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The courts were nixed because they were spying on their POLITICAL enemies!

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yknot Donating Member (215 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:02 PM
Original message
The courts were nixed because they were spying on their POLITICAL enemies!
How can we get the list, and how much you wanna bet some of names would create an unbelievable scandal?
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marylanddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
1. excellent point - thanks. n/t
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peace frog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
2. Ding ding ding ding ding!
Edited on Mon Dec-19-05 12:05 PM by peace frog
You win the kewpie doll.
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BleedingHeartPatriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
3. And, THAT was the question that wasn't asked..."Is your program secret
Edited on Mon Dec-19-05 12:06 PM by BleedingHeartPatriot
and not utilizing FISA because it includes people you personally consider enemies, ala Nixon, rather than true enemies of the US?"

MKJ
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
4. Yep, I agree!
Edited on Mon Dec-19-05 12:07 PM by Spazito
Remember when the WH would not release the list of names and information, despite the request of the Senate, on certain people that Bolton had requested and received during his hearings, my bet is they are tied to this spying crime.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
5. Daschle, Leahy, Reid, Boxer, Feinstein, Pelosi, Kucinich, Kerry,
Kennedy and I'm sure the list goes on and on and on. I wonder if whomever leaked the spying info has the list? and are timimg its release?
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Norquist Nemesis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Probably Howard Dean, too
especially as he was gaining ground through grassroots efforts during his campaign
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Botany Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:07 PM
Response to Original message
6. We have a winner.
In Ohio in 04 they hacked into Kerry's computers .... some w/ 5 firewalls, crashed phone lines,
and read e mail.

I saw some of this myself ...... it was a very sophisticated operation.
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long_green Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:07 PM
Response to Original message
7. Definitely.
Edited on Mon Dec-19-05 12:08 PM by long_green
How much trouble do you think it would be for the government to get a federal judge to approve wiretaps on suspected terrorists? Not much. It is precisely because the subjects of the NSA wiretaps are innocent American critics of administration policy.
With Bush's hints about newspaper and Democratic critics helping our enemies I don't think we are too far from seeing a trial balloon go up in the form of an accusation of treason against an American citizen. If that happens, we'd better be prepared to take to the streets.
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
8. I've been saying this for sometime.
It's the only thing that makes sense. They wanted to spy on people that were not engaged in terror activity, and they knew no court would let it happen, so they went around the court. That simple. I think they are spying on political opponents, and dissenters.
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yknot Donating Member (215 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. I'm reminded of taps we were caught putting on foreign diplomats at the UN
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
9. i htink so too. probably have the old granny protestors on their
list too.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
10. I wouldn't put it past them
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:14 PM
Response to Original message
13. was it true that they only monitored international calls?
how does that relate to monitoring political enemies?
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. LOL, because they say this is what they were doing means
they were doing the opposite. If nothing else, they are consistent in saying they are doing the opposite of what they are actually doing. They were monitoring American citizens', it is as simple as that.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #14
19. everything they say is a lie
hence me asking the "international" as a question instead of making a statement.

this should be a relatively straightforward fact to investigate, if there is an investigation
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Only if it is an independent investigation, imo
The difficulty is that ANY investigation will be behind closed doors and all testimony will be classified due to 'national security' so how will the American public ever know the facts in this?

Watching this is like being transported into the twilight zone and the book "1984" all at the same time.
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Botany Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. and why would you believe anything that "they" say?
If anyone of those shits told me it was called and dark on 12/25 @ 12 midnight in Fargo North Dakota
I would put on my shorts and sun screen.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. I don't believe them either
I firmly believe they did this to circumvent judicial oversight

I think there is more to it than just spying on their political enemies.
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yknot Donating Member (215 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. Not sure what's true actually
I was under the assumption that calls and emails from the US to other countries were monitored. Have you ever called a friend or relative abroad?
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. I have called friends abroad
But I would think that 99.99% of political enemies monitoring would be purely domestic

I don't believe the bushturd for a second. He lies every time he flaps his gums.
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yknot Donating Member (215 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. I guess we need clarification
What is meant by "international" calls? Isn't a call from the US to somewhere overseas an international call? I'm not sure. My guess is all kinds of calls were monitored, foreign and domestic.
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Tamarin Donating Member (337 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. We just have to take their word for it? There has to be oversight
otherwise there is the potential for abuse.
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yknot Donating Member (215 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. I think they fulfilled that 'potential' many times over
That's why there's going to be an orgy of ass covering.
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killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
24. yep
there is no other reason to bypass the courts
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triguy46 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-19-05 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
25. Hitting the nail on the head. We know that is why...
and why the patriot act and this rampant executive power grab is so heinous.
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