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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:17 PM
Original message
Are some folks wary of speaking their minds on DU because...
they are fearful that the "opposition" will somehow take their positions or their words and twist them and distort them to their advantage? Isn't this basically a problem with the Democratic Party also? They are so cautious that they end up saying nothing and standing for nothing, Dr. Dean and a few others notwithstanding?
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yes.
And we have to get over it. And we need to stop letting our own party shut up the outspoken ones.
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dave502d Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:22 PM
Response to Original message
2. I think you could be right.n/t
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medeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:22 PM
Response to Original message
3. yes..... was lectured by long time poster
when I initially came on re posts that really weren't controversial.

There was a paranoia on DU by some that lurkers were constantly watching.

I don't give a rat's ass. :-)
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. "I don't give a rat's ass"
copy that! :)
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tofubo Donating Member (229 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. g.o.p. FUCK YOU
Edited on Sun Jul-31-05 03:28 PM by tofubo
the only respectable repub is ron paul from texas, he is the only one to openly question this administration

EVERY OTHER REPUBLICAN claims selective amnesia when confronted with FACTS about this admin (i didn't know about that, etc)
one woman on cnn, a us news and world report reporter, said SHE NEVER EVEN HEARD OF THE PROJECT FOR A NEW AMERICAN CENTURY, even tho she has covered every single member practically at one point in time or another

how they can be sheer LIARS and turn a blind eye to the HYPOCRISY every single day means they are BOUGHT AND SOLD FUCKS that need to be removed and have NON-CORPORATE RUBBERSTAMPERS (rep's AND dem's) elected in 2006

independant/3rd party/dems in 2006 is our ONLY way out of this shit
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leeroysphitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
22. agreed n/t
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #8
32. HEHEHE!
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CatholicEdHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #8
39. Paul is not a Republican
he is a Libertarian. He just ran as a Republican instead of a Libertarian in Texas to get elected. That (L) or (R) makes a huge difference.
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. Ahhh... the spirit of Carlos lives on.
Edited on Sun Jul-31-05 03:31 PM by TahitiNut
The self-annointed Office of Speech Approval has many volunteers. :eyes:
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. You just hate Joe Lieberman
because he's an observant Jew :)
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tofubo Donating Member (229 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. no, it's because of the company he keeps
http://www.seekgod.ca/apostles.htm

Senator Joe Lieberman, Al Gores former running mate, is honorary chairman of the Center for Jewish and Christian Values, which is a part of the IFCJ. From the website, " The Center for Jewish and Christian Values, a special project of the Fellowship, works to improve the moral climate in our country by bringing together Jews and Christians in support of a common set of principles and programs on which to build a more moral society in America." 3

THE ADVISORY BOARD includes some of the names listed above and Gary Bauer , Bill Bennett, Chuck Colson, The Baroness Cox, Kay Cole James, Jeane Kirkpatrick, Lloyd Ogilvie, Ralph Reed , Jack Kemp, William Kristol and so on.
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. T'was a joke
You had to know Carlos... be glad you didn't.

:hi:
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. Yep. That's a classic Carlos line. Played the bigot card constantly.
The slimey ad hominem attacks and ignoring or demeaning anything the other person would say ... that's our boy. :eyes:
He shared the Smirk 'talent' for looking into the hearts of others ... in cyberspace, no less.
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. He's reprised his roadshow at DailyKos
Still drawing from that 5-item cut-and-paste database. And still drawing fire from 95% of the other posters at the site. God bless 'im.

BTW, he's finally owned up to his nascent Republicanism:
"For the forseeable future, though, I will not vote Republican. I am too afraid of the religious right and don't like their tax policies."

...

Q: do you want us to persuade youto be Republican?

Q: jiacinto, are you looking for an excuse to become a Republican? Why aren't you?

A: I don't like the religious right

http://jiacinto.dailykos.com/story/2004/12/6/231354/639

:hi:
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greatauntoftriplets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #17
48. He DID????
It was SO obvious....

Same old Carlos...checked the link.

:eyes:
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. 'Nut, I had forgotten about that guy..
:)
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. Well, that's something to be grateful about.
:silly:
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AX10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
4. Yes
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:26 PM
Response to Original message
5. there are issues on this board, no matter logical
there is such an extreme it is a waste of time ot even try to discuss it. sometimes i take the plunge, inevitably it is a waste of time
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:27 PM
Original message
It's a dilemna
if we are silent - our future is sealed
if we speak out - we might be able to lead our leaders - hopefully

Our competition is the money they get from corporations - we don't give enough, it seems.

Dark view - this has been a disastrous year for the way many Dem leaders have voted against us. And they don't do a damn thing about the stolen votes - except for a tiny minority. The biggest mouths in the Dem leadership (those who get invited on MTP) don't peep about stolen votes. Clinton, Biden, Shirmer.

I value those who fight for us more each day.

Thanks to the good ones.
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Sgent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
7. self delete
Edited on Sun Jul-31-05 03:28 PM by Sgent
misread question
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blue sky at night Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
11. not...................
not.........
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #11
20. I censor myself a llot.
I read what I type before submitting the post. I believe that the Net is monitored by Govt. sources. I don't post anything that I feel may garner me a visit from the agency that could take me to an undisclosed place and keep me there without any charges for as long as they feel like keeping me there.

The Govt. has the power to detain citizens without charges for an indefinite time period. This is not being paranoid. It is a fact.
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tofubo Donating Member (229 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. charge or release, it's that simple
Edited on Sun Jul-31-05 03:58 PM by tofubo
http://www.lewrockwell.com/hornberger/hornberger51.html

The Padilla doctrine
Moreover, those who are tempted to think, “Oh, well, it’s only happening to foreigners,” should think again, because it’s also happening to Americans. For almost three years, the Pentagon has held an American, Jose Padilla, in a military brig in South Carolina. They’re accusing Padilla of conspiracy to commit terrorism but they have never formally charged him with a crime. They arrested him in Chicago but there has never been a grand jury indictment. During most of the time that Padilla has been held in military custody, he has been denied the right to speak with his family or with an attorney.

Now you might be tempted to think, “Hey, Padilla is just some poor Hispanic guy who got himself into trouble. So what? Why should I care?”

You should care because the Padilla doctrine constitutes a watershed event in American constitutional history and arguably the gravest threat to our way of life in the history of our nation. It effectively washes away centuries of constitutional protections with respect to the administration of criminal justice, including the presumption of innocence, habeas corpus, right to bail, right to counsel, and right to trial by jury.

What everyone also needs to recognize is that the Pentagon’s position is that it has the legitimate power to do this not only to Jose Padilla but also to every single American.

If the Padilla doctrine is upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court, military officials will then possess the power to arrest any American, including newspaper editors, dissidents, and any critics of the government, and jail them indefinitely or, even worse, transport them to Cuba or elsewhere for torture or killing.

Equally important, no one should operate under the misconception that the torture, sex abuse, rape, and murder of prisoners which have been committed by both the military and the CIA, have been committed by a few “bad apples.” As the evidence has surfaced, the “environment” and “culture” permitting and encouraging torture and sex abuse stretch all the way up to the highest reaches of executive power.


let me repeat from earlier post on this thread

G.O.P FUCK YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Nabia2004 Donating Member (566 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #20
35. The Men in Black
Call me paranoid but I am always on censor, even when on the telephone. Hell, it took me a couple of years just to make my first post here at DU.
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pretzel4gore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
18. fear to dishearten, or demoralize
1/2 my posts i don't post cuz of that...too negative ....god knows a positive outlook (and a sunny disposition) too often overlook the murderous venality of bush and his pigmedia; but i'm sitting here with guns/ammo and exit strategy etc, so maybe too pessimistic ...bottom line is life must/will go on, regardless of bushpig and them tapeworms eating away at life's gut, regardles....life will go on....
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niallmac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
19. Maybe in this same theme someone can clarify how 'admin delete' works.
I sent a letter to the admins and understand it is unlikely to be unanswered until next week but I can't resist mentioning to whover is reading this that I am not clear in my mind how administrator deletions of threads work.
Last Friday a thread entitled "I hate my (this?) country" was posted. Now maybe that was not the best title but the post listed in good order many things that I feel DUers agree on that drive one crazy about how the US of A operates at this time. When I got back from work that same day
I saw that the thread had been deleted. Then a little later that evening I saw another post by the original author asking why his post had been deleted. Then I found that THAT post had been deleted.
Now I am all open to the possiblity that something evil was going on that I was unaware of but I wish there was some sort of communication besides the big 'Deleted' window that cited the rule that had been violated. It could be that the thread devolved into something distasteful. How will I ever know? Certainly the original poster is in the dark. Maybe I was participating in something the admins do not feel is kosher. If that is so how will I ever know's so I can watch my P's and Q's in the future? It leaves me a little unsettled as I am not sure frankly what exactly happened. I think the feeling is called paranoia.
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BornLeft Donating Member (202 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #19
24. Is' an image problem
the powers to be fear Dems who have balls. Better to be viewed as good little citizens than have the good name of this site smeared by freeps. Oh they already do that.
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #19
28. the FAQ's are your friend, they may answer your questions and save you the
Edited on Sun Jul-31-05 04:53 PM by AZDemDist6
need to email the Admins.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/faq.html#why-deleted

Also if you have questions specific to a particular forum, the (volunteer) Moderators are listed next to the forum name in the "Lobby" view, just click a name to send a Private Message to one of them.

Hope that helps :hi:

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SalmonChantedEvening Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
23. Not really
I could say 'I wear shoes on my feet' and freepers would somehow contort it into god hatin' anti-bush terrist lovin' librul propaganda.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
25. Nope. The "opposition" can kiss my unpatriotic, anti-war, anarchist ass.
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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
26. i'd like to go on record and state
that any lurking freepers can line up and kiss my ass and/or go fuck themselves.

that is all.
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AirAmFan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
27. People who feel that way need to guard against breaking their arms while
patting themselves on the back for their self-presumed brilliance, originality, and insightfulness! The fundamental problem they must have is not paranoia but rather delusions of grandeur.
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FlemingsGhost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 05:04 PM
Response to Original message
29. Essentially, DU = DLC ...
There's your problem.
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Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Then why are most DU-ers agaisnt the DLC? (nt)
nt
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FlemingsGhost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #30
34. Most on DU are still talking elections and "proper" candidates.
They still believe in the myth, and the DLC absolutelyloves them for dropping to their knees ... yet again.
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
31. Lies/disinfo and attacks on dems/progressives are given free reign.
Edited on Sun Jul-31-05 05:17 PM by Just Me
Passionate reactions to that crap are quickly "deleted",...but, not the threads. Who the fuck is in charge, anyway? That's what I want to know!!! :grr:
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
33. "some folks wary of speaking their minds"
That is why I've always held back, when I probably really should have hauled off! I'm too old and pissed off to hold back any longer!

Bush is a total Dip Sh*T!!!! $$$$$$$$$ Damn, I feel better already!
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
36. I don't give a shit what the lurkers and disruptors think
Edited on Sun Jul-31-05 06:08 PM by LeftyMom
but I want no part of the circular firing squad. Sometimes all you have to do is be the dissident voice on one issue (it doesn't even have to be political) to get some self-appointed guardian of the status quo to make it thier moral duty to show you the error of your ways.

Some times I just don't feel like dealing with some 12 post off topic tangent and I keep my opinion to myself. I don't know if that's wrong, or just common sense. :shrug:
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Redstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:02 PM
Response to Original message
37. You're right. we, all of us, need to stop being afraid.
What are the assholes going to really be able to do to us, after all?

Fuck 'em.

Redstone
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. We are supposed to be in a safe haven from assholes.
Why protect their right to invade and divide and destroy? Why not protect against their predatory practices against our people?

Why not be a warrior against assholes rather than allow them to hurt those who are clearly NOT a member of their destructive crew?

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Redstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:35 PM
Response to Reply #38
44. I'm not protecting anybody's "right to invade..etc."
I said "fuck 'em," and that's exactly what I meant. I said not to be afraid of the pissants, because what are they going to do, march up to your house with their Wanker Army and bore you to death with their idiocy?

Redstone
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
40. there are cabals here at DU with whom one can't communicate
The Democratic Party is just so neutered and so infiltrated with wolves in sheep's clothing that they are damned near incapable of voicing any coherent opinion on any subject.
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:37 PM
Response to Reply #40
45. What do you mean?
??
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #45
46. I mean people of all stripes with a progressive viewpoint
are censored, self-censored, told to shut up, constrained to some orthodox group-think that is usually based on dogma rather than reality or reason.

it happens here

it happens in the editorial pages

it happens on Capitol Hill

it happens across the country
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:17 PM
Response to Original message
41. If they take my words and twist them into pretzels, let them choke on them
Respect is a two-way street. I'll listen to anybody who respects my right to be a progressive citizen of the U.S., but when they start beating me with the L-word bat, then I don't care what they think.

Conservatives aren't conservative anymore. They're simply repressive.
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Booster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:26 PM
Response to Original message
42. Yes, I was called a bigot and ignorant by 2 long time posters
simply because I said that gays should stop pushing for the word "married". My point was, if you take away the opposition's rant that only a man and woman can "marry" then they no ammo to block gays from getting EVERY RIGHT married people have. You would have thought I had driven a stake thru the long time poster's hearts. My statements were'nt directed at them nor were they personal, but calling me a bigot and ignorant certainly was directed at me and I took it very personal. If we don't allow thoughts and ideas to float around, then we are as closed minded as the freeps.
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wli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:29 PM
Response to Original message
43. my only fear is govt. agency monitoring
I might as well prefix all my posts with, "Dear FBI Agent."
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-05 06:43 PM
Response to Original message
47. No.
I've had the chance to be involved in a few conflicts that were public in nature. The media has a way of giving one side a chance today, the other side tomorrow. It used to be a blast. I was never concerned about dealing with any person's intellect when they were attempting to justify injustice.
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