Bring it on, Frist. This is a win, win situation for the dems.

Here is why I believe that. If the Republicans actually are able to pull off the nuke option (which I don't believe they will), they will forever be known as the party that changed 200 year old rules to suit their immediate power needs. They might benefit in the short term, but not in the long term. As far as I'm concerned, the Dems simply putting up a solid fight is actually a win here as well. I believe that Daschale would have caved by now. I don't miss him at all.

Is horrifying.

I really believe that it is beginging to happen. When one party has so much power, there is usually revolt. The same thing happened to the dems in 94.

This entire effort is being done so as to not filibuster Supreme Court nominees

Kind of makes you real nervous as to whom this administartion is thinking of nominating if they are going to this much effort to stifle speech in the Senate

The odds that the nominee will be centrist, middle-of -the- road are slim to none and slim just left

where he'll force about 13 bills directly on the floor for discussion and a vote. This senate rule will allow bills to bypass committee and be put immediately on the floor for a vote. ANd what Reid wants to vote on are real things that our country needs: Hike in minimum wage, increased VA spending, healthcare, responsible sex education and a host of other stuff.

And by forcing the vote on the floor, repukes will have to vote on these issues and either they'll pass or they'll end up looking like shit for voting against something as increased VA spending

I have gained so much respect for Reid in the last 2 months. He has been bold and unwavering. Nice to see for a change.

I'm warming up to Harry Reid. Invoking Section XIV will look good for us, as moderates and liberals, however to think that it will cause a revolt in the unwashed masses is a little premature.

The Republicans have gotten to where they are by demonizing many core tenants of our ideology. They are against a minimum wage hike and they frame it that it will hurt the economy (we all know that is not true). They say that healthcare reform is socialist and it will hurt the economy (again, not true). Finally, sex education will be framed as "liberals trying to teach your child that sex is ok, but its the devil!".

At any rate, those are a few examples of how the Republicans really could care less if these bills are brought to the floor for a vote. As long as they get their judicial nominees pushed through, they could care less. Why? Because all of the principles outlined above can be overturned, set back or erased by their judicial nominees regardless of what we try to do in the future.

and I believe that you're correct that the REpukes would scoff at many of them as "hogwash liberal ideology". But there are spending bills for VA, disabled and senior citizens that would cause backlash if the Repukes try and fight this.

The point is to get this important bills on the floor where we can have a clear cut picture of who supports these ideas and who's against them. Then for those repukes running in 2006, we have killer attack ads as how these repukes opposed increasing minimum wage, Veterans, Seniors, etc.

I think the move is brilliant. I was never a Harry Reid fan because of his anti-choice nature (but one of those bills is an increase sending in family planning & education), but he is the total opposite of Tom Daschle and I'm so glad that Daschle got the boot!

Harry Reid is the antithesis of Tom Daschle. Bringing these bills to the floor is definately a good thing and will help define the positions of many on both sides (I try not to get my hopes up since the Bankruptcy bill).

I still say that even though we may have great attack ads, there is always a counter argument. We all know that they are masters at framing the political discourse and they may be the ones that benefit from a up or down vote on those other bills. Its a double-edged sword, but Im confident that Harry Reid will make the right moves.

If Reid invokes this article, is that a sign that we are going to concede the fillibuster? I believe we will. At that point, Im convinced its a win-win for the Republicans. They get their judges and they get to keep the fillibuster, just in case they are ever in the minority. If this happens, its going to be hard to overthrow their majority if they control the judiciary.

GOP will not think twice.

See you in the Work Camps.

then there are NO rules.

Repugs are doing

Remember, Supreme Court Judges are appointed for life...

So, even if they are remembered as "the party that changed 200 year old rules to suit their immediate power needs," with RW judges firmly in their pockets, they will STILL be the party that can do whatever the fuck they want, regardless of the consequences...

It's a sad fact, but this isn't going to stop any time soon...

They know that if they are ever thrust back into the minority role, they will have the judiciary (which should ideally be a fair representation of the populace) to overturn or stonewall against anything we are able to get passed.

That's why when I hear some people say "Republicans may be the minority party at some point, so they don't want to lose the fillibuster either", I get a little discouraged. They simply DO NOT CARE. It's all about right here, right now. Short term gain for long term pain.

It is just stunning to me that there are folks out there in DU-land that want to see this potential filibuster rule change as just another political tactic for the Democrats.

If the rule is changed, then well before the 2006 elections, Bush will easily nominate and get approved by at least 51-50 Senate votes, the most rightwing judges you can imagine. That includes probably two Supreme Court members.

After that a "backlash" will not matter. The Republicans will steal the 2006 election not only at the ballot box, but anywhere there is a dispute, a Bush-appointed federal judge will validate the stolen election.

In other words, the radical Republicans benefit in the short term ... and also the long term.

This is either a win or a loss for this nation. There will not be any political advantage for anyone but the Christo-fascists if Frist gets the rule change. Let's be very clear about what the stakes are here.

Beat down the concessionaires!

You have hit the nail square on the head here. This is not just Dems jiggering for position on a minor point. This is the MEAT of the Republic. It is on the restraint of the majority, and the safeguards of the minority that everything depends.

It does not get more basic, or more important.