Olberman: Fallout from Hurricane on Jeb and George's Heads........

Did you see Olberman's "Countdown" last night?? He did a piece on the Politics of Disaster, and it was the first news I've heard of grumblings beginning to surface down in Florida.

First part of piece was Kerry making his statement urging his people in Florida to help victims. He then featured Kerry's remarks about not going right now to Florida so that important police resources, etc. would not be diverted to his visit which Olberman used to emphasize that it was a "swipe" at Bush (Olberman's on our side and it was a great put down of Bush). Then he went to Craig Crawford to assess political fallout of it all.

Crawford said that there was already complaints coming out of Florida. He said that when the weather people predict landfall of these storms they hedge their bets by indicating a wide swath were it could make landfall. He said that Jeb concentrated everything on the Tampa area and, thus, the areas that took the direct brunt were not warned and evacuations attempted until it was basically too late. He said there IS going to be politcal fallout on the head of Jeb and that, by association, it's going to hurt George (I'm also sure the people in those areas who feel they were not properly warned are going to look at Georgie coming down as a cheap political trick to try and bail his brother from their wrath).

Crawford also made a remark I couldn't hear very well. I thought he said that those counties hit the hardest were counties that were pro-Bush in 2000 election (maybe he said they weren't---I couldn't hear). Anyway I got the gist that they will be important counties for Bush if he is to win this time.

Would like to hear from Florida people or people who are in contact with Florida people and ask you if you've heard any such rumblings starting to develop down there?? Be interesting if the media would cover them; but if they start coming out in various newspapers, it could be a disaster for both Bush boys.

Olberman needs to have his own network. He is simply NOT afraid to report the truth. :-)

Crawford said that the counties hit were SWING COUNTIES in a SWING STATE and implied a problem for Bush.

therefore going to be a real problem for Bush. I'm so waiting to hear if what he said about the grumblings start hitting papers down there because that's the only way they will make it on national news. Apparently, according to him, Jeb screwed up and just did not get these counties and areas alerted in time to evacuate even though they were indicated in the warnings by the forecasters. Hopefully some astute Dems down there will start pointing this out to the papers.

He was basically mouthing the BFEE/Rove line and talking about the optimistic spirit would take over.

He seems to be in line to be the next Zell Miller.

to turn disasters in their favor - you know it will be deja vu - Dumbya standing on a pile of rubble in Florida - yelling I hear you, and I care, now vote for me!

Just ask NYers; also, if he stands on a pile of rubble and says vote for me it's likely to piss off Floridians who aren't thinking about votes right now. He wouldn't be that stupid....oh I forgot!....

Bush would not be there if it were a blue state instead. I'm so sorry for all these victims; losing all their belongings, and the loss of loved ones is just so sad. This has to be one of the most traumatic experiences of a lifetime.

I did think at the time (ie., before Charley made landfall) that the evacuations were in a fairly narrow swath, esp. considering the overall danger.

Good if it bites them in the butt. I think they've been slow to react afterwards too. And the National Guard issue (the lack of them). Yup. Good.

Georgie's mouth down there?? Everything is WE ARE PREPARED; WE ARE SO PREPARED; NO ONE ON GOD'S EARTH WAS EVER SO PREPARED, etc. because of the total fuck up of Papa hanging over their heads like a dirty secret in the family closet. Yet, it sounds from Crawford's report that they fumbled the football. Why is there something with all of this that sounds like divine justice to this family???----God revisits Papa's screw up as his two useless sons stand knee deep in the same rubble and could be smelling the death of their own political futures. Spookey.............

the many, many people who were in the path of that storm who are one paycheck or Social Security check away from financial disaster. The real story is of the thousands of elderly living in flimsy mobile homes because they are inexpensive and the state does not appear to have any regulations requiring them to be hurricane safe. The real story will be the number of people in Florida who went off the cliff on Friday and may never be able to put their lives back together.

It is so, so tragic.

their overtime pay.

longer than one election cycle I'm afraid.
Meanwhile, assessment of political fallout from this are premature. It will take a few days longer at least. Maybe a week or 2.

Hurricanes are unimaginally horrible things. Being a Bush adminstration, I doubt they were very well prepared. The horror will unfold in the coming days and weeks.

night. Thank you so much for this report from the Olberman show.

To me, the one good thing is that it is election time and they have to help to these poor people. Even though they are probably the chickens who vote for Colonel Sanders. It's still no fun to have your life's belongings wiped out and some even their life.

"the elderly" with not a great gob of money. If then, Jeb did divert most of his attention and resources to the rich Tampa area and ignored these people until almost too late, that is a big story right there. I hope these people move fast to put the pressure on Jeb and George because come the day after the Nov. elections, they will leave them to rot.

He and Jeb haven't done shit and I think it is far more obvious this time than during 9/11.

I haven't seen the show and Thanks for the post!

and Orlando, Winter Park and other cities were hit also (you aren't hearing much about them) and they aren't filled with poor people in "mobile homes" living on SS checks.

This was huge devastation in a 200 mile swatch through Florida. It hit everyone Rich, Poor and in-between. Jeb should have been more prepared.

the only people hit by the storm were poor people but most people living on Sanibel and Captiva will have a cushion to fall back on. I was struck by the number of people interviewed on NPR who said that they had nothing. I was also surprised that there are not building regulations in Florida to make these mobile homes safer.

devastation than they are focusing on...looking at it from the fact that media focuses on PuntaGorda, but that there's more, that they aren't talking about... And even Sanibel and Captiva had folks running businesses and living modestly there who aren't able to cope with this, and how it will pull their businesses under...

The whole thing is dreadful for everyone there...Peace!

. . . that the people of Sanibel and Captiva had a mandatory evacuation order. I don't believe Punta Gorda had mandatory orders to evacuate. That's curious IMO.

TYY

Unfortunately, it was a little to late. I just got my power back on about two hours ago. It's a mess down here.

Looks like another two or three days before we get hooked up again. We were lucky and had no structural damage to the house. The problem was that all the old oak trees acted like sails in the wind. They were toppled and had no place to land but on the power lines.

TV said last night that a half million homes in greater orlando were without power. Just a note to those who might envy floridians. Florida is definately not a nice place to live without a/c. Ninety degrees, with the humidity to match numbers.

Meanwhile, we are roughing it at the Marriott.

. . . it was only voluntary, and as you say, late at that. By the time the hurricane had changed from a category 2 to a category 3 (briefly) and then to a category 4 (in less than 45 minutes) and was heading straight for Charlotte Harbor there was no time to evacuate; with the possible exception of finding a local shelter. The last place you want to be in a category 4 hurricane is in your car and stuck in a traffic jam while trying to make a last minute dash for safety.

EVACUATIONS: Mandatory for visitors, nonresidents and mobile home residents in Monroe County (Florida Keys). Pinellas and Hillsborough counties have asked up to 680,000 Tampa Bay residents to evacuate from coastal or low-lying areas. Mandatory for tourists and residents of coastal areas of Lee, Sarasota, Hernando counties, Manatee, Pasco and Marco Island, Everglades City, and points in Naples in Collier County. Voluntary for people in Glades, Levy, Charlotte, DeSoto, Taylor, and other parts of Collier County that aren't mandatory.

http://cbs4.com/floridanews/FL--TropicalWeather-D-dn/resources_news_html

TYY

Jeb Bush predictions? Don't meterologists still work down there? Did the press give more attention to sadistic Jeb and ignore the meterologists? Did Jeb issue special orders? Did he call the path? I don't exactly understand? Was Jeb being political in an intruding and dangerous way?

I lived in FL and I don't ever remember anyone listening to a Gov instead of the weatherman when a hurricane was coming. What's changed down there?

..they said that in these situations that the forecasters always "hedge their bets" because of how unpredictable these things can be and warn people that a large swath could end up being in the path of the storm's direct hit. They did this also in tis case. BUT Jeb decided to issue the emergency warnings, evacuations and all the personnel and money that goes with such warnings for basically Tampa and ignored these other areas that should have been undergoing evacuations until the deadly last moment when the storm turned. He was given the "wide area" that could be hit; but, like his brother, the big man 'called it' and like his brother's decisions over the last 4 years, it was, well, disasterous.

But let's all be mindful that the government must maintain emergency services the are responsive for the whole coast. It is not a matter of conectrating resources in the best-guess scenario. Jeb and Bubba sent too much Guard into Iraq and neglected to bolster emergency managements tools, failed to build FEMA and help Red-Cross at a time when we all know that a big hurricane in the modern age can effect millions of people. After Hugo, there should have been a massive infrastructure of evacuation plans, temporay services to the needy and dislocated, emergency housing, mobile water treatment and chlorination facilities, food banks and distribution, volunteer organizations for implementation of emergency services and security needs, temporary primary education facilities for kids starting the school year, heavy equipment, search and rescue, fire containment, hazzardous cleanup, ship salaage and channel clearing, traume counselors, field communication and lost family facilities, temporary lost pet shelters...WTF!

How come nobody ever loses their jobs when these things happen!

and they were saying that they needed water and food--they lived in a trailer park in Punta Gorda--the worst hit area in Florida and that they had seen no officals in their community at all--except for the NBC news crew-whom they thanked on air for giving them the snacks and water they had with them. This is on Sunday morning after the hurricane hit on Friday night--in the worst part area of the state--what does that tell you? Help is NOT getting to these folks no matter what BushCo are claiming! Trust me, the people there will raise hell and you will hear more about the lack of help in the initial hours following the hurricane--when you need help the most (I'm a Hugo survivor myself-I know firsthand). This will come back and bite them in the ass.

the great managerial decisions of the Bush Boys can't seem to get even a sandwich and a glass of water to them. Now, America, do you understand why the Bushes are incompetent and, thereby, dangerous to our health??? This terrible disaster in Florida could just end up hammering that point home to the nation. Could be that within the month George will be spouting, "what brother; I don't have a brother"........and Papa will claim that Jeb was adopted ..

that being adopted makes a child a REAL part of the family, right?

Just a friendly reminder from a mom, who got that name through adoption.

from the NG and Clinton.

That improving response time and coordination of FEMA was a major priority under the Clinton administration.

those decisions are made at the local level based on information provided by local meteorologists and the National Hurricane Center. Jeb has nothing to do with predicting the path or ordering evacuations. As I said below, as much as I would love to blame Jeb, I can't.

The weathermen predicted landfall in Tampa, but they frequently say that it could change direction and that they don't know for sure. The weathermen only give their best estimates. They frequently mentioned that there was a hurricane warning for most of the west coast. Anyone on the west coast should have went inland. People need to be responsible for their own personal safety too.

I can't. Evacuation decisions are made at the County level. Zoning and hurricane building codes are also made at the local level. There were madatory evacuations all along the west coast from the Keys to north of Tampa. The evacuation orders and the individual residents' decision whether to follow them were based on the best information available. I know, I was watching the updates on tv and online. Up until 2 hours before Charley hit land, it was headed towards Tampa and was a Category 2. Even though I live within 2 miles of the coast, I wasn't even advised to voluntarily evacuate because I am 150 miles south of Tampa and my area is rated to be safe through a Category 3 because of our elevation (12 ft). We didn't evacuate even though we don't have hurricane shutters. By the time Charley changed course and became a 4, it was too late for us to safely go anywhere. I only know of one neighbor who left and she left 3 days before Charley hit.
What people don't realize is that evacuating isn't always possible. There are only enough shelters for maybe 5-10% of the residents. We in SW Florida are pretty isolated and there is only a 2 lane road out of here in either direction. You can't evacuate everyone unless you start a few days before the hurricane hits. I have 3 dogs and a cat, shelters don't allow animals (even crated) so my only choice would be to leave my animals to fend for themselves, something I would only do if I was forced.
I do think it is completely fair to blame Shrub for the complete lack of National Guard and other troops.

evacuate and you live 150 miles away. But that was the gist of the report on Olberman. This type of info was given to Jeb by the forecasters because they said it could hit directly in these areas; but the decisions were centered around Tampa and other areas ignored. In other words, there should have been either voluntary warnings stressed in the other areas or even mandatory evacuations started in the days before. The state government was advising the counties of where this was going to hit and they took it upon their own shoulders to ignore broader area warnings that the weather center gave them.

The warnings are issued by the National Hurricane Center - not by Jeb. Each Florida county has an emergency operations center that makes the decisions and orders evacuations. The information and predictions come from the National Hurricane Center - not from Jeb. Each County got the same information from the NHC and made their own decision regarding their residents. I hate the guy, but I can't blame him for this.

...the citizens of their respective states from threatening weather.

Sorry, but Jebbie is squarely on the hot seat for failing to publicly order a mandatory evacuation of the low-lying areas along the coast in the path of Hurricane Charley.

I have to disagree. I have been through a few hurricanes and other natural disasters myself and also worked with disaster relief and I do believe that Jeb and his administration failed in this case.

Don't you want to know that if something like Charley ever happens again there will better preparation? Or would you accept the same thing happening?

They are enforced on the local level but there are state building codes and there is even a national building code. Localities can institute additional regulations if they wish but the state code governs. In Massachusetts there are new building regulations for housing along the coast that specifically address hurricane proofing homes.

The state of Florida has its own building codes, including hurricane standards. Counties are free to enact stronger building codes but they are not forced to. Many coastal counties have some additional hurricane requirements. the toughest are those in Miami Dade (which were enacted after Hurricane Andrew). My county's requirements are less than those in Miami Dade but tougher than those in Charlotte County. The decision to enact tougher building codes is made on the local level. Since Charlotte County hadn't seen a hurricane in almost a century, their county officials didn't feel the need to enact the stricter codes, especially those involving mobile homes. That isn't Jeb's fault.

mean more expensive housing for the people who can least afford it. Unfortunateky, they end up being hurt the most!

But planning and preparation can be done well or poorly, and I believe both could have been done better.

And the administration of what plan they had seems to be even worse.

If they were gonna serve the millions in Tampa Bay, then why haven't they got the help to the few hundred thousand who live just 150 miles away? Three hours away from Tampa by road, are thousands of people who are now without water, food, etc. If the state had a good plan on place, the help planned for millions would have arrived that night for the fewer hundred thousand.

A more honest approach would have been that there is no way they could prepare. But that's not what Jeb said, eh? They are not prepared, they never were. Bush lied, people died.

workplace safety codes, nuclear reactor codes, food, medicine codes are all in the dumpster now. How many industries has this administration already de-regulated that impacts us at the local level?

...he is responsible for making informed decisions to protect the citizens of Florida.

And that's the bottom line in this discussion. No amount of excuses will absolve Jebbie for failing to make the right decisions in the face of an oncoming hurricane.

my god, the man has purged voter rolls, broken the bank, his wife and all his kids have been arrested, his extramarital affair is the nation's worst kept secret. i don't see how a natural disaster can penetrate his teflon...

his wife was arrested for smuggling, his older daughter 3-4 times for various drug charges, his son for vandalizing his ex-girlfriend's property, and his younger daughter for reasons i can't recall. And of course jeb's girlfriend was on the state payroll for a long time.

mall with his girlfriend--that would be jebbie jr.
He told the police, "My dad will take care of this."

Was he dating Katerine Harris?

who worked in the state "specal projects" office :evilgrin:. She recently was caught by her husband of 3 months with yet another man in the sack. I can't remember her name though. Supposedly Columba caught her & Jeb in bed once, too.

BBC style piece.

best prepared state in the country, in terms of homeland security.

With the money his brother has poured into the state, it should be.

But in terms of 1st reponders to an emergency, if this is the best, what is the worst?

to do nothing. My husbands DMAT team has been in two diff cities doing nothing since yesterday morning. The Govt cant seem to figure out where to send them...they are only needed everywhere!

I don't see a story here??????

evacuations. Here in SC the governer orders evacs, often (as in this case) of the entire low lying coast. Of course SC learned a very hard lesson about hurricanes from Hugo, but FL has obviously had just as hard or harder lessons from Andrew etc.

Are any of the "news" people talking about the lack of NG?

I think one station did a report on the National Guard, but from what I saw, there were only like 5 or 6 them.

Mostly they just keep thanking God that the hurricane turned where it did sparing the Tampa Bay area. Apparently, God likes Tampa Bay better than Port Charlotte according to these people.

A few have said, most notably on the local Fox affiliate, that in natural disasters, we should all transcend politics and help as best we can to clean up and let the state officials do their job and hope those affected are able to get on with their lives as soon as possible. Kind of reminded me of the network news after December 12, 2000 and all the talking heads saying we should all get behind Bush because he's "our president" now.

"meteorologists" or just plain weather forecasters were guaranteeing that Tampa was gonna get hit. As of 7 a.m. Friday these jokers were basically calling their viewers delusional if they didn't believe this most dire prediction. Also, Sarasota/Pinellas officials got the majority of air time/exposure with little regard being given to the lower west coast folks. I can understand the focus being on the most heavily populated area of the coast but to the exclusion of all others it did seem curious.

I figured, initially, Jebthro was gonna take care of KKKatherine's constituency above all else. The media will probably make it a hindsight issue due to the rapid strengthening and unexpected landfall since these storms are unpredictable. Too bad we can't say the same for them.

that downloads automatically all of the Nexrad NWS radar frames as they are input into the NWS computer. It's as real time as you can get. At 10:30, I noticed a definite turn to the NE, but was not sure if it would continue. Hurricanes wobble, causing short periods of anomalous movement direction.

By noon, there was no doubt in my mind. That was 1.5 hours of NE movement. Note that Nexrad NWS radars give you a new frame about every 5 minutes. So that's about 18 radar frames of constant NE movement by noon. It was obvious to me. At 18 MPH, during this period of time, the storm moved approximately 27 miles in a NE direction, but the NWS did not see a directional change worthy of modifying their warnings and advisories? I think the TV stations began reporting this at about 3PM.

It was not a large storm, and the extra 3 hours would have been very helpful. At 1 PM, the weather was not bad at all. They had at least 2-3 hours to get away from the shoreline, and to get out of trailers and rickety buildings.

Not sure how this relates to Jeb and his brother. I think the reports of bad response the last two days, along with not being nimble enough in shifting resources, is the ticket to hurting both Bushes.

he said that Bush's trip was definitely politically motivated and he just hopes that he brings some money too. He was the only one that they asked and I found it interesting that 1) they actually asked him the question and 2)his comments were the ones that they aired.

Hopefully most see this trip for the photo op that it is.

Miracle!

Imagine that getting out on tv.

on edit~ When you think of all the fawning I heard was going on cnn.

But in relation to gay rights (which isn't on the political radar right at the moment)