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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-29-04 10:00 PM
Original message
CHINO Tribesmen, Ex-spook Handlers, and the Guerilla War on Democracy
Edited on Sat May-29-04 10:18 PM by arendt
Its a long weekend, so maybe people will have time to wade
through this admittedly over-long essay. My point is that, in
spite of the GOP running the government, we are really in
a guerilla war. Conventional tactics cannot decapitate and
kill the hydra-headed beast that is the corporate/CHINO/spook
army. Voting out Bush is not enough. We have to keep to expose
them at all levels of government, media, and business. Otherwise
we will never root them out.

On this Memorial Day, I think of all the Americans who died to
preserve our Constitution and way of life, and I am ashamed at
how our generation has rolled over for these un-American fanatics.
I will not feel safe, even if we defeat Bush in November, until we
have a grass-roots movement to preserve democracy from the
kind of guerilla war that has been waged on it.

----

CHINO Tribesmen, Ex-spook Handlers, and the Guerilla War on Democracy
by arendt

...."Every time a church tried to act through the propaganda devices accepted by an
....epoch, the truth and authenticity of Christianity were debased...In such moments
....(when acting through propaganda), Christianity ceases to be an overwhelming
....power and spiritual adventure and becomes institutionalized in all its expressions
....and compromised in all its actions. It serves everybody as an ideology with the
....greatest of ease, and tends to be a hoax...Thus reduced to nothing more than an
....ideology, Christianity will be treated as such by the propagandist...this ideology
....will no longer be Christianity. It will be just another doctrine."


....- Jacques Ellul "Propaganda"

----

...."(One may choose to) emphasize the tribal aspects of Christianity...This is the
....orientation of American fundamentalism and its kindred beliefs abroad. Fundamentalism
....rests not on the acknowledged Christian virtues of charity, forgiveness, and understanding,
....but on war - on an imaginary epic conflict between the self-styled 'forces of God' and those
....of His adversary. Reality is reduced to a simple matter of 'us' and 'them'.

...."By dint of this process, Christianity is in effect drained of its universal applicability. It
....becomes, instead, merely a ratification of something much more parochial. Christianity is
....in effect made synonymous with the values of Middle America; God is perceived as
.... a patron of, say, Peoria, Illinois, and such places come to be seen as blueprints,
....so to speak, for Paradise."


....M. Baigent, R. Leigh, and H. Lincoln, "The Messianic Legacy"

------------

The 20th century barely survived its two psuedo-religions: Nazi-ism and Communism.
Four years into the 21st century, Washington, D.C. is looking like 1975 Saigon, as
fundamentalist guerillas, supported by the tank battalions of Big Oil, close in on the
hapless defenders of the U.S. Constitution.

Those defenders expected their opponents to play by the standard rules of politics,
i.e., to, in the old American tradition, "play fair". But the fundamentalists had learned
that they could not compete with open government and conventional argumentation.
They were completely outgunned. So, they fell back on the classic tactic of the
underdog: guerilla warfare.

It is hardly a uniquely American tactic. Separatists and anti-colonial movements have
used guerilla tactics for centuries. Anti-Royalists in France formed an armed guerilla
resistance called the Fronde, which was more Catholic than the King. This movement
often linked up with ultra-Catholic nobles like the Guise family. Such movements often
outlive their founding political purpose, and survive as religious tribes within a nation.
The Fronde festered in the provinces for over a century, participating in risings against
both Louis XIV and Napoleon.

It may be that the current American Fronde can be traced back to the racial tribalism
of the Ku Klux Klan. The Klan ran a paramilitary organization that flouted government
authority when it wasn't being surreptitiously run by elected officials. It used secrecy
and brutality to intimidate its white opponents, and justified its lynchings with the
Bible. The Klan did not limit itself to hating blacks and Jews. It hated intellectuals,
and was heavily involved in the anti-Darwin agitation surrounding the Scopes
Trial. As recently as two years ago, Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott was out-ed
as catering to the Sons of the Confederacy - yet another unrepentant, revisionist
defender of Confederate slavery.

Given this French and American history, and given the success of the Viet Cong in
a thirty year guerilla war, you have to wonder just how blind the 1980s liberals were.
They had seen the overt, conventional right wing disintegrate in the 1970s, as Nixon
took the GOP and the CIA down with him; and they naively thought they were in total
control - the same thing the Shah of Iran thought. Like the Shah, the liberals did not
see the covert, guerilla movement coming. Admittedly, it was a sudden thing on a
historical scale - driven by the Roe v. Wade decision, the school prayer decision,
the 1970s stagflation, budget deficits, trade deficits, and oil shocks.

But, what my survey of the American Fronde has shown is that what was sudden was
not the anti-government, fundamentalist sentiment. Rather, what was sudden was the
massive funding and media-savvy organization to focus it.

Much as North Viet Nam, China, and Russia provided military supplies and safe bases
to the Viet Cong. The big money of reactionary conservatives, like the Coors brothers,
provided the fundamentalists with an untouchable supply depot; and the liberals' respect
for religious freedom gave them an untouchable sanctuary. Like the Viet Minh attacking
Dien Bien Phu, the fundamentalists began their campaign by laying siege to the foolishly
forward base of the "liberal media" and the political think tanks. With reactionary money,
they manufactured their own think tanks, and they bought their own media. In ten
short years, between 1980 and 1990, they pulverized the liberal media and began a
drive to media concentration and dominance that is today equivalent to a privatized
fundamentalist Propaganda Ministry.

The initial guerilla cadres of this movement came, not from religious fanatics, but from the
disgraced covert ops wing of the military-industrial complex. Cynical opportunists, like
Chuck "I'd run over my grandmother" Colson, founded Christian ministries. Drug-running
spooks like Ted Shackley shilled among the Fundamentalists for money for the Afghan
guerillas. Out-of-work intelligence people, such as Oliver North, set up their money-laundering,
drug-funded apparatus inside their own country. Like some American Frei Korps, they
became street agitators. They played the classic "liberals stabbed us in the back" gambit
about our defeat in Viet Nam and spouted the "spendthrift liberal" canard about an economy
wrecked by massive inflation induced by war deficits and oil-shocks.

These fundamentalist guerillas attacked the supply lines of conventional politics. They
have screamed for tax cuts night and day, boom or bust, surplus or deficit. They have
constantly sniped at the educational system that supplied critical thinking, training in
democratic principles, and the historical facts needed to apply the thinking to the problems
of the day. They won a huge victory over democracy when the Fairness Doctrine was repealed,
and the floodgates opened to pure propaganda.

That moment marked the kind of change that occurred when the North Vietnamese
started fielding entire infantry divisions in a South Viet Nam softened up by guerilla
actions and nests of spies and nationalist patriots. The moment the Fairness Doctrine
went down, up rose Rush Limbaugh and his ilk. It is true that they were lavishly funded
by the newly reactionary owners of the media, but they honestly did attract the fundamentalist
true believer. The cadres had created a sea to swim in.

----

But this extended analogy gives too much credit to the anti-democracy forces at large
in America. The North Vietnamese were principled people. Ho Chi Minh was a great
nationalist leader who adopted Communism pragmatically, as a means to obtaining
arms and support. His troops were rarely accused of atrocities because they were
genuine patriots who could not afford to alienate their countrymen. The North Viet-
namese moral never cracked under a decade of strategic bombing by the world's
most powerful air force.

The leaders of the guerilla movement in America, on the other hand, are often the same
CIA people who "handled" the Meo hill tribesmen. Those tribesmen from the boondocks
were recruited by the CIA to be a counter-insurgency against the Communists. The CIA
supplied guns to these primitives, inserted Green Berets to train them, and turned them
loose on their traditional enemies, the Vietnamese. The Meo had no idea what the war
was about. They weren't committed ideologues, just simple-minded hired guns easily
manipulated into a ferocious battle that had nothing to do with them. Which brings us to
America's intellectually primitive tribes of Christian fundamentalists.

Actually, as the opening quotes point out, these people have slapped the name of Jesus
onto a patriarchal tribalism that dates from time immemorial. Men in charge; violence the
measure of power; and "otherness" in any form met with brutal suppression. There is
nothing Christian at all about their Old Testament ferocity and intolerance. Hence,
the increasing tendency to label these people "CHristians In Name Only" or CHINOs.

At least 20% of America is hard-core CHINO fundamentalist. That number grows to about
45% if you include Evangelical Christians and hard-right Catholics and Mormons. It is a
well-known fact of counter-insurgency warfare that you can sustain a guerilla movement
with the passive support of as little as 10% of the population in the absence of government
counter-represssion. And since "liberals" would never repress anyone, as it is against their
core principle of tolerance, the liberals have, for the last decade, found themselves totally
on the defensive against people who absolutely refuse to play fair, people who snipe and
sabotage - sometimes literally, as in the case of abortion doctors and clinics.

Today's situation in America resembles not only Saigon in 1975, but also China in 1948.
The liberals are trapped in the coastal cities. The liberals cannot walk on the ground in the
rural communities. The liberals are perceived as elitist parasites. Now, all of that made
sense when you were talking about the corrupt Chiang Kai Shek - whose wife became
a darling of the American right wing - in an impoverished country. But liberals genuinely
tried, by their own lights, to help America. They passed laws to increase civil rights, the
social safety net, and educational and job opportunity. When they were taken to task for
budget deficits, they listened and changed their ways. Even the triangulating Bill Clinton
provided the first economic benefits the lower classes in America had seen in twenty five
years.

----

The hatred against liberalism, then, is disproportionate to its so-called crimes; and, the
remedies offered by the corporate/spook cadre of the CHINO movement, while they may
provide spiritual benefits to fundamentalists, take away economic benefits.

As has been increasingly noticed in the bland acceptance of the Bush administration's
and the corporate media's complete detachment from reality, we are not dealing with
rational political and economic matters any longer. We are dealing with irrational religious
hatred that has been focussed into a weapon by shady characters formerly and/or currently
found in our intelligence and military apparatus. (It is both surreal and ironic that it is Sun
Myung Moon - KCIA asset, cult leader, America basher, and convicted fraudster, but still
the only genuine religious fanatic among the founders of this movement - had to rescue
the bloodthirsty CHINO, Jerry Fallwell, from bankruptcy.)

The educated, middle-class remnant of civic-minded, democracy-respecting Americans
has been maneuvered into a religious killing zone. A kill zone where anyone who says
he is for peace is somehow simultaneously not supporting our troops and not being a
"muscular Christian, doing his duty in the Crusade against Islam". A zone where Homeland
Security throws Quaker peace workers off airplanes. A zone where anyone who even states
the facts about the disastrous results our policies have produced in the Middle East is reviled
as "comforting the enemy and undermining our troops", while the incompetent running the
show is treated by the CHINO fire-breathers as, literally, the second coming of Christ. A zone
where, contrary even to the CHINOs' favorite misogynist Paul, the pie-in-the-sky end of
"democracy for the Middle East" justifies the criminal means of torture, indiscriminant bombing,
collective punishment, and the radioactive pollution of an entire country. A zone where
Supreme Court justices blandly lie about America being founded as a "Christian nation" and
are in a position to make that lie into reality.

While rational people are hemmed in, lunacy is given free rein. The White House is
handing out an unprecedented number of summer internships to students from a
two-year-old religious "college" founded in Washington D.C. A half dozen CHINO
Congressmen live collectively with CHINO seminarians in training. And, a recent article
disclosed that a high percentage of the "administrators" in Iraq were wet-behind-the-
ears kids who posted their suitably conservative resumes on the Heritage Foundation
web site. This isn't democracy; this isn't "the best and the brightest". It is tribalism.
It is a backlash against "soft" feminine values like peace, compromise, and tolerance.

That, my friends, is what we are up against: patriarchs out to re-enslave uppity women,
uppity niggers, godless geeks and nerds, perverted queers, and dirty foreigners. There
are two groups of patriarch wannabees: the super rich, and the barely-getting-by.
(As Springsteen sang: "Poor men want to be rich men, and rich men want to be kings.")
Its no surprise that neither group is middle class.

The elitists, gathered around Bush, want to regain their stranglehold over government
policy and to use that stranglehold to force the rest of the population down into
subservience. The Joe Six-packs, the Ralph Cramdens of America, they know they
are losers; but the Bushies have offered them the standard deal for jailers: if Joe
and Ralph toe the line, they can beat their wives and abuse their kids and drink their
paychecks at the corner bar because they are "pater familias". Neither group has any
use for democracy, except as an excuse when it works in their favor.

----

Liberals have been fighting a conventional war against the CHINOs, but such a strategy
is doomed to fail. We need to undertake the classic response to guerilla action: the drying
up of their bases of support; the identification and neutralization of their organizers.
Unless the middle class goes out on the streets, goes one on one with the sorry-ass
Ralph Kramdens of America, and unless they get their act together politically and kick
Bush out of the White House or at least the GOP out of Congressional majorities, we
are looking at a Tokugawa Shogunate in America for the rest of our lives and beyond:
cold-blooded killers and cynics milking the peasants and dictating the minutest details
of daily life in accordance with their version of religion and tradition.

However, unless we just want to descend to their level of "us and them" violence,
we must engage these extremely limited people in some kind of intellectual
discourse. Unfortunately, all these people know is their version of the Bible.
(You may be surprised about their version if you've never heard of the Scofield
Reference Bible.) So we are forced to engage them in theological argument,
and because they instantly denounce any non-fundamentalist Christian as
a demon or agent of Satan or somesuch, we must engage them in Biblical
argument.

Therefore, I challenge the theological arrogance of the CHINOs and the
total cynicism of affixing the name of Jesus to a program of mayhem and bigotry.

My God tells me that planet earth is like the parable of the talents. God has given
each generation of humans the set of resources created by the previous generation,
and he has asked them to be good curators of that gift. If a generation leaves the
world a better place for its children, my god says that that generation has done
well in his eyes. Because, as anyone who believes in a god knows, you truly
cannot take it with you.

Around 1980, the leaders of the U.S. inherited a world with about five
billion people. There were no major hot wars threatening civlization, and
the Cold War was entering its final stages, unbeknownst to many at the time.
Countries in South America and Africa were beginning to experience positive
growth. Life expectancy was increasing, education was increasing,
smallpox was being wiped out, the food supply was being increased.
In short, the world inherited by those in power in 1980 was a getting
better.

Cut to today. The population has grown by a billion and it has become
much more economically segregated. Poverty levels, illiteracy levels,
and disease levels are all up sharply. In spite of their being less of
a military threat, we are spending more money than ever on defense.
We have the largest prison population on the planet. In some states,
we spend more on prisons than on higher education. Pollution is up
dramatically, especially in poorer locales, which have become dumping
grounds. The world offers less opportunity to our children, and George
W. Bush is in the process of handing them half a trillion (with a T) dollars
of debt a year. The world has gotten nastier every year the GOP have
held office since 1980.

Here are some biblical questions for the CHINOs:

Who says God isn't going to judge us by how we invested our wealth
to improve the lot of the six billion less fortunate people on the planet?
And I don't mean, we created some shitty sweatshops for child labor so
that the "miracle of the marketplace" will improve their illiterate lives.

Why has making money become the religion of America and making
peace (without making a desert and calling it peace) become the work
of Satan? Why do CHINOs think Al Gore is evil, but have no problem
with Ken Lay going scott-free after robbing his employees and his investors
of billions of dollars?

Who says God isn't going to judge us on how we treated our Good
Samaritans, of whatever faith? With hundreds of religions anathematizing
each other and murdering each other over theological minutiae, who
says God does not honor goodness without creed?

Who says God wants us to tithe 10% to a church but cut government
taxes for peaceful purposes to nothing? Whatever happened to "render
unto Caesar"?

And, finally, how dare you try to encourage Armageddon? Religiously,
it is conjuring and witchcraft to try to force God to begin your so-called
end of days on your schedule. Rationally, it is a rush to planetary and
racial suicide. Why are you so-called peace-loving CHINOs so fixated
on war?

----

I'd love to hear in their responses some sign of awareness from the CHINOS
about the moral swamp into which they have dragged us all. But I expect to
hearnothing but the same poisonous scapegoating and denial of reality
that has gotten us to our present disastrous state.

The American version of the Khmer Rouge is upon us, and all that stands
between us and a continent-wide killing field is one trumped-up terrorist
attack/martial law declaration.I pray for my country and the small minority
of its citizens who are still exercising their free will.
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-29-04 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. Front page kick
Getting responses to these big essays is like to trying to light
a barbeque. You have to keep pouring on the lighter fluid and
throwing wood chips until it catches.

arendt
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bobbieinok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-29-04 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
2. impressive, as always ---------- 2 points I've been thinking about
Directed to the Chinos--

1- Jews were expecting a messiah as king. Jesus said several times, 'My kingdom is not of this earth.'

So isn't it a major heresy when Falwell, Robertson, et al want to set up a 'Christian' America?'

2- One point a great many 'born agains'/evangelicals make is that each person is unique. God has created each individual with his/her unique personality and set of gifts. And God has a unique plan for each individual. This is preached quite often.

So the question is 'How can you justify killing so many children in this 'Holy War against Islam?' You have destroyed unique personalities created by God for specific tasks; you have destroyed important parts of God's plan.

I'm working on these thoughts, trying to phrase them convincingly.
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-29-04 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Interesting reaction to the essay...
I didn't think of that.

Maybe we should start a thread of theologically well-posed
questions guaranteed to short out what little circuitry exists
in CHINO heads.

After we have collected them, and gamed them against the
likely responses, we could put them out along with the
parrys.

arendt
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
4. Sunday morning kick n/t
n/t
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Eloriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
5. Interesting. Some comments
This throws the whole thing off, IMO:

It may be that the current American Fronde can be traced back to the racial tribalism of the Ku Klux Klan.

UNLESS you're speaking of a far more narrow piece of what's going on than our whole current government (and if so, that's not clear in your essay).

Or maybe I should approach my comments from a completely different angle. Instead of disagreeing with parts and pieces, I should disagree basically with your whole premise. I see the CHINOS, as you call them, as but one flank who are basically used by the larger organizing principle, which is fascism. Or used by the organizers, who are fascists.

From the period of time before WW2 when major American industrialists supported Hitler -- Henry Ford, Prescott Bush and Averill Harriman and their business colleagues, Randolf Hearst who was paid by Hitler to print pro-Hitler propaganda in his newspapers, and others -- to Operation Paperclip and the Nazis who were brought in to help the new CIA fight Communism, right on down to George H.W. Bush who was in the CIA and in Dallas when Kennedy was assassinated and who later headed the CIA, on through CIA drug dealing in Vietnam and other SE Asia countries and the October Surprise which ended Carter's re-election chances which made GHWB Vice-president, continuing through Iran-Contra and other Reagan/Bush or Bush treasons (like the S&L boondoggle), picking up the Neo-Con fascists along the way, etc., etc., and ending up where we are today.

The goal is world domination, and frankly it took my breath away to learn just the other day that Nazis weren't just recruited for the U.S., but also for Great Britain and Italy:

Operation Gladio
http://www.copi.com/articles/guyatt/gladio.html

Operation Gladio
from the book
The CIAs Greatest Hits
by Mark Zepezauer
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/CIA%20Hits/Gladio_CIAHits.html

Operation Paperclip Casefile
http://www.conspiracyarchive.com/NWO/project_paperclip.htm

Which means we have nearly a world-wide cancer growing which was never fully extinguished at the end of WW2. And if you read DevilsAdvocatNZ's post re-posted in this thread:

Everyone who is a fan of the DLC, needs to read this post,
(Devils Advocate NZ's post is included)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/cgi-bin/duforum/duboard.cgi?az=show_thread&om=11323&forum=DCForumID60#114

you begin to see that the "plan" really is worldwide.

Here are some other DLC links to round out that part of the picture:
LINKS - What every DUer and every Dem needs to know about the DLC
http://www.democraticunderground.com/cgi-bin/duforum/duboard.cgi?az=show_thread&om=4443&forum=DCForumID22&archive=

Let's be REALLY honest about the DLC
http://www.democraticunderground.com/cgi-bin/duforum/duboard.cgi?az=show_thread&om=23262&forum=DCForumID60&archive=

Outing the "New Democrats" -- Pukes in Progressive Clothing.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/cgi-bin/duforum/duboard.cgi?az=show_thread&om=1435&forum=DCForumID34


Anyway, I am not saying your analysis is wrong, and it definitely has some interesting and useful points, just that it's not, IMO, a meta-analysis.
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. No disagreement; just a different emphasis
> UNLESS you're speaking of a far more narrow piece of what's going
> on than our whole current government (and if so, that's not clear in
> your essay).

We all have our own piece of the elephant (the old parable about the
three blind men...). But, I don't think what I said is contradicted but
what you are saying. I was focussing on the CHINOs, not their handlers.

> I see the CHINOS, as you call them, as but one flank who are basically
> used by the larger organizing principle, which is fascism. Or used by the
> organizers, who are fascists.

Right there in my title. Who do you think are the ex-spook handlers?
Lots of words in my essay about Ollie North, etc.

We all understand that CHINOs are being manipulated by this
corporate/spook cabal. I wanted to focus on the fact that once
people as dumb and stubborn as the CHINOs are put in play,
the object of their hatred has a big problem. If the cabal vaporized
tomorrow, these people would simply grow a new head and
keep at it. The phenomenon is now self-sustaining. That was
my point.

I have no disagreement with anything you say. My fear is that.,
as the Nazi pseudo-religion swept aside the corporate "handlers"
of Wilhemine Germany and the Wehrmact, some CHINO fruticake,
like Judge Roy Moore, will hijack the GOP and create a theocracy
with a satchel full of nuclear weapons.

So, my focus is not on the slimy CIA/fascist thugs. My focus is
on the fanatic mob they have created and unleashed. These
guys are doing a remake of "The Sorcerer's Apprentice", only
the sorcerer is old Adolph.

arendt

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Alerter_ Donating Member (898 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 10:29 AM
Response to Original message
6. Time to protest CHINO churches on Sunday mornings
The war pictures and Abu Ghraib signs and relevant Bible verses. I suspect this tactic will blow the fundie churches wide open. It's time to show the perversion of war to the people who think they support it. The TV is not going to.
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 10:41 AM
Response to Original message
7. Great essay. I'm just not so sure about our options though.
Playing theological games one-on-one might be fun but I don't see it breaking the National/Worldwide media vice grip that now controls the minds of so many people that are being used by the Theo-Fascists.

Other than that the connections between people like Falwell, Moon, Bush, Delay, Ashcroft (Lost to a dead guy) and those "Jesus Plus Nothing" fruitcakes, is terrifying.

They have waged a brillient guerilla war for Plutocratic Theo-Fascism and frankly the options for us, those who don't subscribe to it, are diminishing.

Nice essay though, thanks:-)

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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. I didn't say to ONLY play one-on-one games...
We have to do that AND we have to beat Bush.

Still, we are going to have to cordon off this CHINO poison
before they take over more school boards, more hospitals,
more faith-based programs.

How do you think the CHINOs got where they are. They did
it with these one-on-one games. They did it by "stealth"
candidates for the local party. And we are going to have
to undo it the same way.

If you want a tolerant country, you are going to have to
expose these people for what they are. I'm sure that if
I looked inside the local volunteers for the police stateTIPS
programs, I would find a large CHINO group busy blackening
the names of people like you and me who dared to have
a thought contrary to Bush's.

I think, given the fact that the papers are finally reporting some
of this stuff, that the big boys have had enough of Bush and
they want him out before he does any more damage. Of course,
like the German industrialists, it may be too late. One more
phony, staged terrorist attack and we could be a dictatorship.

So, do what you can, while you still can.

arendt
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. How do we "Cordon of this CHINO poison"?
By trying to replicate what they've been doing for thirty some odd years? Sort of seems late in the game for that. A "Movement" to take over the very things that they seized takes not only the foot soldiers, of which we have many, but the money to support them, which AFAIK we are sorely lacking in. That's what really got the CHINOS where they are in my opinion.

But since, short of armed rebellian, that's about all we've got in our arsenal I suppose it's worth trying.

Obviously a Kerry victory would create a hiccup in the Theo-Fascists plan so it's worth the effort, OTH if he fails then it's a long shot.

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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Donate to PFAW, TIA, MoveOn, and other pro-separation of C&S groups
Edited on Sun May-30-04 02:00 PM by arendt
> the money to support them, which AFAIK we are sorely lacking in.
> That's what really got the CHINOS where they are in my opinion.

Yes, I mentioned the suddenness of the money influx in my essay.

Months ago I wrote an essay in which I said the American political
parties were now essentially Whigs (Dems) and Tories (GOP).
Kerry is a Whig. He is conservative, pro-business, and patriotic.
The Whigs are afraid that the Tories are bad for business. Business
being the raison d'etre of Whiggery, they are gearing up to spend
big money and try to peel away some of the more rational of
Bush's worshippers.

Make no mistake the Whigs are spending money o bring
America back from the extreme, lunatic right only as far as
the gray, corporate, friendly fascist right. The corporate right
instead of the religious right.

So, the money is there to support Kerry as long as he stays on
the reservation. I'm waiting to see whether bashing CHINOs is
on or off the reservation. In a few speeches Kerry has said that
he doesn't wear his faith on his sleeve, and "where are the good
works?" or somesuch. If he doesn't get shutdown by his corporate
funders for that, it may be open season on the loony right.

I don't mind being called the loony left if it is legal to send money to
MoveOn. (Thank god for the 527 FEC decision.) I don't have to
fund Kerry, just vote for him.

arendt

arendt
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 05:03 PM
Response to Original message
12. kick n/t
n/t
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 06:36 PM
Response to Original message
13. kick again n/t
n/t
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bobbieinok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
14. some possible historical points
When did Robertson start CBN? late 70s, I think

The role of Paul Weyrich....he bankrolled a lot of the RW groups, mailings, the religious right

They really got going nationally in an organized fashion when they stopped the Equal Rights Amendment dead. I was in IA at the time and remember the massive religious right + Mormon front groups that pursued an extremely successful drive to have IA vote to withdraw the legislature's approval of the ERA. (The state had passed the amendment in a period when most people thought it was the right thing to do; the religious right worked hard against this, claiming among other things that the ERA would legalize homosexuality.)
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-30-04 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Good milestones; but I'm as hazy on them as you are.
I will have to do some research.

But, its true that the defeat of the ERA was the last time the
sane people in this country were on the offensive.

The Mormons have faded into the background compared
to the more crazed CHINOs.

Do you know if they have "mellowed" ? Or have the extremists
gone too far for them? Or are they right out there with the nut
cases? I mean, where are the CHINOs on polygamy, tithing,
Church charity, etc?

arendt
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Tight_rope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-31-04 12:37 AM
Response to Original message
16. kick ...........n/t
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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-31-04 12:43 AM
Response to Original message
17. Kick
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-31-04 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
18. Last day of holiday weekend kick n/t
n/t
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bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-31-04 12:10 PM
Response to Original message
19. How the CIA and Harvard "built an elite" for Ford in Indonesia
when first published in 1959 American University's William Hanna called US backed Indonesian coup "a new form of government, military-private enterprise..."

Read this slowly and try to see how we now resemble that in many professions and in many ways-an elite has been created, outsourced and is imposing an agenda on the PEOPLE. This model seems to fit our present time imho and life experience.
http://www.cia-on-campus.org/internat/indo.html

Btw, don't forget the role of PSYOPS and disinfo in this "war on terrorism" which means US Army Military Intelligence and the Defense Intelligence Agency and the rich historical contributions of US Army Col. Michael Aquino the former Church of Satan priest that replaced that cult/religion with his own Temple of Set in 1975 while listed on active duty. Let's be open and factual now.

Temple of Set Statement to US Armed Forces (see Temple of Set)
http://www.nightspell.dhs.org/

Temple of Set history
http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu/nrms/satanism/tempset.html

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id163/pg1/

Charges of Nazi and fascist ideologies present in Temple of Set "refuted"
http://www.necronomi.com/magic/satanism/fascist.set.txt

PSYOPS: The "Temple of Set" and mob psychology
http://www.answers.google.com/answers/main?cmd=threadview&id=205198

I know Aquino was involved in the illegal MH CHAOS in 1969, he and his wife Lillith were investigated but never charged with anything in The Presidio molestation cases.

Aquino's name is also part and parcel of the callboy ring and Franklin Mint investigations.

Abu Ghraib, spooks that follow the legacy of Col. Aquino gained "influence" over command, right?

NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW.
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-01-04 07:12 AM
Response to Reply #19
22. Holy S*** - not more of this "Council of Nine" crapola!
I only looked at one of your URLs, and it was enough to ruin
my day.

In "The Stargate Conspiracy", the authors ?Picknett and Prince?
detail how the CIA may be behind all the New Age nonsense -
Bauval and Hancock and all the hysterical nonsense at the
pyramids - SRI, Edgar Cayce, Hall of Records... (Not to mention
UFOs and the whole LSD scene. I'm with Frank Zappa: "the sixties
was just one big CIA experiment with drugs.")

P&P detail how many places the Council of Nine has popped
up, and tied them all back to the psych-spooks - Andrea ?Pukarich?,
the Esalen Institute, Uri Geller (mixed up with Mossad), etc.

I am hardlly surprised to hear of them again. Its just I've never
heard of the Temple of Set. I know something about Egyptian
theology, and Set killed Osiris, but black magic? Don't know.
Will investigate.

Thanks for the depressing links (seriously, I can't turn away
from horror stories).

arendt
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TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-31-04 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
20. Kick - can I post this on my website?
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arendt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-01-04 06:58 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. Sure, just tell me where to look for it...
These are my fifteen minutes of semi-non-obscurity, and I
like to bask in all the Martian daylight I can get. :-).

arendt
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-01-04 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. Kick!
:kick:
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