of every color and station are able to understand
each other better. We need to open our eyes and look at our fellow man and realize what has happened in their past has brought them to their today. I've only recently started looking at an Obama presidency as more than a way to right the Bush Administration's mess, but a way to go deeper into the American psyche and make changes that will ripple forward in ways that will change this country for the better.
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1monster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 12:07 PM
Response to Original message
36. Thank you for this. I was in a tenth grade class last week that was
Edited on Mon Apr-21-08 12:09 PM by 1monster
watching a video performance of A RAISIN IN THE SUN.

Toward the end of the show, one of the main characters was acting out for his family how he would bow down in a "Yes, Massa, You da Man" type act of desperation and one of the student laughed at it. When I looked up, I realized that the girl laughing was black.

When the video ended, I took a few minutes to tell the whole class about what racism was like to the eyes of an 18 year old who had just moved south from a very white farm country area. While I had been aware that racism existed (there were a few small episodes of petty racism that I had witnessed), I was very innocent as to what it was really like.

I was truly shocked by the conditions the black community lived in, infrastructure in black neighborhoods blatently neglected, the use of pejoratives, the overt disrepect, and the fact that all but one black person I saw in those first years that I lived in the south worked in menial jobs: maids, kicten workers, garbage collectors, custodians or janitors, etc. The one black man I saw who didn't have a menial position was an assistant manager in a grocery chain, and he was very much the token black who had to defer to every white person on the staff...even those whose positions were nominally inferior to his.

I don't think any of them really got it. It was "ancient history" to them since it happened twenty or so years before they were born.

I wanted them to know what had come before because there are still those who would take us back to the past.

This article was far more eloquent than I could ever be in painting a word picture of the huge racial divide in this country not all that long ago.
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PaucorumHominum Donating Member (3 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 12:19 PM
Response to Original message
37. Profanity inappropriate
Since the Underground's own published "standards" prohibit personal attacks and profanity,
why then do posts such as this one violate the DU standards?
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #37
41. A word from the parsimonious
who has just eaten a raw persimmon.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #37
42. How is this a personal attack?
:shrug:
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 12:31 PM
Response to Original message
39. There are so many elephants in the room it is hard to breath ... kr
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
40. Here's a story about how recent things of a vile racist nature are:
Katrina.

That's it in one word, Katrina.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
43. When I was about 10 years old (mid 60s)
My dad had a meeting at our house of the board of an organization he chaired. One of the board members was a black man.

Next day our next door neighbor saw my dad in the yard, came over and asked 'who was that nigger' he saw at our house.

My dad said 'Oh I meant to tell you. We sold our house to him.'

That neighbor never spoke to my dad again in all the years we lived there. :rofl:
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #43
44. I just fell in love with your father.
It is always fabulous to realize how some of the daddies out there had real wisdom in their souls.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #44
51. He was a pretty wonderful man
My dad was a teacher and had summer afternoons off. We had an amusement park in our city back when I was a kid and once a year my dad piled as many of us and the neighborhood kids we could squeeze into our car and took us to the amusement park for the day.

Then one summer when I was about 12 it was almost time for school to start and I realized we had not yet been to the amusement park. So I asked my dad when we were going and he told me he was sorry but we couldn't go there anymore. Then he explained that the park had refused to let black kids come there and he just couldn't support the place anymore because of that.

Years later I read a newspaper article about this. Apparently the black community pressured the park owners to allow them to come to the park but the park refused. A few brave prominent white citizens complained to the city and the park but the policy remained. Eventually the park gave the blacks one day a week to come and most of the white folks stayed away from the park on that day.

Just a few years later, the park went out of business. I have no idea why but I like to think the place had bad Karma and deserved whatever happened to shut it down.
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #51
55. Pm'ing message.
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BunkerHill24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. Rec'd #100

:cry:
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Stump Donating Member (808 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
46. K&R
What a powerful post...another example of "the hypocrisy."
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JDwho Donating Member (339 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:54 PM
Response to Original message
47. God is just, yet he gave us free will. This is man's doing
When is man (and woman) take responsibility for our past. It is truly America's shame. Man's free will. God is just, and allows us to commit atrocities, for now.
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ChristianDemocrat1 Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
48. "Damn" = "Punish the sins of" --- a legitimate Bible message
Edited on Mon Apr-21-08 02:50 PM by ChristianDemocrat1
This is very classic language of biblical preaching:
From the Prophets: who were famous for calling upon God's punishment (damnation) against the sins of Israel and ancient nations.

From John the Baptist: who called the celebrity religious leaders of his day (Pharisees & Priests) a "brood of vipers" saying to them, "Who told you to escape the wrath (God's damnation) to come."

From Jesus: who said, "Woe (God's damnation) unto you Chorazin, woe (God's damnation) unto you Betsaida, for if the miracles that had been done in you had been done in Sodom & Gomorra they would have repented... but they shall stand up in the judgment and condemn (damn) you on that day."



"God damn America" simply means "God punish the sins of America"
And the Biblical concept of God punishing (damning) sins is so that 1) good people can be set free from the oppression of bad people AND 2) bad people can (hopefully) be brought to wake up and change their ways to become good people.



And that message is no different than that of celebrated American preachers since Americas inception. Remember, "Sinners in the hands of an angry God," the famous Puritan sermon from the time of America's founding.

I have listened to a fair number of Jeremiah Wright's most flamboyant sermons on YouTube, the ones containing the most controversial remarks, and I found nothing that offended me. Of his messages, whatever did not stir within me a hearty "Amen!" served to stimulate godly contemplation of a difficult subject - and that's a good thing, too, (perhaps even Wright's godly goal).

(BTW, I am a quiet, middle aged, Midwestern, deeply religious, socially & theologically conservative white man who is well received in a variety of local churches with whom I am involved. While no one but Jesus is perfect in words, Jeremiah Wright, I believe, is to be highly commended for his work and words).
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
49. Still not enough rec's.
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Pappy Donating Member (113 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 02:15 PM
Response to Original message
52. So what good are you doing by pointing out what our party used to do? Don't cling to the past
Just because the South was dominated by racist Democrats doesn't mean that our party is like that anymore. The future is now, and the past, well that was a long time ago.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #52
54. Racism still exists
Racists are just more discrete now.
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RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #52
62. how the black vote moved from Republican to Democrat
in 1927 there was a big flood on the Mississippi. Herbert Hoover was president. He didn't send in any federal agents or money to help out the people in Lousiana and elsewhere who were stranded because of the flood. Some moved to higher ground on levee and were stuck there without food or water for days.

Finally, some "powers that were" started rescuing ppl off of that levee. They took the white people and held off black people at gunpoint. A lot of those were forced to rebuild levees and lost their lives... they were shot or they drowned accidentally in the course of the work. The people who did that back then were also probably really good christian men like Blackwater's Eric Prince. Didn't stop them from being evil bastards back then either.

A lot of black people left the south and went to the midwest, where the racism wasn't quite so bad... better, at least, to say no to going back to what was.

Hoover was running for president in 1928. The Franklin D. Roosevelt democrats, also known as social democrats in western Europe to this day, took the "voting block" that was the African-American community who stood with Republicans because of Lincoln. If you think there are parallels between Hoover and Bush, you're right. Let's hope Jr. doesn't bring on another depression. I'm not holding my breath on that one, however.

Let us hope if the republicans have created another economic atrocity, we have a leader of the caliber of FDR.

The Republicans have never won back those African-American votes because they have never deserved them. In the meantime, the Republicans DID make a conscious decision to appeal to white racists in this nation. It is no accident that, to this day, the southern slave holding states are now the ONLY solidly republican portion of this nation.



Yes, we are going forward. I wouldn't hesitate to remember and reconnect with the good parts of the past, frankly, since the Roosevelt social democratic party, with a super majority, is the ONLY, THE ONLY, THE ONLY administration to win a war in this nation since WWII. The only administration in this nation to view human rights as equal rights and act upon that with power. The only govt to take seriously the idea that democracy is more important than capitalist's already-overflowing stock portfolios. (Reagan and the Bush twins wars against small, relatively defenseless nations does not a war win make...that's theatrical war paint for civil war reinacting among the jerk offs.)

So, in order to go forward, you have to know about and learn from the past, or else the b.s. artists will continue to lie and use racism's hard heart to bring everyone down. The south, like Germany, has to learn to live with the horrors of its past. Germany has done a better job of it, imo, because they at least ADMIT what scumsuckers their ancestors were and have implemented economic and social policies to guard against another convulsion of hatred and racism. They don't try to pretend that, now that Hitler is gone, fascism is still not a potential threat and thus they cannot pretend it never happened.


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Caretha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 07:40 PM
Response to Reply #52
66. I don't recall
the word "democrats" in the OP's thread. Me think thee doth protest too much. Get it? I do.
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MISSDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 03:19 PM
Response to Original message
56. And some people have the unmitigated gall to pretend to be
outraged by what the Reverand said!
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 03:34 PM
Response to Original message
57. I suggest your post subject should read, "God has damned America." Thanks to the greedy
and racist republicans.
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UndertheOcean Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 03:47 PM
Response to Original message
58. K&R
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
59. If there is a just God in heaven, getting one's just desserts is just a matter of when, not if
PS Should there be a just God in heaven, ever wonder what just desserts might be in store for those professing to love Jesus and follow his teachings all the while supporting junior's pre-emptive war and the carnage, destruction, and torture that go with the territory? :D
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swimmernsecretsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
60. I had to read this in bits and pieces.
It was just too hard to read in one go. I thank you for reminding us of where we've been, and the hard road some of our elders had to walk to get there. I want us to keep moving.
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Vattel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
61. nice post
When you see an individual perpetrating a horrible injustice, it is often natural and unobjectionable to yell, "God damn him!" It's an expression of moral outrage. Well wake up Americans. Our country has perpetrated horrible injustices. If it is unpatriotic tp feel moral outrage and to express that outrage in repsonse to our country's failures, then screw patriotism."
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PanchoBass Donating Member (24 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 05:56 PM
Response to Original message
63. kick n/t
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MISSDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-22-08 03:24 PM
Response to Original message
67. As someone said and I paraphrase (probably) "when I reflect that
God is just, I tremble for my species".
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