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The Noose Tightens: Rumsfeld, Ashcroft and other top Bush officials could soon face legal jeopardy.

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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 03:18 AM
Original message
The Noose Tightens: Rumsfeld, Ashcroft and other top Bush officials could soon face legal jeopardy.
Edited on Sat Dec-27-08 03:19 AM by Demeter
http://www.newsweek.com/id/176044

By Jonathan Tepperman

December 19, 2008 "Newsweek Web Exclusive" --- The United States, like many countries, has a bad habit of committing wartime excesses and an even worse record of accounting for them afterward. But a remarkable string of recent events suggests that may finally be changing—and that top Bush administration officials could soon face legal jeopardy for prisoner abuse committed under their watch in the war on terror.

In early December, in a highly unusual move, a federal court in New York agreed to rehear a lawsuit against former Attorney General John Ashcroft brought by a Canadian citizen, Maher Arar. (Arar was a victim of the administration's extraordinary rendition program: he was seized by U.S. officials in 2002 while in transit through Kennedy Airport and deported to Syria, where he was tortured.) Then, on Dec. 15, the Supreme Court revived a lawsuit against Donald Rumsfeld by four Guantánamo detainees alleging abuse there—a reminder that the court, unlike the White House, will extend Constitutional protections to foreigners at Gitmo. Finally, in the same week the Senate Armed Service Committee, led by Carl Levin and John McCain, released a blistering report specifically blaming key administration figures for prisoner mistreatment and interrogation techniques that broke the law. The bipartisan report reads like a brief for the prosecution—calling, for example, Rumsfeld's behavior a "direct cause" of abuse. Analysts say it gives a green light to prosecutors, and supplies them with political cover and factual ammunition. Administration officials, with a few exceptions, deny wrongdoing. Vice President Dick Cheney says there was nothing improper with U.S. interrogation techniques—"we don't do torture," he repeated in an ABC interview on Dec. 15. The government blamed the worst abuses, such as those at Abu Ghraib, on a few bad apples.

High-level charges, if they come, would be a first in U.S. history. "Traditionally we've caught some poor bastard down low and not gone up the chain," says Burt Neuborne, a constitutional expert and Supreme Court lawyer at NYU. Prosecutions may well be forestalled if Bush issues a blanket pardon in his final days, as Neuborne and many other experts now expect. (Some see Cheney's recent defiant-sounding admission of his own role in approving waterboarding as an attempt to force Bush's hand.)

Constitutionally, Bush could pardon everyone involved in formulating and executing the administration's interrogation techniques without providing specifics or naming names. And the pardon could apply to himself. Such a step, however, would seem like an admission of guilt and thus be politically awkward. Even if Bush takes it, civil suits for monetary damages could still proceed; such cases, though hard to win, are proliferating. Yet most legal scholars argue that a civil suit would not the best approach here. Neuborne calls it an "excessively lawyer-centric" strategy and says judges are extremely reluctant to award damages in such cases. Conservative legal experts like David Rifkin (who served in the Reagan and first Bush administrations) argue that no accounting is necessary, since the worst interrogation techniques, like waterboarding, have already been abandoned and Obama is expected to make further changes.

A growing group of advocates are now instead calling for a South African-style truth and reconciliation commission. Kenneth Roth, executive director of Human Rights Watch, says that although "we know what went on," "knowledge and a change in practices are not sufficient: there must be acknowledgment and repudiation as well." He favors the creation of a nonpartisan commission of inquiry with a professional staff and subpoena power, calling it "the only way to definitively repudiate this ugly chapter in U.S. history."

But for those interested in tougher sanctions, one other possibility looms. Michael Ratner, president of the Center for Constitutional Rights and author of "The Trial of Donald Rumsfeld," points out that over 20 countries now have universal jurisdiction laws that would allow them to indict U.S. officials for torture if America doesn't do it itself. A few such cases were attempted in recent years but were dropped, reportedly under U.S. pressure. Now the Obama administration may be less likely to stand in their way. This doesn't mean it will extradite Cheney and Co. to stand trial abroad. But at the very least, the threat of such suits could soon force Bush aides to think twice before buying plane tickets. "The world is getting smaller for these guys," says Ratner, "and they'll have to check with their lawyers very carefully before they travel." Jail time it isn't—but it may be some justice nonetheless.

I'M EXPECTING THE WHOLE ENCHILADA, MYSELF. THE REVENGE OF THE BOOMERS, THE CULMINATION OF THE 60'S.
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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 03:25 AM
Response to Original message
1. K&R
Most interesting.

I'm all for justice!

:patriot:
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ihavenobias Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #1
25. Ditto.
Edited on Sat Dec-27-08 02:07 PM by ihavenobias
K & R
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Lil Missy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 03:29 AM
Response to Original message
2. kick for later ...
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ZombieHorde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 03:40 AM
Response to Original message
3. K&R
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 03:45 AM
Response to Original message
4. 5 Recs before 4 AM! Lot of Insomniacs Out There!
Visions of sugarplums and war crime and treason trials dance in my head!
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Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 04:31 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. One more rec.
More good journalism from Newsweek.

For those of you who don't know the background in the Maher Arar case, you can start here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maher_Arar
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azmesa207 Donating Member (327 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #6
65. War Crimes trials
will never happen against the out law Bush Regime
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Norrin Radd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 03:47 AM
Response to Original message
5. kr
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 04:34 AM
Response to Original message
7. a simple start point to unravel the whole deal is to ask why we invaded Iraq, and exclude propaganda
no talk of terrorists, WMD, or spreading democracy: who lobbied for the war and what did they hope to gain? Did they get it? If so what should we charge them for using our military as a smash and grab operation?

That the war was about oil is irrefutable, but so rarely spoken of in all but the most fleeting terms that John McCain actually apologized for telling the truth and saying the Iraq War is about oil.

The last fig leaf the Bushies have is the media keeping alive the asinine talking point that they are ''misguided idealists'' or they were just trying to hard to protect the country. It was nothing of the sort. They are thieves. At a minimum, they exploited our shock and paranoia after 9/11 to pursue personal gain. Every word they said publicly about Iraq was an insincere sales job, a con to trick us into letting them have the keys to the greatest war machine in history.

Until this can of worms is pried open, their sins will lack context and the motive will seem more benign than it actually is.
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #7
38. It doesn't start with Iraq, or with 9-11. It starts
Edited on Sat Dec-27-08 07:38 PM by Jackpine Radical
with Cheney's super-secret Energy Policy meetings. We don't know much of what wnt on in those meetings, but we do know that they were already dividing Iraq up among the oil companies as if it were a freshly slaughtered carcass.
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nashville_brook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #38
42. that's the "first cause" -- that was the reason for the rest.
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mucifer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 04:50 AM
Response to Original message
8. They are above the law. Nothing will happen to them.
It's a nice dream tho.
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #8
19. That's not true and you know it.
We're going to make this dream a reality.
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #19
43. We're going to make this dream a reality"
No, we will not. The people that profited from this war will walk away richer than ever before. That is why impeachment is off the table.
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #43
53. "No, we will not." YES WE CAN as Obama said.
The battle for women's rights took a long time, but it was eventually accomplished.
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PatrynXX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #8
40. Need Seagal from 1987 right away
"you guys think your above the law, you aren't above mine" :)
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Dangerously Amused Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 05:09 AM
Response to Original message
9. Call me a fool, but I harbor a deep and abiding hope that we - and they - will taste justice.

K&R.

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Sherman A1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 05:32 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Agreed
I am with you there. I may be dreaming, but I too have hope.


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OneBlueSky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 06:06 AM
Response to Original message
11. these guys will never be prosecuted, much less convicted . . .
it would all be so, well, unseemly . . .

and Bush himself? . . . not a snowball's chance in hell . . . America doesn't punish its former presidents for what they did in office -- no matter how odious . . .

guilty as they are, and much as they deserve it, it's simply not gonna happen . . .
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cabluedem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. And like with Nixon, respect for the law will plummet to all time lows. nt
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #11
20. "Not gonna happen" keep saying it over and over again. You're not gonna stop it from happening.
Nor are you gonna stop us from making it happen.
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #20
44. Ok, I will, "not gonna happen"
Nixon didn't pay for his crimes, neither did Rayguns or Poppy Bush. W will never see the inside of a court room (or a House investigative committee).
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #44
49. So you KNOW they won't. You KNOW we won't be successful.
Can you tell me if I win the lottery this week, since you can apparently see into the future?

:eyes:
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #49
61. just ONE congressman...
(Kucinich) brought up impeachment. Several times, as a matter of fact. Each time Pelosi basically told him to shut up and sit down. Only a couple other reps stood with him, the rest just sat there on their complicit asses and did nothing. Could DK go to the media and try to get the people to voice their opinions to their reps? No, because the media ignored him more than Pelosi did. As far as investigating his predecessor, Obama will not do this. It will be pushed aside "for the good of the country". Do I agree with it, no. Do I want this admin to get what it deserves? Yes. But putting on rose colored glasses and trusting that a politician will do the right thing will not get it done. The public has spoken on more than one occasion. The public was ignored.
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notesdev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 06:10 AM
Response to Original message
12. Ashcroft is probably clean
Misguided or no, he believed in what he was doing and that he was standing on the principle of law. That Gonzales guy, on the other hand, made a total mockery of the duties of the Attorney General position. Trying to get Ashcroft to sign papers while he was in ICU was just beyond the pale, IMO.
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OnyxCollie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #12
18. Ashcroft is not clean.
Ashcroft was the one who took down the "wall" between federal agents and local law enforcement. Warrantless wiretapping done under the looser FISA standard to conduct "signals intelligence" in a "time of war" was shared with local law enforcement. The USA PATRIOT Act also changed the "primary purpose" of FISA (conducting foreign intelligence) to a "significant purpose".

http://www.fas.org/irp/agency/doj/fisa/ag030602.html

Ashcroft might be the shiniest turd in the bowl, but he's still a piece of shit.
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Senator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 07:25 AM
Response to Original message
13. There Is Still PLENTY Of Time For Impeachment
It could be over (with or without resignations) in a few days.

The good it would do for our once-great nation -- http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Senator/16">by unifying us, promoting moral diplomacy, easing trade/economic problems -- are immeasurable. It could save us from generations of internal and foreign policy strife.

Don't think so? Ask the "Good Germans" about their experience.

---
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #13
21. Yes Senator. We still have time.
Edited on Sat Dec-27-08 12:25 PM by Independent_Liberal
Trying to convince others of that is going to be very hard though. You're right, just threaten it and we could have: 1. Cheney resigns for "health reasons." 2. Bush appoints someone like McCain, Giuliani, or Thompson as VP. 3. Bush resigns. 4. Replacement VP takes over and oversees the transition until 1/20/09.
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #13
45. "Still PLENTY Of Time For Impeachment"
didn't you hear the (2 year old) news? Impeachment is off the table.
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #45
52. That doesn't mean we should stop demanding it.
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Senator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 04:45 AM
Response to Reply #45
56. Putting it back on the table could save Pelosi, Obama, Reid, and...
...others from having to face their own war crimes tribunals.

And that takes no time at all.

---
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
15. K&R n/t
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Champion Jack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 09:26 AM
Response to Original message
16. K&R Nice work
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formercia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
17. Truth and Reconciliation Commission?
Edited on Sat Dec-27-08 11:42 AM by formercia
I used to think it was a good idea to deflate tensions but what happened in South Africa changed my mind.

The boys had already lost Rhodesia and they knew they had to do something otherwise the great South African prize would be lost forever.

They recruited a prisoner by the name of Nelson Mandela and gave him a choice to cooperate or rot in prison.

The boys kept their fortunes and the poor in South Africa, both Black and White, are still poor.

As a reward, they made Mandela a Knight of Malta.




Now, isn't that precious?


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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #17
67. Kick
So sorry I was away. This deserves a huge RECOMMENDATION.

Damn, a picture doesn't even need any words sometimes.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
22. AFTER prosecution and conviction I might consider truth and reconciliation.
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stubtoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
23. I hope they get careless, decide to travel, and end up getting busted
in one of those 20+ countries who are willing to do the job for us.

How embarrassing that we won't do it ourselves.
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northernlights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
24. I'd like to see all of them renditioned
and taken to faraway lands to "not" be tortured.

I won't really be satisfied with anything less than prison garb, chains and dogs.
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whoopingcrone Donating Member (92 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #24
32. okay, but skip the dogs, please.
The methods and procedures used in creating attack dogs
are also forms of cruel and unusual punishment... for the dogs.
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
26. Rec. no. 40.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
27. yada, yada, yada
this will amount to nothing, just like all of the other crimes along the way
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. It will amount to nothing if we do nothing.
I can tell you that.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. and it will amount to nothing if we pour our tears, sweat, and cash into it
just like everything else over the last 15 years. Nothing is going to change in this country until hate radio is taken off the air in a permanent fashion.
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 04:15 PM
Response to Original message
30. Can't happen soon enough...
I still say the Hague is what it's about! The * Criminals are afraid of the Hague...and with good reason.
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no limit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
31. Can anyone explain to me why pardons shouldn't have to be done prior to election day?
The idea that a president can pardon after election day seems insane.
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TripleKatPad Donating Member (241 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
33. Wish I could believe justice is coming for the BushCo
I've seen nothing to make me believe it will happen. I have seen everything to believe it will not. JMHO.
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 12:05 AM
Response to Reply #33
50. I've seen some developments that give me...
...reason to believe it will happen. They're hard to see. You got to really look carefully.
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peace frog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #33
59. GMTA
As right as it would be, as much as we yearn for it, justice is not coming.

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faulknercindy Donating Member (75 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 05:59 PM
Response to Original message
34. Don't Hold Yer Breath..
Bushie will pardon the lot of them.
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #34
51. Pardons CAN be undone...
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 06:15 PM
Response to Original message
35. If Bush pardons them for torture,
could the DOJ go after them for violation of civil (or human) rights? I know that is how the Feds got around the Southern all white juries that acquitted people for murder of civil rights workers.
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Dystopian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
36. KandR. Thank you for posting. eom.
peace~
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earcandle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 08:01 PM
Response to Reply #36
41. That's okay.... I guess it is okay... is it?
We'll just be known to be stupid and cowardly, or continue to
be terrorized by our own leaders into a coup that hands off
our country to a different group of new world order leaders
that do not recognize our constitution, our land rights, our
votes, our books, our principles, our laws and our boundaries.

ON TV, I hear the kids blaming the Boomers, as if individuals
have anything to do with the collective programming of our
economy, or had a choice if they did know.  Hey, jobs left, we
needed to get something for our labor.  We got credit cards. 
Now we got debt.  Now our labor is cheap.  Or gone.   

How are the kids going to stay human, care about humanity, if
they cannot have a reality they can trust and count on.  How
can we keep them from wanting to punish or hurt us for
destroying their world, if history doesn't show that it took
less than 5% of the population of the meanest men and women in
the world who did all of this?  THIS WAS NOT THEIR PARENTS.   

Yea... I remember asking Europe to step in, in a poem I wrote,
just before 911.  It would be good if someone with knowledge
of the law, and the army to back him up, can stop the security
mercenary troops from protecting these criminals.  Have our
payroll taxes been developing our own enemy forces, and could
Blackwell and his crowd take over our country? Because our
army or defense is non-existent? If they are really running
things, that explains a lot.  

Are we a powerless, whiny, Third world country now? 

I am having a Rachael Maddow moment.  Will somebody please
talk me down?  
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tclambert Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 06:46 PM
Response to Original message
37. We have a wonderful opportunity here to prove no one is above the law.
It would be a tragedy to squander it. It would also be a tragedy to send the opposite message to the future.
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Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
39. Justice indeed
Happy to rec
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
46. "Revenge of the Boomers"
Let's expect it into reality. :toast:
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 10:11 PM
Response to Original message
47. K&R 67!
how sweet justice will be... hoping & praying.
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nankerphelge Donating Member (995 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-27-08 11:34 PM
Response to Original message
48. Nothing short of orange jumpsuits for the lot of them...
is acceptable.
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donheld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 01:48 AM
Response to Original message
54. One can only hope
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 02:40 AM
Response to Original message
55. If Bush doesn't pardon them, Obama certainly will
It is part of that "reaching out" process. Perhaps we could them on a float for the Inaugural, for healing sake's.
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rambler_american Donating Member (565 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 08:31 AM
Response to Original message
57. Kicked
and would recommend, but

Error: you can only recommend threads which were started in the past 24 hours

d'oh
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mwb970 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
58. I want these criminals held accountable for their actions.
Is that too much to ask, Barry?
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 09:43 AM
Response to Original message
60. They're Gonna Get It
Edited on Sun Dec-28-08 09:43 AM by Dinger
And many here who say that nothing will happen to them will be proven wrong. I'm liking that!:toast:
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
62. Hey Newsweek- STOP QUOTING CHENEY AS A CREDIBLE SOURCE
Vice President Dick Cheney says ....


:eyes:
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Joey Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
63. Question
Question: Constitutionally, does the VP have the authority to approve torture as Cheney now publically states he did? Since when does a VP have that sort of authority? Other than casting a tie breaking vote in the Senate and being ready to assume the presidency if necessary, I don't think the VP has any other constitutional authority. Therefore, I feel that Cheney violated the constitution. Should he not be investigated and possibly stand trial? And how crazy will it be if Bush really issues a "blanket pardon" for his entire administration? I don't think that's ever happened before in the history of this once great (before Bush came along) country.

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Senator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 08:45 PM
Response to Reply #63
66. Answer: Of Course Not
There exists no "authority," constitutional or otherwise, for any official to violate US Law (US CODE: Title 18,2441) or US treaty obligations (Geneva 1949: common article 3); in other words, to commit recognized war crimes.

But yes, "crazy" is the word for this reality and any cowardly "blanket pardon" attempt; which would itself be a criminal act in furtherance of the conspiracy to commit torture and war crimes.

The only thing "crazier" is the DC-Dems' failure to object/impeach over these publicly documented atrocities, committed in the name of our once-great nation.

Their failure defecates on the memory of our greater generations who fought and died to forge these basic moral and legal standards of humanity.

Impeachment remains our ONLY moral, patriotic option.

--
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Joey Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-08 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #66
68. I agree! nt
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-28-08 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
64. ' ........ there must be acknowledgment and repudiation as well'
Edited on Sun Dec-28-08 03:56 PM by higher class
Does this sound familiar?

During the impeachment of President Clinton, the corporate networks and their guests used this on Bill Clinton.

There was a mantra in three parts that went on for two years; one following the other. They were drummed into every conversation and update which was 24/7 on tv, especially FOX, CNN, MSNBC and often CNBC (since NBC, CBS, and ABC were busy bringing the rest of the nation some corporate news along with their serials and sports).

First it was = JUST COME FORWARD,
then JUST ADMIT IT,
then JUST SAY YOUR SORRY.

It was relentless until the final vote in the Senate.

(I particularly remember Adrianna Huffington taking part in the bombardment. It would be very easy to find a clip of her pitching in and doing her part.)

It's interesting to learn that acknowledgement and repudiation is the name for the tactic.

Even though Republicans made acknowledgement and repudiation into a joke with these mantras relative to a lie about a personal act that had nothing to do traitorism or illegal terrorizing, the loyalists will now fight against acknowledgement and repudiation being asked of their beloved lords who brough peace and safety against Moslems.

When are people going to wake up to the real America under these Republican overlords? My lost America. So hard to get back now to the point where we were at one time - making progress on justice and fairness, sometimes too slowly.

The majority of the people want justice and fairness, an unstolen vote, their Constitution and Bill of Rights. A Military that is there for Defense. Not sweeping people off the street without telling anyone, without legal representation, with denial to those who are trying to help, with lies, and all for profit and benefits for a few.

Money raked in by Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and the top mound of people who acted as operatives on behalf of their baron owners - that money might allow many to stay in their houses and get their pensions back. How much is owed the tortured and tormented. A pardon is more torture.

We've been through a grand series of thefts, torture, torment. And now justice is lost with a few words from an idiot who never earned his office, who got in by the machinations of thieves?
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