Bush Threatens U.N. Over Clinton Climate Speech http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1977334&mesg_id=1977334

US Delegation Walks Out Of Climate Talks http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=1976764

please excuse me, I am so fucking pissed off (not at you)
Why is this not a top story in the news? You can bet the rest of the world is talking about it! War on Christmas? This is a fucking war to save the damn planet!
These vampires are the enemy to all that live on this earth!
Why is there not an IMPEACH sign on every car, bicycle, house, boat, hat, coat, skateboard, rooftop, backpack, lawn, snowman, scooter, baloon..............Don't dare tell me IMPEACHMENT won't happen because the Republicans control everything! I don't fucking care!!!Repeat:
I don't fucking care!!! I want to see the word IMPEACH everywhere I look in this country, Everywhere!!!

scream, bang, smash, cough, sputter, @#$^&*^%%!!!!!!!
:mad: :banghead: :nuke: :argh: :nuke: :argh: :mad: :banghead:
there..

edited because i can barely speak or spell right now

I'm witcha.

on edit:

the bullying tactic of these people are beyond arrogant - it's simply childish

I don't know what's worse, that Junior's cabal pulled this shit or that it isn't being reported on the front page of CNN.com.
Truly despicable, arrogant, shameful, petty, neurotic, petulant behavior.

has been talking about the UN climate conference for weeks.

!!!!!!! Pissed here too!

Now it's on their Science page:

http://www.cnn.com/TECH/space/

as well as world news:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/americas/12/09/climate.clinton.ap/index.html

but are they showing it on TV????

When the guy from Arkansas got over the fence and onto the White House lawn before the FBI tackled him down, they had a voice over with Bill begging to be let back in so he could fix the mess they had made.

I too believe that we should IMPEACH all the way down to HASTERT... wouldn't that make Harry Reid interm President?

CNN.com reported that the "U.S. delegation was displeased with the last-minute scheduling of the Clinton speech", not that they threatened to scotch the treaty over it.

CNN often does this -- as a story develops, they update what they had already written, and change the headline to reflect developments.

First,they reported that * was displeased...I posted the headline of this article to another thread.

Second, they reported that * was threatening to reject the deal ALLEGEDLY because of Clinton's speech. I think someone else posted this article to start a new thread.

Third, they reported that an agreement had been reached anyway. Sadly, this third version (which is still up) dropped any mention of the hissyfit threat. It's like someone at CNN wrote an unpleasant truth, only to have it "cleaned up" on edit. Not that the article was flaterring:
"
Despite Clinton's message, many here seemed resigned to waiting for a political change in Washington.

"It's such a pity the United States is still very much unwilling to join the international community, to have a multilateral effort to deal with climate change," said the leader of the African group of nations here, Kenya's Emily Ojoo Massawa.

"The administration just doesn't seem to get it. They don't understand the world is suffering from climate change," said environmentalist group Climate Action Network.
"

Unfortunately, most Americans hadn't the slightest idea the conference was even happening, so there was no opportunity to lobby for change etc. The meeting began on November 28. The CNN links are from Dec 9, the last day.
Kudos to Clinton for drawing some attention to the conference.

Leading up to the meeting this was obviously not considered an important story in the US.
Then there is the story reported in the UK: "How America Plotted to Stop Kyoto Deal" (below)

--------

http://www.allheadlinenews.com/articles/7001184261

UN to Hold Largest Climate Conference Ever

November 25, 2005 12:30 p.m. EST

Ayinde O. Chase - All Headline News Staff Writer

Bonn, Germany (AHN) – The United Nations is hosting a Climate Change Conference beginning November 28 through December 9 in Montreal, Canada. The conference is expected to gather between 8,000 and 10,000 government delegates, business and civic leaders and environmental activists.

The assembly will be the largest meeting of its kind since the Kyoto Climate Conference in 1997.

"This meeting will not only be one of the largest climate change conferences ever, it will deliver a range of substantive results", says Richard Kinley, acting head of the United Nations Climate Change Secretariat in Bonn, Germany.

Parties are expected to agree on steps to strengthen the clean development mechanism, a tool designed under the Protocol to support sustainable development projects that reduce greenhouse gas emissions in developing countries. The United Nations Climate Change Secretariat will be showcasing such projects at the conference.

..more..
-----

---------------------------

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/1208-03.htm
Published on Thursday, December 8, 2005 by the Independent / UK

How America Plotted to Stop Kyoto Deal

by Andrew Buncombe

A detailed and disturbing strategy document has revealed an extraordinary American plan to destroy Europe's support for the Kyoto treaty on climate change.

The ambitious, behind-the-scenes plan was passed to The Independent this week, just as 189 countries are painfully trying to agree the second stage of Kyoto at the UN climate conference in Montreal. It was pitched to companies such as Ford Europe, Lufthansa and the German utility giant RWE.

Put together by a lobbyist who is a senior official at a group partly funded by ExxonMobil, the world's biggest oil company and a fierce opponent of anti-global warming measures, the plan seeks to draw together major international companies, academics, think-tanks, commentators, journalists and lobbyists from across Europe into a powerful grouping to destroy further EU support for the treaty.

It details just how the so-called "European Sound Climate Policy Coalition" would work. Based in Brussels, the plan would have anti-Kyoto position papers, expert spokesmen, detailed advice and networking instantly available to any politician or company who wanted to question the wisdom of proceeding with Kyoto and its demanding cuts in carbon dioxide emissions.

..more..

it's hard to keep track of them all.

The DP issue in particular is important to me also

I've been listening to a lot of BBC lately

Boy are "we" looking BAD lately!
I didn't think it get worse, but...

and these new Nazi/Commies will meet the same fate, oblivion.

When there were hostages during the Carter administration, you could not turn the TV on without seeing some report on it.

There are 4 hostages of a Christian ANTI-WAR group being held in IRAQ and the media is not giving it the attention it gives the Leonid Metor showers when they come to town.

Vote Reform legistlation passed in the 60's is being circumvented by Bush appointees. The people who had the facts about 2004 rigged elections aren't being listed to or have been silenced.

This ISN'T a slow news day, so why all the fluff and fillers? Because the MSM is back in the saddle with the administration again.

We gotta yell and scream - again.

I wonder if someone has a list of all the distractions Rove has created over the last 5 years?

thank you for bringing it to my attention.

I'm not surprised, but I am pissed. They're time is going to come. The shrub administration will get everything that's coming to them. Multiplied.

"IMPEACHimpeachIMPEACHimpeach" right after the "A".

:evilgrin:

:hi:

If junior's impeached his predecessor will pardon his crimes.

I want this fucker sitting next to Slobodan Miloševic. George like Slobodan sez they we're protecting their country from terrorism.

Share knitting and keep a tidy cell!

I want all the PNAC evil bastards stripped of their ill-gotten worldly possessions and their personal freedom to fuck up the planet more than they already have.

If the public knew of their complicity in staging the 911 events, they'd clamor for the death penalty. I'm not in favor of the DP but I'd make an exception when it comes to the PNAC/Buch cabal.

Great rant.

A detailed and disturbing strategy document has revealed an extraordinary American plan to destroy Europe's support for the Kyoto treaty on climate change. The ambitious, behind-the-scenes plan was passed to The Independent this week, just as 189 countries are painfully trying to agree the second stage of Kyoto at the UN climate conference in Montreal. It was pitched to companies such as Ford Europe, Lufthansa and the German utility giant RWE.

Put together by a lobbyist who is a senior official at a group partly funded by ExxonMobil, the world's biggest oil company and a fierce opponent of anti-global warming measures, the plan seeks to draw together major international companies, academics, think-tanks, commentators, journalists and lobbyists from across Europe into a powerful grouping to destroy further EU support for the treaty. It details just how the so-called "European Sound Climate Policy Coalition" would work. Based in Brussels, the plan would have anti-Kyoto position papers, expert spokesmen, detailed advice and networking instantly available to any politician or company who wanted to question the wisdom of proceeding with Kyoto and its demanding cuts in carbon dioxide emissions.

It has been drawn up by Chris Horner, a senior official with the Washington-based Competitive Enterprise Institute and a veteran campaigner against Kyoto and against the evidence of climate change. One of his colleagues ­ who describes himself as an adviser to President George Bush ­ was the subject of a censure motion by the Commons last year after he attacked the Government's chief scientist. Mr Horner, whose CEI group has received almost $1.5m (£865,000) from ExxonMobil, is convinced that Europe could be successfully influenced by such a policy coalition just as the US government has been.

EDIT

While there is nothing illegal about the lobbying, the documents reveal a rare insight into the well-funded efforts within the US to influence opinion at senior levels of European corporations. Campaigners say the campaign is similar to a notorious lobbying effort carried out during the 1990s to undermine support for Kyoto within the US. The revelation comes as international negotiators in Montreal are discussing the next step within Kyoto and the possibility of introducing new emissions targets. The Bush administration ­ which has rejected the treaty ­ has insisted it will not agree to any measures that legally bind it to reduce emissions. Mr Horner has been present this week in Montreal.

EDIT

http://news.independent.co.uk/environment/article331768.ece

We are at a crossroads as far as environmental efforts are concerned. The Bush administration is prepared to reverse all of the progress that has been made in the past 35 years .... and I am serious about "all of the progress."

People interested in working to combat the mindless corporate attack on the natural world have a number of good options. I would suggest working with The Wilderness Society as one option. For more information, see:

www.wilderness.org

It is true, there is a crossroads/turning point. I have always been drawn to the environment as a catalyst for my activist efforts. As i get older i recognize more the interconnectedness of things. I work now towards a variety of goals. Voting Integrity, National HealthCare, Civil Rights, Native American Sovereignty, etc... but with a four year old and three jobs needed just to get by, time is valuable. I have to pitch a tent sometimes to remember why OUTSIDE is so important. I am in the process of designing a "model/seed community"... based on the knowledge contained in books such as:

-Pattern Language/ Alexander, et al.
-Dwellers in the Land/ Sale, K
-Cradle to Cradle/ McDonough & Braungart
-Unsettling of America/ Berry
-Gaviotas/ Weisman
-Walden Two/ Skinner
-Money/ Greco
many more on my shelf...

Personally i have been optimistic about the change i can affect locally... and live every day with this in mind. But i have also been discouraged at how difficult it is to do more than sign petitions and give cash for a national endeavor. As far as i'm concerned, it is you bloggers/posters that are affecting change on a national level. THANK YOU and i applaud you. Keep up the good work H2O man. Someday i hope you will have positive news to report to those of us who work towards turning the tide. Wishing you well.

simply outrageous! :grr: :grr: :grr:

You bet the world will think of the United States as a big-ass terrorist nation. :scared:

This is also :tinfoilhat: stuff, but I am quite :scared:

That's my only question. Surely they have the technical expertise available to know better. Do they think that we can blithely continue down this path and that everything will somehow come out OK or do they have a Big and Evil Plan?:tinfoilhat: I really don't know and don't know which is worse.

Fuck Impeachment!!!! WOULD SOMEBODY JUST BBQ THE BASTARD ALREADY!!!!!!

This ASSHOLE actually threatened the UN?! OVER A SPEACH! AHAHAHAH! Fine BU$Hitler, here's a speach for you:

EAT MY ASS!

Now go ahead...THREATEN THE UN OVER MY SPEACH!!!!!! GO ON, DO IT FUCKER!!!

What we need is the UN to say "ENOUGH OF THE BULLSHIT! WE ARE SENDING IN TROOPS TO REMOVE THIS NEO-KKKON MESS OF CRAP ALREADY!!! SORRY WE'RE LATE! BUT BETTER LATE THAN NEVER!"

Lu

I'm with you! What is this ignorant fool doing still acting like a President? He should be in prison! How long did people, back in Hitlers day sit around like we are and just rant? I am sure they were scared to death like us! We have to do something!

Now, would you be willing to lose your job to have this headline? Assume your next job will be minimum wage and have no benefits, oh, and you have a family to support.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4512696.stm

He sure showed them up. Fugg Bushco.
Edit -add.

:sarcasm:
That should move opponents to stand up.

Poised: lovely word.
Climate: I love the climate in Hawaii.

Real incindiary stuff here.

give a damn. People in the US a facing unbelievable winter weather and it isn't even winter yet and these fools are threatening the UN about a serious discussion on climate change. Three Cat five hurricanes in one year and Bushco's concern is contracts. :puke: :puke:

And, that's what they did.

When Clinton talks,
people listen.
But,
RepubliCONs
run like
scared cats.

My apologies to scared cats.

a Google news search this morning:

http://news.google.com/news?ie=utf8&oe=utf8&persist=1&hl=en&client=google&ncl=http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-1918796,00.html

___

Conference reaches climate deal
U.S. agrees to watered-down declaration
Dec. 10, 2005. 08:25 AM
PETER GORRIE
TORONTO STAR

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1134213762270&call_pageid=968332188492&col=968793972154

MONTREAL -- Weary delegates, politicians and lobby group members cheered early this morning as the United Nations climate change conference finally passed its last two major decisions after two days and nights of gruelling talks.

The main negotiating logjam broke around midnight, when the United States agreed to a watered-down declaration that all 189 countries at the conference will start an open-ended “dialogue” aimed at finding new ways to cut greenhouse gas emissions.

That move, in turn, allowed the passage of a crucial separate deal, under which Canada and 39 other industrialized nations bound by emissions-cut targets under the Kyoto Protocol will begin to negotiate deeper cuts for after the Protocol’s first phase expires in 2012.

The U.S. had objected to several increasingly weak versions of the dialogue agreement during the two week conference, and walked out of the talks Thursday night.

But under intense pressure from most other countries represented here, it finally relented, signing on to a final version after yet more revisions.

Environmental groups were enthusiastic about the conference’s outcome. “This is a set of agreements that may well save the planet,” said Elizabeth May, executive director of the Sierra Club of Canada.

<snip>
“The Bush administration blinked. The world should remember that,” said Bill Hare, policy director with Greenpeace International.
..more..
___

:applause:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/10/AR2005121001405.html?referrer=email&referrer=email

U.S. Won't Join in Binding Climate Talks
Administration Agrees to Separate Dialogue

By Juliet Eilperin
Washington Post Staff Writer
Sunday, December 11, 2005; Page A01

MONTREAL, Dec. 10 -- Despite the Bush administration's adamant resistance, nearly every industrialized nation agreed early Saturday to engage in talks aimed at producing a new set of binding limits on greenhouse gas emissions that would take effect beginning in 2012.

In a separate accord, a broader coalition of nearly 200 nations -- including the United States -- agreed to a much more modest "open and nonbinding" dialogue that would not lead to any "new commitments" to reduce carbon dioxide emissions associated with climate change.

..more..

The Cabal does not, I repeat, not want to do anything that will benefit mankind. They are selfish, egotistical maniacs!

coverage. I know this is nothing new (as they were instrumental in leading the country into "Aggressive War", a Supreme War Crime according to the Nuremberg Tribunals.)

The lack of reporting for instance on the secret plan to undermine the talks as reported in the Guardian last week cannot be seen as anything but deliberate complicity IMO. Isn't withholding information about a crime a crime? The string of crimes committed by the US corporate media is stunning. In this case, they could care less it would seem, if all live as we know it on this planet is threatened.

to bring against the *. pResident bush is a felonious embarrassment legislatively, nationally, internationally and glatically!

The Earth is not replenishable and he is destroying our the habitat for Humans! may he be forced to live in an ecological disaster he has caused with his hubris and stupid environmental policies! * is THE.WORST.EVER. as a human!

considering his range of influence and power, I would say there is a sound argument that he is.

The anti-christ.

:)

nothing surprises me

You speak for me, too!

But it's a start.

business as usual over there....

all have KIDS. WTF do they think their KIDS are going to do? Watch the planet destruct from outer space?

This bastard is still not my president. He and his criminals don't speak for me.

we should call it The War To Save Earth. The Republicans love war, I think we could then win more of them over, than just saying let's save the environment and all life as we know it.

stand up and protect your mother!

People need to wake up and realize the future of humanity is at stake! I'm so sick to death of the defeatist naysayers who keep saying there's nothing we can do about it. I for one am NOT going to sit back and let them destroy the environment and turn our country into Nazi Germany or Communist China. You need to get up off your ass and do something! I don't want to hear anymore moaning or complaining! It's a matter of life and death and we are going to act NOW! Okay? Thank you.

There is no second place everything else is simply relegated to humanistic drama. There is no guarantee that humans will survive forever.



The Death of Nature : Women, Ecology, and the Scientific Revolution

Synopses & Reviews
Publisher Comments:
Nature as Female

The world we have lost was organic. From the obscure origins of our species, human beings have lived in daily, immediate, organic relation with the natural order for their sustenance. In 1500, the daily interaction with nature was still structured for most Europeans, as it was for other Peoples, by close-knit, cooperative, organic communities.

Thus it is not surprising that for sixteenth-century Europeans the root metaphor binding together the self, society, and the cosmos was that of an organism. As a projection of the way people experienced daily life, organismic theory emphasized interdependence among the parts of the human body, subordination of individual to communal purposes in family, community, and state, and vital lift permeating the cosmos to the lowliest stone.

The idea of nature as a living organism had philosophical antecedents in ancient systems of thought, variations of which formed the prevailing ideological framework of the sixteenth century. The organismic metaphor, however, was immensely flexible and adapt able to varying contexts, depending on which of its presuppositions was emphasized. A spectrum of philosophical and political possibilities existed, all of which could be subsumed under the general rubric of "organic."

NATURE AS NURTURE: CONTROLLING IMAGERY. Central to the organic theory was the identification of nature, especially the earth, with a nurturing mother: a kindly beneficent female who provided for the needs of mankind in an ordered, planned universe. But another opposing image of nature as female was also prevalent: wild and uncontrollable nature that could render violence, storms, droughts, and general chaos. Both wereidentified with the female sex and were projections of human perceptions onto the external world. The metaphor of the earth as a nurturing mother was gradually to vanish as a dominant image as the Scientific Revolution proceeded to mechanize and to rationalize the world view. The second image, nature as disorder, called forth an important modern idea, that of power over nature. Two new ideas, those of mechanism and of the domination and mastery of nature, became core concepts of the modern world. An organically oriented mentality in which female principles played an important role was undermined and replaced by a mechanically oriented mentality that either eliminated or used female principles in an exploitative manner. As Western culture became increasingly mechanized in the 1600s, the female earth and virgin earth spirit were subdued by the machine.1

The change in controlling imagery was directly related to changes in human attitudes and behavior toward the earth. Whereas the nurturing earth image can be viewed as a cultural constraint restricting the types of socially and morally sanctioned human actions allowable with respect to the earth, the new images of mastery and domination functioned as cultural sanctions for the denudation of nature. Society needed these new images as it continued the processes of commercialism and industrialization, which depended on activities directly altering the earth--mining, drainage, deforestation, and assarting (grubbing up stumps to clear fields). The new activities utilized new technologies--lift and force pumps, cranes, windmills, geared wheels, flap valves, chains, pistons, treadmills, under- and overshot watermills, fulling mills, flywheels,bellows, excavators, bucket chains, rollers, geared and wheeled bridges, cranks, elaborate block and tackle systems, worm, spur, crown, and lantern gears, cams and eccentrics, ratchets, wrenches, presses, and screws in magnificent variation and combination.

http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?inkey=1-0062505955-12

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0062505955.01._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-dp-500-arrow,TopRight,45,-64_AA240_SH20_SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

I am very much aligned with this way of perceiving our dilemma.
I would like to get this book when I can afford it.

Have you heard of Derrick Jensen?
http://www.derrickjensen.org/published.html#lang

He has some incredible books. He points out among other things how the degradation and violence against ourselves translates into the degradation and violence against the earth.
The books are long but very much transforming in nature.

I am currently reading "A Language Older Than Words". Looking forward to his upcoming book.

Highly recommend "The Arrogance of Humanism" by David Ehrenfeld.

The problems we are facing are far deeper and differently arranged than the perceived realm of politics. That's off the spectrum of discussion for "The Culture of Make Believe".

:hi:

Derrick Jensen on Radio4all.net

I hope others will check this out too.
I saw him speak once. It was well worth it.

The connected will survive.



And that's the plan.

....but my mom says it'll never happen (and she's the smartest Democrat I know). :cry:

That was the subject of my very first post in any political forum, years ago.

And it was greeted with dismay.

I am not full of facts. I am an idiot. I can read and forget what I read in an hour. BUT, I have an ability to see trouble way way way far ahead. I got it from my parents. It's in my genes.

It hurts to see the lack of action on this. And to be honest, I have always felt that if the country did as your post suggests, it wouldn't matter who is in the majority in Congress.

McCarthy was not bounced by the media. Nor did Edward R. Murrow do it. It was the people who did it.

Maybe the first step is to find a million dollars, and start printing up the impeachment stickers. Maybe it's something that silly.

I don't know. I'm just posting, because I believe we had better do it now. How do we do it?

I'm at my breaking point. I've essentially given up. Thank you for the much needed injection.

How can we communicate to the American public how dire this situation is? Randy Rhodes is doing her job. Conyers is fighting. DU is working away.

So here we are, three or four years after my first post. And we're saying just the same thing. Now what can we do to further that goal? I honestly don't know.

all of the save the earth, stop pollution, no war for oil and etc stickers i see on cars. cars driven 4 blocks to the store, cars driven down town ( i live very near downtown baltimore ) just to pay $ 10 per day to park, cars that are old and need a tune up pumping out black smoke, on big older suv's, etc.

what i mean is F U to all the people who complain about the environment but love their gas guzzling cars, who could walk or take a bus. do something about it.

my example is me, i have a 30 yo car that i love, but i put in a modern motor that gets better mileage and is literally about 90 % cleaner in its emissions. and i even walk to the store to get the exercise and save gas/money/environment.

i say a simple put up or shut up

and to the UN, i think everyone here does not like to be pushed around by the .gov but the UN tries to push every .gov around. the cars we run in the US are cleaner burning then the cars in europe.

here is a crazy way to cut down on your emissions, get an electric lawn mower. the typical lawn mower puts out more crap in 1 hour than a newer car does in 24.

just another of our many disconnects.

Good grief, people. Bush used to run financially unstable energy companies. He has a deep understanding of how the world works. Who are you gonna believe about climate change? Him or the rest of the world and their "scientists" with their "PhDs".

the whole world is furious with Bush. The European view of the US has changed from seeing us as a joke to fear and distrust. We are viewed as a threat to civilization. I was shocked.

a lot of my dismay stems from listening to the BBC etc. and realizing how clueless we seem here. It is shameful and embarrassing. The US is responsible for 25% of greenhouse gases and our 'wealth' should allow us more of the means to address the problems.

especially great ones like these. Thanks for pointing it out..


Monitor LBN! Let's make sure we get every single story in time and AVOID STUPID STORIES!

Kik's and nominated

The Bushco agenda was clear that first week.



4 years ago.






Wake up America? :boring: