What do you think is(are) wrong with schools, how to fix?

Is it standard testing, too much federal government, not enough, too many strings attached to teachers, too little money, too much and wasted on admins, and so on?

Since I was young I have heard schools are in trouble, suck, et al (and I am 39 now). What seems to be the problem and how do you think such problems can be fixed?

It's a huge problem, there isn't a simple answer to your question.

when they set up the Federal Department of Education. That was about the same time they started consolidating schools all over the country, in the 1960s and '70s.
Anytime the Federal government puts their fingers in the pie, they spoil it with over-regulation, strings to the funding, etc. They should have left all school stuff to local control.

it doesn't matter which party is in office but 9 times out of 10 when the Feds get involved its downhill from there.

And needed to happen.

There's something wrong with parents.

We have to work too hard to earn a buck.

parents have always had to work hard, but then by hook or by crook they usually found the time to actually parent their children instead of letting TV, the net or Playstation be the parent.

for forty, maybe fifty hours a week. Now it's two breadwinners working a hundred hours plus between them -- who's got the time to see that the kids are doing what they need to do? Who's got time for PTA? For teacher conferences? And that's the lucky, two parent families.

I can guarantee, when we see your typical worker, the office shlub or busdriver, supporting a family of 4 on a single paycheck, 40 hours a week, we will see a vast improvement in the schools.

was ultimately bad for education, and that more smaller neighborhood schools instead of giant schools with thousands of students would be better, albeit more expensive. But I am not an educator and have nothing to back that up, it is just my perception.

that doesn't value learning.

public beatings. And how about doing something about this integration thing? And let the stupid kids quit and get jobs -- school won't do them any good anyway and they just drag the good kids down. The more of them that drop out, the higher the end of year test scores will be!

I said, reflecting on my modest proposal.

American 9 year olds? We are Number One!

has been going on since the 1960's. It is for the convenience of the district, supposedly more cost effective as in "it makes good business sense". But as far as establishing a warm, nurturing environment for learning to take place -- it fails. Teachers can't give each student the necessary attention, make them feel important, give them self-esteem, all of which are so critical in the elementary years.

It's too late for me to go into my litany of things that are wrong these days.

I work in a school and am going to college to be a teacher. Early on in my college courses, I learned that schools are a miniture of society. Violence in schools reflects violence in society. Teenage sex reflects the lack of morals and over marketing of sex in our culture.

With that said I think there are 2 things that make teaching really hard. First is the lack of funding. Teachers don't get paid well. Their pay is ok, but better pay would attract better teachers and students would benefit.

Second, and most importantly, is the lack of parenting. From single parent homes to chaotic home lives, school is a refuge from many students. It is the only calm place in their lives and the last thing they think about when they enter each morning is learning. They are more worried about eating or if they are going to get slapped for doing something at home. I work in a Kindergarten class and 3 students have had one of their parents go to jail this year. 2 others are in and out of homes/apartments every other week. 1 girl was abused and her mom got turned to DHS and they found a history of sexual abuse. These students will struggle with learning all through school because they will have to deal with this issues at home. If these students home lives would get better, schools would get better.

i just stepped into public school. had been doing private. i like what i see in the public school thus far.

I went to a public school in a wealthy area of Lexington, KY for most of my middle school years. The school was great, teachers were good, and parents generally supportive. When we moved to NYC, my parents enrolled me into the Dalton School to start my high school career. The experiences, learning techniques, and feeling of accomplishments are vastly different. I would never trade my private school education for a public school education ever.

Band, art, football, cheerleading, etc.
Not enough math and science.

They use another part of the brain and encourage abstract thought. Students need to learn to THINK, not just rattle off facts and dates. Math and music are very similar in many ways.

...American society as a whole, we pander to the wealthiest 2 percent in America to the extreme neglect of the remaining 98% who are left to work out their own problems without the needed resources to properly address and fund solutions. Bush's federal budget this year for defense is $419.2 billion of line items and $87 billion for supplemental for a total of $506.2 billion, but how much federal funding goes to education?

<snip>

President Bush's Proposed FY 2006 Federal Budget for Education

In his budget request to Congress for fiscal year 2006, President Bush has proposed a $2.57 trillion budget that would either freeze or reduce spending for many domestic programs and employ a five-year plan for deficit reduction. The budget proposes 48 "program terminations" that affect education, totaling $4.3 billion, including $2.2 billion for high school programs such as vocational education.

<snip>
FY 2006 Program Terminations
The list of programs proposed for elimination in the FY 2006 budget request to Congress is attached along with the current amount of funding for each program. During a February 7 budget briefing, U.S. Secretary of Education Margaret Spellings noted that among the 48 program terminations proposed, 15 programs currently receive $5 million or less in funding. Spellings added that the funding for these programs would be “redirected to implement No Child Left Behind.”

Programs proposed for elimination include:

Comprehensive School Reform $205.3 million
Education Technology State Grants $496 million
Even Start $225.1 million
Safe and Drug Free Schools Grants $437.4 million
School Dropout Prevention $4.9 million
Smaller Learning Communities $94.5 million
Teacher Quality Enhancement $68.3 million
Vocational Education State Grants $1.19 billion

<more>
<link> http://www.nsba.org/site/doc.asp?CID=892&DID=35292

Then get to the heart of the matter, Bush's base!

<snip>

How to Fix What's Really Wrong with American Government
by Roger D. Rothenberger

Most of America's many political, economic and social ills are caused or aggravated by its most fundamental problem: America is not a democracy. America is a plutocracy governed by a wealthy few. Its government is populated by and first and best serves the wealthy who hold a perpetual hegemony of power and wealth through the generations, much to the detriment of the rest of the populace. Elections, offices and the favors of government are bought just like any other commodity.

While the major political parties embrace some differing secondary issues that attract each of us to one over the other, they all embrace and do not alter the current plutocracy. Therefore, the fundamental injustices and the many social and economic problems caused by the plutocracy are never repaired. Superficial reform and eternal tinkering will never fix the problem. The problem is not which party or who populates the government. The problem lies in its design, its structure and the distribution of its powers. The wealthy and wealth serving hold a hegemony of power over the electoral process and in all three branches while all others are excluded.

Our current plutocracy is not the result of irresponsible wealthy corporations and individuals corrupting in recent decades our once-sacred democracy. The creators of America's constitution and government were among the wealthy aristocrats of their day. When creating their new government, the founders excluded democracy to the extent politically possible at the time. They embraced instead the republican form of government, so-called "representative" democracy.

<more>
<link> http://www.newtopiamagazine.net/content/issue19/oped/fix.php

very good points. The wealthier school systems have better test scores because they have better funding. They have the money to do all of the creative things to illustrate the point the teacher is trying to make. In our schools the teacher are buying supplies out of their own pockets because they need them to adequately teach the kids.
Other schools have high test scores because they are small and the teachers have plenty of time for one-on-one work with each child and all questions can be addressed. No one gets left out.
Still other schools have put the focus on making the kids feel like they can trust the teachers and believe that the teacher is their friend and cares about them. This is also a time spent together point.
All schools have a bit of trouble with parents. Some parents think that if something needs to be worked on with the child, it is a reflection on them and they become defensive. Other parents act like they are to busy doing what they are suppose to do and the kid should keep up with school issues themselves. They (both parents) work many more hours a week than they use to. Plus, now, here, the parents have to buy school supplies that they remember the school use to supply. I hear the complaining in the department store every year.
Our society has gotten so fast paced and stressful that the kids feel it too.

The first thing wrong with schools is that it's hard to hold them accountable. They are like their own society living within our society.

The next thing wrong with schools is that they make kids take algebra. High school kids can't count back change! Make them learn usable math. This is a problem that has to be handled by starting with the grade school kids. They have to comprehend basic math, reading, and writing skills. They are too often let to continue throught the system without learning the basics. They are then somewhat lost the rest of the way. They need to master the basics and then move on. They need to master the math that they will use in everyday situations before they even worry about algebra and above. Higher math should still be available to those who do get it, but not forced upon kids who aren't getting it.

The next thing wrong with the schools is that it produces and almost encourages a society of hate. It allows the kids to harass the hell out of each other with almost impunity. The kids on the so called "fringe" can't make it through school when every day is hell. They are essentially denied an education because of the intimidation from the other students. This too should be handled by starting when the kids are young. Simple don't allow it. If bullying and shit starting is allowed at a younger age, it will only get worse. If it is nipped in the bud at grade school, it will follow more so in high school.

As to school funding? Follow the money. Where does the money that the school gets go? I bought a really nice stove at an auction recently. You really could hardly tell it was used. It came from the school system. Why did they throw out these stoves? Did they really need to replace them? This one was very good and the others looked good too. Smooth top type stoves. Computers too. Why throw out all of these pentiums 2? Wouldn't they still work fine for the majority of things that are done on the school computers? Couldn't the have been used in at least the grade schools? I bought one for my grandson for 30.00 and he plays all of his games on it. I don't know how much more computer he would need.
Where are they wasting the money? Who's doin the books?, and how much are the really high up people making?

ok, thats my suggestions for the schools

and 4-5 HUNDRED BILLION a year goes to feeding the military industrial monster.

very little goes into education.

As I understand it, other developed schools are spending comparable amounts or less per student and getting better results, which in and of itself should give us pause to review what we are doing. If what we are doing is wrong/poorly targeted/etc, spending more money will not appreciably change the results. I am not ready to commit to massive additional education funding until we get a better handle on what would be more effective.

That last part is the difficult piece. Bill Gates was right, the current US school system and structure are not going get us where we need to go. Other countries spend less and get more. However Japanese or European style solutions may not work in the US. Our school schedule was derived from the need to harvest crops. The training model was based on Victorian methods to bring basic literacy to the masses (the rich had private tutors). I believe we need to rethink things in general.

Make no mistake here, I desperately want to see the schools get better, but first want to see some serious analysis of alternatives as to structure, methods, and goals. This is not support for vouchers or the like, which are just private/fundie versions of the same thing. I would be really interested in seeing some serious alternatives looked at as a way to revamps and revitalize education in the US. Just more money in the current system would not appear to be the answer.

My bias/background for this is industrial design. A number of industries were up against practical limits of production volume, quality, and resultant price. New concepts came along, prices drop and quality improves. Have to think that something along those lines is possible for education.

1. Fix the buildings, heat, lights, visual aids, sports and play ground equipment,etc.
2. Enough books for every student.
3. Less attention on sports. More attention on the arts.(band, theater, choir, student paper,etc.)After school actives.
4. More pay for the teachers. Less for the administration. More funds for class room resources so the teachers don't have to pay out of their own pocket for supplies and teaching aids.
5. Hold parents more accountable for the actions of their kids. If a kid doesn't learn respect/manners, how to be kind,thoughtful,and helpful at home they'll never learn it on the streets.

that is a dramatic change from when I grew up....a time when parents SUPPORTED the disciplinary decisions made by teachers...


if you want to see the difference that discipline makes...look at Catholic schools (where most children go to college, even with low-income inner city kids), where parents AGREE to allow their children to be disciplined....to succeed in college, requires the skills of DISCIPLINE, MOTIVATION, AND FOCUS....


compare to PUBLIC SCHOOLS, where parents ATTACK the teachers continuously, much of it for tiny little attempts to maintain discipline in the classroom, often getting lawyers to back them up and destroy the teacher's career.....the result is to be expected...discipline cannot be enforced, classrooms are CHAOS, teachers fear for their careers, and few children learn the discipline, motivation and focus needed to go to college....

Public schools are about politics and keeping children out of the workforce. Sure, they act as if they are concerned about education, and some of the people in the system actually believe it, but it only takes a quick glance at what gets funded annually to see just how much people care about public education. What receives the first cuts when the government runs predictably over budget? Education. Why? First, the decision makers have all of their kids in private schools, so they don't give a shit. Secondly, corporate interests have been trying to move into public education as a way to condition future consumers earlier for years now, and politicians who whore themselves to corporate will know that a needy public education system will be more likely to cooperate with these corporate interests just to get the funding the state is denying them. Third, by keeping future voters poorly educated, or selectively educated as in the case of a "standardized" curriculum, they are more likely to allow, say, an unjustified pre-emptive war in Iraq without resistance.

In Florida, where Jeb! consistently lies about the progress he's made in public education, there is a disproportionate amount of retired people from other states who vote. They are far more concerned about health care than education, and the politicians trolling for their votes know this. As a result, decisions about the fate of public education in Florida are made in a board room by people more concerned about elderly people in condos than the children in public schools.

Have absolutely nothing to do with education. To paraphrase a quote I saw somewhere, education is an option that can only happen after a child's other physical and emotional needs are met.

So when you've got kids who aren't getting enough nutritious food to eat, who are living out of cars or on their mother's second cousin's couch, who live in neighborhoods where gunfire is more common than birds chirping, who live two blocks away from a hazardous waste incinerator or other industrial pollutor or were raised in a house full of peeling lead paint, who have medical problems like asthma, migraines, depression or even a sprained knee that they can't afford to get medical care for, who spend their evening taking care of younger siblings while their parents are on their third jobs of the day, who have parents who hear voices coming from the TV -- there's little chance that they will be educated.