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durutti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:39 PM
Original message
What's this about mustard gas in a barn?
And long-range missiles -- are these the same ones that the Iraqis agreed to destroy before the invasion started? And who's this Charlie Dolfer (sp?) character?
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Orangepeel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. The mustard gas in the barn was in Libya
but it just goes to show that them A-rabs is sneaky. :eyes:

I don't know who Charlie is.
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guitar man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. What gets me
is that they keep acting like they didn't know Libya had chemical weapons until Libya "volunteered" the info. after the Iraq invasion. Bullshit. It is no secret that Libya used chemical weapons against Chad back in 1987. Who do they think they are trying to fool?
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leftyandproud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 09:01 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. yeah but...
We didn't know where the weapons were...and Lybia sure as hell wasn't ready to give them up until they sensed their ass on the line. Quadaffi aint stupid...he prefers to keep his power.
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guitar man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. What I don't get
is that they keep acting like they didn't know Libya had chemical weapons until Libya "volunteered" the info. after the Iraq invasion. Bullshit. It is no secret that Libya used chemical weapons against Chad back in 1987. Who do they think they are trying to fool?
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guitar man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:57 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. damn dupes
the damn thing tells me i couldn't post the message,so I did it all over,then it tells me the editing period has expired.
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Orangepeel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
2. The mustard gas in the barn was in Libya
but it just goes to show that them A-rabs is sneaky. :eyes:

I don't know who Charlie is.
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texas1928 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Barn
Not just a barn but a turkey farm in Libya. Can't you just hear Cheney and Powell in the other room on the mike to his ear piece going "SHUT UP STOP SAYING THAT!!!"
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Ripley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:48 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. LOL!!!!!!!
I was absolutely screaming with laughter! I usually don't watch the idjit, but I HAD to tonight. He was doing his comedy routine.

"We broke up the network at the turkey farm that had mustard gas!"
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VelmaD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
17. He certainly wasn't making it clear...
that it was in Libya and NOT Iraq.
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FloridaPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:47 PM
Response to Original message
4. Yes to the missles. And to paraphrase a lot of people
when did mustard gas become a WMD???
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HornBuckler Donating Member (978 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. I'd Say Mustard Gas A WMD
It's Definately A Gnarly Ass Toxic Agent Capable Of Killing Many - Still, I Find This Turkey Farm Comment Ridiculous.

Mustard Is Good On A Turkey Sand However! :)
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mike1963 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. No, it is not a WMD. There are no WMDs except nuclear. That lie has
been thrown around for a few years now. It's VERY difficult to kill a large number of people with chem agents (or bio) and virtually impossible to do so without suffering 'friendly' casualties as well.
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bleedingheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:55 PM
Response to Original message
8. wasn't that how he basted a turkey or something...
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sasquatch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 08:59 PM
Response to Original message
10. He's still trying to sell people on WMD bullshit
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OBrien Donating Member (243 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
13. perhaps a turkey sandwich with mustard?
?
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texas1928 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. if you eat enough
Mustard you can get mustard gas. :hurts:
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truth2power Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 09:08 PM
Response to Original message
15. He was rambling.
Edited on Tue Apr-13-04 09:09 PM by truth2power
I was trying to take notes and I got something about "mustard gas in a turkey farm." WTF is he talking about?? I was laughing my a$$ off.

edit: typo
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GMessori Donating Member (3 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-13-04 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. Was anyone paying attention?
What he said was that Libyan authorities guided them to a significant amount of a chemical agent called "Mustard Gas". In fact, underneath that turkey farm was tons of Mustard Gas. He used that to illustrate the fact that there may still be WMD in Iraq, and until we search all of Saddam's cupboards, we don’t know WHAT there MIGHT be.

Merriam-webster online dictionary defines Mustard Gas as follows:

Main Entry: mustard gas
Function: noun
: an irritant vesicant oily liquid C4H8Cl2S used especially as a chemical weapon

Further refrence can be sourced elsewhere on the internet, I have included a brief synopsis below.

Mustard gas is the common name given to 1,1-thiobis(2-chloroethane), a chemical warfare agent that is believed to have first been used near Ypres in Flanders on 12th July 1917. Its chemical formula is Cl-CH2-CH2-S-CH2-CH2-Cl

Its other names include H, yprite, sulfur mustard and Kampstoff Lost, but the name mustard gas became more widely used, because the impure "agent quality" is said to have an odour similar to that of mustard, garlic or horseradish. When pure, it is in fact both odourless and colourless. It was synthesised much earlier than its first reported use, by a man named Frederick Guthrie in 1860, who reacted ethylene with Cl2, and noticed the toxic effects it had on his own skin. (1) The effects of mustard gas exposure include the reddening and blistering of skin, and, if inhaled, will also cause blistering to the lining of the lungs, causing chronic impairment, or at worst, death. Exposure to high concentrations will attack the corneas of the eyes, eventually rendering the victim blind. Any area of the body which is moist is particularly susceptible to attack by mustard gas, because although it is only slightly soluble in water, which makes it difficult to wash off, hydrolysis (the splitting of a compund by water) is rapid, and occurs freely.
It is important to note here that not only are mustard gas and hemi-mustard both vesicants (blister skin), but the hydrolysis reaction also produces three molecules of HCl, which in itself is a skin irritant.Despite the ease of hydrolysis, mustard gas in its solid form has been found to last underground for up to ten years. This is because, in an environment where the concentration of water is relatively low, the reaction pathway is able to proceed once, thiodiglycol is formed using most of the water available at the solid surface, but then the sulfonium intermediate reacts with this instead of another molecule of water, as the concentration of water molecules at the bulk surface is now lower than the concentration of thiodiglycol. This produces stable, non-reactive sulfonium salts, which form a protective layer around the bulk material, and therefore prevent further reaction.Mustard gas is a paticularly deadly and dehabilitating poison, but its real danger when it was first used in WW1, compared to other chemical warfare agents at the time, was the fact that it could penetrate all protective materials and masks that they had available at the time. In more recent years, urethane was discovered to be resistant to mustard gas, and also to have the advantages of being tough, resistant to cut growth, and to be stable at a wide range of temperatures. One of the reasons that exposure to mustard gas must be prevented, rather than cured, is that detoxification is quite difficult due to its insolublity, and that the effects of mustard gas are devastating - essentially if the inhalation of the mustard gas itself does not kill you, it is very likely to cause cancer later in life. During WW1, doctors were fairly helpless for treating victims, as the only means of detoxification was by oxidation with hypochlorite bleaches - NaOCl- and (CaCOCl-)2 (a super-chlorinated bleach) were most commonly used. Detoxification is no longer such a problem, as there are several methods developed in recent years which are quite efficient. Both sulphur amines (sulphur dissolved in amines)and magnesium monoperoxyphthalate have been found to quite good decontaminants, but, the best method is the use of peroxy acids (RCOOH, where R=C7H15, C9H19, C11H23, C13H27 ), as they react within a few seconds, and this rate of reaction can be enhanced further by use of a catalyst. It had already been shown that the sensitivity of the bone marrow of mice to mustard gas is similar to that of humans, and therefore resarch lead to clinical trials, and nitrogen mustards became part of modern chemotherapy treatment, being mainly used as a cure for cancer of the lmyph glands - Hodgkin's Disease.




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