Wingers pretend to believe in "victory" in Iraq w/o having to define it

The appropriately named "Armchair Warrior" castigates Howard Dean, Nancy Pelosi and John Murtha for advocating "surrender," claiming that Democrats don't understand (as sensitive Republicans evidently do?) that the "enemy" is watching for every sign of "weakness" in the US.

You know something, you fucking armchair Sun Tzu, if you want to show resolve, get your own lard ass up and go show it in Iraq. And get your other cheese-doodle devouring resolutionaries on the right out of their hidey-holes to join the fight with you.

The reason most Democrats (and most Americans) are against the war is that it isn't the one sold to us. We were baited and switched. And Americans and Iraqis are dying because of the stupidity of Republican assholes in Washington and Wahhabist assholes in Riyadh and the Hindu Kush who are too chickenshit to fight their own battles.

http://thearmchairwarrior.blogspot.com/2005/12/dean-true-blue.html


You see, most Democrats are totally against the war effort, they don't support the troops or the mission, and they want America to fail in Iraq because that means Bush fails. They think failure in Iraq puts as check in the win column for them. Imagine for a minute how much better our mission in Iraq might be coming along in everyone (read: Democrats) in America was on our side and supported the effort. I wonder sometimes if Democrats understand that the enemy monitors our news, they know exactly what is going on in Washington and in the Halls of Congress. So, when Howard Dean goes on the air to say the America will no win in Iraq it only emboldens our enemy. And you have lawmakers like Nancy Pelosi and John Murtha calling for an immediate withdrawal of troops - don't they understand what kind of message that sends. It wasn't long go that in an intercepted email from Ayman al-Zawahiri (Osama's deputy) to Musab al-Zarqawi that the subject of Vietnam was mentioned and that if they were patient then America would cut out of Iraq just like they did in Vietnam. And of course it wasn't long after Congress cut off funding for South Vietnam that they were overrun.
I just read the other day that "A war can be won on the ground overseas and lost in Washington." So true.

:grr:

At right wing stupidity.

They always have plenty of excuses as to why they are stateside instead of fighting for Bush.

Armchair Soldier? If he's aware of the easiness of his position, you'd think he'd have the human decency to just shut up while others are being killed for his ideology.

No objectivity at all.

progress in Iraq. We've been there nearly three years and it's just getting worse. When do we see something other than our soldiers being blown up?

that progress has suddenly miraculously become sufficient to permit us to cut and run.

It will save some lives when we declare victory and bug out.

It's the nation building that we will lose. Let's frame this the right way: Mission Accomplished

We kicked Saddam's butt, and he's on trial. America was never meant to be an occupying nation builder, or did we miss that memo?

If we did miss it, show it to us again, and show me the exit strategy. An American police force for Iraq was never part of the deal.

False. Not real. Fake. Phony.

I immediately suspect information like that and take it with a grain of salt--and, probably unwisely, assume anyone who sees it discounts it based on the source as well.

Do you have a link to a story about that e-mail? I'll Google it myself, but I'd appreciate it if you can give me a shortcut to it.

Because it's very clear that the American public swallows this sort of bullshit by the shovelful.


Here's what Juan Cole had to say:

http://www.juancole.com/2005/10/zawahiri-letter-to-zarqawi-shiite.html

Here's another site that questions the email AND the Zarqawi mythology:

http://www.comw.org/pda/0410zarqawi.html

Here's a guy at sayanythingblog.com, quoting the NY Sun:

October 19, 2005
Doubts In Washington Now About The Zawahiri Letter
By Rob on October 19, 2005 at 8:52 am

Looks like some people in Washington are beginning to notice the problems with the Zawahiri letter I highlighted yesterday:

New York Sun - …over the weekend, Al Qaeda in Iraq issued a statement from Mr. Zarqawi claiming the letter was a fake. “Everything in the letter attributed to Ayman al-Zawahiri is false,” the statement said. Some analysts inside and outside the administration now are also taking this line.

“This does not read like an Islamist text,” a terrorism analyst at the conservative-leaning Hudson Institute, Chris Brown, said in an interview yesterday. “It only uses the word ‘infidel’ twice and makes five references to ‘crusaders.’ They are talking about the U.S. military in Iraq, which all Islamists, including Al Qaeda, always refer to as the crusader nations, but in this letter Zawahiri refers to America almost exclusively.” Mr. Brown added that the letter also uses references to both the Christian and Muslim calendar: “We know that Al Qaeda leaders will use the Islamic calendar in private correspondence and the Christian calendar for statements meant to be public, but never both in an internal communication.”

Mr. Brown also notes that the letter, which was dated two days after the London underground bombings, makes no mention of the attacks carried out by Al Qaeda’s minions in Britain. “It’s quite amazing that they went to great lengths to assure that Al Qaeda would get credit for the subway bombings and they would make no mention of it in this letter, especially considering that Zarqawi is also commander of all operations in Europe,” he said. . . .

Two sources inside the Bush administration told The New York Sun yesterday that some lower-level analysts share some of the concerns Mr. Brown raised, but that at the highest levels of the government there is no questioning the letter’s authenticity. “Some of us think there is a possibility that a foreign intelligence service may have faked it,” one administration source said. (end of quoted sources)

The clincher for me was seeing a copy of the translated email. At the end, Zawahiri cordially asks Zarqawi to give his greetings to various people, including... Zarqawi. IOW, he asked Zarqawi to give his greetings to himself.

And wouldn't you know, while yahoo-ing this for you, I saw numerous cites which showed The Weekly Standard and FrontPage magazine, two publications which are synonymous with neocon thought, touting this "email" as "the mother of all connections" or some such crap.

My opinion: we should NEVER believe in any tape, video, email, etc., which purports to give information about "Al Quaeda" or about "terrorists", if the tape, video, email, etc. is being presented to us by the Bush administration, or by anyone even remotely related to the Bush administration.

"We can't pull out of Iraq because our exit would leave chaos and the innocent Iraqi people would suffer!"

What Bushistas/Neocons mean: "We can't pull out of Iraq because we REFUSE to give up the oil and oil pipelines we're going to OWN, because then we wouldn't get richer than ever, which is our Number One Goal, always!"

Not that we just got beaten. Now those same men are in power again and they once again believe if only.. if only they can keep popular support going it will all work out okay.

and that's what they're doing again - America loses and has to pull out - well its the Democrats fault and those damn anit-war protestors who caused the loss. Certainly not the 56,000+ soldiers who died in a foreign country NOT protecting America, and certainly not because of the 2,100+ soldiers who have died on foreign soil to NOT protect America. I would like to see an explanation of what would we have won in Viet Nam had we stayed? Would the be a now peaceful nation - oops, they are. Would they have become America's trading partner? Oops, they are. What was accomplished besides death and destruction and a bunch of pigs in the pigsty becoming rich fat hogs?

And we should also recall that after the US pulled out of VN, the govt gave tacit support to Cambodia because of its fucked up the-enemy-of-my-enemy-is-my friend philosophy. And we all know what a good friend our enemy's enemy was.

begged them NOT to invade Iraq, and they still did it!

With Vietnam, it was still possible for some who hadn't been around at that war's beginning to fool themselves into thinking that it had at least started out as some "noble cause" or other.

With this shit, NO SUCH ILLUSION is sustainable.

Remember this little nice gem??

"Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is."
-Governor George W Bush (R-TX)