Suggestions for Convincing A 17 year to Not Go to the Marines

Maybe I shouldn't even try. He's my friends nephew and I think he's 18 or 17, I'm not sure. They sign these kids up and get to them in high school! I really don't think this is at all fair since the truth of the war barely gets through in a Republican suburban household.

I don't even know this person, but he's my good freind's nephew and he's just an normal kid with girlfreind a mom and a dad... He's working at McDonalds now.

So I go to McDonalds all the time. I was thinking I could get a copy of Robert Greenwald "The Truth Uncovered" and write a heartfelt letter asking him to at least watch the film.


Any other suggestions on what to say or films to give a 17 yo brainwashed to dissuade him?

especially the scene with the soldires being blown up, and the ones without legs or arms

That should convince anyone who has even rudimentary logical abilities.

should be required before a kid is allowed to sign the papers.
At least it would insure the Veteran's Hospitals would be everything they could be.

or Uncovered: The Truth About the Iraq War or even OutFoxed. All of those are good for understanding the current conflict better. But the movie that cured me of any desire to join the military when I was a teen was Born on the Fourth of July. Before watching that I had always fantasized about military life and war. But when I was 14 I saw that movie, and I never thought of joining the military again.

and the two suggestions above write him off. Cause he is :crazy:

<http://floridapatriots.com/jeff_lucey.htm>

and he managed to contract the following diseases:

1. Malaria
2. Beri beri
3. Dengue fever

and ... he came home 115 lbs and sweated like a pig on and off for the rest of his life drinking quinine water.

He was proud alright but a total physical wreck for the rest of his life.

What good did this do my father? Answer: None.

He received no compensation.

He continued to try to work until he became so sick he couldn't.

He died a miserable and horrible death.

What a way to go and all for what?

He lived his Guadalcanal hell for the rest of his life. In the end, he hated war more than I do. He marched the anti-war marches in the late 60s and 70s. After he died, I threw the Japanese flag he had taken as a "souvenier" off of a dead Japanese soldier. I threw in in a wild river to set the long deceased owner free at last I can only hope.

THE FEW, THE PROUD, THE MARINES ... uh huhhhhh ....

:dem:

We need the marines, and the more people enlist, the less likely a draft.

The military is still a good option for some people.

My partner, who is in a position to know, says:

"Depending on his chosen specialty (MOS), a large part of our ground forces (the Army and the Marines) either are, have been, or are going to Iraq and Afghanistan. Say this very plainly to him: THIS IS NOT A GAME. Troops get killed. Troops get wounded. And contrary to what the recruiter will tell him, the military is not taking care of its own this time around. Disabled men are being told to pay back their enlistment bonuses because they didn't serve long enough. What kind of shit is that? They went into the service with a whole body. They came out of the service with less than a whole body and somehow they're the ones who didn't deliver. VA Medical Services now require means testing, even if you're a disabled vet with a rating (in other words, with a documented injury caused by your service)."

1100 + men and women have died in this shitty war. 8000+ have had their limbs, hands, eyes, and faces blown off. These injures are PERMANENT. They are no longer attractive toy soldiers. Women love men in uniform. Do women love men in uniform who are missing their JAWS?

About 200,000 men and women have been in Iraq. 9000+ have been killed or wounded. How do you like your chances? Do you feel lucky?

We make too much money for the VA to treat his disability. We don't make that much money, either.

I suggest you simply smile at him and say, well, a lot of people don't mind dying young. I wouldn't choose it, as I've enjoyed all of my life so far. But, if that's what you want, good luck.

Then, go home and drink a beer and watch TV knowing that, in a few years, Republican support (especially among young people that have a lot of life yet) will be dying off one by one. When they kill enough of their own, we'll get the majority back again.

Remember, you're not the one killing him. You're just benefiting from his fantastical choice.

If you want to be mean, throw in, "In 10 years when I'm alive and you're not, along with many of your Republican friends, I'll be in the majority again and we'll be able to save the lives of children like you. Until then, I guess you'll just have to die for me."

Welcome to the Holy States of America.

Most people don't join the military because they're Republican. They join the military because they don't have a lot of other options. They want to go to college, they want to get out of their dead-end hometowns. They join the military because in many cases, that's the only hope they see.

If people joined the military out of political ideology, why are there so many Republican chickenhawks?

their wife gets pregnant.

But, once they join, they are likely to become Repubs. Who really cares WHY people join the military? The fact is that they do, they are willing to kill and to die, and they vote very very very heavily republican. I say, good luck to all of them and bless their souls.

How are we going to get fodder for our damn wars if the fodder is informed about the personal consequences ?

$13 bucks for Moores book at amazon should do the trick:


http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0743271521/qid=1099775144/sr=8-2/ref=pd_csp_2/103-1282761-4842259?v=glance&s=books&n=507846



Will They Ever Trust Us Again?
by Michael Moore

Over the last year, Moore invited soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan, as well as their friends and family members, to send him letters. He received "thousands" of responses, mostly via his Web site, and this book presents a sampling of those transmissions. Some are short notes thanking Moore for Fahrenheit 9/11 and ranting against Republicans, but the vast majority are personal stories written with passion and an obvious mixture of emotions—anger at the Bush administration ("I signed a contract with the government to serve in our military, and proudly, but I never thought that our military would be used in such a self-serving, crooked, and disgraceful way"), remorse ("It didn’t hit me until I saw Fahrenheit 9/11 that I was driving the ship that was sending planes to kill people"), fear ("I am wondering if this is the last Christmas I will spend with my son") and sorrow ("Chris, the dead young man, was a former student of mine. This incredibly stupid war now has a face and a name, and I find I can’t quit crying").

How about:

"Good GOD! Surely you can do better than joining the Army?! Only stupid losers enlist and they only ever really join up because they feel they're no good at anything else! They always give other reasons, but that's the real one. The Army knows this, it plays on their fears and tries to get them to doubt their own judgement. I know you, you're a good person with a lot going for you and you deserve better than that!"

Possibly would only strike a chord in European countries, though, where being in the Army is rightly seen as a job rather than some sort of weird calling.

I will now be toasted. Shall I sprinkle myself lightly with chopped garlic and basil? Or Demerera sugar? All three can be nice, sometimes, but that would mask my unique piquancy.

If he is working at McDonalds then I suspect that he sees the military as his only option, unless you can line him up a better job and a chance at something better I don't know why it would be worth trying to convince him otherwise.

I view this as a sample of Maslov's Hierarchy of Needs...he is worrying about subsistence...he doesn't have the luxury of viewing the big picture.

have him do a little reading on this website ==>

http://www.veteransforpeace.org/

my basic "why you shouldn't join the military" pitch is to ask whether they would be willing do whatever someone else tells them to do even if they think it's wrong ...

i would ask whether they know that veterans often have disagreed with the U.S. government when ordered to war ... once you sign on the dotted line, you've turned over your right to determine what is right and what is wrong to someone else ... the very idea of doing this seems immoral to me ...

A DVD of Full Metal Jacket would also be appropriate.

Ask him why exactly it is that he wants to join the Marines?

After that take it from there with the suggestions that are already on the board. But be sure to understand where he is coming from only then can you get to the root of the problem.