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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 03:38 AM
Original message
Bacteria Not Flu Killed Most In 1918
http://www.motherjones.com/blue_marble_blog/archives/2008/08/9177_bacteria_not_fl.html

A new study in Emerging Infectious Diseases concludes that bacteria not influenza killed most people in the 1918 flu epidemic. The lesson: stock up on antibiotics for the next flu pandemic—bird flu, horse flu, or otherwise.

New Scientist reports that researchers sifted through first-hand accounts, medical records, and infection patterns from 1918 and 1919. They found that bacterial pneumonia piggybacked on surprisingly mild flu cases. And the victims didn't die fast. A supervirus would have likely killed them in three days. Instead, most people lasted more than a week and some survived two weeks—classic hallmarks of pneumonia. Most compelling: medical experts of the day identified pneumonia as the cause of most of the 100 million deaths—the most lethal natural event in recent human history. Other research suggests the brutal mechanism. Influenza killed cells in the respiratory tract, which became food and home for invading bacteria that overwhelmed overstressed immune systems.

Ten years later, penicillin overpowered bacteria in subsequent influenza epidemics. But nowadays we're having those nagging antibiotic problems.

So health authorities are increasingly interested in the role bacteria will likely play in the next pandemic. Yet little action has been taken. "They are just starting to get to the recognition stage," says Jonathan McCullers, infectious disease expert. "There's this collective amnesia about 1918."

Julia Whitty is Mother Jones' environmental correspondent, lecturer, and 2008 winner of the Kiriyama Prize and the John Burroughs Medal Award.
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nebenaube Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 04:29 AM
Response to Original message
1. gee...
I thought it was conclusive that the 1918 flu crossed the blood-brain barrier and decerebated the brain-stem... Any pneumonia that hastened death was probably a blessing.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 04:32 AM
Response to Original message
2. K&R very interesting and informing.....where is our current team to head off the next biggie?
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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 05:17 AM
Response to Original message
3. Surprisingly mild flu cases?
People without symptoms could be stricken suddenly and within hours be too weak to walk; many died the next day. Symptoms included a blue tint to the face and coughing up blood caused by severe obstruction of the lungs. In some cases, the virus caused an uncontrollable hemorrhaging that filled the lungs, and patients drowned in their body fluids (pneumonia). In others, the flu caused frequent loss of bowel control and the victim would die from losing critical intestinal lining and blood loss.

In fast-progressing cases, mortality was primarily from pneumonia, by virus-induced consolidation. Slower-progressing cases featured secondary bacterial pneumonias, and there may have been neural involvement that led to mental disorders in a minority of cases. Some deaths resulted from malnourishment and even animal attacks in overwhelmed communities.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Flu#Patterns_of_fatality


Piggybacked bacterial pneumonia did play a role in some, but not all, cases. This was no mild strain of the flu.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 07:40 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. indeed -- but this is going to set off a misunderstood firestorm around here. nt
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #3
14. You are correct it wasn't mild. My grandmother used to tell
my sister and I stories of this, she called it the "bloody flux" because they spit up blood right before they died, and she said they died in just days most of the time. She spent a lot of time sewing shrouds to buy them in. I don't buy this article.
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. EDIT I meant "bury" not "buy". Duh.
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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-08-08 03:28 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. I knew what you meant.
I've heard chilling stories like that from grandparents.
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raccoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
5. Off to greatest! nt
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formercia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
6. Pneumonia Vaccine.
I was having problems with Pneumonia following the Flu and viral infections until my Doctor ordered a Pneumonia Vaccine for me. No problems since.

It's what kills most people in the end. Get it and you may live a lot longer.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
7. Damn. This changes everything.
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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 11:13 AM
Response to Original message
8. My first hand oral history project data contradicts this study's finding
Edited on Thu Aug-07-08 11:20 AM by HamdenRice
Many years ago, I wandered around southern Africa gathering oral histories from elderly black South Africans. Many did not know their birthdays, so we would use the flu epidemic as a rough dating device.

People who had survived the epidemic called it by a Dutch/Afrikaans name, "drie dag" (three day) or "drie dae" (three days), and they said that was because if you got it, you either died in three days or you survived.

The study, however, says:

"A supervirus would have likely killed them in three days. Instead, most people lasted more than a week and some survived two weeks—classic hallmarks of pneumonia."

But my point is that in South Africa, it seems it overwhelmingly killed in 3 days, suggesting, as the study says, a very virulent virus. Of course, I'm sure many survived drie dag and died of pneumonia as well.
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progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
9. Sure, stock up on antibiotics
But, which antibiotics?
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
10. Although penicillin was "discovered" in 1928, it did not become widely available
until the end of WWII: shortly after its discovery, the discoverer did begin using crude preparations of it to treat infections in some patients in the London hospital where he worked, but a great deal of work was needed to isolate and test the active agent and to provide industrial scale manufacture

So it is somewhat misleading to claim that "ten years <after the flu pandemic> penicillin overpowered bacteria"

The first "wonder-drugs" were the sulfa-drugs, which were widely used during the WWII era


http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,850206,00.html
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3874/is_199901/ai_n8844382/pg_1?tag=artBody;col1
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
11. I think there were two phases of the deaths from infection -
some went down almost instantly from what is a called a cytokine storm; the immune reaction goes into overload and destroys the body. Others lingered and were taken down by opportunistic bacteria. Ironically, it was the young and strong who were most likely to die from a cytokine storm!@
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The Blue Flower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. That's what I read
nt
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mrs_p Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
13. here is the original article
http://www.cdc.gov/eid/content/14/8/1193.htm

as a scientist in training, i think it is always best to read exactly what researchers say and look over their data (though, i do love mother jones). i have to get back into the lab but will sift through the article later.
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shenenebrown Donating Member (11 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
16. Interesting
Pneumonia is scary.
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elleng Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 09:01 PM
Response to Original message
17. The story in my family
has been that my grandmother (Dad's mother; he was 5 at the time and the baby of the family, and he's 94 now!) caught the bug as a result of caring for others who were sick; she died therefrom.
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