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Which is the most disturbing photo of prisoner abuse? . . . Why?

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skip fox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 11:45 AM
Original message
Which is the most disturbing photo of prisoner abuse? . . . Why?
Edited on Thu May-20-04 11:49 AM by skip fox


In this undated photo, obtained by ABC News and allegedly taken
by Sgt Charles Frederick in Abu Ghraib prison in Baghdad, Iraq,
Army Spc. Sabrina Harmon of the 372nd Military Police Company
poses with the body of a dead Iraqi man packed in ice. According
to testimony obtained by ABC from Spc. Jason Kennel, who is not
accused of wrongdoing, the man died while in the custody of the
U.S. authorities at the prison. (AP Photo/Sgt. Charles Frederick
via ABC News)

I say that the above photo might well be the most distrubing. Fresh American girl with the flush of health and youth aglow in her face (hell, she could do a facial soap ad!), made unbelievably coarse by war and whatever environment/orders were her lot in Iraq. IMHO.

The smiling monster it makes of us.


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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
1. The hooded, wired man on the box
His very anonymity could mean he is anyone or everyone, you or me. His utter dehumanization shows that we are no better than the thugs Bushco said we were there to overthrow.

That photo is the worst so far, and it's also the one most widely ciruclated, both as itself and in editorial cartoons.

I'm sure worse is yet to come, though, as the sadomasochistic, homoerotic stuff starts to leak out.
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Poiuyt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. This photo symbolizes Iraqi war for me
It's like the photo of the little girl in Viet Nam.

There's something very Christ-like in the picture of the wired man on a box. His pose makes him look like he's being crucified.
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writekid Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
2. Abu Graib is the American Way
Lately many have asked how the abu graib debacle could have occurred? “I can’t believe what I’ve seen,” they say. “I’m disgusted,” said gw bush. “I can’t even look at the pictures,” said laura bush. “This does not represent America,” cries the congress. One word comes to mind when I hear these statements, “denial.” The abu graib events personify all that is American, but like most Americans, we simply don’t like to admit it.

One of america’s strongest characteristics is that we have an incredibly pure and wholesome ideal of what is “American,” yet the behavior of our government and many of our citizens is diametrically opposed to this ideal. “All American”, “apple pie”, “honor”, “dignity,” “the founding fathers” etc are phrases used to conjure images of freckle faced boys helping old ladies across the street as they defend the land of the free and home of the brave.

Our current leader and commander in chief of the armed forces is a man who fumbled his way through school and avoided military service by way of political connections. He admits that he hates to read and can barely carry a conversation unless reading a script. In one of his early pre election speeches he said in reference to our first president, “…or as his friends used to call him, George W.” GW bush actually compared himself to this nation’s first president, George Washington. Also known as ‘the father of our country.’ ironically, the father of our country was the only us president not to father any (white)children.

George Washington was an accomplished farmer, a man of letters, a courageous war hero who motivated his troops to stand in the cold of valley forge and to give their lives so that they would not have to endure the oppressive government of England. A government that taxed its citizens without allowing them representation in the affairs of government. His fellow soldiers described Washington not as a brilliant military strategist, but as a man who literally road his horse into battles with an aura or greatness and fearlessness that seemed to render him indestructible. This is the man that gw bush compared himself to. Gw bush, who used daddy’s influence to avoid going to war, to avoid even going to national guard duty.

when george washington won the greatest battles in the history of the world, after he defeated the greatest military power the world had seen to date, he wished to return to his farm tired and weary so that he may live in peace. But his country pleaded with him to become the first president. They chose him to be president of the most radical and advanced political experiment every attempted in the history of civilization. A free citizenry would elect representatives to govern the land as servants of the people. Such was his presence and wisdom. This is the man that gw bush compared himself to. The same gw bush, that when told that the country was threatened by the world’s most notorious terrorist in a presidential briefing entitled “bin laden set to attack US,” continued to stay on his ranch and fix fences during one of the longest vacations in presidential history.

Now gw bush decides to send the us to war. Based on a grand lie. A war that benefits nobody except for the financiers who will split up the 87 billion us tax dollars spent. And to do this bidding he uses the countries poor and uneducated masses. Our military soldiers are comprised largely of kids from small town. Hispanics told that if they just sign up, their college will be paid for. Young girls from west virgina who sign up because the manufacturing and mining jobs that used to drive their town’s economy have been shipped over seas in the name of “free trade.”

The grand lie of course was that saddam Hussein had tried to buy uranium from niger. When one of bush’s most trusted ambassadors was sent to to niger to investigate this assumption, he concluded that no such sale or attempted sale had occurred. When the amabassdor made public his report called “what I didn’t find in niger,” it was immediately leaked that ambassador’s wife was a cia agent. This compromised not only the safety of the cia agent, but the safety of all her contacts. This is among the highest acts of treason. Why would such a leak occur? Who would leak such a thing? We can’t be sure, but it’s obvious that it came from the one of the seven men who were clamoring for war. All efforts to determine the source of the leak have been thwarted by the bush administration. Why would they do that? This is called “treason” “deception” “maliciousness.” Since this was perpetrated by the highest powers of American, this must be the American way.

So now we know that saddam tried to buy uranium. Actually we don’t know this because the bush administration has done an excellent job of repealing those pesky media ownership laws. The original Americans thought it would be a bad idea if one or two media companies owned all the radio and tv stations. In communist countries it’s called “state run” media and it means you can only hear what the government tells you. The people who financed bush’s election really hated those laws so in return for all the cash, bush and his buds are repealing those laws. Thus companied like clear channel, run by gw’s best friend, can now own all the stations. So the public never hears about things the niger lie. Instead they turn on their tv’s and see big signs that say, “operation iraqui freedon.” Because we have no money for schools we don’t know much. So we grin and say, “freedom good. We love freedom.”

So know we’ve been lead to believe that saddam tried to buy uranium and we’re really pissed. So let’s call up the military and invade that dishonest, hateful country. Some how the media forgets to tell us that korea has nuke and is ready to use them and that Pakistan is selling nukes to any country with cash. Why aren’t we going after them? Because what we really want is a country in shambles that has tons of oil oil’s good. We need it to fuel the machines that make all those shoes and tee shirts that we’re buying at the malls. The ones that used to say “made in America” on the tag. Anyway, back to the invasion. We gotta get over there and start killing people. So let’s get those troops assembled.

Where are those troops? The real Americans. The brave. The proud. The freaking immigrants who are too dumb and too poor to get into college. Let’s get them trained and ready.

But before they go over seas they’re prepared by high schools that have no books and no qualified teachers. They’re indoctrinated into the “American way,” which means they should fight for the founding fathers and for American freedom. Remember that first us soldier who died in iraq. You remember him don’t you? He was the one who couldn’t get us citizenship even though he was in the army. The government was so grateful, that they gave him a posthumous green card so that he can pick strawberries legally at the big migrant worker camp in the sky. Nobody tells them that the seven men who initiated this war all avoided military service. Nobody tells them that the reason our military is in 130 countries is to act as a watch dog for the corporations who have moved over seas to avoid those pesky us labor laws. We took your job and your father’s job away. Now go protect the companies that are paying those kids a dollar a day to make shoes, tires, soda and tee-shirts that you’re going to buy at the mall this christmas.

And to make sure they’re “moral” we’re going to tell them to believe in jesus. We’re gong to give them all a bible. We’re going to make them pledge to “one nation, under god.” God is the way. God says don’t have sex. God says no condoms in school. God says no pornography. God says no bad words on the radio. Our leader has been born again. He has seen the light. He has been taught well by the priests who are raping young boys by the thousands and being protected by their parishioners. So our children go to a foreign land under false pretenses knowing only that if they don’t do this they’ll be called “un patriotic” and that’s a bad word. If they speak out against the government they’ll be called “dissidents” and that’s a bad word. Funny how the very thing that created America is now called “un American”. The very men who were the original patriots would be called “unpatriotic” by today’s standards.

So what do these kids do when they get to these foreign lands where they are forced to dodge bullets and bombs? They do what any sexually repressed poor uneducated kid would do. They say, “hey there are no rules here. Let’s make these arabs have sex with each other. Let’s dehumanize them. Let’s laugh at them. Let’s party like there’s no tomorrow. Who cares? We’re killing brown skinned people. Let’s take pictures of it and show them to our buddies.” Do you know what victims of child abuse do, they abuse children. Do you know what sexually repressed people do when nobody is looking? They engage is bizarre sexual acts. that's america. we're real moral. one of our presidents even said it's okay to get blow jobs from young chicks even if you're married. he gave a ten minute speech about the word "is." i'm not sure what he meant but i'm pretty sure it's okay to make arabs butt fuck each other while we laugh.

now that they've been caught they're saying things like "i was just following orders." hmm, where have i heard that before. i can't remember. it must've been something american though because an american just said it.

This was no accident. This is no aberration. These soldiers are doing exactly what they’ve been programmed to do. And was anyone surprised to learn that one or more of these animals was trained in the us prison system? This is the American way. there's big bucks in locking up people. the darker the skin the better. Funny how when one world leader acts badly, we raise no objections to the killing of his people and the destruction of his land. They’re all arabs aren’t they? Who cares if we’ve killed 10,000 sand niggers along with women and children. “We oughta nuke the whole country,” screams ann coulter and the fox crew, Reagan disciples all. Who is more American than Reagan and his followers?

every president creates a perception of america in the eyes of the world. this is the first time in recent history that the morals and intentions of america have come under such great scrutiny. never before have so many countries voiced such disdain for america. right or wrong, that's the perception. so why is this happening now when so many of our governemt's supporters claim that we are doing good and noble things?

We captured saddam Hussein already. Why are we still killing people over there? Isn’t he the bad guy? Didn’t he cause all this? Shouldn't that be enough? or could it be that there are more bad iraqi's? wasn't it just saddam who was the bad apple and his people simply didn't know better? Yet when our us soldiers rape and murder, it has nothing to do with America or our leaders. It doesn’t represent America. It’s only a few bad apples. Let’s get those anti American soldiers. Wait a second, didn’t we just have a rally for them? Didn’t we have a moment of silence before the last baseball game to praise all the soldiers who are doing the American thing representing America? I don’t recall anyone ever saying, “let’s support the troops except the ones who are rapin’ and killin’ all the Iraqis in them jail cells.” I must’ve missed that speech.

And now our brilliant and courageous architect of the war, don rumsfeld, personally flies to iraq to set free 300 “detainees,” in an act of sheer benevolence. he did this because americans are kind and compassionate. Wow there sure were a lot of cameras around on that day. Why didn’t don do this back in January when he was first told about these abuses? Because the people who elected him didn’t know about the photos back then, that’s why. This is the American way. Doesn’t every kid in America learn that it’s only wrong if you get caught? If that weren’t the case, then nearly every catholic church in the country would be shut down by now.

But this is a Christian nation run by a Christian government and therein lies that great mismatch of ideals vs behavior. If I’m not mistaken Christ said things like “do not kill, do not lie, those who live by the sword die by the sword.” How can bush call himself a christian on Sunday, and then turn around on Monday and order a massive killing spree? I’ve never read the bible, but I’ve never heard anyone say, “thou shalt not kill unless gas prices get really freaking high.”

So this is the America we now live in. we say that we are honest and just and kind and benevolent. Then we go and invade a country and kill their people. If anybody objects, unlike the old ‘true’ Americans, they are not allowed to protest. We have a nifty new piece of paper called “the patriot act” which basically says, “forget about those rights you were guaranteed by the first Americans. This is the new better America.” And shouldn't a governement run by a career C student know much more than all those silly writers, inventors, farmers, artists and other idiots who wrote the constitution and the declaration of independence?

This is America. The soldiers who are raping, killing and making sex tapes are Americans. They represent the heart of America. They are us. We created them. We support them. We bless them. Those who approve of this will continue to elect the officials who promote this. Those who disapprove will try to elect someone else. In the end, another American will represent America. During the birth of America it seems like ideals and behaviors were very close. Today it seems like they are farther away from each other than England and her long lost colonies. That is the “American” way.

imagine if i were to publish this letter on the front page of the new york times. think of all the people who would scream for my expulsion or death. i would imagine the entire cast and crew of the fox network would lead the way. bill oreilly, sean hannity, ann coulter, rush limbaugh and dick cheney would be calling for my head. these same people would say that they are true and great americans. perhaps we should change our slogan from "the land of the free and home of the brave," to "you're either with us or you're with the terrorists." has a nice kind of 19th century eastern european ring to it.
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kayell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. Wow, what an amazing rant! Welcome to DU!
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Tyler Durden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. Welcome and WOW.
This is one impressive piece of work. You done good, Kid.

When you have to run to Canada, look me up.
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skip fox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #2
12. Damn!
Welcome to DU!

:toast:
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zbdent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
3. not an answer, but evidence of the "keeping a body on ice until
it's politically convenient."
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zbdent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
4. Another point - the hoods of "anonymity" give the repukes an out
when it comes to "pictures of prisoners" - since the prisoners/bodies aren't identifiable via faces, that may be a technicality that saves *.
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Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 12:09 PM
Response to Original message
5. This one is for me as well.
Initially, I thought it was a sick photoshop.

Her seeming wholesomeness makes it so much more terrible and disturbing.
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 12:10 PM
Response to Original message
6. I'm sure that the most disturbing photos of all have not been seen
by most or any of us here.
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gula Donating Member (619 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
8. The naked man on the dog leash
I found that one to be the most disturbing, to the point of having nightmares about it.

For me it sums up how the present regime sees all of us who are against them. It most clearly illustrates their disdain for human beings other than themselves and shows their absolute lack of humanity.
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graham67 Donating Member (732 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-04 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
9. The pic of...
Lynndie English giving the thumbs-up next to the naked hooded Iraqis really angered me. I know it doesn't make any sense and I know it isn't PC, but I sat there are wondered how a woman, a sistah, could do this? I'm kind of numb now so these new photos, while they still disgust me, don't bring about the same response. The shock factor wore off.
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