Was the Fallujah incident revenge for prison torture?

These investigations started last year. We were kept in the dark, but of course word of mouth could spread in Iraq and communicate the goings on in these prisons.

Also, didn't the 'coalition' close several media outlets in Iraq? What were they guilty of saying to justify being closed down I wonder...

aka mercenaries

and I heard that Sadr's newspaper was reporting on this abuse, and printing accounts from some who were released...

and then Bremer shuts the paper down...

:hi:

That these newspapers may have evidence that the news was circulating in Iraq about the routine use of torture. If so I hope some is presented soon.

Americans need to know the context of Fallujah, if indeed the prison torture is the context missing. Empirical evidence available so far tends to suggest it very well may be.

*sigh*

And the mercs are just what... walking off scot free? (where did the phrase 'scot free' come from, anyway?)

How is that justice? How will that affect the battle for hearts and minds in Iraq?

so yes, they get to walk away... how often are they even mentioned in the talking-head b.s.-fest? Rarely if at all

instead, they will get even bigger contracts... notice Bush is already asking for more billions? You think he'll open up the interrogation and detention contract to other bidders?

hell no

:grr:

revenge for our democracy

for our freedoms

Now I can't stop thinking about it.

Some borderline mental case repug (is there any other kind? ;)) called in screaming about how our troops were treated in Fallujah (too stooooopid to remember they weren't troops, but hey) - and another caller said that these investigations started last year so maybe Fallujah was revenge for this.

It brought back all the anguish I felt after our bombing Fallujah - after they had allowed women & children back in JUST THE DAY BEFORE. I've never felt so ashamed of my country as on that day. :cry:

I've been thinking they may very well be at the very least part of the result. I'm coming to the conclusion in listening to the testimonies and reading reports that the abuse was actually a planned tactic in an attempt to gain information. The pictures were both the documentation of the abuse as well as the actual instrument of coercion to gain information...a psy-ops. If that's the case, it makes sense when Rumsfeld's outrage about someone 'leaking a confidential report' in that the pictures were the report. JMO

Are you saying that the 'torture' was staged, and the pics used to intimidate others into talking?

I think the torture really was on a small scale and was probably set up by intelligence (be it CIA and/or MI) to unknowing MPs. Then, these pictures were intended to be used to intimidate others. Doing it in this manner keeps psy-ops' hands clean but gives results wanted which is human intelligience. The reason why this seems logical to me is this: Which agency would best know the culture? Is it really conceivable that the MPs just happened to stumble on to the one thing that would most humiliate, shame, and terrify Iraqi/Muslim people? That's quite a stroke of luck, IMO.

Also, showing the pictures to a large number of people in individual situations can give the impression it's large scale without being so. It still intimidates and they then go tell other people "I've seen pictures! They showed me tons of pictures of what they're doing to people"

I'm not condoning or excusing this in any way. I firmly believe it's wrong wrong wrong wrong. And I could very well be completely wrong about this. There's still more information to be found out. But a psy-ops operation is what I'm reading between the lines.

Enquiring minds want to know.

Note that when you say "Americans" I read "the kind of Americans who think Saddam had anything to do with 9/11". :)

I'm certain that this is just the beginning of violence that will be rationalized as revenge for the prison abuses. Circle of violence. It is our shame that our leaders didn't consider this and modify their power grab. Violence begets violence. I live that. It's news to some.

So true... we're really not so far removed from monkeys as many would like to believe, I think. Monkeys who can figure a few things out- that's all we are. All the obsession about appearance and the importance of image vs. character these days bears that out completely.

:(

They said that it was revenge for the Iraeli assasination of the wheelchair bound cleric at a mosque. The people who did it were known to have immediatly left Fallujah, so the attacks on the city were collective punishmnet of civilians. BTW there were about 80 mercs killed that week, not just the four. I believe the Guardian in the UK ran that story.

here in the US they only begrudgingly tell us how many TROOPS are killed, let alone the thousands of mercenaries.

I somehow managed to miss 'their' claims that it was revenge for something Israel did. I'll have to look for that. Thanks.