History buffs: Please help me out with the war of 1812

I am wondering about the cause of it, why the brits invaded us (again), what ended it, etc. After becoming independent in 1776, did they think that they could beat us the second time??

short answer is:

Start of war: impressment of U.S. Citizens into the British Navy during Napoleanic Wars with Britain and France. You know, the Brit's would just snatch Americans off their boats at sea and put them into the British military against their will.

Ended: Battle of New Orleans. That's quite an interesting battle. Brits should have won it....like other battles they should have easily won in the Revolutionary War....long story...

the treaty of ghent ended the war, but cnn was a bit slow in those days. news hadn't reached new orleans and the culmination of a series of battles for new orleans took place weeks after the treaty was signed.

This song by Johnny Horton had good sales in the '60s:

link for the music to sing with is http://www.niehs.nih.gov/kids/lyrics/battleof.htm


In 1814 we took a little trip
along with Colonel Jackson down the mighty Mississip.
We took a little bacon and we took a little beans
And we caught the bloody British in the town of New Orleans.

We fired our guns and the British kept a'comin.
There wasn't nigh as many as there was a while ago.
We fired once more and they began to runnin' on
down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

We looked down the river and we seen the British come.
And there must have been a hundred of'em beatin' on the drum.
They stepped so high and they made the bugles ring.
We stood by our cotton bales and didn't say a thing.

We fired our guns and the British kept a'comin.
There wasn't nigh as many as there was a while ago.
We fired once more and they began to runnin'
on down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

Old Hickory said we could take 'em by surprise
If we didn't fire our muskets til we looked 'em in the eyes
We held our fire til we seen their faces well.
then we opened up with squirrel guns and really gave 'em..well.

We fired our guns and the British kept a'comin.
There wasn't nigh as many as there was a while ago.
We fired once more and they began to runnin'
on down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

Yeah, they ran through the briars and they ran through the brambles
And they ran through the bushes where a rabbit couldn't go.
They ran so fast that the hounds couldn't catch 'em
on down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

We fired our cannon til the barrel melted down.
So we grabbed an alligator and we fought another round.
We filled his head with cannon balls and powdered his behind
and when we touched the powder off, the gator lost his mind.

We fired our guns and the British kept a'comin.
There wasn't nigh as many as there was a while ago.
We fired once more and they began to runnin'
on down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

Yeah, they ran through the briars and they ran through the brambles
and they ran through the bushes where a rabbit couldn't go.
they ran so fast that the hounds couldn't catch 'em
on down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

Hup 2, 3, 4. Sound off 3, 4.... Hup 2, 3, 4.
Sound off 3, 4.... Hup 2, 3, 4

We beat the British in New Orleans!

:nopity:

The real issues were
1)the British blockade of European ports, which was harming American trade
2)Invasion of Canada- the original war hawks(this was the birth of that term)thought the Canadians would greet them with flowers and candy

The Brits burned down Washington DC and would have kicked our asses if they hadn't been preoccupied with a more pressing war in Europe.

http://home.earthlink.net/~gfeldmeth/chart.1812.html

No in depth analysis, but gives a brief overview of most of the issues leading to the war.

http://members.tripod.com/~war1812/

More in depth view.

Kind of like asking Americans if they really thought they could beat the Iraqis.

The US invaded Canada in an effort to make us part of America.

We sent you home.

Even burned your 'white house' down for good measure.

I'm not surprised y'all are so confused about it today, since I doubt any of this is in your history books.

You're right that this war is largely ignored in the US. Do Canadian school kids learn a lot about it?

and all the deaths.

The part of Ontario I currently live in was once invaded by you chaps...and of course we gave Detroit -D'etroit- back to you because we're generally nice folks.

for the reply. I'm a teacher, but we don't do much on the War of 1812. A pity, since I find it very interesting. From what I've read there was some nasty fighting along the border caused by large numbers of Americans that had settled in Canada and started trouble. Burning houses, etc.

Sorry about all that...

The US is lucky to have such a good neighbor.

Tecumseh, the Shawnee war chief?

It's Tecumseh's curse on every president elected in a year ending in 0.

The war ended the dream of a a native confederation in North America.

You got a president out of it. William Henry Harrison.

...you'd think that the origin of our national anthem would get a little more attention.

Francis Scott Keys wrote his poem "the Star Spangled Banner" during the bombardment of Ft. McHenry near Baltimore, part of the same campaign as the attack on Washington. (It was later set to a drinking song, and somehow was made the national anthem).

But yes, whoever we fought it against had their way with our white hosue! Was that when it was in Pennsylvania?

Canada was a British colony at the time. The capitol was in DC. The Royal Navy contolled the waters off the East Coast and landed troops from ship. Burned the Washington DC, at least parts of it. President Madison had to flee to VA. Supposedly there is a beam in the White House that shows damage (blackened) from the incident.

still showing to this day.

We were early Canucks, and had a few Brit soldiers over here too.

The British army marched on DC and burned the WH.

Well actually, it wasn't white then. It was rebuilt and then painted white.

It had been called the President's Mansion up until then

in the Washington DC expedition. While this is often an article of faith on the part of Canadians (that they were the ones that invaded DC), in reality, it was pretty much an all Brit show.

While in some of the single ship naval battles, the US won some notable victories, the Brits won the war at sea on a strategic basis by pretty much keeping the US ships bottled up in port.

The decisive battle of the war was the battle of Lake Champlain. Prior to that battle, the Brits were pushing some rather punitive peace terms on the US delegation (northern half of Maine, indian nations "guaranteed" by the Brits agaisnt the US), after Lake Champlain, the Brits settled for the status quo pro ante after Wellington gave them the size of the troop list required for him to go to Canada and defeat the US.

Although I believe it was called "York" at the time.

We've got lots of books, but some people don't bother to read.

But much of it surrounded issues regarding maritime trade.
The Brits were also stirring up some trouble with the American Indians.

That's about all I can remember, I am a product of the US public school system.

The main reasons were:
1. Poor treatment of US shipping by Royal Navy - stopping US ships, impressing sailors, drawing US into European conflicts
2. Alleged British support for natives in Mid-West who were fighting westward expansion

It was a stupid war, neither side was ready to fight. The British were busy fighting in Europe and didn't want to go to war. More farce than fighting. The US tried several times to invade Canada. The Brits burned the capitol. The only positive outcome was the writing of the national anthem.

American merchants were shipping and selling goods to both sides for a while, until the British got real pissed off and blockaded the east coast in 1805. In 1807, President Jefferson suspended all trade relations in hopes of getting the Brits to lift their blockade. Britain refused, and the US declared war on Britain in 1812.

...who was getting some good ones in on the British army at the time. This lead to increasing beligerence at sea between the US and UK, including pressing US sailors into service and privateering US merchant ships.

President Monroe also accused the British of stirring up trouble among the Native Americans in the West (Tecumseh and his brother were very active at the time and did eventually side with Canada), and urged Congress to declare war against Britain and invade Canada.

They did, and we got out butts kicked until 1815, when we got lucky.

edit: speling

you can't fully appreciate the war of 1812 without getting into the napoleanic wars. making it a true world war.

the british and the french (among others) were at war, and the u.s. tried to be neutral and trade with both sides. both sides retaliated in their own way, but it just so happened that britain was more of a pest and also a more convenient target.

americans shut down shipping to in counter-retaliation, leading to a black market via canada.

this in turn led to an invasion of canada. this invasion was quickly pushed back, but the canadian/british continued onward, hoping to regain control of their wayward colonies.

we failed to conquer canada, and england failed to conquer us. many died, nothing was resolved.

then napoleon was captured and things changed.

was the first world war.

1756-63

about the so-called "French and Indian War?"

Only Americans call it the F&I war.

was what the Soviets called WWII.

What's your point?

Since your post indicated you thought they were separate wars.

Hence the "so-called" and the " "" "

That sonofabitch had me beat by seconds.

;)

Didn't mean to offend :)

It's a big deal for the US Army. Generally considered the first time US regulars defeated British regulars in a straight up even fight in the open. Winfield Scott deserves most of the credit, and he had a long and interesting career in the army (was still around in the Civil War).

Interesting detail is that Scott couldn't get enough uniforms for his men so many were wearing gray jackets. Supposedly the British at first thought they were militia. They say that the gray West Point uniforms are in memory of this battle, but that's a myth.

It was a preemptive war, like Iraq. And Warhawks influenced James Madison.

As a Canadian, it always makes me laugh when Americans say the Battle of New Orleans won the war. The Tripod website is most excellent.

Summary:

http://members.tripod.com/~war1812/summary.html

http://gatewayno.com/history/War1812.html

sets the US/UK conflict in terms of the European wars, cites the primary land battles of the Canadian border and the battle of New Orleans, which occurred after the Treaty of Ghent.

I'm not a nationalist, I'm an internationalist, but the War of 1812 does make my heart swell. And however much continentalists say assimilation into the American empire is inevitable, there are still enough Canadians who'll stubbornly resist.

Here's a popular Canadian folk song, "Secord's Warning," that celebrates Laura Secord's heroic alert - I suppose Paul Revere-like - of an impending American attack in the War of 1812:

Secord's Warning

Come all you brave young soldier lads
With your strong and manly bearing
I'll tell you a tale of a woman bold and her deed of honest daring
Laura Secord was American-born in the state of Massachussetts
But she made her home in Canada and proved so faithful to us

Chorus
There's American guns and 500 men
So the warning must be given
And Laura Ingersoll Secord was the stalwart heart
Who braved the heat and the flies and the swamp
To warn Colonel Fitzgibbon

There's soldiers pounding at the door
And they come from across the border
American officers march inside
It's food and drink they've ordered
In comfort they have dined and drunk
Their own success they've toasted
But they pay no heed to the woman who hears their plan so idly boasted

"Oh, James I've overheard it all
A surprise attack they're making
Fitzgibbon they intend to smash
His men for prisoners taking
And James a warning never you'll take with your wounded knee and shoulder
I myself must carry it past the sentries and the soldiers"

It's an all-day tramp to the British camp
By way of Shipman's Corners
There're snakes and flies and sweat in her eyes
There is no respite for her
She's lost her shoes in the muck of the bog
Her feet are torn and blistered
But there's many a soldier lad to be spared if the message be delivered

So all you Yankee soldier lads who dare to cross our border
Thinking to save us from ourselves
Usurping British order
There's women and men Canadians all
Of every rank and station
To stand on guard and keep us free
From Yankee domination!

The story:

Canadian militiaman James Secord was badly wounded in the Queenston battle 13 October 1812. The following May, Queenston was again invaded by Americans and this time they took the area. All Canadian men over 18 were marched off as prisoners of war, but James was allowed to remain in his home due to his wounds. Three American officers lodged with James and his wife, Laura Ingersoll Secord. Some months later, Laura overheard the Americans planning a surprise attack on the Canadian forces under FitzGibbons at Beaverdams.

Laura decided she had to get word to FitzGibbons of the planned attack, and set out at four in the morning to walk the 32 kilometres to the Decew house where FitzGibbons was staying. She told the American sentry she was going to St. David's to visit her sick brother, and after briefly stopping there, she continued on the Old Swamp Road into Black Swamp. She could not go by the main road and was forced to go through the swamp in the mid day heat, watching for rattlesnakes and wolves. By noon she had left the swamp and was ready to cross Ten Mile Creek before climing "The Mountain" , the name given to the Niagara Escarpment. When Laura finally reached the top of the mountain after an 18 hour ordeal, she was exhausted and lost. Stumbling through the woods into a clearing she was surrounded by Mohawks and Caughnawagas, loyal Six Nations allies. Laura pursuaded the warriors to take her to FitzGibbon. FitzGibbon was amazed at the 38 year old woman's tenacity and later wrote:

"Mrs. Secord arrived at my Station about sunset of an excessively warm day, after having walked about twelve miles which I at the time thought was an exertion which a person of her slender frame and delicate appearance was unequal to make."

With Laura's warning, the Canadian forces were prepared and when the Americans arrived, 50 soldiers and 200 warriors stood ready. All but 6 of the American soldiers were captured and their attempt to control the Niagara Peninsula ended.
http://www.rootsweb.com/~canmil/1812/bios/laura.htm

Thanks!

everytime I hear it.

A cover of it by Lynn Noel can be downloaded here (though I don't like this version as much as the one by the band Tanglefoot on their CD A Grain of Salt):

http://homepage.mac.com/WebObjects/FileSharing.woa/wa/default?user=lynnoel&fpath=A%20WOMAN'S%20WAY&templatefn=FileSharing6.html

and a code not to abuse women, even as prisoners. Perhaps because their women voted for the war chief? Anyhoo, they played a huge role in the formation of this country.

The British and the French played them but the Iroquois and other "natives" played the French against the British as well. It was an interesting time in Canadian/American history. I grew up where much of it happened. It's worth researching on your own.

The 'Indian' Wars had been going on for close to a century before the revolution. The French arming some, the Brits others. Supporting one tribe or another to gain access to the fur pelts for their ladies in London or Paris. Big business with the Indians bearing the brunt of the fight.

After the revolution the Brits continued arming various tribes with the hope of preventing expansion into new territory. America objected.

Although American forces were stopped when attempting to go into present day Canada, a condition of the truce between Britain and America was Britian would stop arming Indians. It worked and for all practical purposes nothing stood in the way of America's expansion westward, except the soon to be poorly equipped Indians.

It goes to show that a battle can be lost, yet America still got what it wanted when the war started.

will have a show about the war on Sunday, Sept. 12th 9pm est..

http://www.historychannel.com/1812/

They've been using September 11, 2001 to promote their little documentary.

They should called it the Fox History Channel.

<http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/books/amh/amh-06.htm>

Florida Patriots


BTW - The original Florida Patriots got their ass kicked for stirring things up in 1812, not by Spain or England, but ultimately by the Native Americans. The staff of FP seriously hopes this does not occur a second time on our current endeavors against King George and would like to note before hand we mean no harm to our native brothers. :)

When Washington burned

Conventional wisdom says the country comes together during wartime. But that has not always been the case, says historian Arthur Schlesinger Jr. -- not even when the British torched the nation's capital in 1812.


http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2004/09/02/schlesinger/

Interesting little war. The British general who commanded at New Orleans was General Packenham, the brother-in-law of Wellington. Packenham was killed during the battle. And there were actually two battles, one on each side of the Mississippi. The British had split their forces so that they had troops on both sides of the river. The ones on the east side were defeated by the American forces. But the British troops on the west side of the river beat the Americans they went up against. For anyone who is a Richard Sharpe fan, elements of the 95th Rifles were at the Battle of New Orleans. The Museum of the City of New Orleans has a Baker rifle that was found on the battlefield. I drooled.