what did John Edwards mean by this statement?

Edwards jumped in moments later, challenging Dean to say whether he was wrong to have made his comments about the flag.…

"Let me tell you, the last thing we need in the South is (a) somebody like you (b) coming down and telling us what we need to do," he said.

http://www.myinky.com/ecp/gleaner_news/article/0,1626,ECP_4476_2403043,00.html

a) I'm assuming he means something along the lines of "Birkenstock liberal", but regardless, he's clearly stereotyping, and expressing a disdain for this group

b) the only thing Dean wants to tell Southerners that they oughta do is vote for Dems because it's in their economic interest to do so

a + b = :wtf:

a) I'm assuming he means something along the lines of "Birkenstock liberal", but regardless, he's clearly stereotyping, and expressing a disdain for this group .

who are running for president without a sense of the historical and divisive nature of the confederate flag.

if so, i share his disdain.

situation. Democrats have treated Southern Democrats like shit for years. I understand Edward's remarks, but I also know that Dean is right, otherwise we'll never win another election in the South.
Democrats, running for office, won't even admit to being Democrats.

("Yankee liberal coming down here, telling us what to do") sounds to me like something from the '60's. However, Dean's point was right on but as Howard Fineman said this morning "not artfully expressed".

classifying poor southern whites as drivers of pickup trucks with confederate flags. I'm not pulling this out of my ass. Edwards specifically said "stereotyping" several times when critisizing Dean

you don't see the stupidity of this?

:freak:

all the candidates attacking Dean are leaving sound bytes in their wake that will most certainly be used against them at a later time…

"Somebody like you" = Northerner with peace sign sticker on Volvo.

"Coming down here..." = We are so screwed up politically here we are embarassed that you are calling us on it. We desperately need to gain back those voters but we don't want YOU telling that, so we'll just ignore it and hope that they come back someday...

So why isn't he running for re-election?

He knows he will lose.

Johnny-come-lately was a NC fluke - NO CHANCE at reelection to his Senate seat. Also NO CHANCE at Dem. nomination for the White House. NC repubs will never vote for a lawyer, and at least half of NC Dems will not vote for a warmonger-enabling, poll-sniffing flip-flopper. Fuck you, too, Johnny - your 15 minutes are about up.

And we don't need your stinking unions down here either!

yeah...I like people like you...those posters
who cut through the crap.

"A rich and privileged guy" trying to tell "Mill Workers"{not wealthy)people what to do.

else should be judged on what he says and does, and not on speculation and interpretation that can be colored by our own beliefs and biases.

There is no mistaking Edward's context. Anyone who's spent any amount of time in the south can tell you that.

With or without the "Birkenstock Liberal" variable, the bottom line is Edwards called Dean a carpetbagger, or something like it. If I had a dime for everytime I heard a Southernor say 'we don't need Yankees telling us how to ...." I'd be hot tubbing somewhere on a mountain in Nepal.

but I was kidding myself, I guess.

The "people like you coming down here" statement is pure, unadulterated southern demagoguery. Edwards resorted to the tried and true appeal to regionalism and ignorance. "Don't you Yankees try to tell us what to do!"

I'm very disappointed. I imagined Edwards as a President one day, but this tells me he doesn't have it.

I don't think Dean has any idea how hateful and non-mainstream those rebel flag wavers are. They do not represent the average Southerner.

with incognito's statement that it meant "'A rich and privileged guy' trying to tell 'Mill Workers' {not wealthy) people what to do." My point is that Edwards did not say that and that we should focus on what he actually did say.

That was my interpretation of his "insinuation". What does..."Somebody like YOU" mean?

I have to say I think the whole thing is overblown.

Dean did make a mistake by bringing up the flag. It has way too much baggage associated with it. He should have said poor whites in the south and left it at that.

Edward's knee-jerk "we don't need you yankees telling us what to do" isn't helpful either. That attitude is still prevelant down here, I've seen it countless times in the letters to the editor here recently regarding the removal of the U of M's mascot by a "Yankee Consulting Firm."

Race and the flag are huge issues here though. One of the most common election signs I have seen here is "Keep the Flag, Change the Governor." And Barbour won. Which means when the flag referendum comes back up, the Confederate Flag will stay in the State Flag.

The Democratic Party does have to find a way to bring poor white in the South back to the party. It is insane the Bush won Mississippi in 2000, though his economic policies are killing the same poor southerners who voted for him.

Do they not care about the economic issues? Do they care that they are NOT better off under republican rule? Are guns and the confederate flag more important than feeding their families, having a job or sending their children to good schools? I honestly don't understand it. They can't really be voting on the confederate flag and gun issue ONLY, can they? What is it, exactly, that they have in mind when they vote? They don't REALLY think the republicans give a rats a@@ about them, do they?

:(

:kick:

n/t

. . .a lot of hypocrisy floating around.

nothing more than for them to pair up as Pres/VP. But on this one, I think Dean needs to rethink his position, and I think Edwards' reaction is understandable. But I am more concerned that this is being blown WAY out of proportion by the media. There are MUCH bigger issues that need to be addressed.

It's bad for anyone to use literary devices such as IMAGERY when everyone's waiting to jump down your throat.

Dean has also gotten in trouble for using a simile (congress will scurry like cockroaches).

If the other Dems learned one thing from Bush, it's the need to hate intellectualism.

. . .when he was talking about voting to give the president leverage with the UN. . .big difference.

when he was talking about voting to give the president leverage with the UN. . .big difference.

You talking about ONE quote? What are you talking about specifically? Quotes please.

confederate flag stickers in their truck windows. Dean never said that ALL poor white southerners flew the confederate flag, just that those who do fly the flag aren't paying attention to the issues because they keep voting republican. If the confederate flag wavers could get off their kick of "you can have mah gun when ya pry it from mah cold dead hands!" mentality and realize that under republican leadership they are losing their jobs, they will never get affordable health care, and will stay in their rut along with their children and grandchildren who won't be able to afford to go to college, etc.

These guys think they are losing their jobs because of blacks or immigrants coming in who are willing to work for lower wages, but what they apparently aren't aware of is that it's the republican CEO's of those companies that are trucking in illegal aliens so that the fat cats can make more money. These repukes dont' give a damn about the poor white southerners with confederate flags in their windows, they just want to make sure that they keep flying those confederate flags and that they don't look behind the curtain to see who's running the show.

nailed it!

I've been wavering over whether I would hold my nose and
vote for him if he somehow ended up as the Democratic
nominee.

Last night, I made up my mind.

He now joins Lieberman in my very, very exclusive club of
alleged Democrats for whom I would not vote.

Atlant

You ever think for a second that he would knwo the region better than Dean? Is that possible? Is it OK for Edwards to be offended? Can Dean do anything wrong in the Deaniacs eyes?

he lives in Washington.

And no, I don't thikn edwards has it right about the south. I live in NC, and I don't see it his way at all. But then, he thinks a new democrats stock car is a wise choice.

primaries are to shake out who can take it or not

(NT)

That "People like you" comment was jaw-dropping. Since I'm a person like Dean, I assume that Edwards holds me in complete contempt. I will be happy to return the favor.

would be an arrogant northerner from a privileged background, not a 'Birkenstock liberal.' This is more Deanite straw man at work.

should be thrown in his face from now until kingdom come.

In one of Edwards early C-Span New England town meeting appearances, I saw an interesting interaction between him and someone in the audience who asked a question. Edwards was openly hostile, revealing the nasty element beneath his slick, charming but somewhat vapid exterior. I never forgot it and wasn't surprised when he finally let the cat out of the bag about his true motives.

If anybody can imagine a northerner saying to a southerner:

"Let me tell you, the last thing we need in the north is somebody like you coming up and telling us what we need to do"?

Why is it that northerners don't seem to have any problem at all supporting and voting for southern candidates but so many in the south will not support a northerner?

And by the way - what was Dean supposed to be telling southerners to do? I thought I liked Edwards after his hardball thing but that statement turned me on him completely. I understand what Dean was saying and it's being used by the other candidates, to their own detriment in my opinion. I know there are a lot of southerners on DU and I've been down south many times myself. It's not a secret that there are lots of confederate flags down there. All he's saying is that those people can't be written off by the Democratic Party and that they should be reached out to. They're not all racists and if they were made aware of what the Democratic Party stands for and that it would be in their own best interest to vote for Democrats we would all be better off.

And for the record, I'm a Cark supporter and I'm pleased he didn't put himself into the middle of this.

> All he's saying is that those people can't be written off by the
> Democratic Party and that they should be reached out to. They're not
> all racists and if they were made aware of what the Democratic Party
> stands for and that it would be in their own best interest to vote for
> Democrats we would all be better off.

Thanks for understanding this and for your kind words.


> And for the record, I'm a Cark supporter and I'm pleased he didn't put
> himself into the middle of this.

I'm a Dean supporter, and it certainly didn't escape MY notice that
Wesley DID NOT attempt to make any hay using this cheap trick
(of deliberately twisting Dean's words) that several of the other
candidates have employed.

Atlant

is richer (always has been, in fact), and doesn't carry the stigma of racism and slavery to the same degree that the South does. I think many Southerners have an inferiority complex towards the North, and as such, hang on to their traditions and regional pride extra-firmly as a way of compensating. Just my opinion.

I love your Sinatra pic...can I copy and save it? It's awesome.

I love your Sinatra pic...care if I save a copy? It's awesome.

and he didn't make a big deal out of it. As a southerner who very badly wants change I didn't appreciate what Edwards said. There's a big difference between the issues that Dean is trying to raise and some of the things that start spats between southerners and northerners who move here and "try to tell us what to do".

Dean shoots off his mouth with a statement not meant to be inflammatory but got jumped on anyway, politics being what it is.

Then Edwards has to go shoot off his mouth and make it worse by bringing up old wounds that are slowly being healed. That was deliberate and inflammatory.

And it sucked. It deliberately brought to the front all that history of North-South animosity that we are supposed to be healing. And keeps the Dean comment on the front page.

What the hell is he doing? Trying to set us back a hundred years?

If this nonsense gets legs, it could be the single most damaging thing that this primary campaign has done to the general election next year. I can't speak for anyone else, but it sure left a bad taste in my mouth, and I wouldn't be at all surprised at all if it left a worse one down south.

As a party, we have to fight for the hearts and minds of anyone who will listen to us, not insult an entire region.

We'll see if Dean can pull his nuts out of the fire over this, but Edwards is pure shit and the sooner he pulls out, the better.

Evidence of which is already creeping into the board: South vs North

Rove couldn't have orchestrated it better.

Sharpton inserts the race wedge and Edwards introduces the regional one.

that was the point.

in his offending carelessness. Maybe there's more to him than I thought -- it was quite an accomplishment.

But don't you find the slightest irony in the fact that you condemn Dean for his attempts to be more inclusive, while attacking me for not being more inclusive and embracing your strident and insulting style with open arms when the Clark troops first swarmed over this board?

Dean must be a better person. ;-)

And you may not have noticed, but many Dean supporters are more generous to Clark than Clark supporters are to Dean. It is appreciated when the occasional Clark supporter offers their insight when it is not blinded by rabid hate.

I guess Dean supporters are more inclusive?

A pathetic -- but Deanish in its lack of honesty -- attempt at spin. Please, show me where I 'condemned Dean for being inclusive.' I condemn Dean for being arrogant, for being ignorant about race issues, for being too stubborn to admit when he's wrong, for shooting off at the mouth when he shouldn't, for lying, for smearing the other candidates, for being unceasingly negative, for being the candidate the republicans desperately want to run against -- yes, I condemn him for these things. For being 'inclusive?' Wouldn't think about it.

But don't you find the slightest irony in the fact that you condemn Dean for his attempts to be more inclusive, while attacking me for not being more inclusive and embracing your strident and insulting style with open arms when the Clark troops first swarmed over this board?

Actually, I started out liking Dean. It took the hard work of people like yourself, and Dean's myriad faults, to push me into the anti-Dean camp. But you do serve one role: you, along with Dean's consistent screwups, remind me why I dislike him. If nothing else, you serve that function well.

I guess Dean supporters are more inclusive?

Too bad it's against the rules, or I'd make a list of the 'inclusive' Dean supporters, and some of their more 'inclusive' posts. But as I said above, I think there are tons of Kerry supporters and Clark supporters, and a few Lieberman supporters, who know exactly how 'inclusive' Deanites are.

You do not want to include Dean. I understand.

As for that "I started out liking Dean" ...LOL! Thanks for the laugh Billy. One doesn't reach your level of overt hostility... refering to Dean as "pudge" and spouting your bile every other post, on account of lil' ol' me. Why I am flattered.

In the meantime I will acknowledge Clark's strengths, but not refrain from addressing his weaknesses. Think you can find that balance? Didn't think so.

I actually liked all the candidates for one reason or another. Until last night. The contest last night to see which candidate could get the most buckshot in Dean's butt was truly crude, devisive, and stupid. The worst kind of "political correctness." It was amusing to watch Clark just watching it all with a big smile on his face.

Is that Dean does not know what is best for these folks down here.
Hell even Edwards may not either.

But what you have here my Dean loving peers, is someone who is trying to do to much with the wrong groups and at the wrong time. If Dean knows what is best for the South, then why not come down here at say it? Say it to the Southern Dems too?
I'll tell you what those confederate flag waving rebels are registed Republicans, and wont change until a thing about themsleves until next year. No one is paying attention to what he's saying from around here, espically when he says it in IOWA. or whatever Northern state.

People around here know what is best for them and right now they see it as with the Republican party. Classifying them all into one "gun touting, grit eatin, Rebel Flag waving, tabacci chewin people" is not going to win any friends.

Edwards and Sharpton called Dean out, and now the best response is to try to pin hypocrisy on Edwards? wtf?

If anything he was right IMO. Northerners are snobbish know it alls, and it took me 8 good years to snap outta that myself. No matter where you from you dont dersevre to be talk down to and told you dont know whats best.

hang this up Deanites.

What Edwards meant when he said "people like you" was a person like Dean (who is a great example) who generazile poor white southerners as people who embrace the confederate flag. That simple! Not people from the north or any specific group.

Don't try to spin this.

As soon as I heard that awful cliche exit his mouth, I had confirmed what I had suspected about Edwards, that he is an empty suit with at best a third rate mind. I've heard that bullshit phrase "We don't need...." offered up in response to practically every damned issue that affects the south. It's a stupid, unproductive, thing to say. It's a stock phrase inserted to fill a place in a pargragh when logic fails.

OR.

He is pandering to the same group that Dean is trying to reach. To the same effect, no doubt. If I can muster any credit for Edwards' intellect, I would say that everything he does at this piont is directed to winning the vote in SC. If he can't make it here, he can't make it anywhere, and he knows it. He is ten points behind General Clark (pushing a broom after the parade has passed -- wave bye, bye now Johnny) in SC. It's all over but the crying, but he hasn't figured that out yet. He's in that desperate-last-struggle-before-his-head-sinks-beneath-the-quicksand stage. I was very negatively impressed with how badly Edwards did thoroughout the debate.

Edwards is smarter than Bush, but not by much. Damn, I don't want another embarassing dimbulb Southerner in the White House.

I swear, guys, we Southerners are not all halfwits.