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If Martha Got 5 Months, George W Bush Deserves 15 Years.

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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 06:28 AM
Original message
If Martha Got 5 Months, George W Bush Deserves 15 Years.
Martha got sent to the federal pen for lying about a stock transaction.

George W Bush did that and more, but his Poppy ordered the Feds to cover-up for him. In return, Richard Breeden, the guy who did the dirty work protecting Smirko also helped scotch WorldCom case. Oh yeah, Robert Jordan, the schmuck who repped Bush got made ambassador to Gas Field One.


Harken Hypocrisy

Bush's corporate ethics: Do as I say, not as I do.


By William Saletan
Posted Tuesday, July 9, 2002, at 4:11 PM PT

"A new ethic of personal responsibility" for who?On Monday, President Bush defended his stewardship of Harken Energy, a company on whose board of directors he served more than a decade ago. On Tuesday, Bush called for corporate responsibility in a speech on Wall Street. There are standards and assumptions under which the explanations Bush gave Monday can be defended, and there are company directors whose conduct can be defended under the standards and assumptions Bush outlined Tuesday. But there's no way to square the rules Bush applied to himself on Monday with the rules he applied to others on Tuesday.

The key facts in the Harken case are these: Bush sold more than $800,000 worth of stock in Harken in June 1990, two months before the company reported a far larger quarterly loss than investors had anticipated. Millions more in Harken losses had been concealed by suspect accounting of the sale of its subsidiary, Aloha Petroleum, in 1989. The SEC challenged the propriety of this accounting, and in January 1991, seven months after Bush sold his stock, Harken revised its books accordingly, nearly quadrupling the net loss it had reported. A form on which Bush was supposed to report his stock sale wasn't filed until eight months after it was due. However, he did file on time a form reporting his intent to sell the stock.

CONTINUED...

http://slate.msn.com/?id=2067870


Investigator Who Cleared Bush Gets WorldCom Job
Thursday, 4 July 2002, 3:07 pm

Alastair Thompson

A former Securities and Exchange Commission chairman appointed court monitor of WorldCom Inc. on Wednesday was previously responsible for clearing U.S. President George W. Bush of insider trading concerning his involvement in Harken Energy during the lead up to the 1991 Gulf War.

Bush’s involvement in Harken Energy in 1990 during the presidency of his father resulted just a wrist slapping for George Junior. George Bush had failed to file share sales declarations to the SEC for eight months during a period when the company's shares tanked.

The 1990 investigation into Harken has been receiving considerable coverage in US media in recent days.

SNIP...

And now it seems more than ironic that a man appointed by George Bush Senior as the SEC chairman, and who cleared George Bush of any impropriety over Harken (in spite of considerable evidence to the contrary) has now been appointed to oversee the largest corporate fraud in US history.

U.S. District Judge Jed Rakoff in Manhattan selected Richard Breeden, who headed the SEC from 1989-1993, to act as the court-appointed monitor in the SEC's civil fraud suit against WorldCom.

CONTINUED...

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0207/S00033.htm


TODAY’S JOLT

G.W. Bush = Ken Lay


BY SETH GITELL

THURSDAY, JANUARY 24, 2002 — Today’s papers are filled with the news of the resignation of Ken Lay, the chairman and chief executive of Enron. The reporters in Washington all want to know about President George W. Bush’s long-standing relationship with Lay and whether Lay parlayed that relationship into government help in keeping his complex energy-trading firm alive. This is, without doubt, an important question. Yet it neglects an essential fact about our president (one that nobody is talking about these days): George W. Bush is Ken Lay — or at least he was. Both profited by selling stock in their Texas-based energy companies shortly before those collapsed.

SNIP...

But both used and attempted to use their political connections to financial advantage. Bush had friends in high places during the SEC inquiry. His father was president during much of it, and Richard Breeden, a Bush family ally chaired the commission during that period as well. There’s more. When it came time for Bush to pick an ambassador to oil-rich Saudi Arabia last summer, he picked not an expert in terrorism or in Islam, but Robert Jordan, an expert in oil. Jordan’s main qualification? He represented Bush in the Harken Energy dispute.

SOURCE...

http://www.bostonphoenix.com/boston/news_features/daily/documents/02133528.htm

So. What happened to Martha Stewart seems a bit harsh when compared to what didn't happen to the smirking psycho.
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B Calm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 06:35 AM
Response to Original message
1. Yes, but Martha donated to the Democratic Party!
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 06:46 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. That's a real crime. This story leads to Treason...
You got that right, B Calm! Here's something else: Harken ties Bush to the bin Laden clan, and no presstitute working for Corporate McPravda today appears to have in interest in that story.


Bush & Bin Laden - George W. Bush Had Ties to Billionaire bin Laden Brood

By Roger Miller
 
The world now associates the bin Laden name with Osama bin Laden, the prime suspect be hind the terror atrocities of Sept. 11. As President George W. Bush leads an intense international manhunt for Osama, few Americans realize that Osama's eldest brother, Salem, was one of Bush's first business partners.

SNIP...

Osama embraced Islamic fundamentalism and is now the world's most wanted man. "Salem went on to become a business partner of the man who is leading the hunt for his brother," the Daily Mail's Peter Allen said. "In the 1970s, he and George W. Bush were founders of the Arbusto Energy oil company in Mr. Bush's home state of Texas."

President Bush and the bin Laden family have been connected through dubious business deals since 1977, when Salem, the head of the bin Laden family business, one of the biggest construction companies in the world, invested in Bush's start-up oil company, Arbusto Energy, Inc.

James R. Bath, a friend and neighbor, was used to funnel money from Osama bin Laden's brother, Salem bin Laden, to set up George W. Bush in the oil business, according to The Wall Street Journal and other reputable sources.

Through a tangled web of Saudi multi-millionaires, Texas oilmen, and the infamous Bank of Credit and Commerce International, Bush was financially linked with the bin Laden family until Salem met an untimely end in a freak flying accident near San Antonio in 1988.

CONTINUED...
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ladjf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 06:42 AM
Response to Original message
2. Bush deserves a life sentence without parole for flagrant
treason against the Govt. of the U.S.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 06:52 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Ironic how W believes in capital punishment...
When the general public discovers the Harken story, he might change his opinion. As you noted, ladjf, the story leads directly to treason:

The Bush-Bin Laden Connection

by HOUSTON CHRONICLE
June 4, 1992

Feds Looked Into G.W. Bush-Bin Laden Connection In '92.

Part One -- Bush Said Friend's Arbusto Investment Was His Own, Not Saudi Money. Friend "Declined To Comment For The Record."


"Federal authorities are investigating the activities of a Houston businessman -- a past investor in companies controlled by a son of President Bush -- who has been accused of illegally representing Saudi interests in the United States.

The Financial Crimes Enforcement Network -- known as FinCEN -- and the FBI are reviewing accusations that entrepreneur James R. Bath guided money to Houston from Saudi investors who wanted to influence U.S. policy under the Reagan and Bush administrations, sources close to the investigations say.

SNIP...

The federal review stems in part from court documents obtained through litigation by Bill White, a former real estate business associate of Bath.

White contends the documents indicate that the Saudis were using Bath and their huge financial resources to influence U.S. policy. Such representation by Bath would require that he be registered as a foreign agent with the U.S. Department of Justice.

In general, people required by law to be registered are those who represent a foreign entity seeking to influence governmental
action or policy. An Annapolis graduate and former Navy fighter pilot, White, 46, claims that Bath and the judicial system, under the veil of national security, have blackballed him professionally and financially because he has refused to keep quiet about what he regards as a conspiracy to secretly funnel Saudi dollars to the United States.

CONTINUED...

http://www.meta-religion.com/Secret_societies/Conspiracies/George_Bush/bush-bin_laden_connection.htm
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Laura PourMeADrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 06:55 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. My sentence for him: (1) be forced back into the Texas National
Guard and send him to Iraq -- one of those convoys that gets shot at all the time, (2) then into community service for the rest of his life, if he makes it out of Baghdad. Homeless shelter live-in manager would be good.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:15 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. You'd make an excellent Judge.
Most fair, your sentence, Laura PackYourBags. The crazy moron never did finish his obligation to the Texas Air National Guard, so it would be fitting for his next assignment to be a truck pilot supporting the troops on the front... if only there were a front.

Speaking of homeless shelter managers, have you heard what Bush did to get community service the first time? Someone named Xymphora mentioned cocaine.

http://www.serendipity.li/bush/xymphora01.htm

Wonder what the judge would say if were to discover Bush was also a traitor? The late FBI agent John O'Neill would have provided most interesting testimony at trial.


The Bush-Saudi Connection

EXCERPT...

Spiked Investigations

SNIP...

On October 12, 2000, two suicide bombers ignited their boatload of explosives next to the USS Cole, an American destroyer refueling in Aden, off the coast of Yemen. The blast killed seventeen sailors and wounded thirty-nine others. O’Neill and his crack investigating team were dispatched to Yemen and hit a stone wall. He had hoped satellite intercepts of phone calls between an al Qaeda operative in Aden and Osama bin Laden in Afghanistan would lead him to the mastermind of the Cole attack, but the American ambassador and the Yemeni officials blocked the investigation at every turn.

O’Neill resigned from the F.B.I. in July 2001 and signed on as security chief for the World Trade Center in September. He died in the WTC attack on September 11, 2001.

Oil Diplomacy

In Forbidden Truth: U.S.-Taliban Secret Oil Diplomacy and the Failed Hunt for bin Laden, two French intelligence analysts, Jean-Charles Brisard and Guillaume Dasquie, claim that the Clinton and Bush administrations impeded investigations of bin Laden and his al Qaeda terrorist group in order to maintain good relations with Saudi Arabia and to maintain the stability of the oil market. "As the late John O’Neill told one of the authors of this book, ‘All of the answers, all of the clues allowing us to dismantle Osama bin Laden’s organization, can be found in Saudi Arabia.'" (8)

In articles and interviews, Brisard has expanded on this statement, pronouncing the official story about bin Laden’s exile from his native Saudi Arabia in 1994 and his frozen assets to be a canard. Not only did O’Neill and the F.B.I. have extensive information concerning the finances of bin Laden and al Qaeda, but the business connections between the bin Ladens, the Mahfouzes, the al Ahmoudis, the Saudi royal family, and the Bush family kept turning up in their investigations.

Mahfouz, who owns Nimir Petroleum, has conducted joint ventures with the al Amoudi family, which owns Delta Oil. Delta Oil and Unocal planned to build a pipeline through Afghanistan before the Taliban backed away. These Saudi companies are still partnered with bigger oil companies (such as Texaco and Unocal) in developing Central Asian oil projects.

CONTINUED...

http://www.new-enlightenment.com/BushSaud.htm


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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 08:21 AM
Response to Reply #6
17. I'll vote for that!
I don't know about making junior Homeless Shelter live-in manager. He'd steal from them while they sleep!
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Blind Tiresias Donating Member (103 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:02 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. along with
his father, donald rumsfeld and all of his defense department associates, condi rice, dick chaney and his associates in the vp office. rush limbaugh deserves to be sodomized by a swarthy ex-baathist goon for daring to equate rape with fraternity hazing.
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Laura PourMeADrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:05 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. Speaking of Rush - Is he ever going to indicted for drugs?
It's amazing how these people get away with shit. Like Bill O'Reilly -- sailed right through the sex discrimination thing -- just a minor blip.
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Blind Tiresias Donating Member (103 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:11 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. i dont want him to get busted for that
because unlike that filthy sot, i am intellectually consistent in my positions, and dont think non-violent drug offenders should be prosecuted. Abu Gharib was a defining moment for whether conservatives would truly condemn something that was purely vile. Almost all of them did, but Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Glenn "syphillis plague" Beck and a few others didn't. In fact, Limbaugh and Beck suggested that such despicable tactics were equivalent to fraternity hazing.

I hope Satan has a special chamber of hell reserved for these fascist degenerates...
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Laura PourMeADrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:38 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. Agree on AG, but on the drugs -- change the laws, yes -- but
there are normal people in jail now for the law now -- why not him.
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Blind Tiresias Donating Member (103 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #13
25. hard to argue that
you are right. According to the laws, they should prosecute him. and since he apparently was obtaining 1000s of these pills, that should be enough to prove intent to distribute, which come w/ a long jail sentance.
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timtom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 06:53 AM
Response to Original message
5. Nonsense!!!
Bush deserves, AT THE VERY LEAST, life imprisonment and hard labor. At the very least!
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:00 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. True.
Thanks, nathan hale! The article was missing something and I couldn't quite put my finger on it. The little turd from Crawford would probably never walk free again should the courts ever return to the hands of the just.

Speaking of "just us," here's a nice article from "In These Times" on this very subject:

QUESTIONABLE TIES

Tracking bin Laden's money flow leads back to Midland, Texas


by Wayne Madsen

On September 24, President George W. Bush appeared at a press conference in the White House Rose Garden to announce a crackdown on the financial networks of terrorists and those who support them. “U.S. banks that have assets of these groups or individuals must freeze their accounts,” Bush declared. “And U.S. citizens or businesses are prohibited from doing business with them.”

But the president, who is now enjoying an astounding 92 percent approval rating, hasn’t always practiced what he is now preaching: Bush’s own businesses were once tied to financial figures in Saudi Arabia who currently support bin Laden.

In 1979, Bush’s first business, Arbusto Energy, obtained financing from James Bath, a Houstonian and close family friend. One of many investors, Bath gave Bush $50,000 for a 5 percent stake in Arbusto. At the time, Bath was the sole U.S. business representative for Salem bin Laden, head of the wealthy Saudi Arabian family and a brother (one of 17) to Osama bin Laden. It has long been suspected, but never proven, that the Arbusto money came directly from Salem bin Laden. In a statement issued shortly after the September 11 attacks, the White House vehemently denied the connection, insisting that Bath invested his own money, not Salem bin Laden’s, in Arbusto.

In conflicting statements, Bush at first denied ever knowing Bath, then acknowledged his stake in Arbusto and that he was aware Bath represented Saudi interests. In fact, Bath has extensive ties, both to the bin Laden family and major players in the scandal-ridden Bank of Commerce and Credit International (BCCI) who have gone on to fund Osama bin Laden. BCCI defrauded depositors of $10 billion in the ’80s in what has been called the “largest bank fraud in world financial history” by former Manhattan District Attorney Robert Morgenthau. During the ’80s, BCCI also acted as a main conduit for laundering money intended for clandestine CIA activities, ranging from financial support to the Afghan mujahedin to paying intermediaries in the Iran-Contra affair.

When Salem bin Laden died in 1988, powerful Saudi Arabian banker and BCCI principal Khalid bin Mahfouz inherited his interests in Houston. Bath ran a business for bin Mahfouz in Houston and joined a partnership with bin Mahfouz and Gaith Pharaon, BCCI’s frontman in Houston’s Main Bank.

CONTINUED...

http://www.inthesetimes.com/issue/25/25/feature3.shtml
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:29 AM
Response to Original message
12. If Martha Got 5 Mos, What Does W Deserve For 3000 Counts of
Negligent Homicide, Perjury and Obstruction of Justice for the cover up of his gross neglect of duty on 9/11?

If he got only one week for each of these wrongful deaths, he'd be behind bars for twenty years. I would confine him to an open air stockade at the site of the World Trade Center, and allow the public to get close enough to tell him to his face what they really think of him.

That would be justice, of a sort, that's been too long denied.



:mad: :puke: :grr:
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flordehinojos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. can you add to that 3000 the hundred of thousands innocent dead iraqis,the
number of young americans he has sent to die to defend his greed for oil and need for POWER, and as recently as yesterday the killing of an italian intelligence agent who protected with his life the life of italian journalist giuliana sgrena ... because WHO but BUSH would want to have sgrena silenced? she was first captured (disappeared when she went to interview survivors of the fallujah USA conducted massacre. AND certainlyr wouldn't the insurgents want the entire world to know what exactly happened in FALLUJAH? AND ... in how many pictures taken from the many real-life cases have DICTATORS and their GOONS killed someone they wanted silenced and then blamed it on the old, 'HALT' but 'THEY DIDN'T STOP SO I HAD TO FIRE' excuse. There is so much on Bush's hands!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that even if he had three lives and all three were sentenced to suffer execution by guillotine that would not be justice enough for him to repay all the damage and carnage he has hurled on so many.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 07:47 AM
Response to Reply #12
15. Bushler ties together Stock Fraud and 9-11
Your suggested punishment reveals that you are truly a compassionate person, leveymg. Bush and his ilk see only an eye for an eye. It's best to let murderers, gangsters and traitors live to think about what they have done. Having a public, open air prison sounds an excellent way for him to hear and learn many new things.

Almost forgot, James R Bath is the guy who ties Bush's business dealings to the bin Laden clan.

(Unger, the writer below recently penned "House of Saudi, House of Bush," is a good reporter -- fair, honest and as objective as possible. The article's from Salon and requires registration/commercial viewing -- it's worth the hassle.)


Mystery man

Why the White House deleted the name of Bush pal and Saudi go-between James Bath from the president's military records is a tantalizing but unanswered question.


By Craig Unger

April 27, 2004  |  Last month, before the 9/11 commission began its public hearings and Iraq exploded in renewed warfare, the White House tried to quell a gathering storm regarding President Bush's military service, releasing hundreds of documents about Bush's tenure in the Texas Air National Guard some 30 years ago. A close examination of the documents reveals that they not only fail to answer lingering questions about Bush's service but prompt a crucial new area of inquiry that could play a role in the presidential campaign -- a long and lucrative, but low-profile, relationship between Saudis and the Bush family that goes back 30 years.

The document that raises that question is dated Sept. 29, 1972, and notes that 1st Lt. George W. Bush was suspended from flying because of his "failure to accomplish annual medical examination." Since he had just received hundreds of thousands of dollars' worth of training as a jet fighter pilot, the fact that Bush let his medical certification lapse raises a troubling matter. Why did he allow himself to become ineligible to fly when he still had two years of service left? Given that random drug testing by the military had just started, some have suggested that Bush had not yet given up his partying ways and may have begged off because he had a substance abuse problem.

The records released by the White House last month fail to answer that question, but they do add one compelling fact to the story -- namely, that Bush was not the only man in his unit to be suspended for failing to take the physical, and that someone else at Ellington Air Force Base in Houston was suspended for exactly the same reason at almost the same time. However, in the documents, the second man's name was inexplicably redacted -- raising new questions.

Throughout the reams of documents released by the administration, standard practice was to allow each National Guardsman's name to be printed in full. Why did the White House make an exception in this case? Why would the Bush administration want to make sure this name in particular did not make it into the public eye?

The White House declined to answer these questions. However, the same document that was redacted by the White House had been the subject of a Freedom of Information Act request filed by Marty Heldt, who was investigating the story before the 2000 presidential election. In the same document that the White House selectively censored for release to the public, the name of the man who was also suspended with Bush is clearly printed. His name: James R. Bath.

CONTINUED...

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2004/04/27/james_bath/
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. Read the stuff on Bath years ago. Thanks for the link to the Houston
Chronicle article - I've seen that referenced before, but not reposted.

You're a natural resource, Octafish.

Honestly, I don't think I'm being that compassionate. After about 3 hours of being sworn at and spat upon by thousands of people, I'm sure W would wish he was dead. Imagine 20 years of that.

Best regards -
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Remember Pete Brewton's "The Mafia, CIA and George Bush"?
The open-air penitentiary is a most great image to visualize. How about we add a 24/7 webcam? That way, the People in the hinterlands can visit online. The folks who've helped create remote sensing devices could adapt some form of virtual spitting.

Most importantly: Thank you for the kind words, leveymg. They are much appreciated.

I believe the author of the article is Pete Brewton. He is the brave soul who wrote "The Mafia, CIA and George Bush" which helped document the connections between Poppy, those august bodies and the looting of the nation's savings and loans.

The Mafia, CIA and George Bush

by Pete Brewton
SPI Books, NY 1992
ISBN 1-56171-203-5

pp.209-210 & 224-227

EXCERPT...

Mischer has said he knows Bath, but "just to shake hands with him."

Big SNIP...

Skyways Aircraft Leasing began on July 2, 1980, as a company callled Cotopax Investments, registered in the Cayman Islands. Then, 29 days later, Cotopax changed its name to Skyways Aircraft Leasing Limited. On July 24, 1980, the directors of Skyways Aircraft Leasing met in George Town, Grand Cayman Island. (Interestingly, the meeting was a week before the name change was registered with the Cayman Islands authorities.) The directors named Bath as president and director and then resigned. All of the stock was made into bearer stock, which meant that it belonged to whoever possessed it. In his sworn deposition in the lawsuit against White, Bath refused to name the owners of the Skyway's stock. (Documents filed in another lawsuit indicate that Sheikh Khalid owned Skyways. White said Skyways had at least one airplane, a Gulfstream, that was on a long-term lease to an Abu Dhabi oil company.)

The original subscribers to Cotopax, who then turned Skyways Aircraft Leasing over to Bath, were Cayhaven Corporate Services, Ltd., of George Town, Grand Cayman; David G. Bird of George Town; and Grant J. R. Stein of George Town. Bird and Stein are both directors of Cayhaven Corporate Services and attorneys with W. S. Walker & Company, a law firm in George Town headed by William S. Walker.

Cayhaven Corporate Services and Bird were two of the three subscribers to a Cayman Islands company called I.C., Inc., which was incorporated April 26, 1985. I.C. sits right in the middle of a chart drawn by Oliver North, and found by investigators in North's White House safe, that shows the private network that provided support and money to the Contras. Here's how it worked:

The money started with donations to Spitz Channell's National Endowment for the Preservation of Liberty (NEPL). Then it was wired from NEPL's account at Palmer National Bank to the account of IBC, a Washington, D.C., public relations company formed by Republican operative Richard Miller at another Washington bank. Next, IBC wired the money to I.C. in the Cayman Islands, which then transferred a majority of it to the Swiss bank account used by North's "Enterprise" to fund the Contras.

CONTINUED...

http://www.webcom.com/~pinknoiz/covert/brewton.html
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. No, that work has escaped me until now. Do you know whether Salem bin
Laden's BAC 1-11 went down offshore in 1988?

There are conflicting accounts of where and when he died. The PBS Frontline Editor's Note that amended Lowell Bergman's otherwise excellent account is inaccurate. Shttp://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/binladen/who/family.html

Was unable to find a record of any crash involving Salem Bin Laden from 1982-1989 in the NTSB archives when I looked in early 2002. If there had been a crash, even of an ultralight, within the United States it would have been recorded in those reports.

Do you know of anyone who's ever followed up on this? Still curious, and you seem to know a great deal.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 12:13 AM
Response to Reply #22
27. FAA doesn't investigate / document ultra-light crashes, FWIU.
Here's what the Startlegram posted just after 9-11, using an interview with a former bin Laden family pilot and the local acting police chief.

The Strange Death Of bin
Laden's Brother In Texas


By Bud Kennedy
budk@star-telegram.com
Ft Worth Star-Telegram 9-27-1

SCHERTZ - One chapter in the enigmatic story of Osama bin Laden might lead to a Texas pasture, where his oldest brother died 13 years ago in an accident that is still something of a mystery.

What we do know is that Salem bin Laden, 42, and the oldest of Saudi Arabia's bin Laden brothers, was on one of his frequent visits to Texas when he and friends went out for a Sunday afternoon of fun - flying low-power ultralight aircraft at an air park north of San Antonio.

What we don't know is why Salem bin Laden took off in the tiny aircraft and turned toward a nearby row of high-power electrical towers. He climbed, but not high enough to clear the upper power line. The Sprint ultralight got tangled and crashed into the ground 115 feet below.

"Of everybody who was there, nobody could figure out why he tried to fly over the power lines," said Gerry Auerbach, 77, of New Braunfels, a retired pilot for Saudi Arabian Airlines and for the bin Laden brothers, multimillionaire builders who long ago disowned Osama.

"It was kind of a weird deal," said Schertz police Lt. Stephen Starr, at the time the city's acting police chief. "He just drifted up into the wires."

CONTINUED...

http://www.rense.com/general14/brother.htm

The original link at the Star-Telegram is no longer in service. This is a copy of the original posted on Rense.com.

Most importantly: Thanks for the kind words, leveymg. I'm just a scribe. GOOGLE is my friend.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 08:16 AM
Response to Reply #27
33. This incident wasn't recorded in the NTSB archives - there was a similar
fatal ultralight crash on May 30, 1983 near Bakersfield, CA. One of the witnesses named in that report was Dale Salem.

My original search of the National Transportation Safety Board database was done in February 2002 on-site at the NTSB headquarters in Washington, DC. That database tracks all fatal air accidents in the U.S. (lists several categories of aircraft, including homebuilts and ultralights). It is now available on-line with a query feature at:
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/query.asp

My original search during the period 1/1/82-12/31/88, revealed that there was no recorded fatal accident involving a BAC-1-11 in or near the US. That was confirmed by an on-line check this morning. See, below.

Furthermore, my original search did not reveal that anyone named bin Laden piloting an ultralight or small aircraft was killed during that period in the US. I went through every fatal incident report nationwide for ultralights and single-engine aircraft.

I performed a more limited on-line search this morning for fatal ultralight crashes in Texas during that period. There are six incidents retrieved - none match the powerline crash incident reported at Rense.com for Salem bin Laden. See, below.

Intriguingly, however, the NTSB database does show that on May 30, 1983, there was a fatal ultralight crash near Bakersfield, CA.
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001214X43022&key=1

One of the witnesses named in the original micro-fische accident report was Dale Salem, a representative of the manufacturer of the ultralight that crashed into high tension wires, electrocuting the pilot-owner, Donald M. Pierro of Los Angeles.

To further obscure things, The Times of London reports that Salem was "killed in a car crash" <9/15/2001, "Outcast Who Brought Shame on Family".> The Houston Chronicle and Wall Street Journal accounts both indicate that Osama bin Laden's older brother did die in an air crash near San Antonio, Texas in 1988, which confirms details of the initial PBS Frontline report. The FAA accident reports index would not include air crashes that occur outside U.S. territory, and had the bin Laden plane gone down in another country's territory, that data bank would not reference the incident.

The current index covers crashes offshore in the Gulf of Mexico. There was a non-fatal incident involving a TACA (Salvadoran Airlines) BAC1-11 on September 6, 1983.

I am afraid that Rense.com's assertion that the NTSB archives do not include ultralights is a fallacy. It actually lists all crashes -- fatal and nonfatal -- according to type of aircraft: homebuilt, ultralight, single engine, multi-engine. The strange thing is that there is no report of a crash involving Salem bin Laden during that period.

It is implausible that a local paper like the Ft. Worth Star-Telegram could report a fatal crash and it wouldn't be in the federal archives. I did get a copy of the local Bakersfield, CA paper, and there was a news story in there.

Either the report was removed from the NTSB archives or the Ft. Worth-Telegram account is bogus. NOTE: The NTSB archives were purged of "minor incident" reports on October 2, 2001, and one can no longer access "static files" according to a notation at bottom of the query page:

NOTES:
- On Jan. 8, 2001, dynamic access to the SQLServer accident data repository was implemented. Static files are no longer available.
- On Oct. 2, 2001, minor cases which do not fall under the definition of "accident" or "incident" were removed from the database; these entries were previously identified with "SA" in the NTSB number.
- On Sept. 18, 2002, data from 1962-1982 were added to the aviation accident information. The format and type of data contained in the earlier briefs may differ from later reports.


Would anyone like to follow up on this? I'd look first in the International Air Safety organization archives, but they wanted to charge a fee for their search. Please let me know if you find something definitive.

4 records meet your criteria.
A docket of supporting materials may exist for factual and probable cause reports. Please contact Public Inquiries. Dockets are not available for preliminary reports.
PDF Reports require the free Adobe Reader for viewing. Current
Synopsis
PDF
Report(s)
Event
Date
Probable
Cause Released
Location
Make / Model
Regist.
Number
Event
Severity
Type of Air Carrier Operation
and Carrier Name (Doing Business As)

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
1/28/1987
7/10/1989
ORLANDO, FL
British Aircraft Corp. (BAC) BAC 1-11 201
N101EX
Incident
SCHD Part 121: Air Carrier FLORIDA EXPRESS,INC.

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
10/17/1983

WASHINGTON, DC
British Aircraft Corp. (BAC) 1-11/204/AF
N2111J
Incident
SCHD Part 121: Air Carrier USAIR (D.B.A. U.S. AIR )

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
9/6/1983

GREEN CANYON172
British Aircraft Corp. (BAC) BAC 1-11
YS17C
Nonfatal
SCHD Part 129: Foreign TACA INTERNATIONAL AIRLINES

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
5/21/1982
5/21/1983
DAYTON, OH
BAC 1-11-204AF
N1124J
Incident
SCHD Part 121: Air Carrier U.S. AIR




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 of 1 Page


6 records meet your criteria.
A docket of supporting materials may exist for factual and probable cause reports. Please contact Public Inquiries. Dockets are not available for preliminary reports.
PDF Reports require the free Adobe Reader for viewing. Current
Synopsis
PDF
Report(s)
Event
Date
Probable
Cause Released
Location
Make / Model
Regist.
Number
Event
Severity
Type of Air Carrier Operation
and Carrier Name (Doing Business As)

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
4/18/1985

HOCKLEY, TX
CONDOR AIRCRAFT CONDOR III
NONE
Fatal(2)
Part 103: Ultralight

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
9/22/1984

MCKINNEY, TX
Mitchell T-10R263
NONE
Fatal(2)
Part 103: Ultralight

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
5/8/1984

HORIZON CITY, TX
Mitchell T-10R263
NONE
Fatal(2)
Part 103: Ultralight

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
8/26/1983

KELLER, TX
ROTEC RALLY 2B
NONE
Fatal(1)
Part 103: Ultralight

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
7/30/1983

ROUND ROCK, TX
PTERODACTYL ASCENGER II+
NONE
Fatal(1)
Part 103: Ultralight

Probable Cause
Factual ,
Probable Cause
5/8/1983

MANVEL, TX
ROTEC RALLY 2B
NONE
Fatal(1)
Part 103: Ultralight




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 of 1 Page

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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. I stand corrected and thank you for the information...
...Regarding the mysterious death of Salem bin Laden. As I indicated (From What I Understand), I was going by what I read -- not what is extant.

I thank you for your work, leveymg. The PBS folk aren't known for making such a major error, but things happen. And they may be correct. Determining the truth there could open some important new avenues of discovery.

The story gets muddied right off the bat. The FAA's record of an eyewitness to the California accident with the surname "Salem" is a most interesting example of how the unusual seems to appear in pairs -- synchronicity Jung called it.

Didn't Salem bin Laden commission James R Bath to convert a BAC 1-11? Perhaps that is where PBS's confusion arose. I included the Star-Telegram/Rense archive story because it had witness names who reported what they saw.

Here's what Sander Hicks put together on the PBS angle:

A New Look at the Reality of 9/11

"The People Will Not Go to War Over Imperialism."

A New Look at the Reality of 9/11


By Sander Hicks

EXCERPT...

Background on Bush/bin Laden

Since 1978, there has been a relationship between the bin Laden family and the Bushes. Bush's first company, Arbusto Energy, took $50,000 from James Bath. Later sued by his former business partner Bill White, Bath had to divulge the cash sources. While indicted in the BCCI Scandal, Bath admitted working for rich Saudis who bought political influence in the USA. The Sheiks invested in the young Bush whose dad was head of the CIA.

Bath's Saudis were Kalid bin Mahfouz and Salem M. bin Laden. The latter was the older brother of Osama bin Laden, his close companion since childhood. When Salem died in a mysterious 1988 plane crash, Osama attended the funeral. Some bin Ladens have distanced themselves from Osama, but Salem's fatal plane crash could have started a feud between the Bushes and bin Ladens.

According to PBS, Salem's death was investigated but the results of the inquiry never revealed. A former pilot, American Heinrich Rupp, stated to PBS that this BAC 1-11 that killed Salem was the same that flew Vice Presidential candidate George Herbert Walker Bush to Paris on October 18, 1980. There, according to sources, they convinced the Iranians not to release the 52 American hostages until Reagan was inaugurated. Israeli intelligence's Ben-Menashe corroborated Rupp's story when he told Congress he had seen Bush in Paris before they met with Iranian Mehdi Karrubi. Reagan was inaugurated January 20, 1981, and Tehran simultaneously released all 52 hostages. The Iranians later received advanced American weaponry in their long, bloody war with Iraq.

When a C-123 cargo plane was shot down by the Sandinistas in 1986, the Iran/Contra/Cocaine arms-for-hostages trading scandal unraveled. The Reagan administration was exposed for violating its own laws, selling arms to the Iranians in exchange for the release of hostages in Lebanon, and then diverting the funds to Contras in Nicaragua. Vice President Bush maintained at the time (and later throughout his Presidency) that he was "out of the loop." But late into his disastrous 1992 presidential re-election campaign, General Richard Secord testified that Bush did know all about the operation. The best that President Bush's campaign strategist Mary Matalin could do was panic. With four days to go before the election, she claimed that Iran/Contra was old news. Her mantra was, "people's capacity to focus on politics is about the depth and breadth of their thumbnail."

Wrong. People sensed they were being lied to. Bush and Matalin suffered a resounding defeat at the hands of Bill "Slick Willie" Clinton. On Christmas Eve, 1992, Bush pardoned Caspar Weinberger, McFarlane and four other CIA operatives "undermin the principle that no man is above the law." according to Special Prosecutor Lawrence Walsh. Bush had withheld evidence, refusing to hand over his personal notes on high level meetings.

SOURCE:

http://sanderhicks.com/articles/9111.html

Back to the Salem bin Laden (purely conjecture): How would his passing be of benefit to the BFEE? With all his money and interests, the guy seemed to be the kind of asset that people like to know and keep near. Did he know too much? Was he an eyewitness who was going to spill the beans on Arbusto and HARKEN? Did he plan to call in his IOUs made out to James Reynolds Bath, George Walker Bush and George Herbert Walker Bush?



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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 08:00 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
smirkymonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 08:34 AM
Response to Original message
18. Bush deserves a life sentence at the Hague...
as Slobo's bitch.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. Love letter from Krugman explains things better than I can...
You hit the pinhead right between his tooclosetogethereyes, smirkymonkey! The guy shouldn't have it easy in the slammer like he has throughout his wasted life. Krugman sums up the legal case nicely...

Everyone Is Outraged

More on accounting fraud and a secret in Bush's past


EXCERPT...

My last column, describing techniques of corporate fraud, omitted one method also favored by Enron: the fictitious asset sale. Returning to the ice-cream store, what you do is sell your old delivery van to XYZ Corporation for an outlandish price, and claim the capital gain as a profit. But the transaction is a sham: XYZ Corporation is actually you under another name. Before investors figure this out, however, you can sell a lot of stock at artificially high prices.

Now to the story of Harken Energy, as reported in The Wall Street Journal on March 4. In 1989 Mr. Bush was on the board of directors and audit committee of Harken. He acquired that position, along with a lot of company stock, when Harken paid $2 million for Spectrum 7, a tiny, money-losing energy company with large debts of which Mr. Bush was C.E.O. Explaining what it was buying, Harken's founder said, "His name was George Bush."

Unfortunately, Harken was also losing money hand over fist. But in 1989 the company managed to hide most of those losses with the profits it reported from selling a subsidiary, Aloha Petroleum, at a high price. Who bought Aloha? A group of Harken insiders, who got most of the money for the purchase by borrowing from Harken itself. Eventually the Securities and Exchange Commission ruled that this was a phony transaction, and forced the company to restate its 1989 earnings.

But long before that ruling — though only a few weeks before bad news that could not be concealed caused Harken's shares to tumble — Mr. Bush sold off two-thirds of his stake, for $848,000. Just for the record, that's about four times bigger than the sale that has Martha Stewart in hot water. Oddly, though the law requires prompt disclosure of insider sales, he neglected to inform the S.E.C. about this transaction until 34 weeks had passed. An internal S.E.C. memorandum concluded that he had broken the law, but no charges were filed. This, everyone insists, had nothing to do with the fact that his father was president.

CONTINUED...

http://www.pkarchive.org/column/070202.html
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smirkymonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. There is enough on that dirtball to legitimately keep him in
prison for the rest of his miserable life. The fact that he belongs to one of the biggest and most powerful crime families in the world is the ONLY reason he's in the White House and not the Big House.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 01:05 AM
Response to Reply #23
32. Perhaps the reason he's destroying the world so fast...
... is that he knows, given time, the American people will discover what a crook he is and actually put him behind bars. Thus he moves to penure the American worker, destroy the earth's habitat and create Chimpageddon in the Middle East.

Oh, he doesn't worry about himself or his retainers. Rev. Moon has created a hideaway the size of Massachusetts on the Paraguay / Brazil border. The Swiss don't keep all the gold in mountains for nothing.

So we better get crackin'...

Given his eugenically selected parentage's longevity means the psychotic moron would get to spend many, many decades in maximum security prison, doing hard labor.



Watching Over Enemies of the People.

Wouldn't that be a sight for sore eyes.

Source:
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GetTheRightVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
24. Life in prison would be to good for him
:kick:
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 12:40 AM
Response to Reply #24
28. Osama brother, Bush shared biz ties
Seeing the twisted moron making little ones out of big ones, digging ditches, laying rail or other appropriate work for the next 50 years does project a sense of justice.*



Osama brother, Bush shared biz ties

By London Daily Mail
Monday, September 24, 2001

LONDON -- U.S. President George W. Bush's past reveals strange links to the family of suspected terror kingpin Osama bin Laden.

In 1978, Salem bin Laden, the late older brother of Osama, appointed Bush pal James Bath to be his representative in Houston.

Bath had served with Bush in the Air National Guard.

Bush was not long out of Harvard Business School when he started Arbusto Energy oil company in his home state of Texas in 1978.

Bath invested $50,000 in Arbusto. Three years ago, Bush said that was the only dealing he had had with Bath.

It was never revealed whether Bath was investing his own money or somebody else's. There was even speculation the money might have been from Salem.

CONTINUED...

http://216.239.63.104/search?q=cache:wsM9nwMzTl8J:www.freemasonrywatch.org/arbusto.html+salem-bin-laden+%2B+ultralight&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

Original Source:
Ottawa Sun
http://www.canoe.ca/OttawaNews/OS.OS-09-24-0009.html

* This would represent the first REAL work ever done by the little turd from Crawford.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-05-05 11:34 PM
Response to Original message
26. You're making Laura nervous, Octafish




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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 12:50 AM
Response to Reply #26
29. Praise the Lord and Pass the Prozac!
Laura’d probably be happy to have the little turd out of the house for 25 years to life.

Do you think she knows about this?



Or how about the FBI? Do they know about this?

Connecting the Dots ... Bush ... Bath ... bin Laden...

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/Mahfouz.html

It's not just the fibbees -- Would that all Federal employees knew this, let alone the general public.
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 12:57 AM
Response to Original message
30. 15 years for Harkin, but a whole lot more for all those other crimes. n/t
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #30
35. Counterpunch's St. Clair pegged the turd with purdy words...
High Plains Grifter

The Life and Crimes of George W. Bush


By JEFFREY ST. CLAIR

Part One: The Ties That Blind

The mad cowboys are on the loose. Pack only what you can carry. Liberate the animals. Leave the rest behind. The looters are hot on the trail. Only ruin stands in their wake. Not even women and children are safe. Especially not them. Run for the hills and don't look back. Don't ever look back.

So the story goes, anyway.

We find ourselves living out a scene in a bad Western. A movie filmed long after all the old plot lines have been exhausted, the grizzled character actors put out to pasture, the Indians slaughtered and confined to desert prisons, the cattle slotted into stinking feed lots, the scenic montane backdrops pulverized by strip mines. All that remains are the guns, bulked up beyond all comprehension, and the hangman and his gibbet. We've seen it all before. But there's no escape now. Someone's locked the exits. The film rolls on to the bitter end. Cue music: Toby Keith.

Perhaps only the Pasolini of Salo: 120 Days of Sodom could have done this celluloid scenario justice. Or the impish Mel Brooks, who gave us Blazing Saddles (one of the greatest films on the true nature of American politics), if you understand the narrative as comedy, which is probably the most emetic way to embrace it. Both Pasolini and Brooks are masters of scatological cinema. And there's mounds of bullshit to dig through to get at the core of George W. Bush.

CONTINUED...

http://www.counterpunch.org/stclair08312004.html
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 01:01 AM
Response to Original message
31. guillotine
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-06-05 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #31
36. The Bush Gang IS the Mafia, but worse.
America today is like the terrorized neighborhoods of prohibition era Chicago. The mob rules through terror. Gee. For that matter it’s like 1930s Germany, too. Hitler said nothing moves people like fear of imminent death.
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