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A brief review of ("majority") voting in the Senate.

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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-22-05 11:44 AM
Original message
A brief review of ("majority") voting in the Senate.
Edited on Sun May-22-05 11:48 AM by TahitiNut
The rhetoric being employed today betrays both a basic ignorance of what constitutes a 'majority' for voting purposes and an exploitation of that ignorance. Without going into the esoterica of the kinds of questions being voted on, let's try to be clear that the notion that 51 (50%+1) Senators is almost always the minimum required to approve anything is completely false.

Would it be a surprise to anyone if I said that 26 Senators (or less) could successfully and legitimately be enough to approve an action of the Senate? It's true, you should know.

Let's first enumerate the language used to specify what constitutes sufficient "Yea" votes to approve an action. The language used includes
  • "... three-fifths of the Senators duly chosen and sworn ..."
  • "... two-thirds of the Senators present and voting ..."
  • "... majority of the Senators present and voting ..."
  • "... unanimous consent ..."
  • "... two-thirds of the whole number of Senators ..."
  • "... majority of the whole number of Senators ..."
  • "... majority of the Senators duly chosen and sworn ..."

Now, let's look at Rule VI ...
RULE VI

QUORUM - ABSENT SENATORS MAY BE SENT FOR

1. A quorum shall consist of a majority of the Senators duly chosen and sworn. 2. No Senator shall absent himself from the service of the Senate without leave. 3. If, at any time during the daily sessions of the Senate, a question shall be raised by any Senator as to the presence of a quorum, the Presiding Officer shall forthwith direct the Secretary to call the roll and shall announce the result, and these proceedings shall be without debate. 4. Whenever upon such roll call it shall be ascertained that a quorum is not present, a majority of the Senators present may direct the Sergeant at Arms to request, and, when necessary, to compel the attendance of the absent Senators, which order shall be determined without debate; and pending its execution, and until a quorum shall be present, no debate nor motion, except to adjourn, or to recess pursuant to a previous order entered by unanimous consent, shall be in order.


So, assuming a Quorum is present, any action for which approval ("consent") is set at "a majority of the Senators present and voting" may pass with a "Yea" vote of 26 Senators, if all 51 Senators present actually vote. Even more, if some Senators declare themselves "Not Voting," the action can be sustained (approved) by even fewer Senators! When a Quorum is not present and not insisted upon, even fewer Senators may get away with 'consenting' to an action. Only comity and principle preclude abuses of such possibilities.

When folks speak of "Checks and Balances," let's try to give a bit more attention to the word "balances." When 26 Senators can 'consent' to an action, it's not at all 'imbalanced' to insist that forty Senators can effectively preclude such 'consent.' Indeed, the Rules of the Senate are rife with examples where merely a single Senator can legitimately preclude an action of the Senate, actions so numerous that they occur many, many times each day the Senate is in session.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-22-05 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. So, this means the DEMs can't do like they did in Texas?
You know, hide out in New Mexico preventing a quorum or wait until Bad Dr. Friskie Fritz goes away.
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-22-05 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Since the Reich can assemble a Senate Quorum by themselves ...
... the Senate Democrats can't prevent a Quorum. Some legislative bodies require a higher percentange of attendance for a quorum. It's all in the rules under which they operate, and those rules include the constitutions that establish them in the first place.
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-22-05 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
3. It's sorta disappointing to note that not a SINGLE DUer...
... has observed that the Rules of the Senate require unanimous consent to do anything contrary to the rules of the Senate. In other words, it only takes a single Senator to "obstruct" or "filibuster" any action of the Senate contrary to its own rules ... but the ReichsMonsters of the Senate are planning to violate those exact same rules even if fifty Senators oppose them!
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joanski0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-22-05 04:05 PM
Response to Original message
4. Can you help me with this one, Tahiti?
I posted this in another thread, but that thread is also sinking fast.


What I have been wondering about is


when Cornyn adjourned the Senate on Friday, he said the following would be the schedule for Monday. The Senate would come into session at 11:30 a.m. on Monday, 5/23. Then after more debate on the Owens nomination, at 4:00 p.m., Frist would have the floor for 45 minutes. Then Harry Reid would have the floor from 4:45 to 5:30 p.m. Cornyn then said that a vote would be taken at 5:30 to get the Sargeant at Arms to round up all of the Senators and bring them to the floor. I've been wondering what this is all about. Any ideas, anybody? This is Monday, tomorrow.

Cornyn announced the Cloture Motion for Tuesday, and said that on Monday, Frist would announce the time for the Tuesday vote. What in the dickens is the Monday vote all about?


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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-22-05 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Well, Congress has the authority to compel attendance, if they choose.
That's been one of the functions of the Sergeant at Arms.

June 25, 1798
Compulsory Attendance

Photo of Senator Robert Packwood
Robert Packwood (R-OR)

In February 1988, Capitol Police carried Senator Bob Packwood feet first into the Senate chamber. This occurred after the Senate ordered the arrest of absent senators to maintain a quorum during a filibuster on campaign finance legislation.

The framers of the Constitution feared that members of Congress could strangle the government by simply failing to attend legislative sessions. Without a quorum, the Senate or House would be powerless to act. Accordingly, the Constitution’s writers provided that each body could "compel the Attendance of absent Members, in such Manner, and under such Penalties as each House may provide."

On June 25, 1798, the Senate adopted a rule specifying its manner and penalties for enforcing senators’ attendance. As spring gave way to summer, more than one-third of the Senate’s membership failed to show up for individual votes. Some senators had left the capital to return to their states for the customary five-month break that lasted until the first week in December. Senate leaders, however, had other plans for members before an adjournment would be possible. At the top of their list of unfinished business was one of the notorious Alien and Sedition Acts.

http://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/minute/Compulsory_Attendance.htm


It's my understanding that Frist will make his first attempt to invoke cloture next week ... a so-called "test vote." (This wouldn't preclude another attempt to invoke cloture, that time invoking the "nuclear option.") Frist's purpose would be to determine if he really has 50 or 51 votes when the rubber hits the road. We really never know how Senators will vote ... things could get surprising. Or shocking, depending on one's expectations and sensibilities.
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joanski0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-22-05 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Thank you.
I will be tuned in to see what happens. I'm out most of the day tomorrow, but on Tuesday, I will be glued to C-Span2.
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