Turn on C-Span!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Calling the Capitol Police on the Dems when they were meeting in a room, and then pushing through a bill by unanimous voice vote!!

called the police to remove Dems from library.

This is the way civil wars are started.

I think the Busheviks have placed us on a path that can only have two penultimate "endings":

Civil War II
Orwellian-Totalitarian Police State -- The only kind of brutal state (like the Old USSR) that can suppress internecine rivalries by being loathed and feared by everyone

You might be interested in Carl Rowan's book, which, I believe is called "The Coming Civil War in America" or something very close to it.

He was one of the first and most influential mainstream African-American columnists in the 60s, and he is a very interesting read.

The ultimate ending, which we are now almost certainly committed to, which is really the end of all Empires, which is to be overrun by their former victims once they become too weak.

This might take 50 years or 500 years, but that it will happen is as certain as the Death of the Old Republic (80% probabilty, IMHO, that it is already mouldering in an unmarked grave).

If the ReTHUGlicans think they can call the cops and the Sergeant-at-Arms to evict theDemocrats from any part of the Capitol, it's time, friends, it's time....

First they lock-up our elected representatives, then they come for US....

Think long range.

The pukes are saying someone (a democrat) threatened bodily harm to him, but he didn't name names..

If anyone on this Earth deserves to get the snot beaten out of him, it's Scott McPinhead.

wait, maybe not. too close to call.

Pete's a mouthy guy, but anyone who can feel threatened by him is a wuss.

The pukes are saying someone (a democrat) threatened bodily harm to him, but he didn't name names..

All the Dems left, except Stark. When the repubs tried to get a voice vote on the bill without the Dems there, Stark(?) apparently mixed it up with the Repukes.

Repukes are now changing their story because they know the record will show the Dems are right!!!

Go, Pelosi!!!!

Is this true? Was it a significant bill? What does the police evicting Dems from a room have to do with the passing of that bill?

I'm watching now, but there's no mention of the bill passing at all.

...and didn't give the Dems enough times to read it. The pukes then wanted a vote to enter the bill without it being read into the record as the Dems wanted.

- The majority leader called the police to remove Dems from a library/hearing room where they had met to read and understand the bill.

- These are gestapo tactics...and I'm glad the Dems are fighting back.

- Rangel made the point that the police were called BEFORE the harsh words broke out on the floor.

No disrespect intended for the, shall we say, "less initiated" C-Span viwers on DU, but it's sure NICE to read a clear and cogent narrative of the core issue.

NICE on edit

Wasn't very clear and cogent of me, was it?

a pension bill

A mark-up bill was presented around midnight. The Repukes wanted a vote after only a couple of minutes. The Dems wanted the bill to read in its entirety. The Repukes refused. The Dems then walked out and met in the Library, leaving Stark behind. The Repukes called the Capitol police and the Sargeant at Arms to eject the Dems from the Library. Meanwhile, the Repukes put the bill up for a voice vote, which Stark objected to and got into a mix-up with the Repukes. The Repukes went ahead with the voice vote, and the bill passed unanimously

?

There are plenty of cube dwellers here who would appreciate a play by play if anyone's up to the task.

I have heard him before.. He does not pull any punches..

I think the "Ole YOOniter" has really caused some trouble in the congress that will linger..

Maybe the dems will finally wake up and see what assholes they are dealing with.. They are not "our firends across the aisle".. they are the ENEMY across the CHASM .....

The repubbies will do anything and say anything to get their way.. they are the bullies on the block and they do not even care who konws it..:(:(:(

out of the loop....what was the bill regarding? What the (&^ is going on?? This is NOT the way our country is supposed to be governed. First they hijack the 2000 election, start a war withtheir lies and rob the house and senate on the coattails of same, try to recall davis in CA for winning an election, send homeland security after the texas dems and now THIS???????

Time to bring the whole thing down. This is not only THEIR country, dammit.:mad:

edited by SCD...

guess who takes it in the shorts??? One Guess !!!

Apparently the dems actually wanted the bill read, since they had no copy of it, and were expected to vote without even seeing the bill..

The pukes know that they have the numbers, so screw the dems.. The dems finally stood up to the creeps and decided to have a meeting in the library to discuss the bill.. Bill Thomas got his thong in a wad and called the cops to break up their meeting. During the time between the cops being called and them actually arriving, they voted the bill through by voice vote witrhout the dems even being there..

Stark (CA) and another much younger guy got into a shoutig match and Thomas told Stark to SHUT UP.. Then the cops arrived and I think they arreste3d Strak.. ( I may be wrong)...but I think that was the gist of it..

Now the puke wants "his remarks stricken from the record".. I hope there are enough people recording this because the "official record" will be "sanitized for our obfuscation"...:(

just when you thought the behaviour couldn't GET more appalling. I need TIVO or something. I seriously DOUBT this will be rebroadcast. Thanks for being my eyes and ears today. This is truly a new low.

He makes Delay look positively charming. Whenever they do a "most hated member of Congress" the Chairman of the Ways and Means Committee wins hands down.

...and that's what started the mess on the floor.

- Kleczka of Wisconsin said he was in the room when the police came and was told to 'clear out'. He demands an apology.

- Perhaps the fascist neocons were afraid the Dems were going to kick their asses? I would pay to see that!

Amazing!!!! He was wonderful!

...from the real reason the police were called by blaming it on harsh words by Democrats.

- Rangel said the police were called before the almost fight between Stark and Mcinnis on the floor. If this is true...the police were called to 'clear the room' and intimidate the Democrats instead of as a response to a fight on the floor.

- Doggett said that the pukes wanted to pass this bill with only the votes of one party...'making this a one party state'.

- The pukes are defending the chairman's decision to call the police and are generally saying the Dems don't have a complaint and should shut up about it. Dems then began asking why the police weren't sent to the 'fight' on the floor instead of the 'library'.

- Wow. Some puke just said he wondered if Stark control his emotions...or his 'bodily functions' at this point'. What a prick.

Are they back in some order or--WTF is going on? Why haven't the Repubs ordered the cameras off? Do they think they look good?

Distraction from something else, my friend.

He shouldn't try to connect the current situation to racism. I'm offended by Lewis saying that republicans are racists because of the situation. It is really wrong for someone like Lewis to use his past in the Civil Rights movement to try to win an argument that is completely unrelated.

I haven't been able to tear myself away from CSPAN/CSPAN2 for the past 2 days! Just 2 weeks ago I couldn't watch it without wanting to vomit.

Someone lit a fire under the Dems' asses. I can hardly believe what I am seeing! :bounce:

"You're big enough to make me you little wimp? Come over here and make me, I dare you!"

"you little fruitcake, you little fruitcake, you're a little fruitcake"

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

PETE FUCKING STARK! 70+ year-old Republican-Ass-Chewer! My kind of Democrat!

... to see pissed of Dems sticking it to the repukes.

We may be in a constitutional crisis soon.

We had eruptions like this after the 1994 Repub takeover.

Quoting Madison "gradual encroachments of those in power...."

Committee Chairman instructed capitol police to evict members of Congress. This is how is tyranny begins...applause...

It is our responsibility to stand against the police state to stand in favor of open dialog.....

"This is how tyranny begins"
"These are police state tactics"

Whoa!

Chairman defending his actions. To elevate circumstances which neither party is proud....

Says Ds are putting up resolution that only contains SOME facts....

blah, blah, blah...

Didn't catch who it was, but...

If the problem was in the HEARING ROOM, why did you sic the police on the members in the LIBRARY????

Repugs are trying to rewrite history again.

One of them just said he wasn't sure if Stark was in control of his bodily functions, and that is why the police were called! WTF is happening?!?! Did he think that was an intelligent thing to say? They are all so fucking stupid. Hate spews out every time they open their mouths. How did this party become so powerful again?

Oh yeah. They cheated.

:D

they won't let us hear what they're saying. It's gone blank.

Not sure what this means. I've never heard this before, but it looks like someone could be barred from speaking on the floor for the rest of the day!

Hold onto your hats. This is getting to be a real dogfight.

for saying that he was afraid Stark would control of his bodily functions. HAHAHA!!! he basically got punked and was forced to apologize. (he claims he meant to say bodily movements).

Dem objected to 'what' was said by previous puke. an insult to the Dem member.

equivalent to: "you take that back!"

I hope the media takes this story and smears the evil republicans for all it's worth! This is insane.

Hi all- I'm a long time lurker here! My 12 year old, who does not share my passion for politics, and I were watching and she said "God these guys must not live in the real world-who would call the police on somebody who calls you a fruitcake" How far have we come now that f*******e is now the f word.

I'm relying on you all who are watching C-SPAN to give those of us who can't geet to a TV the details.

Have one on us. I'm sure you've noticed the slow-downs as of late, this is not typical. As I'm sure you're aware, many things have happened these past few days to cause massive increases in bandwidth.

And as for your 12 year old? Give her time, she just might follow in your political footsteps.

Sit down and stay awhile!! :-)

WubWub from Dalnet IRC would you?

Let's hope this isn't the beginning of the end of our democracy!

been watching the outrageous arrogance of the pukes for months. 'rules' that prohibit any chance of open debate, etc.

will their conduct get reported? we'll see.

Mr. Speaker we can hear all the spin and diversion that the majority wants to lay there, but this is the point

The Chairman of the Ways and Means Committee called the police! The Police!!!! This is what republicans have come to in the running of this house. If they don't like what we're saying they'll try to have us arrested. If they don't like what we're trying to do, they'll have us arrested.

Relating it to DeLay and Texas.

Wow!!!!!! Turn it on!!!!

This will not be swept under the rug. Some of us come from families who fled from this kind of persecution.

Why were the police called to the library. The chairman was annoyed and wanted to break up that meeting and called the police to do it.

see above. DEMActivist beat me to it. :)

GEt out your guns! Get thos goddam fucking criminals out of our precious government. MY GOD I HATE THOSE FUCKING POWER HUNGRY LOWLIFES>

FUCK THE REPUKES IN THE HOUSE OF REPS. They are an evil institution and should be destroyed by the real power--the PEOPLE. MARCH ON WASHINGTON! DEMAND THEIR BLOOD! THis is sick shit!

At the end of his remarks, he said (speaking of Stark) that if he had been the majority leader at that time, he would have called the police too, because Stark "couldn't control his emotions or his bodily functions".

Dems immediately called "Words Taken Down", which means the transcript is looked at and approved, and if a member has made an inappropriate remark, they cannot speak on the floor for the rest of the day.

When they came back, Brady apologized for his remarks, and asked for unanimous consent that they be stricken because he misspoke.

Wait! Did Stark call Thomas a "fruitcake"? Interesting choice of words for a sweet guy like Thomas.

- Kevin Brady of Texas is trying to explain away his comments about Start's 'bodily functions'. He said he actually meant something else. Ackerman of New York reminds Brady that the police were called to the library where the Dems were meeting...not to the altercation with Stark on the floor. Ackerman says Stark accepts the 'apology'.

Menendez of New Jersey also brings up the 'police state'. Mentions the misuse of homeland security in tracking down Dems in Texas. The police were 'escorted' back to the library to find and remove them. He's yelling now that THEY WILL NOT BE INTIMIDATED...'

- McCrery, puke of louisiana says the Dems have it all wrong. Weller says the police were called to 'restore order'. Ryan R of Wisconsin swears he would have called the cops because it 'looked like' there was about to be a physical confrontation. The pukes pretty much agree that the police were called because THEY thought a fight was about to break out. But that doesn't seem to coincide with the record or the fact that the police went to the library to remove Dems instead of breaking up a fight.

- Hoyel accused GOPers of arbitrary use of power. Does not give Dems time to debate. Abuse their power of the majority.

Not unless Thomas is a switch-hitter. He was caught boinking Deborah Steelman, an healthcare lobbyist who regularly had business before the Ways and Means Health Subcommittee, of which (natch) he was chairman. Stark was just hitting him in his most tender spot, his swaggering Republican machismo.

So he tries to come off. But "fruitcake" seems a much more apropos epithet for the sissified Chairman, gay or not. Maybe fellow-Californian Stark knew just the right button to push.

thinks he's Dirty Harry, returning America to a time when Men Were Men. So yeah, even Lindsey Graham would be withered by a shot to his reputation as a square-jawed two-fisted humdinger :)

may be of the generation that used the word "fruitcake" as in "nuttier than a fruitcake".

I was scared....I would have called the police too....

Of course, none of them mention that the police were called to the LIBRARY, not the committee room.

We are a nation of laws. Mr. Speaker I have great respect for you. But this is another instance, not a unique instance, of an arbtritary use of power. It shuts down the minority. This is not what our founding fathers had in mind.

The police were called. There is no dispute that they did not go to the committee room, they went to the library.

This is not an isolated or unique incident. It happened in Texas too.

You are trampling on the right of the minority. This is America. This is NOT American.

(sorry this late and paraphrased. Having trouble posting like everyone)

Now this is politics!!!!!

Bush and his republican thugs honeymoon is finally over! It seems the democrats are re-energized by the dissent of the people, media, and presidential candiates.

It's about time, I'm sure Nancy P was waiting to lay the smack down. :cheers:

just checked the big ones' websites (CNN, MSNBC, Yahoo, etc.) and there's nothing.

and while the government is in meltdown, they've babbling on about planning weddings.

You wouldn't want them to actually voer the deception, lies, and brutality of the majority over the minority would you and scare the mindless american public.

But I'm sure this news story will hit later tonight. We are watching it unfold right now. There wouldn't be much to cover except to tell people to tune into C-SPAN and watch the sh*t hit the federal fan.

referred to this on the floor. Can't remember who, but he said something like he was glad there were no children present at the time (midnight!!)when he (stark) behaved that way because he wouldn't want the children to have to witness behavior like that!

OMFG, who will save the children???

Dogget on CNN right now, but this reporter (Judy something or other) is a complete whore.

Fortunately Doggett was speaking for the Dems. He has a real HATE on for Delay, so he never pulls his punches.

Believe me, I will be writing to Mike Castle(R-DE) and let him know that this type of behavior is NOT acceptable and if he wants us First Staters to think of him as a moderator he better come out and condemn this poor playing by the repukes of the house.

It's uncalled for and needs to be stopped.

Lynne

See the text of that letter below in post #67.

I will write my former representative Lois Capps.

and use every expletive known to humankind.

Bring some popcorn, folks. I'm hoping for a hard left to the jaw for Thomas on the podium, really.

Operation Nixon Redux is up and running.

To the Honorable Judy Biggert,

Madam,

It is with great shock and dismay that I write to you to express my disgust for the conduct of the House of Representatives majority party. The calling of Capital Police in order to quell the reading of a marked up bill by the minority party when they had been given no opportunity to read the bill, nor would the majority party allow the reading of the bill into the record, goes beyond the absurd.

This, madam, is reprehensible behavior of a tyrannical and irresponsible majority. We live in a nation of laws, not mob rule.

Submitted faithfully,
Walter E. Starr

The posting times are like a few hours FROM now which as I write is 3:30 on the east coast. Is this post something that has been posted and replied to in the last hour or is this from yesterday or what??? Please give me a time check. I would like to see if any of the major networks cover this tonight.

at 3:29, close enough.
check your user options and make sure you are set to correct timezone. est

dp

are like 7:00 PM - that's PM - on Friday the 18th. My computer is set right now at 3:55 PM est. Thus, it means these posts WILL be posted hours from now. It's the DU time stamp on all these posts that is completely screwed up. Thus, I have no idea if these were posts at 7:00 THIS MORNING and they just have the PM stamp screwed up at DU or if it's just plain screwed up. This is straight from DU, not my computer.

go to your DU user option at the top of any forum page
go to edit your preferances
check your time zone, make sure it's USA/eastern

dp

Pelosi speaking now.

I just got back from a movie...this is a Question of Privilege on the rights of the minority. Pelosi's really nailing them. For all that call Pelosi an "appeaser", reconsider.

War has been declared in the House. I'm guessing a straight party-line vote on this.

YOU TELL 'EM, PELOSI!

.....like our government has just gone Nazi.

Vote now to kill Pelosi's resolution of reprimand. WATCH on http://www.c-span.org ...it's C-SPAN 1.

Recorded vote ordered.

CORRECT VOTE FOR ALL WHO LOVE DEMOCRACY: :thumbsdown:

She nailed em! Damn she did!

There was a voice vote and now they are having a quorum vote on the Minority Leader's Privledged Motion!!

So far vote is 89 YES 73 NO.

Callers coming in now ...

Trying to silence the people ...



:dem:

more later ...

Democratic press briefing on C-SPAN now...Rangel explaining everything.

If any member of Congress is reading this, vote NO if you love democracy.

Reprimanding the Repukes?

What the heck is going on???? This is craziness.

She was talking about Repuke arrogance and hubris, and called that a tragic flaw.

Then she said "We cannot allow your tragic flaw to shut down the voices of the American people".

Yeah, Nancy.

This bill will be tabled because it will be a straight party-line vote, but they have made their point, and, as Nancy said, they have "Drawn the line in the sand".

about Pelosi but that is one powerful quote (note to Nance: hubris is synonymous with arrogance)......I can't believe all this is going on and there's hardly a peep anywhere on the websites except this one....

I don't have the Yeas and Nays because my f*cking computer burped right when he was saying them.

Democracy...may it rest in peace. :-(

Hoyer recognized now for next weeks schedule...MR. PORTMAN IS NOT YOUR FRIEND, HOYER.

Monday-Suspensions
Tuesday and balance of week-Foreign Ops Appropriations
School Readiness Act-Head Start bill
US-Chile and US-Singapore trade agreements
Commerce/Justice/State Appropriations
Pharmaceutical Access Act
DC Appropriations
VA/HUD Appropriations??

Yeas 170 Nays 143
http://clerkweb.house.gov/cgi-bin/vote.exe?year=2003&rollnumber=397

They clearly didn't give members that weren't there time to get to the floor and vote. :grr:

:kick:

I called Congress (the offices of the two Rethuglicans involved) and let them know I do not appreciate them illegally siccing the police on a fellow Congressperson simply for being outspoken. Thugs usually run off with their tail between their legs when you take the simple step of firmly telling them their actions are inappropriate. (If we fail to stop them like this, they may become emboldened by their success in cowing people.)

The contact info for the guy who called the cops (Bill Thomas, R-CA) is:

Web Site: www.house.gov/billthomas

Phone: (202) 225-2915
Fax: (202) 225-8798

Capital Address:
2208 Rayburn House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515-0521

District Office Information:
Phone: (661) 327-3611
Fax: (661) 631-9535

Address:
4100 Truxtun Ave., #220
Bakersfield, CA 93309

The contact info for the guy (Kevin Brady, R-TX) who made the vulgar claim that the Democrat speaking out couldn't control his "bodily functions" is:

NAME:
Kevin Brady (Republican)
428 Cannon Office Building
United States House of Representatives
Washington,DC 20515
PHONE:
1-202-225-4901
FAX:
1-202-225-5524
E-MAIL:
rep.brady@mail.house.gov
WEB:
http://www.house.gov/brady/

If you call a staffer for one of these thugs to complain, and they try to tell you you can't because you're not part of the thug's district, just say something like: "I'm not calling as a constituent requesting legislation. I'm calling as a citizen reporting a crime. As the Sergeant at Arms pointed out, it is not appropriate to call the police to try to silence debate. I'm not calling as a constituent to ask your boss to pass new laws - I'm calling as a US citizen to remind him to obey existing laws."

I had to leave and so glad I can catch up. You know the bill that they were fighting over was HR1776 how odd!!!!!
The police were not called out for Stark they were asked to clear the library Stark was not there.
Now comparing it to Texas Dem deal
Serious infringment on Democracy
Bill Thomas called out the police

then I called a few repukes I picked randomly just to tell them ho pissed off I am overthis.

It probably won't do any good, but damn it felt nice.

Gonna replay at 8pm ET