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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:03 AM
Original message
Kerry On "Swift Boating" of Jack Murtha
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 11:06 AM by sandnsea
“I won’t stand for the ‘swift boating’ of Jack Murtha. It disgusts me that a bunch of guys who have never put on the uniform of their country venomously turn their guns on a Marine who came home from Vietnam with a Bronze Star and two Purple Hearts. No matter what J.D. Hayworth says, there is no sterner stuff than the backbone and courage that defines Jack Murtha’s character and conscience.

“You know why the Republicans are engaged in the lowest form of smear and fear politics? Because they’re afraid of actually debating a senior congressman who has advised presidents of both parties on military matters. They’re afraid to debate a decorated veteran who lives and breathes the concerns of our troops, not the empty slogans of an Administration that sent our brave troops to war without body armor. They’re terrified of actually leveling with the American people about the way they misled America into war, and admitting they have no clear plan to finish the job and get our troops home. Whether you agree with Jack Murtha’s policy or not is irrelevant. The truth is there is a better course for our troops and for America in Iraq, and I am going to keep fighting until we take that course for the good of our country.

“Instead of letting his cronies run their mouths, the President for once should stop his allies from doing to Jack Murtha what he set them loose to do to John McCain in South Carolina and Max Cleland in Georgia. The President should finally find the courage to debate the real issue instead of destroying anyone who speaks truth to power as they see it. It’s time for Americans to stand up, fight back, and make it clear it’s unacceptable to do this to any leader of any party anywhere in our country.”

He will be speaking to this on the floor of the Senate today.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:06 AM
Response to Original message
1. This confirms it for me - Murtha and Kerry ARE working the withdrawal plan
in tandem.

Murtha submits a 6mo plan on the day that Kerry is finally getting airtime for his 13-18 mo plan.

Murtha baiting Republicans to FORCE them into compromise towards the 13-18 mo senate plan?

Let's see what history can add:


http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0918-21.htm

Kerry Says President Plans Huge Call-Up
by Patrick Healy

ALBUQUERQUE -- Senator John F. Kerry accused the Bush administration yesterday of secretly planning to call up a substantial number of military reservists and National Guard units after Election Day to go to Iraq, opening a new front in the Democrat's ongoing attack that the president is concealing postwar instability in Iraq from American voters.

"He won't tell us what congressional leaders are now saying -- that this administration is planning yet another substantial call-up of reservists and Guard units immediately after the election," Kerry told 300 people at a community center here.

"Hide it from people through the election, then make the move -- that's not the way we do business in the United States of America, my friends. We deserve a president who tells the American people the truth, and when it comes to Iraq, George W. Bush simply won't own up to the truth. He hasn't all along. In fact, he'll do anything he can to cover up the truth."

The allegations came after the Kerry campaign this week asked Representative John Murtha of Pennsylvania, a congressional ally and Pentagon specialist, to provide evidence of the reservist plan in order for Kerry to escalate his questioning of Bush's handling of Iraq, aides to Murtha said yesterday. The aides said a relatively small number of new reservists would be involved, probably 2,000 to 2,500, but the idea that such a plan would be kept quiet until after the election spurred Kerry to focus on Bush's honesty as commander in chief.
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Punkingal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
2. I love Kerry...
What a wonderful human being he is. I felt it when I met him in Nevada, oh so briefly, during the election, and every time I read his words, I feel it again. We were so cheated when they stole the election from this man!
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Yes
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 11:16 AM by sandnsea
The world missed so much, it's like a massive crack in the cosmos that he and Teresa aren't in the White House.
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #5
19. I do love Teresa. The first time I heard her I had C-SPAN on and was
half asleep. As she spoke, I was compelled to find out who was speaking -- it was that good. Having missed a lot of it, I went to see when it was going to be rebroadcast so I could watch it.
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. Not only that
They deprived us of his wife and both Edwardses. THK would have been a kick-ass first lady.
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Punkingal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #10
18. Oh, I know....
It still hurts. I so wanted Teresa to be first lady. I turned the television off election night when they said Ohio was going for Bush, and I didn't watch the news again until this past August. I know Kerry and Edwards won, and I couldn't bear to see and hear the RW triumph. And I personally will work as hard as I can for him if he runs the next time.
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 02:54 PM
Response to Reply #10
60. Yes
Teresa is so classy.
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Jack_Dawson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #2
17. Too bad he found his backbone in 2005 n/t
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #17
23. He would have been a great president had he stood up like this. There
was no reason for him to loose to the worst president ever. I'm supporting Clark now.
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Jack_Dawson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #23
33. Welcome aboard - Clark's the man.
:toast:
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #23
44. He did NOT *loose* to Chimpy, ELECTION FRAUD gave Chimpy a second term.
:banghead:
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Tarc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #44
64. I'm sorry, but no
I voted for Kerry-Edwards of course, but the election was lost due to a poorly-run campaign. He should have forcefully slammed those swiftvet morons the second they opened their mouths, should have never, ever uttered the "I voted for it before I voted against it" line, and so on. His campaign was constantly in defense mode from the vicious Rovian spin, and it never got out from under that.
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Twist_U_Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #64
83. another one that needs to do some research
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tiptoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #23
72. Wake Up to Election Fraud and the Sabotage of Democracy
Cut to the chase: This question will put an end to the exit poll debate..."
Do you believe the election was stolen?

If the answer is YES, then do you also agree that the 12:22am State exit polls and 12:232am National Exit Poll (13047 respondents which said Kerry won were close to the truth.

If the answer is NO, then you must also believe the Final Exit Poll (1:25pm, Nov.3), which was matched to the recorded vote, was close to the truth- and that the pre-election state and national polls and the post election state and preliminary National Exit polls (12:22am) were all wrong?
...
But it is really very simple and comes down to this:
If you believe Kerry won, then you must also believe the polls.
If you believe Bush won, then you must also disbelieve the polls.

That's it.

Computer Programmer Clint Curtis Testifies - Hired in 2000 to design a prototype computer program to control elections via Vote Machines in S. Florida (allegedly by former running mate of Jeb Bush, now-Congressman Tom Feeney)
How to Hack the Vote in Under 2 minutes: Video Demonstration Hacking Diebold's GEMS Central Tabulator for Gov. Howard Dean by Bev Harris of Blackboxvoting.org
Election Fraud 2004 - Slide Presentation
REALITY Graph 80+ Independent Pre-Election Polls, Post-Election Exit Polls point to Kerry Victory in 2004
The naysayers continue their relentless agenda to mask the overwhelming evidence provided by the confirmation of
1) pre-election state polls. Total sample = 50 polls* 600 = 30,000,
2) pre-election national polls. Total sample = 18 polls *1500 = 27,000,
3) pre-election Bush approval 48.5%. Total = 11 polls*1000 = 11,000
4) post election state exit polls. At 12:22am, Nov.3 (73,600 respondents).
5) post-election national exit polls. At 12:22am Nov.3 (13,047 respondents)
6) massive documented evidence of fraud in OH, FL, NV, NM, NC, MN, NY, etc..

Were ALL these pre and post-election polls BIASED?
They ALL confirm that Bush lost.
What is it about these polls that is so difficult to understand?

Febble confirms the corruption in points 1,2,3.
And yet she keeps pushing points 4 and 5.

No, Bush did NOT win the popular vote.
The evidence clearly shows that Kerry did - in a near landslide.


Febble, where is the evidence that the exit polls were biased?
Was it shy Bush voters (rBr)?
Debunked in NEP by Mitofksky 43%Bush/37% Gore?

Was it early Kerry voters?
Debunked. View the time line Kerry led at 4pm, 7:33pm, 12:22am

Was it early women voters?
Debunked. 4pm:58%, 7:33pm:54%, 12:22am:54%, 1:25pm:54%

Was it False Gore voter recall?
Ridiculous on its face.
Bush voters recall who they voted for but Gore voters suffer from Alzheimer's?

Was it Bad weather early in the day keeping Bush voters home?
Right.

Was it inexperienced pollsters?
Mitofsky trained them...
...
That the patterm of state Exit Polls provide solid evidence?
Notice the similarity to the Ohio precinct deviation trend.
Forty-two of 50 states deviated to Bush.
That's 1 in 2 million odds. < 1 / 2,000,000 >
...
That sixteen of 50 states deviating beyond the MoE for Bush, none for Kerry?
1 in 19 trillion odds. < 1 / 19,000,000,000,000 >
...
That all 22 Easterm Time Zone states deviating from Kerry to Bush?
1 in 4 million odds. < 1 / 4,000,000 >
...
That eighty-six of 88 touchscreen incidents of Kerry votes switched to Bush?
Try it. Flip a coin 88 times to get 86 heads.
Do the math.
...
--more, incl graph at bottom--

The Theft of the 2004 Presidential Election
History of the Debate Surrounding the 2004 Presidential Election Updated 11/5/2005
Non-Partisan GAO Report Confirms Concerns About Security of Electronic Voting Machines Sept 2005
Who is TruthIsAll? - Background & Links to Exit Poll Research
Freeman v Mitofsky - "Polling Bias or Corrupted Count? Accepted Improbabilities and Neglected Correlations in 2004 US Presidential Exit Poll Data" (October 14, 2005) Text Slides Handout
MADNESS
OHIO - Conyers Report presented Jan 6, 2005
2004 U.S. presidential election controversy, voting machines - 3 firms control 80% of US Vote: Diebold, ES&S & Sequoia

Will California send Diebold packing before Turkey Day?
by Miriam Raftery
Recertification hearing draws protest from activists over last-minute changes in procedures

On Monday, November 21st, California’s Voting System Panel (VSP) was slated to hold public hearings on whether to recertify Diebold TSX touchscreen machines. The California Election Protection Network (CEPN) issued a press release inviting concerned citizens to speak at the 10 a.m. hearing and attend a rally at Secretary of State Bruce McPherson’s office to encourage state officials to “send Diebold packing before Turkey Day.”

But when CEPN spokesperson Sherry Healy called to verify the hearing date and time, she received startling news.

“I asked Bruce McDannold in the Secretary of State’s office if the hearing is still on for Monday,” she told Raw Story. “He said, 'You’re half right. The VSP has been disbanded.' I asked why. He said, 'I can’t speak for the Secretary of State.’”

According to Healy, McDannold stated that a stenographer and recording device would be on hand to record any public comments.

CEPN issued a blistering press release criticizing the Republican Secretary of State, for the last-minute change in procedures. The release questioned the sincerity of those in government to publicly discuss issues with their constituents. “Is this the new government trend for public hearings – just give the people a room and a tape recorder?” the release asked.
...
Dan Ashby of the Voting Rights Force in Alameda County cites serious security breeches with Diebold GEMS tabulator software used to count votes, including the, “GEMS defect which allows VBA (visual basic script) to rewrite the access database containing the vote count without a trace… Dr. Hugh Thompson of Black Box Voting brought it to the attention of the VSPP in July 2003. Nothing has been done… The Secretary of State’s office has been made fully aware of the unsecured GEMS vote database and has refused to acknowledge they know.”
...


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Twist_U_Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #23
82. ummm Kerry won
diebold :shrug:
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Punkingal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #17
25. It is so easy to criticize, isn't it?
He won, and we were cheated, because we don't have a free press in this country anymore. What exactly was he supposed to do?
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Jack_Dawson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #25
32. Hit back on swifties, not conceded in 5 seconds...
There were wayyyyyyyyy too many irregularities going on. But of course he was worried about being "presidential" for the next election. Whatever...I like the guy and think Debate #1 was the greatest thing I've ever seen. I just wish he had hit back a little more. But better late than never I guess.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #32
38. right, he did not address a single of the zillions of things bush
repugs and media threw at him. not one. rolling eyes
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Punkingal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #32
39. Okay, I'm sorry I snapped at you...
I turned off the tv about 2am pst that night, and didn't turn it to the news on again for months, nor did I come here for a long time, so I missed all the aftermath. I just couldn't bear to watch it. Perhaps if I had, I would understand the anger a lot of people feel a little better.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #32
41. August 2004
Too bad people believe what the media tells them to instead of paying attention to what actually happened. What the campaign did then was exactly what he's doing now. Expose them for their smear tactics. Too many people wanted to debate the details of the smear instead. If Democrats and the blogosphere had responded with righteous indignation, like they're doing today and did with Hackett, we'd be singing a different tune.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5392807&mesg_id=5392807
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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #32
61. It was the second slowest concession in my lifetime
Only Gore was slower.

Normally folks concede the night before, not the next day.

Five seconds, my ass.
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Jack_Dawson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #61
62. This wasn't Mondale
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 03:56 PM by Jack_Dawson
Yes, Walter Mondale and Mike Dukakis and countless others got their asses whupped and had no choice but to concede the night before. This race was 50-50 and Kerry conceded when there was a whole lot of weird shit not adding up. Edwards wanted to continue the fight, Kerry did not.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #62
85. There is NO quote after the fact that I know of that Edwards didn't
want to concede. He came out to say there was no concession the night of the election. Obviously, at that point Kerry wasn't conceding either - but waiting for Ohio. The next day, I know of NO Edwards statement saying he would not have conceded, nor has there been one since.

This comment has been repeated though at least 9999999 times on DU. It would be good if it could be linked to a definitive statement. Maybe someone saying this should ask Edwards.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #25
36. they dont have an answer, and they dont care
and they will continue to ignore reality to diss kerry. the same is in talking to a repug, they cant win on argument, so they put hands on ears and say la la la la la. refuse to listen to why bush is a liar, corrupt and incompetent, regardless of fact
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bunny planet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #17
48. yawn.
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_dynamicdems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #2
29. Me too!
He is remarkable, isn't he? He's so kind and calm, but he's always right there defense of others. He reminds me of the father archtype from family shows of the fifties: calm and rational, but stands firmly on principle.
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bunny planet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #2
30. Me too.
Sigh, my President.
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #2
59. I agree
Whenever I see or hear Kerry speaking or just there he has this amazing presence about him. He should be my president now. *sigh* Instead of the bafoon.
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
74. How True.
Sadly... how true. Just imagine where we'd be had they not stolen the last election, and in 2000/Gore.

I firmly believe 9/11 would never have happened.
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
3. Bravo! The goal of the Bushies is to divide and conquer
Democrats by getting Dems to fight their own. The disgusting remarks by Scott McClellan yesterday against Cong. Murtha were unnacceptable and low, even for this Admin.

Kerry and Murtha have some policy differences on what is the best way to get the troops out of Iraq. Policy differences can be worked out, aprticualrly if the goal to be achieved is the same. McClellan called Cong. Murtha's courageous stand yesterday a, "surrender to the terrorists."

Murtha had the best response:

Underscoring the rising emotions of the war debate, Murtha uncharacteristically responded to Vice President Dick Cheney’s comments this week that Democrats were spouting “one of the most dishonest and reprehensible charges” about the Bush administration’s use of intelligence before the war.

“I like guys who’ve never been there that criticize us who’ve been there,” said Murtha, a former Marine. “I like that. I like guys who got five deferments and never been there and send people to war, and then don’t like to hear suggestions about what needs to be done.”

Referring to Bush, Murtha added, “I resent the fact, on Veterans Day, he criticized Democrats for criticizing them.”


Now, who was the 'us' that Murtha was talking about? How many combat vets are there in the Congress and how many are speaking out about the problems with the Iraq War?
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #3
11. I heard a Bushbot pundit on the teevee last night
Some guy from the Hoover Institution. He claimed that idiot son and the evil one were "energizing the base." That could be, but I think they'll discover that "the base" is a very small percent of the population. Their tactics are just pissing everyone else off.
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. This is so true.
None of the old tricks are working. The Bushies are trying to 'divide and conquer' and play the false patriotism card against their opposition on the war and it's backfiring. They may keep their base, but find out that they have alienated everyone else, including the people in the middle who gave them the benefit of the doubt 12 months ago.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #11
57. Yeah...a SHRINKING population. The disapprovals are HARDENING as they
grow in number.
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Binka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #11
86. They Are Energizing The Base Of Pissed Off Iraqis
The other base they are talking about doesn't exist. The 5 million folks Bush claims is his base (mandate) is a fabrication. There was a post on DU a few days back where the get out to vote campaign for 18-30 year olds was a huge success. Well guess who those folks were gonna vote for.... John Kerry!...so where did those votes go? Yep Bush's mythical and BULLSHIT Christian vote did not exist. They stole from our KIDS!

Fuckers!
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
4. hence kerry's ability to now say it the way it is, addressing his own
smearing. he could have easily injected "I" in the spots he used Murtha. kerry would not be able to defend hisself in this manner, would be attack for arrogance and dismissed, but what he says for Murtha is also speaking out for himself. i hope everyone can clearly see this, to at least honor that he has finally been able to say this, thru Murtha. is kinda a nifty healing thing, lol. i love universe
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bunny planet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #4
49. I can clearly see it seabeyond. He is too classy a man to mention his own
swiftboating right now. His point comes across loud and clear nonetheless.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
56. It was the duty of other Dem vets to stand like this with JK in 2004.
of course, those who did received little press attention.
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athena Donating Member (771 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #56
73. Exactly.
Kerry has too much integrity and humility to brag about his own military record. Everybody here criticizing him for not disputing the election results should actually be criticizing all the other democratic politicians for not standing up for Kerry as they should have.

I, too, feel, as someone mentioned earlier in the thread, that Kerry's not being in the White House is a giant cosmic error. (I also felt that the attack on Iraq was an irreperable cosmic error.) Kerry was meant to be president. He's the most presidential man in the country. I don't understand why so few people can see this. I really hope he'll run in 2008.
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Vektor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 03:45 AM
Response to Reply #73
78. Amen Athena, and beautifully put.
I agree wholeheartedly.
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Dhalgren Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:16 AM
Response to Original message
6. Good for Kerry! Now, let's see every Democrat that wants to stay
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 11:18 AM by Dhalgren
in the party stand up an defend Murtha! " Whether you agree with Jack Murtha’s policy or not is irrelevant." I am glad that someone is paying attention and won't let the sorry display of yesterday stand. Thanks, John!
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SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:19 AM
Response to Original message
7. Karma catching up to BushCo
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 11:22 AM by SpiralHawk
The AWOL Deserter-in-Chief and his Propaganda Machine have smeared the honorable military records of McCain, Cleland, and Kerry for years.

But now their Propaganda is turning around to bite them and all their lame ass AWOL excuses - Anal Cysts, Other Priorities, Daddy Pulls Strings, and all the rest.

Terminate the shameless Republican culture of corruption now.
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ClayZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #7
22. The Times they are........
Come senators, congressmen
Please heed the call
Don't stand in the doorway
Don't block up the hall
For he that gets hurt
Will be he who has stalled
The battle outside ragin'
Will soon shake your windows
And rattle your walls
For the times they are a-changin'.
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texpatriot2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
8. Bravo Sen. Kerry. nm
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
9. Damn straight
Maybe he'll fight harder on someone else's behalf than he did for himself.

Murtha sure stood up to Darth Cheney yesterday, I have a feeling they'll regret it if the continue to go after him. If they want a fight, let them bring it on.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #9
31. those are exactly the words he would have liked to use for himself
dont you think. and if he did talk for himself in this manner he would have been ripped apart and it is just not what one does for himself. others have to. there were a few that were able too, but sadly, too many fellow vets did not, and shame on them.

kerry can give it to another, cool for him
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #31
54. I totally agree
He's in a much better position to support Murtha than he would have been to support himself.
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txaslftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
12. Beautiful.
Where was THIS Kerry during the campaign? Gentleman John was too easy going. I like gloves off John.
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #12
26. I like the young John Kerry testifying before Congress.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #12
34. big difference in a year
big difference what you could say hten and now. more incompetence, more people ready to listen now than then. more stuff has come out

back then, kerry spoke out. much wasnt listened to, even by fellow dems it appears

even now, cant be good enough, still have to want more, for a past, that cannot be changed
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ClayZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
14. WHOO HOOOOO SAY IT LOUDLY!
Expose "THE LYING SMEARERS" there are only 30% who still can't see!
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SomewhereOutThere424 Donating Member (497 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
15. I'm glad
I do respect Kerry, and think that he's doing/done a lot of good. It's good to see him do it...but I still don't truly forgive '04
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #15
35. but I still don't truly forgive '04........... that is so tired n/t
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:38 AM
Response to Original message
16. It's good to see him stand up. He is the president after all, just not
sworn in.
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Strawman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
20. That really nails it
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 11:45 AM by Strawman
I prefer Murtha's plan over Kerry's, but what he said there is spot on and I'm encouraged that he said that. He packed an awful lot of truth in those few paragraphs that speaks directly to what is fundamentally wrong with the * administration and their scummy brand of politics.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #20
27. Just heard JKs going to Senate Floor to speak on SWIFTBOATING of Murtha
.
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MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
21. Wonderful statement from JK!
I've been wondering how * & co. think they can get away with "fear and smear" when there are real issues being raised and the media isn't covering for them quite so much anymore. Do they think Americans are that stupid and depraved that they'll accept ad hominem attacks in place of real answers?

Okay, I know a bunch of Americans were stupid enough to vote for * in 2004. But then the media was completely playing bushco's game; and I think that's done. It'll be interesting to see if "fear and smear" in the current context just pushes *'s ratings down further.
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Metta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
24. I wonder if Kerry understands/ This may be *'s downfall ...
* will have his minions doing his dirty work for as long as he/they can in order to muddy the waters and distract from the fact that * has no plan. That's what they've done so far.
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DeepModem Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
28. Thank goodness! This is very powerful. We have to support Murtha...
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 12:02 PM by DeepModem Mom
and destroy the talking point that we don't.

On edit: I propose this for homepage. The indecency of Swiftboating these heroes must stop. We are at a McCarthy moment in this country.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
37. This is a great statement! If the media doesn't give this
full play they will be aiding an abetting a failed administration in its attempt to again distort the truth.

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One_of_8 Donating Member (289 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:09 PM
Response to Original message
40. I'm glad to hear these words
I hope many more Democrats will stand up and speak out for Congressman Murtha. I watched the video of him with Wolf Blitzer, and he spoke very powerfully, and movingly, about why we need to bring our troops home NOW. He had a strong response for every one of Wolfie's talking points, and I truly believe that most Americans feel as Murtha does.

I hope many more voices are raised in protest of this Administration. The more, the better.
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
42. will americablog post this? n/t
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 12:13 PM by LSK
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WildEyedLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #42
67. Doubtful. Aravosis has already made up his mind to hate Kerry
No matter what. Asking him to think deeper on the issue might be asking too much of him. :sarcasm:
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high density Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
43. Yep, the press back to its old shit again
It's like we're back in 2004. "Democrats said (insert 'liberal' truth here), White House blasted back with (insert lies and spin here)." No filtering the shit from the press, no nothing. Just political speak vs. political speak that ends up being a win for Bush since no reporter can actually report any sort of evidence to show whose commments are more accurate.
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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 03:56 PM
Response to Reply #43
63. I did hear this on the radio news today so that's something
They said something about strong words re: Iraq, and then there was this sound bite from Kerry, about Murtha not knowing how to surrender. Yea!
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:14 PM
Response to Original message
45. Most excellent. Recommended.
Peace.
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speedoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
46. Thankyou, Sen. Kerry for saying bush is a Coward:
"The President should finally find the courage to debate the real issue instead of destroying anyone who speaks truth to power as they see it."

We all know the Coward will never find the courage to do anything.

The Coward has no courage whatsoever, and it's time for more people to say so publicly.
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Strawman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
47. JD Hayworth. What an asshole.
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 12:23 PM by Strawman
But some on hand were quick to criticize the event. A broadcast reporter asked his cameraman if he had gotten a shot of Hayworth behind the gun of the Humvee, to which the cameraman replied, “Of this guy who never served a day in the service? Yeah, I got it.”

http://www.hillnews.com/under_dome/042904.aspx

:rofl:

A-S-S-H-O-L-E!
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monk24 Donating Member (38 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
50. Strong statement by Kerry
Edited on Fri Nov-18-05 12:48 PM by monk24
Outstanding statement by Kerry.

If he had spoken like that during the 2004 campaign, we'd be calling him "President" now instead of "Senator". Glad to see he's taking a stand, and not running for cover like too many Democrats are still prone to do.

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Tuesday_Morning Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #50
51. Yes - that's the stuff, John Kerry!
And welcome to DU, monk24
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monk24 Donating Member (38 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #51
52. Thanks
Glad to be here T_M. Thanks for the welcome.

:)
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MarianJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
53. Kerry Vs. Kyl!
Kyl is NO match!
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #53
55. Didn't Kyl sound like a weak fool trying to backpedal from GOP smear
tactics?

And weak on Iraq strategy, too.

Kerry and Murtha totally dominated the debate to make it one of WITHDRAWAL.
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MarianJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #55
77. Backpedaling Away...
...while sticking to the talking points.

He knows that this administration LIED 2000+ American sons and daughters to death, 1000's into disabilities, and tens of thousands of Iraquis to death and dismemberment. And yet this "Christian" defends them.

Ted Rall was and is right. The republicans have to choose between bush and America. It is "reprehensible" that they continue to choose bush.

Make them pay at the ballot box!
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 02:49 PM
Response to Original message
58. Go Kerry!
My president! :patriot:
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JohnnyCougar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
65. Good...it's about time Kerry says something like this.
Instead of constantly taking the ever-so-annoying middle ground.
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WildEyedLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #65
66. You sure haven't been listening to him ALL YEAR, then
He proposed this plan a month ago. But you knew that, being a diligent Democratic blogger, didn't you? So why play dumb?
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jenndar Donating Member (911 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #65
69. Kerry's one of the most liberal senators.
Check his voting record.
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JohnnyCougar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #69
71. I'm talking about his speaking record.
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yankeedem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
68. He should have said this a year ago
and other prominent Democrats should have also.

These pictures didn't help- being from Mike Dukakis home state, you'd think he'd have better sense than to let himself be photographed like this.
August 30, 2005, at the top of the SBLiars attacks


Whoever let him be photographed like this must have worked for Rove-
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #68
70. Except Kerry windsurfs alot for his own enjoyment.
It wasn't a photo op.

He's ridden motorcycles for over 40 years.

He's hunted for 50 years.

Had the press mentioned the FACTS instead of the Rove spin, the pics would have been fine.
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fedupinBushcountry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #68
76. Geez
playing your Rovian game, is tiresome and downright disgusting.

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Vektor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 04:36 AM
Response to Reply #68
81. Photographed like what?
Edited on Sat Nov-19-05 04:38 AM by Vektor
There's nothing wrong with participating in an outdoor sport. Just because some windbag Repukes SPUN IT like it was a sin doesn't mean it was.

And as for the NASA pic. OMG.

CUTEST. PICTURE. EVER.

There is also nothing wrong with being photographed participating in the sport of looking OH SO DOABLE.

Sorry, but the NASA suit is effin' sexy. He looks like a stormtrooper of sex.



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MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #68
84. It wasn't the pics at all, it was the spin.
And the Democratic Party team blew it badly on the spin.

Those pics are GREAT. In the top one, Kerry is shown relaxing - at an appropriate time - doing a highly athletic sport that is fairly common for where he lives. It's a great jumping-off point for talking about what an athlete he is, and more importantly, how he has regularly and frequently used his athleticism for a variety of charity causes, like riding 100 mile charity bike rides in freezing rain. Likewise the second pic is a good segue for talking about his history of support for technology and NASA, keeping America a technological leader (and oh btw improving our security by staying ahead in technology).

So, why were these pics perceived negatively? Because the repubs beat us at the spin. That's all. And successful spin needs a whole lot more than just the candidate to make it work.

Blame Kerry for it if you want, but that won't fix the real problem. Just as in responding to the swift liars, it was what the whole team did and didn't do that made the difference.

And I have no doubt that, by and large, the Democratic Party really was united in intent behind Kerry. They blew it by lack of skill, not failure of intent. I think we need to keep that in mind when thinking about 2008, and how we criticize the 2004 campaign.
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Vektor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-05 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
75. Kerry makes my lady parts engorge.
UNGHF.

SO. HOT.
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 03:58 AM
Response to Reply #75
79. !
:wow:

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Vektor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-05 04:17 AM
Response to Reply #79
80. Tee-hee...
Just being honest.... :evilgrin:
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