I talked to my fundie biological mom for the first time since the election

A little background - I was adopted as an infant and raised by very bright parents, and religion was NOT a part of my upbringing. I was quite satisfied with that, but my wife convinced me to sign up with a registry to reunite with my birth mom. At age 25, I finally got to correspond with her, and met her a couple years after that. She is a kind, decent person, but also a rural person and a fundamentalist christian whose way of thinking is incomprehensible to me. Anyway, we've had cordial relations over the years, though I kind of avoid contact with her because I find her conversations so boring and her thinking to be so backward. We don't talk much about politics because I know her politics are more determined by her religion than logic, that and the fact that she works for a WMD maker -let's say "General Dynamics" (it's actually another WMD company).

Today, we talked on the phone and she asked if we weren't too disappointed about the election. I said that we certainly were, and after a little more discussion, I asked her if she was at all enjoying or making use of the subscription to "The American Prospect" I got her last Xmas. I thought it might be a good way for her to get both sides of the story (especially since she lives in Mississippi.) She said "well, Honey, I don't have a lot of time to read, but I get both sides of the issues because I WATCH FOX NEWS."

(primal scream)

I tried to tell her that Fox was an extreme right-wing outfit, and the other cable channels were not much better, so she mentioned that she likes Carville and Tucker.

She also mentioned that she couldn't have voted for someone with a wife that tells people to "Shove it": (which I said was a major problem with the media -focusing on irrelevant trivialties) and that Kerry never really laid out his vision and what he really stood for, except that he was against Bush. This I couldn't argue much with because it's 100% true. Kerry did a horrible job of laying out a vision, an agenda and a progressive, populist campaign. He was NOT going to end the war, nor would he have changed our trade policies. The best we would have gotten is to have saved Social Security a bit longer and revoked some of the rich folks' tax cuts.

On one level, I was happy that we could talk, without rancor - I actually felt she was listening and respecting my viewpoint, and I tried to be respectful of hers (though I truly find it incomprehensible)

But I was also left pretty dispirited that I can't reach this person, as long as she thinks that getting 5 minutes a night of news sandwiched between 25 minutes of Scott Peterson and commercials will make here an informed person, I don't see how I could possibly get through to her.

(sigh)

:)

Immediately after the election, I was contemplating blowing her off for good. I'm glad I didn't. It would've accomplished nothing.

Even if I can't win her over, there's no reason to hate her. But I will never nod in feigned agreement with right-wing BS again.

:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:

i feel for ya.

Whenever someone mentions the 'shove it' thing, i ask if they approve of the actual president calling someone an 'asshole' or the VP telling someone to fuck themselves...

They usually give a sexist, double standard, BS answer.

But I was also left pretty dispirited that I can't reach this person

As a fundie she may be thinking the same of you. So perhaps to answer your question and help you to find a way to reach her ask yourself this: "If she is dispirited because she cannot reach me, how could she reach me and change my mind?"

I was relieved that we could talk about this stuff and still be okay. I suppose she would like me to become a Christian and go to heaven or something, but It ain't gonna happen. Making somebody else feel better is no reason to practice a religion.

Her becoming a democrat would make me feel a bit better toward her, but It would have made no difference in the election obviously.

I guess I was mostly dispirited because I know that she represents millions upon millions of people who think that a few minutes a day of TV news info-tainment is a substitute for actually being informed. It's not so much about her personally.

And hope you did not take me wrong. My thinking was that you cannot change her any more easily than she can you - but she could reach you more if she did X (like her approach, et al) and maybe she could be better reached the same the way as you could be.

My parents are fundies for the most part, more mom than dad, and I am a christian myself. We see eye to eye on some things but not others, and I have just learned to accept it and not worry about it. What it has done for me though is to make it easier to discuss things and frame them in a way they understand and respect.

The key thing though, on both sides, is that they don't see the left as having the same ideals and values as they do so they won't vote for someone who is a democrat usually (not always true, my uncle was a dem mayor and they loved him but referred to him as old school - ie they had similar values on a religious level and moral level but saw things different on a business world level and favored the workers and such).

My mom once, not long ago, told me my uncle was the first dem mayor in 75 years in his city and had done a better job and was more loved than any of the republicans there. Locally she voted for Coleman (D) for mayor too. But nationally she sees dems as wanting to screw over people on homeschooling, gay marriage, et al. She likes dems and hates them - just depends on the level they are on :)

To me there are a lot of folks like this, they favor dems on core issues like workers' rights, against big companies, but diverge on personal issues.

Again, sorry if you took it wrong.

Fair and Balanced my a$$.

anybody know what happened with that?

Like the MSM would ever report THAT lawsuit. :eyes:

But you are not responsible for her choices. And there are many unreachables, like everyone in my family, and I had to grow up in this family. It may seem harsh, but count your blessings you were brought up in a progressive and enlightened environment. I don't know your feelings around your birth mother, so all I can say is...there are plenty of them (the kool-aid drinkers) out there and life isn't perfect. Hang in there.

"She also mentioned that she couldn't have voted for someone with a wife that tells people to "Shove it"

...but she can vote for a vice president who tells people to go f*ck themselves?!?

I don't get it.

I've been there too. The one I hear now is "Well, now that the elections is over we need to come together" I ignore it and give them a blank stare because if I open my mouth I'm likely to tell them to, "BITE ME" or worse.

I keep hoping that all of this will implode on them and we can get back to normal crazy republicans. But realistically it probably won't. Jerry Falwell can get BJs, then cry on TV say the devil made him do it and he's back on top again. Rush can get 3 divorces and be a millionaire drug addict while telling us we don't understand working class family values and somehow that makes sense to them. Bush can trash talk gays and lesbians even when his VP's daughter is out. It just boggles the mind. Sometimes I want to scream. Occasionally I can laugh about it. Mostly it's disheartening.

Hang in there.

If Bush pledges to veto any legislation which is not bi-partisan - that is supported by at least 25% of Congressional Democrats.
Democrats can enforce this by filibustering everything. Anything which is bi-partisan enough to break the filibuster will meet the 25% rule. No one should complain because we are only asking Bush to be bi-partisan (and only slightly bi-partisan at that) like he said he would be. Shouldn't 55,000,000 people get SOME representation?

But how many millions of people in flyover country think they are getting both sides of the story by watching "fair and balanced" coverage? As much as we wish it were I don't think it's uncommon.

I'm sure you could have countered her "shove it" comment with a discussion on Cheney's floor outburst or W's version of "sign language" but, really, what would be the point.

I guess I tend to hesitate with people like her, because I KNOW that they are less informed. I spend countless hours researching and reading about this crap, and she has her teevee.

Sure, I could cream her in a debate about just about anything because she doesn't have ANY of the facts.

Example: When I told her, I didn't care whether the first lady was charming and genteel like Laura, or even if there WAS a first lady she said "I think they have a law that the president be married."

If I were talking to some freeper online, I could tear him a new one over such a pathetic show of ignorance, but you just don't do that.

Steamrolling people with the facts and proving them wrong doesn't win them over.

It's very difficult to present much information without coming across in a condescending way.

And of course, Fox didn't give Dick or Bush's profanity a fraction of the coverage they gave to Teresa's little outbursts.

My Thanksgiving with Freep relatives was similar although it yielded no such gems as the "both sides" comment. The only thing close came when I mentioned every new baby and every man, woman and child owes $35,000 because of Reagan/Bush debt. My stepmother pointed out "the government has always been in debt. What difference does it make?"

When the information gap is that big there is just no reason to trouble with it.

That's the kind of response I get when I ask my cousin or good friends why they voted for Bush. That type of reason is a non-reason. There is something else - something deeper of more simple. They had no intention of considering Kerry and they can't define, in positive terms, why they voted for Bush, so they spit out a nonsensical reason. As another poster said, you could have thrown the Cheney remark back in her face, but what is the point? She had her mind made up.

My cousin called me with much the same comment - "I know you feel bad that Kerry lost." Well I told her how very bad I felt and she wasn't too thrilled with my reaction.

Good luck to you as you muddle through this with her.