I watched the Passion of the Christ last night

I wanted to like it, I really did. I actually wanted to see how it would affect me, even though I was pretty nervous about the level of violence in the movie. I can honestly say I sat down to watch with a completely open mind.

I started the movie as an agnostic. I finished the movie as an atheist. Something tells me this is not the intended effect.

The level of violence and gore is astounding. Even though I was prepared for it, it was still shocking. I feel really strange today and I can't quite put my finger on it. It did effect me emotionally and there was a point where I openly sobbed ("forgive them, they know not what they do"). Then there were other scenes where I looked on in abject horror... like the bathing in the blood of Jesus scene.

I guess this proves it. I just don't have it in me.

'a snuff film, starring Jesus'.

That about covers it, I think.

Sums it up perfectly.

My problem with it was that anyone who wasn't a believer was depicted as a defective: ugly, drunk, mentally retarded with snaggle-toothed inane laughing and just plain sub-human. Herod was full-on gay-bashing.

Worse than all that is that it wasn't ABOUT anything. There was no theme or reason to it, it was just a travelogue of how things happened. Worse still is that it makes no sense; why does the extremity of the agony prove anything? Torture is two things: physical pain and the fear of death or permanent crippling or disfigurement. The real terror of torture is the latter, but God Junior knows he's gonna be fine in the long run, so what's the big damn deal? The eye-pecking is just a threat that if one doesn't go along with the belief, it'll be excruciating. The promise of paradise to the other guy on the cross just shows one of the uglier sides of Christianity: it doesn't matter what you do to others, just suck up to me and you'll be fine. This is god as the raging egomaniac.

"The Jesus Chainsaw Massacre"


http://www.kliljedahl.net

...that for me, The Last Temptation of Christ had a whole lot more of an impact on my beliefs about Jesus than Passion did.

And LTOC is the "controversial" one that everyone got so riled up about. Passion is just a snuff film as far as I'm concerned, not a "labor of faith" or a great statement. Just a guy getting beaten for two hours.

strengthened my belief and made me grateful. How the Church missed that is beyond me, unless of course they never bothered to watch it.

The whole point of showing Christ in an alternate ending was so the viewer could juxtapose the choice Christ had; die on the cross or fuggetaboutit and take the path of mediocrity.

because it ever so gently pokes fun at all the pompous religiosity and dogmatic rigidity while clinging to the existence of a god and a heaven. It's entertaining enough for an unbeliever like me and provocative enough to get believers to think about things for a bit.

Besides, I've got a thing for Silent Bob.

And, you know, the Church would do well to promote a Buddy Jesus over the trashing of the flesh in Passion.
I am a lapsed Catholic and that movie made me giggle all over myself.

...but same movie review. Thumbs up.

My kids really loved it. And it managed to have an upbeat ending that pleases both believer AND non-believer.
A sweet movie that cuts to the core of hypocrisy.

The film actually brought me back to the faith; it helped me see Christ's humanity, at a juncture in my life when I thought Him to be a distant avatar.

I usually quite enjoy religious films. In fact, the reason why I broke down and watched the Passion last night was because I missed the annual broadcast of The Ten Commandments this year.

And when you realize that Christ's "temptation" is the devil tempting Jesus to not sacrifice himself in exchange for a life of love and comfort, you'll see that the "controversy" was pretty stupid.

watching that one. :) It's basically an annual tradition. I remember watching that movie when I was a little kid (or seeing my parents). :) Always the same one too. Hehe. Moses is one of my favorite Bible characters.

We wouldn't need the likes of MEL GIBSON to tell us about it!

is a much more effective film for conversion. Franco Zeferelli had a clue.

It was playing on one of those obscure channels high up the channel list.

is a much more effective film for conversion. Franco Zeferelli had a clue.

DU must be having technical difficulties. :shrug:

Welcome aboard (actually I'm a naturalistic pantheist)!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=263

Naturalistic Pantheism is a form of Pantheism which holds that the universe, although unconscious and non-sentient as a whole, is a meaningful focus for human spirituality. Accordingly, Nature is seen as being "God" only in a non-traditional, impersonal sense.

I've always refrained from defining myself as an "atheist" because I am quite spiritual. I just don't classify myself under any organized religion.

I am militantly opposed to fundamentalist theists. The thing that is bugging me lately is that "moderate" deists (Christians, etc.) make organized religion "acceptable" and give cover to the real nutjobs.



http://www.samharris.org/

I can't brink myself to watch it. Violent imagry stays in my head to long.

I understand how this movie could turn you into an atheist. The more I hear and read about religion and especially these neo-cons (like seeing the protesters at Terri's hospice) the more I am turned off by religion. The more I see only it's bad effects.

I guess religion is doing good for some people, somewhere. Maybe there are more moderate people who lead their lives by religion and it makes them better. But I see it as taking away the persons ability to reason, to make their own choices.

And I get very offended when religion and morality are linked - as if you can't have one without the other.

she believes that it should not take fear of hell to force someone to be kind or do good, one should be that way because it's right and just.

I agree with her. She and her husband are athiests and make no bones about it, yet they are among the most moral people I know.

when my family did-- I looked away. I think the important part of the story was completely left out anyway-- isn't the resurrection part the real point? that was left somewhat vague wasn't it? nah... there's a culture of death for ya, when you leave out the point of it all.

His life and teachings and just him in general is what's important and that you can overcome death.

And I even have a certain level of belief in Catholic "suffering" theology. The gore seemed gratuitous and did nothing to relate any sort of message about suffering for the sins of others being universal, which is part and parcel to forgiveness instead of condemnation.

Besides the gratuitous violence. I was really hoping to understand more completely how Jesus died for *our* sins, but this did not translate very well.

Also, knowing that Christ suffered can be strengthening when we suffer. He isn't putting anything on us that He wasn't willing to go through. In addition, we suffer from each other's sins all the time, every day. We can respond with a willingness to accept that suffering and pray for those who unknowingly inflicted it. We can also willingly suffer, or sacrifice, for our fellow man. When we do it with good joy and the spirit Christ intended, we become more spiritual and are more closely walking in Christ's footsteps.

I say that with my head because I am so angry at the Catholic Church and Christianity in general that I can't even celebrate Easter. That movie actually made me more frustrated with these fundamentalists.

the violence was necessary to the story, or whether it was gratuitous. I decided it was gratuitous. What made me reach that conclusion was the scene where the bad thief (crucified next to Christ) has his eye pecked by the raven. An unpleasant bit of fiction so far as I know. (But the movie is based in part on visions by certain Catholic mystics; perhaps this is where this came from.)

My impression is that people tended to react to the movie according to their pre-existing religious faith; it had a strong impact on many viewers from conservative Protestant backgrounds. My own brother, a conservative Episcopalian deacon, recommended it to me. I am perhaps a more liberal Episcopalian (more liberal politically than theologically actually), but the movie was a turn-off as far as my faith goes.

The Gospels are a far better barometer. But if you are eager for a cinematic rendering, I suggest the Italian film "The Gospel According to St. Matthew" or Scorsese's "The Last Temptation of Christ."

I've been trying to define it to myself since last night and I just can't. But that's how I felt as it ended. I guess in a sense it really underscored the issues I have with Christianity and made me realize that even though these things have an emotional affect on me, that I just don't have the faith required to believe that the only way to God is through his son. *shrug*

I'll need to ponder this some more.

I went alone because my husband refused to see it.

I was prepared to be wrecked.

Yes, the violence was nearly intolerable. It was so graphic.

I left the theater feeling a multitude of emotions. I felt totally at peace. I had this feeling of overwhelming gratitude.

My predominant feeling, although, was grief for the human race, because--people just don't change. The persecuting, ill-informed Romans reminded me of the neocons. Like the Romans, the neocons do so much in the name of "justice" and "rule of law"--but really, they're just sadistic, reckless, Godless dolts.

My mommy hormones were also activated. Much of the movie allowed you to see Jesus' suffering through his mother's eyes. The movie flashbacked to Mary remembering Jesus crying when he was hurt as a child; and then flash forwarded to Mary witnessing her son carrying the cross, bloody and suffering. It was truly heart wrenching.
Being a mom, I just really identified with her pain.

Also--Simon--the man who helped Jesus when he fell--really struck me. He made me realize how important it is to help others and to speak out against injustice--even when you might be persecuted for doing so. Simon risked a great deal to help Jesus. Simon reminded me of the importance of listening to your intuition.

I'm not sure how to put the movie in a general context--because I really don't know what to believe about religion. I used to be a Catholic and I'm in the process of shedding all of that indoctrination and finding how religion/spirituality fits into my world.

I don't know if "The Passion" is true. Right now, I'm questioning everything. Regardless, "The Passion" is a story that reflects human behavior and the human condition.

I think there are lessons to learn and insights to glean, from "The Passion" no matter what you believe--or don't believe.

The absolute and complete evil of the persecutors.

about "The Passion" is that it focused on Jesus' violent end and not on all his good works and "miracles". The movie doesn't let you know about the man who helped the poor and the needy, spent time with the so-called dregs of society and healed the sick of body and spirit. He spent time ministering to people that today's "so-called Christians" wouldn't be caught dead around.

All you see is a man arrested by Romans and then violently killed by them. Gibson doesn't explain, in my opinion, why there were so many people saddened my his death. Jesus was more than his death and re-birth. He tried to show people how to live and treat each other with love and respect.

I think in this day and age we could use more of that.

on edit: I forgot to mention I like King of Kings better(with Jeffrey Hunter)

.. in that there are tons of films already out there which deal with the life of Christ. To my knowledge, PASSION is the only one which deals head-on with the final sufferings of Christ.

That's the point of the movie... to deal graphically with the difficult and painful moments that Christ was literally been born to go through on our behalf.

It's not my favorite Jesus movie, but it is undeniably moving and powerful. I've always looked at it as the flipside to LAST TEMPTATION. PASSION seeks an emotional response, whereas LAST TEMPTATION is intended to provoke an intellectual reflection. Both have their rightful place.

Honorable mention would go to JESUS OF NAZARETH for giving a very completist retelling; KING OF KINGS for the majestic musical score and drama (although it sometimes hilariously bends characters into situations they wouldn't have been in historically)

But I think from what I've heard about it, that it misses the point. The cross was only the price of man's inhumanity to man, and is only intended to open the eyes of those who don't get the rest of the story.

from his sister and was watching it down here and I was down here ignoring it and all that because I've heard some bad stories of people leaving the room to puke and all that. I was going upstairs and passed the tv area and saw a scene from one of the beatings. It was SO disgusting. My God. It was so disgusting I still have that awful picture in my head. :puke: Of course it is a crucifixion and they didn't have the gas chamber and things like that and crucifixion's were usually back then very very humiliating hence all the gambling for his clothes and the "King of the Jews" sign and the crown of thorns etc. :( It's very sad but yet also very disgusting with all the violence.

that * has on me now. Started out as agnostic, but he has turned me into an atheist. I just cannot understand how a Father could let his children that he loves so much be treated this way. I do understand that a lot of children have to learn by their mistakes, but no parent would willingly let their children be abused the way * is abusing those all over the world today. A loving father would never stand still for us. Now go ahead and flame away.

I found it very moving. I am a very empathic person and I can
admit I found it very difficult to see someone suffering onscreen
like that.

I don't think it affected my faith (or lack thereof) but it did
remind me in graphic detail of man's inhumanity to man.

Even if it is not strictly historically accurate, the romans did do this
(and worse) to thousands of people in their time.

Schindler's list and Hotel Rwanda had a similar effect on me. :cry:

The movie is very true to the book. If you haven't, read 'Schindler's Legacy', stories of the list survivors.
Also, 'And God Cried'. Seriously moving and haunting.
Two significant Holocaust novels that I think are must-read are 'Night' and 'The Forgotten' by Elie Wiesel.
Sorry, back to Easter.

... but I never enjoyed SCHINDLER'S LIST. I thought it focused more on Schindler's character arc and less on the plight of the Jews. Yes, I know that was the point of the movie and it is well-made, but it didn't engage me emotionally on the Holocaust because it told the story at somewhat of a distance from the Jews.

ESCAPE FROM SOBIBOR remains, in my opinion, the ultimate Holocaust drama, and the most emotionally affecting one.

but the story was not only about the victims, but a character study of Oskar Schindler. A good man, but not a perfect man. A story that tells of some (obviously not enough) righteous people who did not sit back and watch the horror, but actually tried to help, and about Oskar Schindler's anguish over not being able to do more.
You're right, there is a bigger story to tell, this is just a small part of what happened during that horrible time in history.
I will take your recommendation. I have not seen the film you mentioned.

It's unfortunately only available in a cut version; the original showing was a two-part CBS miniseries. Reading the book it's based on, by Richard Rashke, will fill in most of the missing bits. Those people went through hell and made a valiant, even ingenious, attempt to revolt against their captors.

Thanks, have a wonderful day.
:hi:

to him as a child then she ran to help him up. That was a very powerful scene but what made it powerful was the love of a Mother for her son which would have occurred with most women regardless of who the person was being tortured. Personally, I was numb half way through the movie and by the time he was being crucified I had a hard time empathizing with his pain because I was just warn out.

I did feel as though they made the Jews out to be dark and ominous. Every time they came in to the room this ominous music would play.

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One, because I'm not a Christian and really have no interest in Jesus and two, because I can't stand blood and guts in movies-unless it's a scary movie and even those I'm pretty choosy about-LOVED "The Ring" because it scared the heck out of me and can't wait to see the "The Ring 2"-not to mention that the first Ring wasn't really gory anyway...

Okay, so while I'm not Christian, I love movies like "It's a Wonderful Life"... Oh My Gawd, I'm drawing a blank here, but just a host of other movies that feature God, Heaven, Angels, etc., in heart warming ways. I guess I pick and choose whatever resonates with me and grabs me at my spiritual-though not religious-core. Given the recommendations here, I'm gonna rent Dogma asap-it sounds like it could be interesting...

children sitting in the movie theater with me (Not Mine!). I am beginning to think all that blood and gore triggered a "nuclear reaction" in some people who were probably on the verge of "going postal" to begin with. Its the same thing that happens in wartime to young people that are exposed to graphic violence. We now have a nation of religious zealots with post traumatic stress disorder. I expect them to start carrying machine guns and shooting at anything that moves any second now!

BTW, one of my sons friends claims there is a Christian video game at his church. My son admires the kid and wanted to know if he could get it. the kid is a good kid as far as I can tell, but his parents are definately homophobic! I have never seen the game, but all I could think is what the heck kind of "game" could Christianity create?!

with my movie violence. Sexless snuff films don't interest me.

and I can't even force myself to rent that movie - mostly because it doesn't appeal to me, but also because I figure it will dredge up icky feelings from my Mormon upbringing.

chocolate crosses you'd get your brain straight.

er...yeah it's kinda amazing what parts of their religion some people want to obsess about. Blood, death, gore...yep there's a great model that will help your children advance the ideals of the "prince of peace".

wonder how many of the people swooning over Passions could sit through What the Bleep do we know...

By the way, here's a take on the movie that didn't get a lot of play:

http://www.truthout.org/cgi-bin/artman/exec/view.cgi/22/3701

But if it was, then all I have to say is holy shit, because the DVD I watched last night was horrifyingly violent.

...you have a good therapist standing by. Snuff films lead to violence I hear. But at least it wasn't Janet's tit!

Coyul