Okay, who won the debate?

Lieberman and Gephardt definitely took a lot of damage. Lieberman got smacked down by Dean, which didn't help him. Gephardt got hit by Sharpton and Kucinich, Sharpton calling his war vote a "miserable failure," and Kucinich making a jab about Gephardt not helping him in the House on the iwr.

Dean, the frontrunner, had a polished performance, and comes out smelling rosy. Sharpton was fun as usual, and Kucinich gave clear, confident answers without sounding like a maniac.

So was Mosley-Braun, and so was Kucinich. I liked John Edwards as well, and even Bob Graham was pretty good. I frankly can't see what gets people so charged up about Dean. Holy Joe looked like a loser. Gephart seemed tired, and frankly bored me.

How did Edwards and Kerry do?

Edwards had a very focused delivery tonight. Kerry was still speaking in convoluted prose.

but there was nothing that stood out about him. Kerry waffled worse than normal.

Lieberman actually drew boos from the crowd with his attacks on Dean. He looked angry and desperate, while Dean kept his cool.

Gephardt was all set to repeat the good showing he made in the last debate, until Sharpton cut him off at the knees by throwing his own tag line at him. It reminded me of Mondale eviscerating hart in '84 with "Where's the beef?"

I think it was largely a wash for the rest of the field.

but agree with the rest.

Sharpton was on fire. And Kucinich got a lot of applause with "US out, UN in".

Man, I like the guy. He ain't no dummy. I'm certain he'd be a fine president, but he's just not quite catching on. Of course, most of mainstream 'Murika couldn't tell you a thing about any of the candidates and have never seen or heard any of them. It's still early folks. The only ones paying any attention are us, and the nut-jobs over at FR.

When the race hits the mainstream and Joe Sixpack starts talking about the election at the water cooler, we're going to see some mild (perhaps more) shifting going on.

He doesn't raise his voice a lot, and when he gets into issues he's quite direct.

I know some get tired of the son of a mill worker bit, but that's for those who haven't seen him. I think he will _always_ say that in any appearance. (Staying on message.)

Watch this guy...

Multiply that by the number of people who might think like you do...

and no bid contracts in response to the "how will you vote on the $87B". Courage!

I don't know why he has not caught on more strongly.

I thought his "best song" (Small Town--John Cougar Mellencamp) choice seemed sincere, unlike that of some others.

Sometimes when you look good, people don't take you seriously.

for NC so he could speak more freely, move more easily to the left.

helped their cause-- Sharpton, Edwards, Braun, Graham

Didn't hurt-- Dean

Detracted from their cause-- Kerry, Gephardt, Kucinich

Laughingstock-- Joe

and why he'd be a bad president if you care about a progressive agenda. I'm a huge fan of his anti-bush rhetoric but his bitchslap of gay marriage was over the top.

Name one of the candidates on the stage besides the super liberal Sharpton/Kucinich/Braun triad who supports gay marriage?

You can't because none of them do. The fact of the matter is that Graham presented a very well-thought and well-expressed argument in favor of future Presidential action to remove all legal inequality between gays & straights. He also explained that the definition of the term "marriage" is essentially a product of religion and American cultural tradition - that tradition (fairly or not) leans toward defining marriage as between a man and woman AND for the purpose of procreation. He didn't condemn gay people. He is decidedly in support of civil unions. It doesn't make Graham a conservative to not be in support of gay marriage. It makes him average in this respect (perhaps unfortunately).

That in itself should get her elected for speaking the truth.

Sharpton took charge during/after the disruptions while Graham, Lieberman and Kerry just looked peeved. Edwards was pretty good - a kind of "regular guy" laughing with Sharpton and making sense. Lieberman really wants to send more troops to Iraq. Gephart had no real message, just bluster. Kerry was average but committed to voting no on $87 billion if he doesn't get the right answers from Whistle Ass. Dean was not as charismatic as usual. I liked Dennis on health care and the war.

top tier: kucinich, lieberman (no, i don't like him at all)

middle tier: sharpton, braun, edwards, graham

bottom tier: kerry, dean, gephardt

well, this should be popular here ... sorry, kids ... i really thought the "front-runners" were uninspiring tonight ... btw, this is my scorecard for presentation only ... not whether i agree or disagree on the issues ...

1) Sharpton
2) Edwards
3) Dean

Losers:

1) Lieberman

I listened to the debate on radio, so my perspective me be a little different. Frankly, I thought the debate sucked. It's all soundbytes, no substance. And that's all we're going to get as long as we have nine candidates up on stage and everyone has only a minute or two to answer.

the one minute format is inadequate ... it's too easy, no matter how good the answers were, to come across as lacking depth on the issues ... they should not agree to this format again ...

the only good thing was that the candidates were allowed to go "beyond the bell" to finish their answers ...

I don't have time to fully respond. I feel like Kerry is in big trouble though. He fell asleep there for a second.
:boring:

I was surprised.
I really liked him in the first debate.

nt

He came off as carrying the debate. He also handled the disruptors very well.

Mosely-Braun and Kucinich both articulated their points clearly and calmy.

Gephardt got some new speechwriters, but nothing much else.

Kerry and Edwards neither gained nor lost any ground. Although I liked Edwards' comment about Sharpton's one answer: "I have to follow that?"

Dean was slick, but to me it seemed like he was pandering.

Graham shot himself in the foot with the marriage thing.

Lieberman smacked down by Dean (and the other candidates he tried to attack but it blew up in his face) and he did not call for the removal of Israeli settlements in the West Bank and said he said he would send more troops to Iraq. And Joe, quit trying to ride Election 2000, it isn't working.

Best performance of the night: Braun (Bush wasn't ELECTED!!!, spending like a bunch of drunken sailors, some other good ones.)

Most improvement since last time: Kucinich and Edwards. Effective and personable.

Most significant(potentially unpopular)position: Dean (Israel-Palestine)

Better than he's been for a while: Lieberman (although his every attack on Dean just helps Dean).

Most charismatic: Sharpton

No help: Gephardt, Kerry

Best one-liners: Graham (Did Bush intentionally mislead YES!!!!, Osama bin Forgotten)

Surprisingly good moderator: Brit Hume.

Best reporter question (don't recall her name) the one who asked Sharpton about whether he would support foreign adventurism LIKE OUR 1973 COUP IN CHILE!!! ON FOX NEWS!! Never hear that again I bet.

Worst analysis: Bill (Mr. Vegas) Bennett on H&C later, doesn't think any of them are presidential material. How the heck would he know? He still thinks Hillary ought to get in I guess so he can have fun bashing her.

What were all those hecklers talking about? anybody get it?

IMO

I look forward to hearing more from him.

These aren't really "debates." I wish people would quit calling them that. They're really just forums. Maybe they're the best that can be done with 9 candidates at the moment, but the term "debate" for what we see bugs me.

Sharpton was very good. The man can talk. I can't wait to hear him at the convention.

I'm proud of all of them.

But I have to pick Dean because I agree with his policy the most (it's not all presentation in the marks) and also he handled himself well when repeatedly attacked by Lieberman. That's not easy, and it's something the others didn't have to contend with.

.. that gets stronger when you attack it. Lieberman is only serving to build-up his enemy even more.

Wait a second.. could the Dean and Lieberman campaigns be working together behind the scenes? Naaaah..

hypnotized by the video game boss, the techno-electric dean harmonizing bon-fire of economic guru-ish-ness... dean, dean is my king... dean, dean is my everything....

or at least benefited the most, as I mention in my almost totally ignored LBN thread. Then that article went away to be replaced by ones about the hecklers and about Lieberman attacking Dean. Ya gotta have conflict, I guess.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=308508


I am locking this one.


NYer99
DU Moderator