'least the vatican didn't embalm John Paul II, Pius XII style-ewww!!!!!!!!

Pius was dogged with ill health later in life, largely due to a charlatan, Riccardo Galeazzi-Lisi, who posed as a medical doctor and won Pius's trust. His treatments for Pius gave the Holy Father chronic hiccups and rotting teeth. Though eventually dismissed from the Papal Household, this man gained admittance as the pope lay dying and took photographs of Pius which he tried, unsuccessfully, to sell to magazines.

When Pius died, then Galeazzi-Lisi turned embalmer. Rather than slow the process of decay, the doctor-mortician's self-made technique sped it up, leading the Holy Father's corpse to disintegrate rapidly, turning purple, with the corpse's nose falling off. The stench caused by the decay was such that guards had to be rotated every 15 minutes, otherwise they would collapse. The condition of the body became so bad that the remains were secretly removed at one point for further treatments before being returned in the morning.

The farce over the Pope's health and treatment in death caused considerable embarrassment to the Vatican, but in the 1950s was not reported, though widely rumoured among those in Rome who had witnessed the body's decay as it lay in state, as well as being captured in photographs. (See Catholic website below.) One of the first acts of Pius' successor, Pope John XXIII, was to ban the charlatan from Vatican City for life.
from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Pius_XII

his lips look wet

:puke:

See how his top lip is pulled down with the weight of his jaw? :puke:

yech!

Papal slippers. :D

so while we're on the subject of the man, i'd be curious to know what you folks here think-was pius a hitler enabler or was he a man who saved as many jews as he could under the circumstances.

i've heard convincing arguments both ways on a number of occasions

Just as he undoubtedly did not care for the atheist Mussolini and his Fascists. Given that the Vatican exists within Italy and during the war was under constant surveillance by the Axis, Pius probably found it advantageous not to risk it and keep quiet. I think his proximity to the authoritarian powers made it difficult for him to do anything of worth. I think the circumstances, while not excusing his silence, explains why he acted the way he did.

The Chief Rabbi of Rome praised him for his efforts on behalf of the Jews and for being a thorn in Hitler's side. What confuses many people is that many local Catholic officials supported the Nazis, but Pius XII did not.

a few swiss guard

My father, who was wounded in Italy and then recovered, was later captured by the Germans. He escaped. He had come up from North Africa into Italy. After all that shit, he was one of the first US Army officers to walk through the gates of Dachau near Munich. He has no forgiveness in his 86 year old heart for Pope Pius XII.

When one actually reads objective information, it is difficult to find any information that suggests Pius XII supported the Nazis. Sure, he could have done more, but he did more than anyone else in Europe did. To suggest he supported Hitler is ridiculous, however, many German bishops and cardinals did without the consent of the Vatican.

i'll admit, i'm not up to speed on all the info-but it looks like the guy did a lot of good, given the circumstances of being surrounded by mussolini's italy

like i said, though-i haven't done all the reading and was hoping for a more informed opinion of either side than mine

faced and more concerned about form than substance. You have no idea what a cold hearted, cold blooded man he was. Then John XXIII. What a joy, what a change. From a slab to the glow of the sun. I loathe Pius.

what do you think of the hitler allegations?

a lot to them. Given what I remember of him, the little cold blooded patrician, I believe them. The buildings were more important to him than the people, the art held first place in his heart.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0385511299/qid=1112754064/sr=1-5/ref=sr_1_5/103-6107394-7626255?v=glance&s=books

"Inside the Vatican of Pius XII : The Memoir of an American Diplomat During World War II"

though perhaps one-sided-i'll have to red "hitler's pope" in additon
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0670886939/qid=1112754064/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_2/103-6107394-7626255?v=glance&s=books

You determined it to be a "nasty slur." Maybe, maybe not. I stick with my daddy's view on Pius XII. Dad hates Pius XII's guts. WW-2 was a nasty time.

However, I think it may be misguided by a lack of information.

He lived it. He walked into Dachau for Christ's sake! I did not. Maybe you did too. Maybe you are 86 too. However, I doubt it.

No. You are wrong.

Mac

Italy. He saw the camps too but didn't blame the pope that I ever heard. He was also with Patton and was shot again. He hated Patton more than anyone in the world:TOTAL hatred (my dad was in the Battle of the Bulge where the American soldiers were all freezing to death)

Bush should now if he is going to be turned away at the colonnade.

Man those Vatican people are just whacky!

In 2001 Pope John XXIII (dead 38 years) was exhumed in order to prepare his body for reburial inside the Basilica. They displayed him in a procession through St. Peter's Square in front of thousands so they could have a look.

where are his legs?

But I can see the Papal slippers there. :shrug:

his legs are under the robe
his skin is covered in wax, according to the article i read