WooHoo! Kerry Picks McCain as VP and DU goes Wild with Cheers!

I thought I'd seen everything, but this one really is the most enchanting!

DU Poll picks Mc Cain as WINNER for VP for Election 2004! I wonder if Skinner, Earl and the "intern" who "waved the banner in front of MSNBC" way back when are thrilled with this? After all these three years this is what we come down to? After a "Stolen Election?"

UNITY PARTY! Kerry picks REPUBLICAN MC CAIN! Dems thrilled while O'Reilly/Hannity/Rush quake in their boots at how the "Lowly Dems" could have suddenly "gotten with the program!"

Oh My! All we had to do was pick a Repug VP for Decades and we would have "Ruled the World!"(sarcasm dripping from my fangs, alert)

Link: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=1621418&mesg_id=1621418

Thanks for starting a new one! It had been what, 3 minutes since the last one?

...having my post deleted after expressing my strong feelings on this matter.

What sort of group-think has polluted the minds at DU? I think it has its roots in people's fears that the US is actually headed towards a fascist dictatorship and they are willing to vote for just about anyone who they feel might slow that process down a bit or stop it.

It ain't gonna stop it.

first time reply....what the hell are you talking about?

:hi:

WELCOME!!! :toast:

is follow the link in the first post to see what this is about.

BTW - NO vote here. I will never vote for a Repub. EVER!

even if the democrat in the race is a total scumbag and the republican is the better choice?

not likely i know, but it could happen

you got the first one, it might have sounded garbled. Just hit the link and you can then agree or disagree. Hey! I'm still a Dem! We always like "discussion!" :-)'s

:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:

Thats why we get excited.
We hate bush and want him gone.

You would lose democrats in DROVES. If anything, it would re-elect *.

People well Average people like mccain

They'll leave the party in droves.

the Democratic Ticket? How has he supported Liberal Causes in the past? What is his voting record on issues that Democrats have traditionally cared about that makes you think McCain on the ticket is a "WINNER?"

What about McCain's views makes you feel comfortable? :shrug:

I would vote for him anyway if in the highly unlikely event that he did, but it would be a HUGE mistake.

I have respect for Senator McCain, but he IS a Republican and the Dems have plenty of qualified folks for Kerry to pick.

That's all we need, Kerry gets knocked off and the Repugs have the White House back. No thanks, even if that is far-fetched.

If you need a uniformed man, go for Clark. Heck, the Dems have a pretty deep bench of politicians who wore the uniform of their country, for that matter.

Give the McCain VP stuff a rest already.

McCain winning in a Poll for VP says it all. Why the hell have some of us spent time here. I don't know...can't imagine why. :shrug:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=1621418&mesg_id=1621418

I think you're misreading it. The poll asks, "would you still vote for Kerry...?" I'd have to hold my nose and puke in the bushes afterwards, but I'd still vote for Kerry.

That doesn't mean, in any small way whatsoever, that McCain won a DU poll for VP. So, what am I missing here?

do you think some of us still angry over "Selection 2000" and what we know has transpired since with the BFEE (Bush Family Empire/Crime) feel about DLC pushing McCain (with Kerry's blessing apparently) for his Vice President?

You don't think some of us are "frothing at the mouth" in anger? :shrug:

a heartbeat over John McCain. And if Kerry is even thinking about that "Media Whore" Joe Biden, then I just might go Nader.

I WAS a Moderate Dem until "Selection 2000." You could say, except for NAFTA vote (which I was totally against) that I would be a Clinton Dem who thought the DLC was making a needed change.

"Selection 2000 changed EVERYTHING for me! And, I have read so much and learned so much from others here on DU in those three years since "2000" that I can't help but be angry and saddened to see a "DU POLL" which supports John McCain.

After all some of us have been through here, to see this just makes me want to :puke: But, then this is my third :puke: emoticom so I guess I'm getting stale here.

All I can say is that it's disgusting that I wasted my time getting involved in our Party for it to come down to this..

Why are you talking to me like I just got here or something? If you think for a second, I'm somehow LESS angry about the 2000 selection than you are, you're mistaken. I'm as angry as anyone, if not, more.

I'm not even disagreeing with a single point you've made. The only thing I'm pointing out is, McCain didn't win a VP poll on DU. That's not what the poll was asking. I think you read that poll about as well as you read my post. I didn't say I'd hold my nose and puke to vote for Kerry. I'd hold my nose and puke if McCain were Kerry's running mate. I'd do this because I WOULD ABSOLUTELY NOT vote for Bush or Nader. So, if hell froze over, and Kerry chose McCain (which he won't) and McCain accepted (which he won't) then I'd vote for that ticket. The world can't afford 4 more years of Bush.

This whole thing is doing nothing but driving DUers apart. Kerry won't pick McCain...period. So why do we fight with each other about it?

or Kerry and any Repug. I chastised you, because you wavered, and I have seen you on DU, and wouldn't expect anyone who wasn't a newbie to say what you said.

But, I accept that you feel I read you wrong...I think I heard what you said, but maybe you feel you didn't mean it as harshly as it came across to me. Still, it's the "PRINCIPLE" of the thing! It's the ISSUES we stand for that could not allow me or any Dem who has been here fighting to get the Bushies exposed for three years to even think about a Repug on the ticket no matter how much we know Bush will ruin America. He's ruined it already. How would voting for a Repug on the ticket make a difference? We must have PRINCIPLES to stand on. To fight back with..or we are as Skinner said in his post a few weeks back: "The Party of Nothing." (I know he said he meant that Kerry wasn't the Candidate yet and his post didn't mean that we Dems were about nothing, but his "turn of phrase" keeps coming back) Are we Dems the "Party of Nothing" that we need a Repug to help us? I don't think so. I am glad to hear you don't think so either, but disappointed that in "desperation" you would think we might need to do this..:-(

Whatever. Anyway, one of my favorite quotations ever... you should credit the author...

some pithy quotes, doesn't he? :-)'s

The thread was about how people would vote IF Kerry picked McCain (which he won't). The poll was not about the PREFERENCE of DUers nor their ENTHUSIASM. :eyes:

... by his own party members. Also I doubt he would campaign against his fellow party members. It ain't going to happen. And continuing this discussion is only a distraction.

I realized months ago that this is the site where the paranoid schizophrenics discuss their worst case scenarios...

Want some serious information and or discussion of what's REALLY going on?

Start here --

www.dailykos.com

http://www.thadeusandweez.com/daily.scribble.pages/dailyscribble.html

http://simbaud.blogspot.com/

http://www.ofrankenfactor.com/

http://www.alternet.org/

http://www.southerner.net/blog/

http://mediamatters.org/

http://www.gregpalast.com/

http://blogs.salon.com/0002874/
World O'Crap

http://interestingtimes.blogspot.com/

http://tbogg.blogspot.com/2004/05/

:thumbsup:

Reality often kicks people who know "what's REALLY going on" in the ass.

Not McCain. That poll just asks people whether they'd hold their nose and do it. It is hardly a ringing endorsement. It just means most people are pragmatic enough to be able to remember that the real enemy here is Bush.

DTH

:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke:

McCain, the Neocons choice for President until Bush picked Cheney as his VP but hell, that must be a positive thing for the DLC & PPI.

alot! I can't think of a better way to express some stuff. It's better than the other "4-letters" in my mind. ;-)'s

(Too over the top?)

It asks if you will still vote for Kerry, not if you will celebrate the decision...

Some sanity.

- I'm beginning to wonder if those who think it would be 'great' to have a REPUBLICAN VP are mainly DLCers? Is this a DLC 'bipartisan date rape' thing to split the party?

- A question: Are there any Liberals or Progressives who feel this way?

that way but what you say goes into my mind to think about.

Also, that old expression: "Dance with them that "brung you" to the party." If I hear what you say then I would add: "Dance with them that brung you...take 'em out for a few drinks, and then make sure you got what you took 'em out for."

OMG...it's crude but that's what I'm thinking is going on here for us to have Kerry even think of allowing this "McCain" thing to keep going and to get on the front page of NYT's and in the other pages of other noted newspapers.

Kerry's keeping it alive and it's making us :puke:

...as they described how gullible Democrats were in trying to work in a bipartisan way with the Neocons. They think Democrats are a joke and take advantage of their naivete' by 'promising' to work together and then pulling the rug from under them at the last moment.

- That's what is so funny about this McCain thing. (Some) Democrats seem to think they can gain some sort of advantage by adding him to the ticket. But all it would accomplish is to further water down the Democratic platform and put a traitor in our midst. Will Dems ever learn? I have my doubts.

a "Strategy" or we hope for a "Savior" like JFK, or Clinton to come to us to be a "silver tongued Devil" to sweep the electorate off their feet with a "Chicken in Every Pot and we will Feel Your Pain" scenario and then we make a mess and the Repugs come in with a "solution" that brings the country to it's knees with debt and corporate crime, but we come back agains with some "semi" Populist message and gullible folks fall behind us in line as we can't wait to cut them off when we need to.

Disgusting.

over something that ISN'T GOING TO HAPPEN.

When are we going to get it together on the left?

This is all pointless, meaningless and counterproductive speculation. It's not going to happen. If it does, we'll deal with it then.

DTH

...but it's TELLING that so many DUers would actually accept McCain on a Democratic ticket. This proves my point that the party has lost its way and that many could care less about supporting and defending traditional Democratic values and principles.

All it says is that a lot of people are outraged, and want Bush out of office. It proves nothing. I would HATE McCain as the VP, and would express outrage at the decision, as I'm sure most DUers would. After all, the poll was NOTHING about preference. The fact that all of this outrage is based on something as likely as pigs flying makes it all the more ridiculous.

himself was quoted on front page of print edition of NYT's as not ruling it out according to his DLC "handlers" so the fact that it keeps coming up on this website which is after all billed as: "Democratic Undergound" and we are the most well informed readership in the Democratic Party today, says that Kerry is still thinking about it. And, that McCain would do so well in a poll on a site billed as...let me repeat: "Democratic Underground" is much cause for many of us to :puke: our guts out, given the amount of activism and trials and tribulations and sorrows we've had to go through trying to get our party back on track on this web site.

BTW! I am involved in NC Democratic Party due to my participation here on DU so I'm not just some armchair typist griping in the wind when I'm in outrage over this DU Poll.

Are there people on DU who would prefer McCain as the VP? Sure, but I would be willing to bet that it would be a minority.

The poll did not ask for a preference. It simply asked if one would vote for Kerry if he picked McCain (which isn't going to happen!) as VP. Huge difference. I was one who voted yes, and I HATE McCain. I would be utterly disgusted at Kerry's decision. But, four more years of Bush disgusts me more. I'm sorry if that doesn't fit your ideal of purity, but I don't think it makes me, or anyone else at DU McCain supporters or centrist DLCers. And basing your judgments using an example that has little to no chance of happening is ludicrous.

Kerry/McCain TICKET! How could you? What if Kerry was assassinated? Would you lie down with the devil hoping that Kerry would be better than Bush just to elect him? Where are your PRINCIPLES?? How could you do this? I just don't see this... A Democrat saying they need a Repug VP because they can't find one qualified among other Democrats?

How could you feel this way?

It's as simple as that. If Kerry were assassinated, I still think McCain is an improvement over Bush. So, I would take the chance that Kerry isn't assassinated, but even if he were, McCain would be president, over 4 more years of Bush. I simply don't think that we can afford to lose this election.

He knows that associating himself with the popular McCain will improve his standing with moderates, and folks who appreciate the appearance of bipartisanship.

Of course, he is assuming that liberals will be smart enough to figure out what he's doing, and that the fact that he will NOT end up placing McCain on the ticket will be sufficient proof by action, not by word.

DTH

is imploding Kerry feels he still isn't strong enough to win with his OWN IDEAS he needs John McCain? Do you hear what you are saying here?

Have you forgotten that we Dems had a TWO TERM PRESIDENT! Bill Clinton!

We can go against any Repug who claims Reagan was King because of two terms.

The Chimps Evil Poppy only got one term before we kicked the sucker out the door! And we NOW NEED McCain?

Do you realize we Dems WON the last ELECTION???

saying we "need McCain?" Note, I said sensible! I still think you're reading waaaaaay too much into that poll. No one suggested we need McCain, and I don't want him. I don't want him. I don't want him. I don't want him.

But, that doesn't change the simple fact that:
Kerry and McCain, if in some imaginary world actually happened, are better than Bush/Cheney. All repukes are bad, but they're not equally bad. McCain is a better repuke than Bush/Cheney. I hope this doesn't get misconstrued as a compliment for McCain, because it's not, but it is a fact.

Let me reiterate, just in case there is confusion here. I don't want McCain on the ticket. I don't know how many times I can say this before you believe me.

a Repug on the ticket. With what we've been through it would be a "kiss of death" to my principles. And you need to know that I WAS a Centrist Clinton/DLC'er before the "Selection." I'm now hovering somewhere so far left I might get called a "socialist" in some quarters.

In this is all because of what our party has DONE TO ITSELF, in the last years, and that it isn't standing up for anything. And, I'm questioning what it did in the Clinton years when it didn't even support him and allowed us to be out here in the "wilderness fighting" for our lives that anyone running as our Dem Candidate, could not put a stop to the McCain/Repug thing on the ticket is just too much!

After all, McCain has already said many nice things about Kerry. It creates an air of friendliness, bipartisanship and "above the fray"-ness that is, dare I say it, downright Presidential.

Politics is about appealing to as many people as possible. If liberals can't figure that out, can't recognize the value of playing nice with people who play nice with you (especially when that sells well with the general public), then I don't know what else to say.

Has our society really become so poisoned that even the notion of saying nice things about a <gasp> Republican is anathema?

DTH

Nicey...Nicey...lets be friends...why are you running around with "crazies in the night" and why don't you use the nice "scratchy post to sharpen your claws" instead of that chair I will have to have recovered.

"politics is about appealing to as many people as possible," YOU SAY!

I SAY....Politics WITHOUT PRINCIPLE is the BFEE and Ken Lay and a Pre-Emptive war based on LIES! :nuke:

He's not a part of the BFEE, and he's stuck up for Kerry when he absolutely didn't have to.

I don't see how Kerry saying nice things about his friend equals any sort of lack of principle. I think it's smart, and appropriate.

Kerry hasn't done anything with McCain. I think there's less than a 1% chance of McCain being on the ticket. So where's the down side again? Aside from your apparently -- and in my opinion bizarrely -- ruffled feathers?

DTH

"I am a man of principles, and chief among them is flexibility."

since there is nothing to prevent lurkers/disruptors from voting in DU polls. The results don't necessarily reflect DU members

out against it sometimes. How is one to know? Leading Newspaper keep mentioning McCain, Kerry doesn't come out and stop the rumors. With all we've seen this would be a cruel twist and yet it's possible and many DU'ers keep posting about it. :shrug:

the Democrats are doing the SAME FUCKING THING here in Montana. They put a Republican on the ticket for lieutenat-gov. So forgive me if I don't just look at it as a cute little campaign strategy. I won't vote for it here in Montana and I wouldn't vote for it nationally. Say nice things about McCain? Fine. We should be saying that McCain is great and should be the kind of republican we can work with NOT suggesting him as a veep possibility.

While I hate to disgust you, I have to agree whole heartedly with Paddy.

:puke: :puke: :puke:

You get the idea.

if that happened? I don't think the poll indicates that at all.

The repulsive idea has been discussed way too much here. There has been thread after thread after thread for weeks.

There are a vocal few who think McCain is the greatest, but I don't think that is what the poll indicated. I just do not think that voting for Kerry, no matter who he picks for VP is all that crazy.

I think picking McCain would be a huge mistake in many differet ways. I don't blame someone for being disgusted enough to withhold their voted. I just don't think that DU is really behind McCain aside from a few threads, and I don't think that voting anyway, even if he did is support for McCain and the Republican party.

I think this is the third go-around of them, and they have been plentiful since Sunday this time.

And it WOULD be a huge mistake.

And I would say the vast majority of people at DU are going to vote for Kerry over Nader.

I'm just against what I see as a wild leap to conclusions from a poll that only asked if someone would vote for Kerry, not if they would support the decision, particularly considering the likelihood of Kerry nominating McCain is very small.

Not so with the McCain stuff.

And centrists probably aren't going to be as outraged about a McCain ticket, and some may even be for it. I'm not arguing that.

It still doesn't change the fact that the poll doesn't say what KoKo thinks it's saying. If we could have a fool proof poll that asked all DUers how they felt about McCain, and everyone answered, I'd be willing to bet that McCain would lose out.

Edited: mispelled Koko's name, and it looked bad.

I am against any damn repub on the ticket. Id vote for Nader if Kerry put a freakin right winger on with him.

This kinda stuff makes us look bad. Can you imagine ? Id rather cram barbed wire thru my eyeballs.

I'd hate it if Kerry put McCain on the ticket, and I don't think he will.

But even IF he did, I'd vote for that ticket. I will vote for ANY Democratic ticket to get this dangerous gang of thugs out of DC. So I answered 'Yes' to that poll, but it certainly doesn't mean I'd "go wild with cheers."

And I believe he'd take it if offered following the tradition of his father and grandfather.

But, I hope that John Kerry ignores the prodding of Joe Biden and others to pick McCain.

Personally, I'm glad that Kerry is dragging this out longer and taking his time, because it's driving Karl Rove insane.

And, for what it's worth (not much), I still hope that JK pick Wes Clark to be his Vice President.

fuckers.