Blackhawk to visit our school

Was just informed that a Blackhawk helicopter will land on our playground in a few weeks. The pilot will have a special talk with the fifth graders. I e-mailed the principal and asked if we could show a few recruitment films as well. I really dislike a lot of things about the school I work in. This tops the list.

the army used to bring tanks and apc's to a local grocery store parking lot and let kids climb all over them.

... this time around.

:-(

But that's freaking cool. I loved when my parents would take me to the park where the tanks and planes and all the other army stuff was. It was awesome to see that junk.

it is an effort to acclimate children to living in a police state

it is a bad sign
Also means they are planning enough wars to need more eager recruits for at least 8 more years (when today's fifthe graders reach enlistment age)

A very bad sign.

That is what Bush has ground the US into. This action only further gives this credibility.

I wonder, how many Americans would be so supportive back last year if they recognized that this little adventure would carry on for generations......when will it end - under Bush, there is no endgame.

Acclimate children to live in a police state?

Please make the connection between the UH-60 Blackhawk visiting a bunch of schoolkids for a day about exploration, and police-state acclimation.

that's not a picture of a Blackhawk.

It's not a Chinook visiting the kids. Chinooks are WAY cooler than Blachawks.

We had High school Graduation speakers that demanded allegiance to Nixon and his American way. No thank you.

My turn to be sorry: are you in the fifth grade?

This isn't a trip with your parents to see an exhibit of military hardware. This is the hardware landing in a grade school's playground, and the military addressing impressionable children without the mediation of their parents.

It's not cool. It's fucking sinister.

the pilot will be addressing 10 and 11 year olds -- They can't vote, they can't serve in the military and i deeply doubt they will want to go out and 'bag' some arabs when they get home.

And once they hit puberty their view of the world will change dramatically. So at 10 they may want to be a military helicopter pilot, but at 16, they want to be a proctologist or an actor or something.

If it was an 8 hour visit every other day for 2 months, then yeah, it would be sinister. but that's not the case.

So yes, let's be realistic: what's the point of this exercise, if not to imprint upon their young minds a recruitment message that the "military is cool"? And the earlier the youth are told this by such overwhelming displays, the harder it will be to dissuade them later in life.

It's Joe fucking Camel, with an assault rifle.

and helicopters, military or other wise, are pretty "cool", but that's neither here nor there. Soldiers are one part of the group that you're taught at an early age are a vital part of society: Doctors, Cops, Firemen and Soldiers. Kids aspire to be one of these.

but is this really a recruitment tactic or just an idea concocted by someone who thought the kids would enjoy it?

When i was in the 5th grade, some cops came by with drug dogs. I have my doubts that the underlying reasons for the visit was to recruit future NARC operatives just on the premise that we would get a free dog and a gun.

but anyhoo...

with an overwhelming display of military hardware?

Even if it's "just an idea concocted by someone who thought the kids would enjoy it", my worry is for the impression it leaves upon impressionable minds.

If I were a parent with a child at this school, and I knew this was coming, I would strongly object to the principal and keep my kid out for the day.

Spot ON, Minstrel Boy. Spot on.

The point is to let them see a helicopter up close, and get to walk around it and sit in the cockpit.

The indoctrination begins AFTER you enlist. Starting with the hideous haircut...

It's one thing for your parents to take you to a museum or plane graveyard. I grew up in Dayton, Ohio, home of the US Air Force Museum at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, and yes, it was indeed cool to go there as a kid and look at all the old war machines. That's a part of history, and it is important, and my parents made a conscious choice to take me there.

However, having a Blackhawk land in the playground isn't much different from Bush's flight-suit-stunt of May 1st, 2003. It's propaganda, and it's a powerful recruitment tool. I personally think the whole thing sucks.

Sheesh, if I were a parent, the last military position I'd suggest to my child would be that of Chief Warrant Officer. Dangerous as hell...

Even today, being anti-Iraq war, and anti-bush administration, I would still freaking love it if a blackhawk helicopter decided to land in my backyard and then talk to me about serving in the military. So long as they stay away from my rose bushes.


Seriously, if these kids have good parents, they'll know the difference between accepting the job the military has to do, and blind faith and devotion and needing to go overseas to kill people. If not, it's just a consequence of the society we currently live it. I cannot be asked to protect other people's children, I do not want anyone else telling me how to protect mine, I am only responsible for looking out for my kids and making sure they are informed.

I agree, really. If I were in 5th grade, I would surely find it wicked-cool to watch a Blackhawk land in my playground.

At the same time, I'm not in 5th grade, and I just don't care for the imagery being forced upon schoolchildren. I'm of the "Keep the Kids as Far Away from the Carnage as Possible" school, I guess. I just want young American kids to be kids.

I think I was blessed to grow up in the late 1970's, and to come of age in the 1980's. All things considered, it was a peaceful time, and even though we kids had nightmares about "The Day After," I wouldn't trade my childhood with those of today's children for anything.

Isn't that pretty sad? However, I think your comment made sense, and I completely understand where you're coming from. :-)

Welcome to DU!!

:yourock:

:hi:

It didn't take me more than two months in-country in '69 to fully realize I'd never see any weaponry as "cool" ever again. Hell, and I was a "REMF"!

These engines of war ought to always be displayed with the mutilated bodies of their victims.

that are used for medical evacuation missions, and save lives, too.

That's different. :puke:

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n/t

Came to my unit several years back and got to see a Chinook (the coolest of cool in helicopters), and they had a great time, what exactly should I have been charged with?

Helicopters rock...

from principal:
Black Hawk will land on the playground at 8 in AM. Students must be inside for landing. During the opening Space Day ceremony they will do a presentation about the machine to the whole campus. Brett will also be there to launch rockets; I have talked to him all ready. We will introduce the Space Day teams, discuss theme of Space Day and do some patriotic stuff. Tammy is making a list of Space films for the day and I will get info on space exploration and the Black Hawk to teachers ahead of time. The theme for Space Day this year has something to do with exploration from Lewis and Clark to space exploration. (some anniversary they are having this year makes this the theme.) The contrasts between yesterday's exploration and today's space exploration would be very interesting. Fifth grade classes would also have designated morning times to go through the Black Hawk helicopter with its pilot....other plans in the making....is this okay???
-end-

Apparently the pilot is the cousin of a staff member.
I mean, I guess this is pretty sinister, really. It just smacks of cramming patriotism and military toys down the throats of impressionable young children.

if possible

I fail to see the insidious nature of this, but I also fail to see what a Blackhawk has to do with space.

I like your UserID, btw!

They are unique, but also inter-related

to gain control of the ultimate high ground for world dominance through technology.

I'd take the chance to show kids at that school all the dead children the US troops just slaughtered in Fallujah and the rest of Afghanistan and Iraq.

Oh, yeah. And Haiti and lots of other places.

TEACH YOUR CHILDREN WELL:

HERE'S FASCISM.
HERE'S YOUR BRAIN ON FASCISM.

ANY QUESTIONS?

the footage of airplanes slamming into the WTC on 9/11.

Here's radical Islam

Here's your brain on radical Islam.

Any questions??

While no one really knows who crashed those planes, we are seeing in NYC to Fallujah that the slaughter of civilians has blowback on innocent people and more slaughter of innocent civilians.

If you do your homework, you find that tricking US children into joining the military as 'the good guys' is how democracy is prevented around the world and human rights stay on the endangered species list.

Not rhetoric, documented facts.

experienced the last three years with bush and especially here recently. buttt.....lol and a wink. i have a couple little ones (boys) adn boyscouts had a soldier come and talk to them, showing flags and talk of experience to them, and as much as i dont like this war or like bush or like guns and killing, everything this represents, it was a good experience for edmund. and i want him to be respectful towards those willing to give up their lives to protect us.

and yes yes, they are fooled today about the war protecting u.s., and my boys understand this, but it was a good experience.

i think your kids will be quite impressed, a smile and an enthusiasm, and maybe you can bring some good out of it

i did get a smile with your quip about recruitment films or something

What, exactly, does "patriotic stuff" look like?

This helio landing is part of a "Space Day" programme? They will be launching model rockets and watching "space films" and then the Blackhawk will visit?

And we're getting all our knickers in a twist like this is a visit from the Bushjugend recruiters?

I feel like I've been HAD....like it or not, the military is the biggest user of aerospace technology, and a helicopter is probably the easiest example of that technology to bring into contact with the kids.

How would you feel if the Air Force trucked in a X-15 rocket plane mock-up on a trailer?

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I hope they have a large playground.

who is obsessed with the impression we adults make on kids, sure I can see it as a cool thing to look at but I am a bit wary of it all.
No offense to you or other pilots.

that there will be no recruiters there with enlistment papers for anyone to sign. :) It's just a crew that volunteered to spend their day hanging out with kids, answering questions, and letting them flip all those cool switches and buttons. (Getting to do an airshow is a reward for crews...they love doing them).

As impressionable as young kids are, they'll be just as enamored with the toad or frog they find next week on the playground, but that doesn't mean they'll all become the next Croc Hunter, either.

.

and talked about how neat it was to jump from planes and how they should all join the Army when they grew up so they could do those neat things.

And a photographer from the local rag was there.

showed up and had a program at a different point of the school year to show them animals, and told them they should be a biologist or a zookeeper, too. Doesn't mean they're going to do it now, does it?

The purpose of a school is to EDUCATE, and to educate you bring in people who do different, unusual, and interesting jobs that kids might find cool, and introduce them to new and different things. And no, it's not indoctrination.

I don't remember ever seeing an accountant come to my school and show us how to do tax returns....because what they do is unappealing to little kids.

Animals and helicopters are cool.

n/t

with a part of your point.

i work for a college, and see young adults all the time. it's interesting that many of them study the things they do based in part on a childhood experience (i'm at a geeky school). they love all kinds of things, and of course many of them change their minds over time, but there's a core group that "has loved the pyramids since i was 4" or "thinks the stars are so neat because i used to look at them with my grandfather." i've read 0000s of entrance essays, this is the stuff they talk about.

so while you're right, some kids will leave with the idea that copters are cool like frogs, others will grow up and want to be in the military. right now, combined with all the other pro-military propaganda (war is a game! killing is fun!) forced on them in a myriad of ways, i worry that too many of the next generation will be uncritical when they decide what to do for a living. and they'll sign up for 'adventure' not realizing it's rapidly become of form of imperalist pseudo-slavery (for most in the military).

further- too many schools have NO money for the scientists and others who would come to the school if there were the programs for them. sure, people volunteer (like this pilot) but don't you think a whole school day devoted to "space" should be hosted by scientists, and not the military? what are we teaching them? we have to "defeat" space?? i wish more schools could bring in experts to teach children. but trust me, that's not happening.

this is bad, but not because the pilot is a bad guy or some CT thing. young kids shouldn't be exposed to this without their parents express written pre-approval, and during after-school time.

Those that do grow up and join the military aren't going to be swayed by a helicopter they saw in fifth grade. People join for a myriad of reasons, be it economic, patriotic, the GI Bill, or wanting to get paid to learn a trade instead of paying to learn a trade. Maybe some relish the idea of being an imperialist pseudo-slave.

I re-read the original post and email provided, and it sounds like the helicopter is part of the space day, and it's not being run by the military. It's being run by the school, and they have a lot of different folks participating from the AEROSPACE industry, not the horrid, war-mongering, military-industrial complex. And I guess if you want to be real cynical, you could try and tie-in the Haliburton corporation providing mercenaries for the Lewis and Clark exploration. Sorry, cheap shot. I apologize.

I do agree that today's kids have been desensitized about the brutalities of war, with all the computer games and television shows and movies that glamorize war. It's not glamorous. It's brutal, and people die, sometimes horribly...and sometimes they're your friends, and that's incomprehensibly sad. And it's not something that can be accurately portrayed or conveyed to those that have not experienced it. But these kids that are also growing up today are the most well-informed bunch of individuals, and they're very inquisitive, and those that join are fully aware they could be put in harm's way. Those that were in prior to 9-11 might have joined up for adventure, but those that have joined up since are under few, if any of those, illusions.

Either way, I still think helicopters are cool. :)

Especially tandem rotor ones...

here's a dose of some children's reality for ya! JESUS WEPT













here's one of their dad's and bush*s "disarming and legging" of Iraq

here's his other leg

I thought it was really cool.

Helicopters are WAY cool...

... filled with maimed and wounded bodies of soldiers on stretchers. Show 'em that way. :eyes:

War is a brutal business. No, carrying dead and wounded from the battlefield is not fun. They are memories that stay with you until the day you die, hopefully many years from now. Unless you've carried dead and wounded in the back of your aircraft (yes, I have) you can't convey the gruesomeness of it, and it can't be adequately put into words how horrible war is. You convey that to the new guy next to you in the cockpit that's flying his first combat mission, not an 11 year old.

The bottom line is these aren't recruiting trips, they're for little kids to see and do something that for many will never again do in their lives, which is see a helicopter up close.

Why does everything have to get so politicized and scrutinized for way more than it actually is?

Where are you in the country, just to give me a general idea?

I like helicopters too, but the growth of militarism and the way it is sold to kids frightens me. I have a cousin who I think joined the Army largely because a childhood of violent video games convinced him it would be fun to kill, and the recruiters only encouraged this naiveté.

In this political climate, it sure does strike me as propaganda, whether intentional or not. Because I'm sure our leaders would love to see more of this happening and on a regular basis.

near Austin.

As part of a field trip to NYC. Then, in High School, everyone has US Army gear. Apparently our school sends many more students on average (for our size) to West Point.

Does he or she not realize how the fascisti are using him/her??? You need to work to get that principal canned for allowing this kind of propaganda to go on!

She was a life-long Mepublican until 2000- Thinks bush is the dimmest man alive. She is extremely patriotic, usually allows for an uncomfortably long "moment of silence" (required by law in Texas) each morning after our pledges. I think that this helicopter deal came about because the pilot is the cousin of one of the faculty.

Dig your DU name.

Are the *ies so desperate that they will recruit ten year olds into the military?

Yes, I'm being facetious

I hope they reviewed the pilot's experience and verified that the helicopter has been scrupulously maintained. I think it would have been better to arrange a field trip, rather than have it flown to the school.
Even though an accident is unlikely, I think it might be an unnecessary risk.

last item on this webpage

http://infowars.com/photos.html


"Infowars has received reports from literally hundreds of people, who confirmed that military helicopters landing in school yards as part of an obvious desensitization and indoctrination of our youth. Although this sounds too bizarre to be true, the photos speak for themselves"

I swear, I edge ever closer to conspiracy nutdom.

or let him go with his school on a field trip to see it?

edit - pre 9 am grammar.

Our school has had a problem with a sewage leak for eight years now. The stench in the gym some days requires us to close it off and not use it. We are also far short, technology wise, at our school. We have been trying to implement a great computerized math program but we can't afford the number of laser printers needed to make it run efficiently. Is it a stretch to assume that the maintenance and fuel costs for this helicopter to fly in for the day equals what it would cost to solve our sewage problem or, at the least, equal to the cost of a few laser printers?

Or in school at all... a Blackhawk helicopter landing in the palyground of my school would be one of the coolest things that could possibly happen....

They didn't do anything like that when I was in school.

I got jipped.

Heyo

there needs to be an understanding that the military has a certain function in our society. They are needed to protect our rights as a nation. I am in no way advocating the war in Iraq, I have been opposed to it from the beginning. I am not opposed however to sending the military to Afghanistan to seek out Al-Q. Some one has to do this job.

Students at the elementary level are exposed to the military in many ways (remember GI JOE). As they grow up they will have a few life experiences behind them and parental guidance to help them decide to be or not to be in the military by the time they are 18.

One more thing, once out of the military helicopter pilots perform other honorable jobs such as a piloting helicopters for hospitals.

I hope my random thoughts make sense to someone.

They're old enough to be aware of the war. They understand that a lot of the people sent over there have kids their age, and are curious about things like helicopters and tanks and such. I don't see a problem with this if it is handled appropriately-it's educational to learn about what tools are used in the military.

as a crewchief, basically being part of the display. These things are a good time for everybody involved, I actually look forward to them. Just last week I was looking through my units "mission book" in flight ops. There are a few school yard "static displays" coming up. One of the things mentioned in one schools request was the budget cut that got them thinking of things to bring to the students since they could not take as many field trips. Once last summer we landed in a large park with fire trucks, etc already crawling with kids. As soon as the pilots finished shutting down I opened the cabin door, turned around and my first customer was already standing there wanting to climb in. When we took off and landed at another site across town they were waiting for us. The blades stopped, I gave the crowd control guys the thumbs up and about 150 kids sprinted over all at once. "How high does it go?" "How fast does it go?" and so on.