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The Swift Boat Attacks and Kerry's turmoil: Inside Scoop from NEWSWEEK

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liberalpragmatist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:03 PM
Original message
The Swift Boat Attacks and Kerry's turmoil: Inside Scoop from NEWSWEEK
Edited on Sat Nov-06-04 06:33 PM by liberalpragmatist
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6420967/site/newsweek/

Kerry himself was itching to hit back at the Swift Boat vets. He had been warned by a McCain aide two years earlier to watch out for the mudslingers on the Republican right. "They'll make it look like you fought for the Viet Cong," said the McCain aide, recalling the dirty tricks played on his own boss in the 2000 primaries. Kerry was furious at former senator Bob Dole, who had gone on TV to say that not all the Swift Boat veterans could be Republican liars. Kerry called his old Senate colleague (and fellow Purple Heart recipient). "You can't say this kind of stuff," Kerry lit into Dole, "and by the way, Bob, I bled from every one of my wounds." Dole blathered that Kerry was a great friend and that he admired him, but he didn't take back what he had said. ("He's an attack dog rehabbed as a statesman, and then he allows himself to be wheeled out for this," growled Shrum, in the midst of a fulmination about "the Big Lie.")

Kerry wanted to blister the Swift Boat vets in a speech he was scheduled to give to the Veterans of Foreign Wars on Aug. 18. "We need to get these guys," he said. But at the last minute his handlers on the road were ordered by headquarters in Washington to restrain the candidate. Cahill and Shrum were worried that Kerry would seem too bitter and angry, the way he had appeared when he sarcastically thanked "Good Morning America's" Charlie Gibson, back in April, for doing the Republicans' dirty work.
Kerry's running mate, John Edwards, also wanted to take a swipe at the Swifties. Edwards was hardly an attacker in the Dole (or Cheney) tradition of vice presidential hit men; his whole persona and appeal were based on sunny optimism. But as early as Aug. 5, when the Swifties were just getting traction, Edwards wanted to push back, hard. McCain had just told the Associated Press that the Swift Boat ads were "dishonest and dishonorable... the same kind of deal that was pulled on me." Edwards wanted to begin a speech, "I join with Senator McCain in calling on the president to condemn this dishonest and dishonorable ad." But Kerry headquarters said no. Stephanie Cutter, the boss of the Kerry communications shop, explained that the campaign didn't need to give the Swift Boat vets any more attention than they were already getting.

<snip>

Kerry was personally hurt by the Swift Boat attacks on his valor and honor. On his cell phone, he called Vanessa several times in August to vent about the Swift Boat vets. He would go on about the unfairness of it all. Vanessa could hear the anguish in his voice.

The pain reached deep into the Kerry family. His first wife, Julia Thorne, had been the forgotten woman of the campaign. Divorced from Kerry since 1988, she lived quietly in Montana, recovered from bouts of depression that had plagued her as the privately unhappy wife of a very public man. Thorne never gave interviews, but she was watching the campaign closely, talking to her daughters, Alexandra and Vanessa, at least once a day. She was very upset, she told Vanessa. She could remember how Kerry had suffered in Vietnam; she had seen the scars on his body, heard him cry out at night in his nightmares. She was so agitated about the unfairness of the Swift Boat assault that she told Vanessa she was ready to break her silence, to speak out and personally answer the Swift Boat charges. She changed her mind only when she was reassured that the campaign was about to start fighting back hard.

***

ON EDIT: Thought I'd add a bit of my own 2 cents. Frankly, if the Newsweek feature is true, I am incredibly glad that Bob Shrum will never run another Presidential campaign. I don't think it's a coincidence he's 0 for 8. The Newsweek article really illuminates a lot of it - so often, the worst of Kerry's mistakes - flowery, flat speeches, clashes with other aides, inability to respond to negative attacks - all of those were against Kerry's instincts, but urged by Shrum. The article made a good point - Shrum is basically an ad man - he knows how to sell a candidate positively, but he cannot strategize. He even fired the young speechwriter who gave Kerry the "bring-it-on!" stump speech during the primaries, which may well have won the thing for Kerry!
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cubsfan forever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
1. Newsweek sucks!
NOW they publish a story about Kerry's pain and dilemma. I have already told them that I am canceling my subscription.

Professor 2
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City Lights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. I cancelled four years ago after having been a subscriber for
nearly two decades. I cancelled Time, and USNews at the same time.
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cubsfan forever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Somehow, Time got renewed at my house
Edited on Sat Nov-06-04 06:16 PM by cubsfan forever
It won't happen again. It's so difficult to find ANY news forum that isn't RW garbage.

Professor 2
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Cattledog Donating Member (695 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
2. I just finished the Newsweek article
and I highly recommend everyone read it. The entire issue is devoted to the election start to finish. Alot of inside baseball stuff.
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lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
3. So is this suppose to be a reflection on a story gone wrong by the media
like their eagerness to rush to war?

It strikes me as a load of shit that they always come out with these types of apologetic stories after the damage has been done.

The media can take their self-reflection and choke on it. I have had it.
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Florida_Geek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:09 PM
Response to Original message
5. IMHO the Swift Boat Ads worked against Kerry on the War on Terra
and did cost him Vet votes...
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serryjw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:09 PM
Response to Original message
6. Kerry KNEW this was coming....NO EXCUSE for not
fighting back..I heard this sh*t many times while I was out there..People beleived it!
Isn't this EXACTLY why he was given the nomination because of his war time record?
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Democat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. He only knew 30 years in advance that they were going to attack him!
Didn't have enough time to prepare I guess?
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serryjw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. AFTER his testimony in Congress.....
He never thought he would be able to have a political career
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Tandalayo_Scheisskopf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:10 PM
Response to Original message
7. I said it last night...
A certain high-level party functionary got called on the carpet and got it GOOD during this thing. Right between the eyes. I mean good. It got him off his ass. To the extent that said ass can be gotten off of.

And such are the things that erode certain people's positions and continued employment.
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Democat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. Who got punched?
If that's what you are saying?
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Tandalayo_Scheisskopf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. No punch.
Just a royal ass-chewing, replete with threats of immediate termination. Like right then, if he didn't get his ass in gear. Kind of a military thing, ya' know?
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Obviousman Donating Member (927 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:10 PM
Response to Original message
8. this story just breaks my heart
what kind of campaign managers do we have? is their goal to lose?
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. It would sure seem that way
:-( I don't know why Kerry didn't go with his gut instinct on this! *shakes head*
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Democat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
9. Stupid fucking Democratic campaign strategists are losers!
Edited on Sat Nov-06-04 06:13 PM by Democat
Kerry should have overruled them.

What the hell is wrong with our party - it's like we don't have any leaders or strategists that even understand how the game is played.

How many times do we have to get our asses kicked by the Republicans before someone realizes that you don't win without fighting.

Even many DUers were waiting for the "backlash" against the Swift Boat Liars. Backlashes don't happen on their own, you have to make one by fighting hard and fighting smart.

This issue is probably the one that cost us the election. If you don't think Kerry being a "traitor" in Vietnam isn't related to this twisted idea of "morals", think again!

Fuck the Democratic campaign strategists!
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liberalpragmatist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #9
18. And Bob Shrum
I hope to God he doesn't even run another presidential campaign. The Newsweek article seems to indicate that virtually EVERY bad decision in the campaign was HIS call. He even told Kerry not to come out against the Iraq War sooner. Even in September, when Kerry was ready to explode, Shrum STILl told Kerry to not appear too "dovish" and instead "play it safe."
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #9
24. Thing is, these swiftboatliars pulled the same crap with Kerry before
Edited on Sat Nov-06-04 08:33 PM by texasblueeyes
and he lost because of it. No way they didn't know this wasn't going to happen again! This should have been discussed and a plan of action formulated before Kerry decided to run for the Presidency!
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ColdWarZoomie Donating Member (79 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-07-04 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #9
28. Bar Brawl
Edited on Sun Nov-07-04 01:00 PM by ColdWarZoomie
Remember the "political judo" crap someone was spouting when the Swiftboat crap first came out? Most everyone on this board, including me, was saying Kerry should hit back hard and fast.

Guess what, folks, political judo didn't work during the out-and-out, beer bottles flying, bar-stool-smashing bar brawl.

Edit: fixed spelling.

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Democat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-07-04 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Judo was almost as bad as "chess"
Strategy is one thing, sitting down and playing chess in the middle of a bar fight is quite another. We got our asses kicked because our side doesn't understand the kind of fight they are in.

We need some strategists who understand what the hell is going on.

Kerry had 30 years to prepare for the Swift Liars attack and he had no response at all ready when they hit. How can that have happened?
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deadparrot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:15 PM
Response to Original message
13. Kerry should have gone with his gut...
I don't like Carville very much, but he wouldn't have let something like the SBVFT anywhere near as big as it did.

It was one of those first efforts to "define" Kerry, and I think it had an effect.
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demnan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:20 PM
Response to Original message
15. Dear Democrats
In the future, get rid of your goddamn handlers and speak for yourself. If you're going to be leader, be a leader. No excuses. We don't nominate knuckleheads; that's the Republican's modus, so you take responsibility for yourself.
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xray s Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. yep
too much money wasted on people with a losing track record.

Kerry should have told John O'Neill to go to hell for smearing the men who fought with Kerry in Vietnam. The Nat Guard convention was the right place and time to do it.
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Gloria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 08:13 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. And they could have probably used Wes Clark a lot more on this, too
Edited on Sat Nov-06-04 08:26 PM by Gloria
For the most part, Clark was doing WesPac things, showed up on cable on and off, but I often wish he was more visible in the national campaign, as in appearing with Edwards or Kerry.
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spooky3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
21. My two cents: I read the first page and found not a single source
Edited on Sat Nov-06-04 08:15 PM by spooky3
identified, so I didn't read onward.

While this doesn't make the story false, it raises all kinds of red flags to me.

For all we know, Karl Rove made up most of the story and gave it to Newsweek and Newsweek would not even have to deny it claimed otherwise.

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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Yep, lots if "unnamed" sources
and people believe whatever they read
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wildflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-07-04 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #21
26. Yes, it gives the public reasons to think that Kerry lost...
and not that the vote was stolen.

-wildflower
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 08:19 PM
Response to Original message
22. I am convinced some of these "Democratic Strategists" are Frikkin Repubs!
Edited on Sat Nov-06-04 08:24 PM by mzmolly
Man this pisses me off! :grr:

Edited to add, this is an amazing article/story. I feel so much pain reading this. I could slap Cahill though. I don't care who likes this woman, she sucks.
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drunkdriver-in-chief Donating Member (267 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-06-04 08:44 PM
Response to Original message
25. Kerry's surrogates should have pounded on the chickenhawk issue
Instead of defending kerry from the swift boat liars, they should have attacked bush and cheney and all the other repugs who avoided service.
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Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-07-04 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
27. Why was Bob Shrum hired after going 0 for 7?
Why give him a chance to go 0 for 8?
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