Lieberman 08

actually no, I dont want that. But I saw him on the daily show just now and doesnt deserve the hatred he receives here. hes done a lot of work on issues we agree on.

:eyes:

not quite sure what to think about that guy

from "suspected" terrorists......

OK

I don't know why, but to me, his voice is like fingernails on a chalkboard.

and I still disagree with a lot of his views, but he's a decent guy. Funny, and he's got the right idea about a lot of things, like social security and global warming.

He represents everything that people have come to distrust about Democrats. He is a politician in that he will say whatever he feels the audience he is speaking to wants to hear. He knows the audience he was talking to.

voted for Joe over bush* even. He was completely serious. I've never been able to get over Joe's asskissing "debate" with dickhead cheney in 2000 though.

Lieberman does not deserve the grief he gets here. He's wrong on a lot of foreign policy issues. But domestically, he is exactly what a Dem should be.

And you can't criticize him on the environment at all.

Without doing so I can only report that my attitude is based on the rhetoric he presents. I believe he has sold out on issues that I believe are at the very core of what this nation stands for. It is not so much his voting record that I object to.

Let me say that in Lieberman's case I have a particular issue with him. During the 2000 campaign he came here to the city of Detroit. I was in attendence when he informed me and the crowd that we do not have freedom from religion. Joe was courting the religious right and the supporters of government funding of faith based charities.

Yes he is a fair representation of a Democrat on some issues. But on many key issues (social and foreign policy) he is dangerously complicitous with the right.

The trouble with this complicitous behaviour is it creates an impression to both sides. On the right it makes him and other dems by association seem disengenuous. They see him playing up to their social and religious issues as a means of sneaking the cliche dem tax and spend economic policies. On the left we feel left out in the cold by the assumption that we have to play along with the games to have any semblence of a voice.

The upshot of all this is that the Dems do not appear to truly stand up for what they believe. Instead they play games with wording and rhetoric to gain votes. Even though they do not plan on following through on the rhetoric. How else is a candidate plying for support from individuals that support such things as church state entanglement and individuals that oppose such things. Clearly they are going to come down on one side or the other. If not then they stand for nothing.

This creates the public percieved image of the flipflopping dem. What do we stand for? Even we are not certain what the heck they will stand up and defend.

The factor that brings the most consistant votes to the right is that they state their issues and stand by them. They may not agree with the issues the repukes represent. But they trust the candidates character because they say what they believe. They do not get this sense from Dem candidates.

Part of this has to do with the fact that the left views the world as a complex structure which does not have clear black and white demarcations. But it is not helped by the tactics and machinations of our Dem leaders who refuse the take a stand on issues.

He has strong views that he's stuck to faithfully over the years and it happens that those views are to the right of many people here.

Give me one example of a time when he's changed his mind on an issue.

about him being bush's choice for VP.

There was talk of McCain and Kerry but never Bush and Lieberman.

you mean homeland security director. Lieberman was never considered to be Bush's VP

Thanks for that.

Still, my point remains. A lot of people think that Lieberman's willing to play especially nice with bush.

We have to live with this White House for four years. Maybe the approach is to scream and yell and put flaming bags of poop on the portico at the White House.

Or maybe the approach should be to find a few reasonable Republicans like McCain and try to get good legislation passed.

But there are other Democrats that are closer to my philosphy than either of them.

Still dont agree with him on many issues, I just dont see how anyone let alone a Democrat can still support the war in Iraq.

don't mean shit. He is a perfect example of the political problem in this country. He's actually considered left of center. Ugh.

I'm not surprised to hear that he's charming. That's part of the whole politician thing.

people can compare him to Lord Zell. there are definetely more conservative dems then him. he is a liberal on social issues. left on center on domestic issues.

pop onto cable news and back the Republicans when they need it.

Bill and Hillary Clinton on. yet we dont bash them.

I must've missed that. I know Clinton has been soft on the Bush administration, but I've never seen him on Fox News with his nose buried in their asses, like Joe Lieberman.

I'm no Clinton fan. He was another right-of-center, pro-corporate Democrat. But he's not the president anymore, and neither he or his wife are welcome in the right-wing press. Lieberman is, and visits regularly.

He sounds apologetic and hesitant -- doubtful. He should take singing lessons, learn to breathe properly and produce a solid tone.

-- and wins comfortably.

As voting records go, I'll take Weicker's over Lieberman's. If there were more Weickers and fewer Santorums, the Senate might be a more civil, bipartisan chamber.

Who's going to be the Democratic nomination?

please don't aim so low. beware of the guarantees of low expectations.

Lieberman is an opportunist hypocrite, progressive and liberal minded Democrats have no reason to celebrate him, he doesn't deserve an iota of respect.

yeah.