Teachers afraid to discipline children

I want to relate a story that happened to my son in school.

My son freaked out during a test and when he should have been at his desk he kept going up to the teacher to ask questions. In fact, at one point he brought out his folder to show the teacher something.

Basically...he cheated.

The teacher called me that evening to discuss the events in school and to present some options for how to deal with my son. The first thing she said was. "Technically what he did was cheating and he should get an F but..." she then proceeded to present all kinds of options.

When she was done, I said. "If he cheated, give him an F because he has to learn that this kind of behavior is unacceptable". When he got home from school I dicussed the situation with him and told him that he was going to get an F. He was unhappy about that but he dealt with it and no problems since then.

My response apparently shocked her because I think she is used to having to deal with parents who would argue with her that their child is special and that he/she should not be punished.

In fact, I saw such an interaction at the school during the school's open house. A mother I happen to know, told the teacher..."My son "xxx"'s teacher last year was out to get him and I am here to tell you that I am not going to tolerate that kind of behavior." ...she then blathered on about how her son was an angel and that the teacher better watch her step around him....

All I was thinking was...what has happened to society??

My partner taught school for a year and got out because his hands were tied by uptight parents and over-anxious administrators. And he was teaching CHOIR, not like he was passing out many D's and F's anyway!

When I was a lad, in the halcyon days of the 70's, a teacher's word was law. I a teacher called the house to discuss disciplinary problems, you could BET we would be in for it. My parents backed the teacher a hundred percent. And I'll just bet I'm a better person for it.

do so for a reason - it might be Asperger's for instance - they are not in tuned with expected behaviors.

While that does not excuse everything - it is something to keep in mind.


Some teachers are really good at encouraging respect in a positive way. Some are not - like the one caught by the cell phone.


I agree that parents should generally support the teachers - but it's not always clear what is the problem. It's seem like a good idea to avoid assumptions about everything.

in fact he gets therapy for it.

But one of the key parts of his therapy are helping him to understand that he can not have his own way and part of his therapy is having to deal with consequences. For example when he starts to get agitated over the way a game is going, if he starts to behave inappropriately the game is ended.

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got all the way through school without being diagnosed. In fact she still hasn't - but I would say there is 98% chance she has it.

She was too shy to act out - for the most part.

I wish I had known, though - it would have made a big difference in socialization and expectations and all.

telemarketers.

on exactly this topic - latest edition I believe

( And what the hell do I know? I only sent six off on the bus at various times) has shown me that there are great schools, good schools and pisspoor schools.

Same for teachers, parents and students.

I have dealt with dress codes, band codes, debate team, drama club, CAP, Scouts, gymnastics instructors, enrichment classes, remedial classes, music lessons, spelling bees, kids who weren't allowed to go to the bathroom so they came home with piss in their shoes, kids thrown in lockers by other students, kids suspended for rumour, kids suspended because they didn't have an immunization they DIDN'T EVEN NEED ( had to TAKE the State forms TO THE SCHOOL to show the principal she didn't know the law from the lavatory), teachers who took the time with kids and were great motivators, teachers who had severe emotional problems, parents who let their kids go to school with headlice and parents who attended every function they could.

Gross generalizations are just that. Gross.

Do what you can to make your school the best it can be for your student. But don't assume that the problems in schools today are solely the result of "overprotective parents." There have always been bratty kids and defensive Mommies; but there haven't always been Columbines happening and there haven't always been Fascists in charge of classrooms everywhere.

were not involved in those boy's lives? The fact that these kids amassed an arsenal and no one noticed anything was going wrong...

There is culpability in the students, teachers AND parents.

Teachers often ignore bullying ( and as we've seen, are often bullies themselves).

Parents don't often notice the things they should, but often parents are poo-pooed when they come to the school with complaints. Did other parents complain or give warning about these kids? Did other students?

Other tragedies have resulted because some principal ignored many, many warnings.

Like I said, the success or failure of a school is dependent on teachers, parents and students. To blame any one group is naive, in my humblest opinion.

but you have no idea how many parents are like the blathering lady in your story. Thanks for doing your job and teaching your son that it is not OK to cheat. Wish there were more like you... Peace!

My mom was a teacher and I kept my head down and behaved in school because if I got in trouble I knew there would be no sympathy at home.

I don't plan on second-guessing every decision a teacher makes about my daughter, when she gets of school-age. I will, of course, take a great interest in what's going on and being done to her, but wrong behavior is wrong and right behavior is right.

in America.

Look at other countries like Japan or India - they demand excellence.

Our colleges and schools (both public and private) have turned into social events where the teachers babysit and hand out good grades to everyone. Then when these young people get to the workplace they don't know how to do anything on their own, without a program telling them they have to do x at y time.

but I think kids can still get a good education. This can happen if the parents are very involved with what their children do in school and if the parents set standards for excellence (in both behavior and academics) for their children. Parents need to demand excellence from their children, because the schools just are not going to do it.

in my school kids were beaten with a wooden board for infractions. That goes too far. I was always too afraid to even think of misbehaving and my emotional development has suffered for this and other reasons.

Getting an "F" on the test would seem mild to me. :) I suppose there has to be a happy medium.

if I knew he was cheating. Then I would have called you to tell you about it.

Don't judge all teachers and all of society from your anecdotes.

I've caught kids cheating before, but I was told by the administration that there was essentially nothing I could do about it. I couldn't prove it beyond a doubt, like my word wasn't good enough (we all know how untrustworthy teachers are!). Apparently, I didn't have good enough evidence if the parents made a issue of it because receiving two identical tests (one from a poor student who never comes to class and one from a good student with good attendance)could have been just a fluke thing (even though the two students were sitting next to each other the day the test was given). Even if I could prove they were cheating (perhaps I needed a video surveillance to prove it), the school district only counts cheating as a level one offense, right up there with talking in class. So, essentially there was no good way to teach the students academic integrity because the administration wasn't going to back you on it. They said the best I could do would be to offer a retest and make it harder for the kids to cheat (translation = punishment for the teacher...teacher must do even more work). Anyhow, cheating was and probably still is a huge problem at that school.