"Pain Weapons" against International Law?

I'm listening to a shortwave program right now, I think it's Radio Canada, and the disucussion is these new pulsed laser energy weapons we're developing. Brian Wood from Amnesty is stating that systems designed to cause intense pain are torture, and illegal under International Law.

Then John Alexander (the guy who "wrote the book" on "non-lethal" weapons in War) says "Non lethal means it's INTENDED not to kill, NOT that it will NEVER kill..." This guy says the pain factor is "Behavior Modification", not torture, and besides, "They use hammers to torture people in N. Korea, but nobody is calling for a ban on hammers..."

And our cops are already lighting our asses up on a daily basis with "Pulsed Energy Weapons"...They're called "Tasers"....

(editied to Name Names and clean up typos)

to the floor. Quite the opposite - these weapons are designed to maximize pain right up to the lethal limit. Eventually, they'll use them to torture everyone for hours at a time within entire city blocks. Those who don't surrender will then be slaughtered with the usual high explosives, shrapnel, and cluster bombs.

The scientists and officers at DARPA who are developing this stuff are Martians.

with as many deaths as we have with taser guns these weapons will have their share of "accidental, not related to the weapon itself" deaths. I'm not looking forward to my first taste of it. Maybe we can get ready for it by sticking our heads in a microwave for a few seconds everyday. :crazy:

We're ameriKKKa. and we're not subject to your petty international laws. :eyes:

between these weapons and say a billy-club or even a bullet? They
all hurt. A lot :(

often kill quickly.

It comes down to the scale and duration of extreme pain inflicted.

and can take a long time to heal (if it doesn't kill you). I speak
from experience ;)

a "phaser" just hurts

Like they do "Cattle Prods"

Pain compliance is unfortunately necessary on occasion. There is no way of getting around it. When someone is combative they must be restrained. Choices for LE are Taser, OC,"Tear Gas", Less-Lethal shotgun rounds, K-9, blunt weapons (ASP and flashlight), and empty hand. The purpose for these tools is to get complaince, not cause pain.

Right now Tasers are the most effective tool which is why their use is spreading. Afraid there is no perfect solution. The old "beat down" method caused more injury, deaths and lawsuits. Every tried to fight someone freaking out on something? I have a personal experience where it took 3 of us to subdue one person. Sprayed him with OC but he did not even flinch. It was coming to a point in the fight that I thought I was going to have to shoot him. A Taser would have been nice. As it was he ended up in the hospital after what seemed like a 10 minute fight. During the fight he tried to take Officers weapons (Thank god for level 3 holsters.)and fought like you would not believe. He almost died because we were running out of options.

You have to way the good against the bad. Implying Tasers are against International Law is not accurate. Their intent is not to torture. At times we must use pain complaince, period.

Are there Officers that abuse Tasers? Certainly. They will be dealt with just like Officers that use any kind of excessive force.

Are there Officers that abuse Tasers? Certainly. They will be dealt with just like Officers that use any kind of excessive force.


Yeah with a blue wall of silence and a tap on the wrist for getting caught. Until
officers" who power trip are separated from officers who care, and the"brotherhood" mentality of the old boy network is dead,this shit police do will never be made honest.

I can find two mentions of fired officers in TODAY'S news.

http://www.billingsgazette.com/index.php?id=1&display=rednews/2005/04/05/build/local/40-officer-fired.inc

http://www.dailynewstranscript.com/localRegional/view.bg?articleid=54159

There is TV and then there is the real world. The "Blue Wall of Silence" is mostly TV. People seem to believe that all of these Police shows that have been on are realistic. Heck, I can not watch CSI without almost vomiting because it is so far off.

Like any job we have our share of morons. Difference is that there are just alot of people that hate Police. They generally continue to speak of these false stereo-types. I get bashed on here all the time by them. Like most Police I have learned to ignore them because there is no point it trying to reason with them anymore then you could reason with Klan member. Each has his views supported by his own "Evidence."

Call us all dishonest and then you wonder why we ignore you... Why? Because most are not and why would we want to listen to an ignorant insult?

Hmmm, this post seems rather hostile but that is not my intent. Its not specificly aimed at you but the small group of Cop haters around here. Guess I need to warm up the ol' ignore button.

Peace

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
George Orwell

Around here, you claim that you were in fear of getting run over by a suspect in a car, that's your "unload your magazine at the guy" free ticket.

I didn't always distrust the Police (what you call "Hate"). Shit, Southern, I even WANTED to be a cop in my younger days. But I've seen too many mariginally psychotic assholes with badges, guns and a moderate authority to use both w/o too many questions to be all-accepting anymore.

Officer Friendly has retired. Robo-Cop has replaced him.

Guess that earns me a place on your "ignore list" then.

"Guess that earns me a place on your "ignore list" then."

Nope. Nothing wrong with not liking Police. Its the people that attack Police at every chance for anything. The ones that post about negative things that do not apply to the thread.

I have meet these marginally psychotic Officers of whom you speak. Problem is we can not get rid of them until they do something seriously wrong. Its not just Police Unions that are a problem its mainly the civil litigation (sp?) that is involved every time you fire someone from a government job. It takes alot of documentation to fire someone. Unfortunately while we build the file the public often suffers at the hands on the moron.

Are some of the best goddam people I've ever met. We have a few
bad apples here too though. There is an unofficial policy - it
is believed - that problem coppers are moved to other districts
rather than being slung off the force as they deserve. It hasn't
been proven though so that may actually be horseshit.

Part of it is attribution of extreme ill will: while no technological advancement has ever occurred without some bad or inhuman application, many people assume that the only reasons for some technological advancements are the worst possible ones they can impute.

It's specious moral reasoning: AI is good and saintly and in God's good graces, while all others are pagan infidel polytheist human-sacrifice offers.

Just as international law now prefers machine gunning down protesters to using tear gas, AI wants to extend the definitions of words with established meanings in treaties to cover innovations that they disapprove of. They want to have established treaties cover abuses they see as inevitable, because *some* people (those AI disapproves of) are guilty until proven innocent--but just in case, let's not give them the chance to show they're actually guilty. If we tried that any place else but in international law, AI would be pitching a fit.