Just to clear the air - Democratic Underground

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:17 AM
Original message

Just to clear the air

My friend Robin Artisson, wrote the locked post http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=3361803&mesg_id=3361803

Deception was not my intent. I offered to post under my user ID, because he doesn't have one. I thought perhaps his point of view would not have gotten a fair shake, if it was his first post.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:19 AM
Response to Original message

1. seems to be a lot of that going around here lately....

it's called plagiarism. It's highly unethical.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Catherine Vincent

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #1

3. It's not plagiarism if he got permission first is it?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:26 AM
Response to Reply #3

11. yes it is

plagiarism is the act of taking somebody else's work - written or graphic, and presenting it as one's own. Asked repeatedly whether he wrote the post, he didn't respond. He at no point claimed it was somebody else's work in that other thread (unless he updated after I last read it.)

Yes, it's plagiarism.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

tishaLA

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:03 AM
Response to Reply #11

52. Oh that "other post"

at no point admitted the words weren't his or her own. Trust me. He or she even posted in another DU forum to alert other posters about his or her brilliance. (Hint: the forum may or may not have something to do with deities! Moralities--or not--indeed!).

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

BuyingThyme

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #1

5. What's plagiarism?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

FlemingsGhost

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #5

9. Using someone elses words as your own

Essentially, that is what happened.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

BuyingThyme

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #9

13. Somebody posting under somebody else's screen name

is not plagiarism. And there are no ethical questions.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #13

16. that's not what happened

Mobius posted somebody else's thoughts and words and presented them as his own. That is plagiarism.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Orangepeel

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:15 AM
Response to Reply #16

58. it sounds more like ghostwriting than plagiarism

I'm not defending the content of the post -- which seemed to be completely wrong, to put it mildly.

But, the situation sounds like ghostwriting, not plagiarism.

The use of ghostwriters is certainly unethical if the named author uses the work for fraudulent purposes, such as gaining an academic degree. But, as it makes absolutely no difference whether something is posted on an anonymous message board by "mobius" or "mobius' friend," it doesn't seem like too big a breach of ethics to me.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:24 AM
Response to Reply #1

7. beleive me I know him well enough

that it was not plagerism LOL

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #7

12. how well you know him as no bearing on it

you presented it as your own work. Somebody else did that recently here, and has had the decency not to come back to try to defend it.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

BuyingThyme

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #12

17. DU posters do not put names to our posts.

A poster can post whatever he or she wants as long as he or she is not violating copyrights.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:32 AM
Response to Reply #17

19. we are not talking about DU rules

we're talking about the ethical rules against plagiarism. Mobius posted somebody else's words and thoughts as his own. That's wrong.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:42 AM
Response to Reply #19

30. Im a she

and before you go off on a copyright tangent, i had permission to do that. Would you like the original link?

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/son_of_art/message/8769

and here is his website:
http://www.thecrookedheath.com/elder/hallpage.htm

We spoke on the phone for hours on this issue, just last night.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:44 AM
Response to Reply #30

32. I apologize

SHE is a plagiarist.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:49 AM
Response to Reply #32

37. Did you read what I typed before

Edited on Sun Mar-27-05 01:50 AM by Mobius

you made your little quip to amuse the masses? If you have permission, it's not plagerism. Do you even care about the original issue at hand? I refuse to respond to your childish namecalling, before this post gets locked, as well.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:50 AM
Response to Reply #37

38. you are simply mistaken

plagiarism is not excused because you have permission.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

mondo joe

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #37

45. When students buy term papers they have the permission of the author

But it's still plaigerism.

This is true here as well, despite the difference that students are generally gaining something in the process.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Texasgal

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:49 AM
Response to Reply #30

36. This makes no difference.

You fucked up, your credibility is shot. Suck it up, move on. Don't do again.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Texasgal

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:34 AM
Original message

Perhaps not violating copyrights

But it is a violation of trust. When Dookus posts something, I believe it should be Dookus's opinion and thoughts, not some asshole who decided to get into the fray and post some bullshit under someone else's ID. This is not just a DU thing, this is pretty much an unwritten rule on most message board communities.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:37 AM
Response to Original message

25. heheh

when you read Dookus' opinion and thoughts, you generally ARE reading some asshole who decided to get into the fray. But at least they are THIS assholes' thoughts :)

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Texasgal

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #25

26. And hey!

THat's all I am asking for! :P

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Catherine Vincent

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:40 AM
Response to Reply #25

28. You're admitting you're an asshole?

Kewl!:-)

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:47 AM
Response to Reply #28

34. of course

and yet I still have a higher opinion of myself than I do of most of humanity. :P

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Catherine Vincent

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:41 AM
Response to Reply #17

29. Hi there!

Check out post #30!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3362698

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #12

20. well it does,

if I had his permission to do so. I beleive everything in it, and consider it my own opinion. I fully intended to wait a fwew hours, and then reveal the true author. It was never my intent, that all should belive I wrote that. I made this post to make sure, noone believed it was my writing.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:34 AM
Response to Reply #20

21. whatever

:eyes:

it was your intent to lie, then clear it up. That makes it all better.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

FlemingsGhost

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #20

27. Congratulations, you are the very first DUer on my ignore list

... and I've been here from day one.

We are on our honor, when posting at DU. So, right now are you "Mobius" or "the friend, Robin." See my point? If you don't, it doesn't really matter. You no longer exist, on my screen.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

mondo joe

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:43 AM
Response to Reply #20

31. Permission makes no difference. Plagiarism is plagiarism.

Students who buy term papers do it with the permission of the seller.

Though I wouldn't suggest anyone pass this off as their own.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Wonk

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:51 AM
Response to Reply #20

41. re: "I beleive everything in it" (sic) see post #23. nt

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

MrNiceGuyDied

(73 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:14 AM
Response to Reply #7

57. What?

Well I will never take another post of yours seriously.

Is this your way of trying to get some mojo back after that brutal thread?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

pacalo

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #7

60. All the questions that were asked of you were ignored.

Each question was an opportunity to explain that it was a newbie's post.

As factually flawed as it was, you should have been anxious to disclaim it as your own.

Well, actually it was an idiotic post.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

FlemingsGhost

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:20 AM
Response to Original message

2. Guess you won't be doing that again.

Right?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

mondo joe

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:22 AM
Response to Original message

4. Please refer your friend to a source for some actual facts of the case,

since his diatribe was medically, legally and historically erroneous.

Try this: http://abstractappeal.com/schiavo/infopage.html

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

jdj

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:51 AM
Response to Reply #4

40. I just think it's so sad that people keep on with this bleeding shit.

my grandmother passed the very same way as Terri Schiavo, and her tongue, and her lips DID NOT BLEED, nor did anything else. That is such a crock of fucking shit. We had lip balm to put on her lips to keep them from chapping and getting too dry. We gave her swabs with water till she couldn't swallow or open her mouth anymore and was semi-conscious. There was no fucking stigmata, scouts honor.

I get so tired of reading this melodramatic garbage. By the way, I'm bleeding right now, it's my time of the month. Should congress get involved on my behalf?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Texasgal

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #40

44. ROFLMAO!

Great post!

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Catherine Vincent

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:17 AM
Response to Reply #40

59. LOL!

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Texasgal

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:23 AM
Response to Original message

6. Personally I think it's bullshit

People here on DU take their debates very seriously. False identities are a huge NO NO.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #6

10. yeah and what chance do you think

it would have gotten with a new user ID?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Texasgal

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #10

14. It doesn't matter...

It's a huge NO NO. If your friend truly believes what they were posting, then having them register and posting their thoughts gives them much more credibility.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

mondo joe

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:29 AM
Response to Reply #10

15. Since it was 100% bogus, no better or worse than with an old ID

The issue is not the newness of the ID or the opinion but the simple factual errors.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

karlrschneider

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:32 AM
Response to Reply #10

18. Probably about the same chance it's getting now, being a farrago of

wingnut lies and bullshit.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

PassingFair

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:34 AM
Response to Reply #10

22. Whatever the effect ...

YOUR credibility would not have been totally trashed.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

saracat

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #10

33. Then since you say that this is your point of view as well, why didn't you

simply post your own point of view? it is misleading to try and make people believe that the post has more credibility as the poster has many posts. You were trying to mislead. I don't think the number of posts give a post more credibility, but obviously you do, as that is what you are stating.
IMO that post, regardless of who posted it , didn't have any crdibility as it wasn't based on "facts". But whatever. I would hope most people wouldn't attempt to hide under another posters post count!

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Wonk

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:48 AM
Response to Reply #33

35. We had a 'sock puppet' moment in reverse. LOL. nt

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #33

43. because hes a much better writer than i am

LOL

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Dookus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:58 AM
Response to Reply #43

49. so why not simply say

"this is what my friend robin has to say on the subject, and I agree with it"?

You were asked repeatedly in the thread if you had written it.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

punpirate

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:25 AM
Response to Original message

8. It seemed to have gotten what it...

... deserved, anyway. It was flamebait.

Do you really think that, in the care of a professionally-staffed hospice, that she's in any pain?

In Florida, there's no law allowing euthanasia, so this is the next, legal means of carrying out her wishes as determined, repeatedly, by the courts.

Adding the gory details (as your friend, not a doctor, presumes them to be) is meant to tweak people's emotions, not their minds.

Cheers.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Wonk

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:35 AM
Response to Original message

23. Your non-DUer friend who you copy-pasted for is an ignorant freeptard

(or am I being redundant?)

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #23

47. Oh hes far from Republican

very far. There are other cultures and belief systems that value life.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

barbaraann

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:37 AM
Response to Original message

24. In my opinion, that was inexcusable.

n/t

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Gannon Man Date

(123 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:50 AM
Response to Original message

39. I wonder

Would you all be treating Mobius so harshly if she had posted something that was sympathetic to Michael Schiavo's position?

In my opinion, no one would probably give a spit. But that's just my stupid newbie opinion, so ignore me.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Wonk

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #39

42. Depends if it was based in reality or not, imho. nt

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Texasgal

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:01 AM
Response to Reply #39

50. NO

There are plenty of people on here that disagree with the Terri Schiavo case. Those people are HONEST enough to post their own opinions on it, debate it and move on. They have CREDIBILTY.

You just don't do this kinda crap.... you just DON'T.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:01 AM
Response to Reply #39

51. one person

well 2 actually!
Welcome to DU :yourock:

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

lies and propaganda

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:04 AM
Response to Reply #39

53. Your handle is awesome!

Welcome to DU:hi:

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

janx

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:53 AM
Response to Original message

46. Who is Robin Artisson?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Mobius

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #46

48. Google it

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

janx

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #48

55. "...a fundamentalist pagan with a messianic complex."

Edited on Sun Mar-27-05 02:11 AM by janx

Once upon a time, there was a man named Anthony Palazzo who, after suffering from intense heat stroke at a New Orleans mardis gras, became convinced he could perform 1337 magick. After trying in vain to shoot lightning bolts out of his fingertips, he then became a fundamentalist pagan with a messianic complex. Mr. Palazzo then turned his mystical efforts to something much more ominous: the internets...

http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/index.php/Son_of_art

It sounds as if young Mr. Palazzo might have a little too much time on his hands. I, however, do not.

P.S. Remember what Dookus said about plagiarism, please. It is intellectual theft. Good night. :hi:

Edit: Oh--and please let Mr. Palazzo know about plagiarism. From what you presented in your copy/paste, it doesn't seem as if he knows much about it either.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Name removed

(0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:09 AM
Response to Reply #55

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Blue-Jay

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:04 AM
Response to Original message

54. In addition to being a plagiarist,

you offered NO evidence to support your (OK, someone else's) assertion as to Mrs Schiavo's current condition. Are you or your ghost writer by her side currently? Are either of you doctors?

Or was your (his) first post merely an exercise in emotional pandering?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Moderator

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Sun Mar-27-05 02:19 AM
Response to Original message

61. Locking

The purpose of confession has been served, and sufficient penance has been served out for remission of the sin.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

DU AdBot (1000+ posts)

Thu Apr 25th 2024, 06:09 PM
Response to Original message

Advertisements [?]

Top

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators

Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.