How many DUers here have seen actual combat?

If it's too personal a question, I'm sorry.

But I'm wondering, do you believe if most Americans actually knew what it was like, would their be less support for military action and spending?

ANd would it force the administration to be more careful of where they send people?

but probably more spending. This administration doesn't care what the people think.
For those keeping track: Viet Nam 69-70 Scout Dog-On Point

Take your pick. Vietnam.

On edit: Sorry, did not read all the question. If 45% of the upper-levels of the Bu$h regime had seen duty, and maybe combat, in Vietnam, we would not be in Iraq now. Period. This is a cabal of wannabee warriors. Never did it the real way so they do it the surrogate way. In fact, I was one of those assholes' surrogates in Vietnam.

I was in the Navy during the fall of Saigon. My ship assisted in the evacuation of South Viet Nam but I was fortunate enough not to be personally involved in a shooting situation there.

I was shot at as a cop several years later but that's different. Most of the people I know who have been in combat (father, several friends who served in Viet Nam) are pretty clear eyed about the cost. Most supported Desert Storm I in 92. All supported the invasion of Afganistan as an attempt to root out Al Quida. Some supported the invasion of Iraq.

Mac

On edit: Welcome home sailor (my apologies, too!).

I cannot understand how anyone could fail to see what a horrible mistake invading and occupying Iraq based on a pack of lies was/is.

Where ya been? Member since July 2003 and this is your 4th post! Don't ask me why, but for some reason your name stuck out like I had remembered seeing it. You should feel honored, I don't remember what I ate for lunch, but for some reason, remembered you from July. HAHA. Good to see ya again.

:(

"How many DUers here have seen actual combat?"
No, but I have seen up close and personal the effects
on people I love and cherish. They are wounded
in a soul sense forever.
Not to mention the physical wounds.
No one should ever experience that type of trauma.
EVER.

"if most Americans actually knew what it was like,
would their be less support for military action and spending?
Yes! Far too long, Americans have bought the Hollywood
romanticization of War. The average person would not
be able to stand the reality for more than five seconds.
I think the cure for the ignorant people who support someone
else enduring battle reality is to send them to experience
it themselves. somehow, I think that would shut them up
rather quickly.
"And would it force the administration to be more
careful of where they send people?"
Yes. If more people were aware of the reality of battle
and the damge it does to the human soul, that would
put an end to anyone sending anyone else to go.

I sincerely doubt the people who send people to
war would last a day in the reality of war.

BHN

Bush has completely sanitised the war in Iraq. If the American people truly saw the horrors of the war both to the military and the civilians we wouldn't be there right now.

Thank you for serving our country.
By speaking out as a person who has
actually seen battle, you are doing the greatest
service possible to America at this time in history.
(((Hugs)))
BHN

2001 and 2002 as a helicopter pilot. If more people in the administration knew what the rigors of combat were, there would be more judicious planning and thinking about whether or not war is the absolute, final answer to deal with a political crisis. That's one of the reasons I support Kerry.

I don't know about the support for the spending. I can see both sides of the argument.

Figured you were due, since you had welcomed all the others. :toast:

I can not begin to imagine what combat is like. My Grandfather fought in World War II in the North Africa, Sicily, and Italy. You could not get him to talk about the War beyond the earthquakes in Italy. That is all he would talk about. But the expression on his face was pain. I can not ever know what Combat is like, I was shot and paralyzed when I was 16. But, I have read and studied a lot of History on World War II and other actions the United States has been involved in, and I can say if I was in the position of our current leaders I would not be so readily to send soldiers to die.

My gramps was in WWII also. He was a pilot in Europe. He volunteered to fly the CG-4 Waco gliders in the Invasion of the Rhineland. Fortunately he has been very good at recounting his experiences. He's a very good writer and public speaker. He's also been an amateur photographer since his teens, so he has hundreds, if not thousands, of WWII pictures.

Well he was in Monte Cassino, Salermo, and his beginnings in the war was seeing the Kasserine Pass action. Those battles were as bad or worse than Operation Overlord and the Battle of the Bulge. I wish he had talked more before he died but I can understand why he did not. He was a line man in the signal corps. He was infront of the front lines stringing wire. The only thing he would say is he lost buddies when they got shot off poles and other things while trying to repair and lay communications lines. He has numerous pictures from Rome and other Italian cities.

Our generation has not really seen that much in the way of horrible battles. We were born on the heels of Vietnam, our memories of miltary action and battles are Grenada, Panama, and the Kuwait conflict. All of them were cleansed down. Even the faulkland conflict was cleansed so we never saw the horrors of what happened.

his desire not to talk about it. The other battles you mention were bad but Monte Cassino is heartbreakingly worse---particularly for those in forward positions.

My father fought for two years with the 3rd army infantry in the Korean war. He refused to talk about his service as well except that seeing children suffer (starvation, death and prostitution) nearly killed him. Your last statement hits the nail on the head.

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

I think Clark expressed, most eloquently, the theory that if the * admin. had ever actually served, they'd me much more reluctant to send our kids off to war. I personally think Clark is absolutely brilliant, and I hope we have him as a public figure for our side for a very long time.

For what that's worth.

An estranged meth addicted boyfriend shot Crystal Devries as she was walking out of class. Turned to flee, noticed she was still alive, shot her again killing her instantly, and then ran. He was tackled and caught by other bystanders.

however, forty-five years after it happened I still clearly remember rolling out of my rack on the USS Lexington to "Boots and Saddles" being piped into our compartment and the rush when "General Quarters, General Quarters,This is no drill" was added. Middle of the night and we were preflighting planes, loaded with nukes, and spotting them on the cats. After months in the Taiwan Straits and listening to Peiping Polly warning us we were going to be "blown out of the water" the pucker factor was immense. The knowledge that those friends of yours that were aircrew were going to head into Red China and probably not come back certainly focused our attention. That is why I continually warn people that a draft may follow the next election if the Neo-cons retain power. The thought of losing someone you care for, be it father, mother, brother, sister, son, daughter, or in the case I just cited, friends and shipmates, WILL focus your attention.
My 500th post.

The fact that most people will never have to fight in a war makes it easier to send others. I had to go because I was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Vietnam April '67 to March '68. I was in the Tet offinsive in 1968. Too much to tell here.

Most people believe that war in inevitable I think.

If we were invaded I think a lot of people would pick up a gun but we seem to think that we are protected from that so we are insulated from the horror of war.

seen as a paramedic for over ten years. I am not a big fan of guns. Still haven't seen an intruder shot. Mostly domestic quarrels and kids palying with parent's guns. Anyway I want to extend gratitude to those that served and have courage now to speak out against this war. You are all heroes in my book.

In 1985, I was woken up in the middle of the night to 'THIS IN NOT A DRILL! General Quarters, General Quarters, all hands man your battle stations!'

My station, as a phone talker in the Pilot House, meant that I was standing in the dark, wearing my gear, and couldn't see or hear a thing... The word was put out that a Iranian fighter had locked on us, launched a missile, but the EW boys 'spoofed' it and it didn't come anywhere near us.

In 1987, I was in the Gulf when the USS Stark was hit... we arrived on the scene hours later, and I worked as part of the boat crew ferrying supplies and personnel over to help save the ship...

So, have I seen combat? I don't think so; but I have seen the aftermath.

Army 101st Airborne in the mountains North an West of Hue.

RC

Desert Shield...not much action at all...welded to the pier...

I saw 4 months in Afghanistan in late 2001 and early 2002. I think there would be MORE support for spending on euqipment, etc., but less support for this administration's use of military power.

Lai Khe Big Bloody One

Peace

while serving as an election specialist in South Africa. I spent 5 months in Johannesburg in the leadup to the first all-race elections in 1994. All hell broke lose in those months. Thousands died during this period. The NAC and the Independent Election Commission (of which I was a employee) were the 2 prime targets for the right-wing factions. Buildings were blown up daily, planes shot down -- many civilians, politicians, journalists, and election workers lost their lives. As ugly and difficult as the transition to democracy in SA was, it was certainly not in vain -- a stark contrast to Iraq.

when I served.