Either Kerry was on Bush's side from Day 1...

OR he is playing possum and knows something we don't. I just don't understand the swiftness...as soon as there was even a snowball's chance in Hell Bush could win OH (before absentee ballots were counted, before military ballots were counted, before we knew about all the rampant fraud going on in OH and discrepancies between exit polls and real vote counts) Kerry conceded quietly and that was it. 30 seconds later Bush declared he had a mandate and was already naming himself the next Emperor of the United States. I don't know about you, but the "bing, bam, boom" of it all within such a short amount of time means ONE of these two things is true: either Kerry was a Bush plant from Day 1, or he is gearing up for something huge that will upset Bush's second term. So which is it?

Discuss.

NGU.

Is he planning litigation as the reports of fraud become more and more numerous? Has he convinced the electorates to vote against Bush (he only has to convince 4, right?)?

What could he possibly have up his sleeve?

NGU.

NGU.

i am avoiding both

I can't believe I was this emotionally tied to the man. I didn't realize how much of my hope I had invested in Kerry

{sigh}

voice and choked up

:shrug: damn hormonal mood swings anyway! :)

window like he was riding in the car and waving! He has a wonderful smile.

I felt sad and happy when I saw it. I guess I'm still in denial.

It gives me an odd feeling of comfort.

Seeing Kerry stickers on other people's cars was such a boost for me during the campaign. Now, when I see them (though not as often, most people have removed theirs), it is more of a comfort than a boost. Comiserating with strangers on the freeway... Helps to not feel so alone.

to inhabit the WH. I've watched him for years off and on..on TV and always thought he would be a good president. Not to be one, I guess.

I have not been able to look at them at all. The one when he is young with the puppy and the one with John Lennon are my favorite. I will frame them when the pain eases a little.

Today even songs on the radio made me think of him.

I guess... I felt like he was someone who cared about me and stood up for me despite all the criticism.

Here come the waterworks again...

:cry:

voter irregularities without the media and the republicans accusing him of everything under the sun. If he is doing anything, he is doing it in silence and probably getting much better results. The media was not his friend last year.

is doing the right thing. Let us, the voters, make an issue of this fraud upon our nation.

The media would only be badgering him to concede and the Bush Crime Family would have their lawyers at work.

think he's doing whatever he thinks is best for us.

I couldn't believe the DUers who abandoned him ..on the first day.

I understand the pain and everyone has a different coping mechanism but mine is not to throw aside something I've worked for months and months at the first sign of trouble.

Especially when the adversary is the bushits.

bush may have fundie koolaiders snowed but he doesn't have 55 million of us!

Kerry wasn't my first, second or third choice but after some time I went from being ABB to a true Kerry supporter. I came to realize he REALLY WAS the best candidate to take on this group of evil brain washers. I trust Kerry as well and if there is anything that needs to be investigated, he would be the man I want doing the investigation.

In my perfect dream, Bush is up there claiming mandate, threatening the democrats, being his usual cocky self and then BAM! Kerry takes the son of a bitch down and proves he is the rightful POTUS!. All of that cowboy talk from chimpy would be a plate of crow. I would donate a silver spoon for him to eat it with.

Kerry as far as supporting him. It was a glorious evolution..not to be undone so easily.

I love your dream..I've been having some beautifully ending scenarios myself.

To Dreams that don't have bush as potus ..O8)

How did Kerry come from so far behind to win the Democratic nomination in the first place?

.

Iowa and New Hampshire did...then that was it. He was declared the victor. They also used BBV in those states....

That Kerry was a "plant" from Day One (yes I know, it's the mother of all conspiracies). But think about it: if Bush can rig the general election, he can rig the dem primaries. And he knew that he was in deep shit and needed a candidate that would work for HIM.

on November 2nd., then it wouldn't matter who we had on the Democratic ticket.....BBV wins every time, even if it was Bush Vs. Clinton.

And if not, what do you base this upon?

That's what that theory is based on.

Hell no. HELL NO!

He's better than that people. Bank on it.

Post like that make me shake my head about America in general.

Questions about voter disfranchisement, voters voting on so-called "moral values" theme...that makes sense.

But I know A LOT about John Kerry. I'm just throwing out some thoughts and looking for comments, not insults to my intelligence.

When he made his announcement I saw Sen. Kennedy there.

He never introduced him or called him on the stage or anything.

What was that about?

Kennedy was in the audience and didn't look sad or anything.

Do they have something up their sleeve or what?

Just that it's possible. It's a conspiracy theory that's been floated around a lot.

Skull & Bones.

but not probable.

In other words, as fellow S&B members, Bush asked Kerry to run as a ringer, in order to publicly defeat Kerry?

how do you explain John Kerry's involvement in antiwar activities and work in exposing BCCI in the 80's? Was that also on mandate from Skull and Bones? He acted directly against the wishes of George H.W. Bush; a fellow bonesman.

While I believe there are many questions about the secret Yale society that haven't been answered, it has been investigated by Alexandra Robbins.

It seems as though Skull & Bones values its inroads with the moneyed elite in America, but its members may use those connections however they please.

Damn they're good :eyes:

They probably helped Kerry get those fake medals too.

That what he does in every election he's ever been in. He looks dead, and just when you think he is dead, he pops up. It must be maddening for his opponents. Just ask Dean.

Skull and Bones my ass. Get a grip.

freeper. Keep that in mind.

And he harped upon it constantly.

I read a quick post on that a couple of days ago in my foggy grief ..that he was an undercover freeper..I couldn't believe it.

I actually defended him on something..I forget what ..but he pmed to thank me.

Crap.

I was just trying to confirm with ibegurpard!:)

reading some of his posts and being taken away with his eloquence. How wierd--are you sure? And how was he found out? LOL Did he post his name on Mortos's thread?

seventhson must hang out, huh?

I have heard others say this but I just don't want to go there.

he would have dragged it out a day or two.

But remember Kerry is an investigator. He doesn't let things drop until he has the answers. You may be right; maybe he has other plans of doing * in. Wish I could help him.

"Why would he be?"

Well, because Bush knew his re-election hopes were fading fast after Iraq. He needed someone working for him to run "against" him in the election. Someone who wouldn't ask tough questions, wouldn't run an aggressive campaign (and no, I don't think Kerry ran a particularly good and aggressive campaign), and would concede quickly and without raising questions...because, even with a bad candidate, Bush would know that the anti-Bush mentality would mean ABB winning in 2004.

He needed someone to concede quickly and quietly.

Which, as Dole could tell you, is no way to win an election. Being against Clinton didn't do him any good.

Exactamundo. He'll do what he can here, quietly. (well, as quietly as he can with all of us shouting about it anyway)

If not here, then somewhere, where they least expect it.

He's still angry, and will be for a long long time. He will never be far behind them. I hope they spend the next 4 years looking over their shoulders.

Kerry the investigator!

....but I am a pessimist so I will go with the S&B theory.

Skull & Bones, baby. Skull & Bones.

I get the feeling Kerry is out for the count.

I would love to be proven wrong :)

n/t

...

*sigh*

I am nothing. I don't belong to any political party and I'm not much of a joiner of anything else. I just thought that I might have something to contribute here. I guess I don't.

Maybe you should check out my other posts and see if my opinion on anything else excludes me from the ideas on this site. Funny I always figured the dems were alot more inclusive and open to differing opinions than most political parties.

My bad. I guess I'm not needed or wanted. Nothing new.

o, apolitical one!

I'm relatively new myself, but fitting in here is not difficult to do.

Contrary to general opinion, DU is pretty open-minded when it comes to discussing a broad range of subjects - things that might be considered to be conspiracy theories, too.

Rather than allowing a steady stream of right-wing talking-points and cultural predilections dictate our behaviour, we focus on data and facts for the basis of our empirical research; it definitely takes an open mind to accommodate some of the concepts floating around this board.

(The mods are notorious for their no-B.S. policy with those they perceive to be disruptors, though!)

I hope you enjoy your stay here.

...shit.
Welcome to DU. :hi:

...but obviously I am not welcome here.

...and at a particularly bad time. It's a common sense thing, ya know?

...I really am. I had no intention of crapping on anything.

I put my hope into Kerry as well (what intelligent person wouldn't against Bush) and I am not exactly feeling too great either, sort of betrayed and very foolish and I agreed with the original post. Not to make anyone feel bad but because it is my opinion.

Feel good in the fact that you have very sucessfully run me out of your town. No worries, I don't fit in anywhere anyway.

you belong. Seriously...Democrats look kinda like the Island of Misfit Toys to others but to us we all seem quite alike.
We're the party of inclusion. If you leave because I said bullshit I'll feel even worse than I do now. C'mon back.
Truce, okay? :toast:

...a truce.

I know everyone feels bad about the situation. I feel terrible that I made someone feel worse.

Again, I'm sorry.

Eternalburn.....when I first joined DU a mod gave me a WONDERFUL piece of advice.

"Make SURE you have a thick skin!"

I do and from then on it's been a breeze.

Jeff

Welcome to DU, EB...no bullshit! :pals:

so imperative for the BFEE to STEAL this election to stop Kerry from getting the office and the power of the presidency.

Kerry had to investigate carefully, quietly, and absolutely thoroughly to unravel BCCI. This is no different and the consequences are far more enormous. The last thing that needs to happen is for the SCLM to run in with their cameras, talking heads, and Faux News nazi agitators. This must be done right and it all has to happen before B*shCo can figure out how it's happening.

Where do you think he will shift his focus to ?

But then I am pissed so maybe I shouldn't weigh in.

I'm completely baffled by the confusion over this. That's the way elections in the US are ALWAYS done. I'm beginning to wonder if there are alot of young people that just don't know this.

When it looks clear that there's a winner, the loser concedes. Usually the night of the election. I just do not understand why people expected anything different. The votes are still being counted, discrepancies are being looked into, if any legal evidence of fraud or tampering is found, then something will be done. We'll be in a much better position if we find the evidence of the fraud before making a huge stink about it.

Where DO you think that four million votes came from, my dear. ;)

We'll figure it out eventually.

...

putting him in the Senate 20 years ago and all...

Rove is just too good. :eyes:

But running for Pres.

As long as they wanted a patsy

Sharpton would NEVER concede. Even if it appeared the election was fair, he would raise bloody hell.

and anything else is magical thinking. Kerry lost and is now a Senator again. That is all there is to it.

impression of not enough votes. This is about more than Kerry or any other candidate. This is about proving fraud and claiming victory or concession means nothing until the votes are counted.
If you conceded after the first state win would not change anything as the constitution is about the people not the politicians. He may very well be a senator but that is yet to be decided by certification.

I hope fraud can be proven but doubt how that can be done if there are no paper trails, but then I don't know everything.

I just fear it is false hope being perpetrated but perhaps, for the satisfaction of some, it must be tried.

if Kerry (or SOMEONE!) does nothing more regarding the election by the 12th, (it is my understanding that in most states 10 days is the legal time limit for contention of the election), I will be through with him as a loved-one scorned. "Got our backs?!?!?" We'll see...

If nothing is done to contest this fraudulant election- fuck him and the horse he road in on.

Kerry had really wanted to beat Bush, I believe. The reason he conceded is because there was no way he could have beaten Bush based on his lead in OH. Kerry would have to allege massive vote fraud and I guess he was not prepared to do that. Maybe that takes a lot of guts, that he doesn't have. Maybe he believes he lost fair and square. Maybe he thinks there is no way to prove fraud even if there was fraud. I don't believe he was a "plant".

"Lawful Good doesn't mean Lawful Stupid"

Yeah, I'm a geek.

He didn't need guts. He has guts. He needed concrete proof. Proof that doesn't require a tin hat to go with it. Either he will be able to gather that proof, or he won't. As a lawyer, he will know a good case when he sees it. Not circumstantial evidence.

counted?" What the Hell was that about? He didn't wait for every vote to be counted before he conceded.

...idea myself. But no, I don't think he was a plant. As for your point 2, I think thats just a lot of wishful thinking from people on these Boards. He conceded, probably knew the fix was in, but there was little he could do about it, since BushCo, Inc. has had 4 years to figure out how to cheat, and to cover their tracks.

And how's Kerry going to investigate this further when he's in the Senate? What, do people think Frist is going allocate funds, and set Kerry up in a special committee to investigate Bush? Thats fairy tale thinking. The Repugs own the Senate, will probably pick up more seats in 2006, and they own the House for - as Mike Malloy said - generations to come. Sorry for the hard dose of reality, but thats about it.

has the ability and the right to imagine that something like the s & b brotherhood could enter the takeover. Anyone who has read political or legal fiction or watched the movies can imagine something like this. Anyone who buys into the idea that they (the corporations or ministers) want to control us deserves the right to think the worst. BUT WITH CAUTION AND SKEPTICISM.

To buy into Kerry being a tool for the takeover, you have to believe that the Dems are a front.

And a lot of people have been saying that for awhile.

I want to believe that most Dems mean what they fight for - when they are not taking money from lobbyists. I believed in Wellstone. I believe in the old-fashioned idealism that is spoken by many Dems.

But, who knows. World order. Allowing Israel to run our business creates all kinds of doubts in my mind. Suggesting that Africans be groomed to be world soldiers is mind boggling.

2 Possibilities appear to exist....

1. Kerry was a Skull+Bones plant, working in tandem with Bush as a plant dating back to his Primary Comeback, on BBV.

2. Kerry as a Bonesman is currently working behind the scenes as people here are suggesting to undermine Bush. If so, this sub rosa activity on Kerry's part is taking place in a the elite realm of power that is the Skull+Bones network.

Regarding seventhson, so he was a mole? Does that discredit all the information he was posting here?

Isn't that the method of Karl Rove to deal with unwanted information, having an easily discredited source release the harmful true data? i.e. Hatfield and the coke bust or The TANG papers earlier this spring with Rather and his seemingly unreliable source.

Seventhson did say some verifiable true facts i.e. Prescott Bush was a financier of Adolf Hitlers. Government Documents establish that fact plainly enough. Should we now doubt the Bush-Nazi link beaise seventhson talked about it? No!

Possibly seventhson was dispensing truthful info on the Skull+Bones, so when he did reveal his true identity all that true information would be disregarded because of his nefarious character.

Again this ploy worked very well with Hatfield and the TANG issues.

Skull+Bones is at the center of this election. Kerry and his wife because of their affiliations with this group have access to and are part of the true power elite that has been running this country since the 17th Century.

My support of John Kerry was partially based on his Skull+Bones membership. I realized we needed someone who had the same access to the same power players that the Bush Family has. The only person having these credentials is John Kerry and I felt that was why he had to be the nominee and why BBV was used in Iowa to ensure his win.

I really want to believe John Kerry and Teresa Heinz Kerry are using these connections and this access for the best for our country.

I am very confused by the events of the past days and am unsure of how to interpret what exactly is happening in our country.

"Possibly seventhson was dispensing truthful info on the Skull+Bones, so when he did reveal his true identity all that true information would be disregarded because of his nefarious character."

What do you mean, he revealed his true identity? And yes, I read the post above. What did I miss?

Sorry to burst your bubble on this one, but we have no BBV in Iowa. It seems you're talking about the Iowa Caucus? If so, there is no actual voting -- at least not the paper and pencil kind -- at a Caucus. People gather in groups for candidates and it's a head count.

Maybe I'm not remembering correctly and I could be...But I seem to recall reading Kerry had defeated Gephardt and Dean making this amazing comeback.

The voting had taken place on BBV and that Gephardt had wanted a recount. But a recount was not possible because there was no paper trail for the voting.

Maybe I'm completely wrong on this...

but i really don't want to start putting all my hope into a scenario that just doesn't seem plausable now. i want to put my energy toward transforming the democratic party into a more progressive entity. call me weak, but i can't be let down again.

look how hard he worked, how he tirelessly campaigned for us...

STOP BEING SO FUCKING UNGRATEFUL.

Blame Rove. HE is the monster.

Yeah he did great campaigning...just to drop the ball when it counted the most.

Blame Rove...yes of course blame Rove, but because he cheated and no one held him accountable for it - doesn't that make those who sat silent just as guilty?

I respect John Kerry more than anyone will ever know so don't EVEN try and tell me I'm ungrateful. But I, like HUNDREDS of other DUers, will never forgive him just rolling over and dying on us....he didn't even try when it counted most. Will we ever have a fair election in this country again? What about how hard ***I*** worked to help him? I worked hard, and fought tirelessly at the risk of my own good health, along with millions of other Americans. And to just turn his back on us like that? I will never get over it. I will always respect that man and am grateful for his campaign, but I will never get over him just going quietly back into the Senate.

Flame away if you want, but I am not going to apologize for how I feel.

nothing. This our fight. Not for one man. For us. WE have to demand to be heard. Kerry is an honorable and gracious man. This is our fight for him.

and there were many things I could have and felt like saying (posting) at the time. I am glad I did not, for I have come to believe that he IS working on the fraud issue, behind the scenes.

I cannot believe he would give up so easily. Just a hunch that he hasn't...

i can honestly say the moment i heard Dean was ditched for Kerry I felt it was a setup...

there were reports also how specific ny consituences were all for Bush but not knowing how to handle the heat conceded that Kerry would do...but even theN i thought BS....

he knows more than u will ever know...

would seriously consider for one moment
that Kerry was "on Bush's side from Day 1."

cut a deal. What was meant by that I don't know. Either he was a bush plant as I said a long time ago (off the cuff, not certain) OR he's holding something against Bush for which in return he won't tell if Bush TONES DOWN his agenda. Then again, he could be hunkering down to pull a come back assault behind these rigged votes.

Just a thought. :shrug:

"OR he is playing possum and knows something we don't. I just don't understand the swiftness...as soon as there was even a snowball's chance in Hell Bush could win OH (before absentee ballots were counted, before military ballots were counted, before we knew about all the rampant fraud going on in OH and discrepancies between exit polls and real vote counts) Kerry conceded quietly and that was it."

He conceded when there wasnt a snowballs chance in hell that he could win Ohio.