http://www.mcsweeneys.net/2003/04/23fellowship.htmlU N U S E D
A U D I O C O M M E N T A R Y
B Y H O W A R D Z I N N
A N D N O A M C H O M S K Y ,
R E C O R D E D
S U M M E R 2 0 0 2 ,
F O R T H E F E L L O W S H I P
O F T H E R I N G
( P L A T I N U M S E R I E S
E X T E N D E D E D I T I O N ) D V D ,
P A R T T W O .
BY JEFF ALEXANDER AND TOM BISSELL
- - - -
- - - -
Chomsky: One of the problems with the perspective offered
by the Man-Elf coalition is that you have to try so hard to
get at the truth of the conflict, at what is really going on; it's
so obscured by their propaganda and relentless militarism. I
mean, here we have swords being distributed to the Hobbits
by Strider so they can protect themselves against these
"evil creatures." Now, in this case, it's probably warranted,
though the "evil creatures" are looking for the ring in their
own individual self-interest. They're behaving in a purely
rational way.
Zinn: The Nazgul have been ordered to get the ring. So,
that's what they're doing.
Chomsky: There are conflicts in rationality as well.
Sometimes valid rationality is forced into conflict because of
the structures of culture. But working through those cultural
differences is where the peace lies. It doesn't lie in
destroying some magical ring. This takes me back to the
media's involvement in all this, and the way the media is
being controlled by Gandalf, such as when he covers
Saruman's palantir in Orthanc. This is the stone that allows
one to see, and thus communicate with, different cultures.
Zinn: Right. "What does the eye command, my lord?" This is
what the Orcs ask Saruman. In other words, what does the
palantir say? Clearly the Orcs know a lot more about the
people of Rohan and Gondor than the people of Rohan and
Gondor have ever cared to know about them. They're
curious beings.
Chomsky: Naturally, it's in Rohan/Gondor's interest to keep
the Orcs obscured, to make everything as restricted and
dehumanizing as possible. It's always the first step toward
genocide. And is this - is there anything less than genocide
being advocated in this film?
Zinn: I don't think so.
Chomsky: Is there any kind of idea that men should live in
peace with the Orcs?
Zinn: Think of the scenes in the prologue with all the arrows
hitting these thousands of Orcs. We're supposed to think
that this is a good thing.
Chomsky: I think this is a tragedy, this story. Because it's
about two cultures. And poor leadership. It's a human
tragedy, and an Orcish tragedy.
Zinn: A perfect example of what you're talking about is
right here, when Strider attacks the Black Riders, "saving"
Frodo from them.
Chomsky: Think of it from the Black Riders' perspective.
No doubt they arrived at Weathertop thinking, "Can we ask
a few questions? We'd like to talk to you."
Zinn: Now from here we jump to Isengard, post-ecological
atrocities. What I personally see here is... well, I see
industrialization, I see a very cooperative workforce, I see a
people who aren't terrorized, a people attempting to make
do with what they have.
Chomsky: Well, they're making weapons, which is sad. I
mean, it would be nice if they could make plowshares, but
unfortunately this isn't the time for plowshares in their
culture. But they're showing great ingenuity, and they're
showing cooperation, you're right about that.
Zinn: Actually it shows the Orcs smithing a lot of pieces of
metal. I don't think it's necessarily established that what
they're making is swords, is it? They could be farming
implements of some sort. They're definitely
unusual-looking. But I have to ask you, what about the
genetic engineering that goes on with the Uruk-hai?
Chomsky: It's certainly a strange aspect of their culture, but
why should we be so condemning? I mean, this is the way
they reproduce. If it looks disgusting to us, well maybe we
should readjust what we regard as disgusting. I mean, is
that any more vile than pulling a baby out of a gaping, bloody
hole?
Zinn: And we go back to the Hobbits. After Frodo's been
stabbed, Strider and Sam immediately journey out in search
of another herb: kingsfoil, or athelas.
Chomsky: Aragorn is evidently into Research and
Development as well.
Zinn: He certainly seems knowledgeable of "herbs" and
"medicines."
Chomsky: And notice the way Arwen Evenstar greets
Strider: a knife to the throat. I think that's a very telling, very
interesting thing that happens over and over. Whenever
"friendly" people encounter one another, they're raising
swords, looking fearful and distrustful.
Zinn: Now we witness the Black Riders finally together -
all nine Riders - giving chase to Arwen and Frodo. When
we see the Orcs destroy their environment, it is this big
scandal. But Arwen is able to send a whole herd of watery
horses down a river, no doubt a very delicate ecosystem,
and probably completely demolish it, and no one says
anything about that.
Chomsky: The Elves, of course, always say that they are
the best custodians of nature. And there's a curious type of
nature-worship in their culture that allows them to claim,
by every implication, "Trees are more important than
people." They don't regard the Orcs as people. However,
Orcs are thinking, sentient, conscious beings with a culture
and a language. They feel pain. They express emotion.
They are constantly evolving, trying to better themselves.
Zinn: But here the Elvish culture is revealed to be very
elaborate, because, of course, they have better
architecture. But I vastly prefer the real grittiness one finds
in Mordor. Think of the suspiciously clean city of Rivendell.
You don't see any life going on there. No people at all.
There's hardly anyone in the streets. It should be said,
though, that, on occasion, the Orcs have been known to eat
one another.
Chomsky: That's cannibalism, sure, but maybe it's part of a
sacred ritual with them. Maybe it's an ancient part of their
culture. Who are we to judge? Still, I have problems with it,
I agree.
Zinn: So here we have another shot of Rivendell being
beautiful because it happens to be located in the mountains,
where the lighter people live. And we see here the two
primary players moving the action forward: an Elf and a
wizard. Elrond and Gandalf.
Chomsky: This is our first real glimpse into the power
structure of Middle Earth. It's basically two men who rule
their people, deciding what will happen - not asking anyone
what they think should happen. Gandalf, even more
disturbingly, does not even rule a people but rather rules
from his own personal whims and preferences.
Zinn: Isn't it implied that he's from Rohan?
Chomsky: Originally he's from over the sea. He is some
type of magic person, according to his own myth about
himself. He doesn't claim any land, instead acting as
custodian of all of their lands. Of course, I think he's a
classic dictator, pulling the strings. Can you detect how
outraged I am by this?
Zinn: Why do you suppose it is that the Elves don't want the
ring to stay in Rivendell? Isn't this obvious proof that the ring
is nothing but a device to be used against Mordor?
Chomsky: This is their justification for war. That's why
Boromir is so insightful when he says, basically, "Why don't
we use it? If this ring's so great, who don't we use the damn
thing?"
Zinn: And what happens to Boromir? The Orcs are tricked
into killing him. Thus silencing him.
Chomsky: I think this is an interesting scene - Aragorn in
Rivendell looking upon the Isildur mural - because it shows
how the militarization of their propaganda has fed their
cultural behaviors and religious beliefs.
Zinn: Isildur's broken sword, you mean?
Chomsky: The myth. I mean, look at this museum, this cult,
all based around a broken sword. They've developed a
religion so that people can be effectively marshaled into
battle. And Aragorn is a part of that. He's a king, performing
a ceremony for people to continue this senseless belief in
some kind of genetic superiority. It is rather like saying, "I
have the signet ring of the house of the tsar," or something.
Now I can rule.
Zinn: Well, I think this scene shows us what kind of person
Aragorn is - a loner, possibly a drug lord.
Chomsky: And then we get bathed in Aragorn-Arwen love
lore. And it's the most simplistic kind of propaganda. You've
got this beautiful woman who represents the Party,
represents the people of the Motherland, and you have the
hero. Develop a little love affair between them.
Zinn: A love affair between the putative hero and the
personified Motherland concept, you mean.
Chomsky: Right. The humans are all so entranced by the
Elves' completely mythological power. It's a spell that has
been cast upon them.
Zinn: I see the humans, embodied by Aragorn, as being
indicative of a sort of middle-class longing.
Chomsky: It keeps them striving. If you're a good enough
man, you can be an Elf.
Zinn: An Elf. As if that's the best thing to be.
Chomsky: Now, at the Council of Elrond, we have the
Middle Earth equivalent of a television broadcast. It's one
guy sitting in a tall chair and talking at twenty other people.
This is how information is spread in this culture. But, you
know, it doesn't have to be this way. Imagine that, right
now, you have the people in Gondor with a palantir, the
people in Rohan with a palantir, the people in the Woodland
Realm with a palantir. And everyone could be standing
around it, talking to one another, sharing a conference in
which the people have an equal interest and stake in what
decisions are made.
Zinn: Technology that Gandalf already knows is available.
But do we see a single Orc?
Chomsky: Oh, of course not. Of course not. Because
everyone here has a vested interest in keeping the Orcs
down.
Zinn: Boromir is the only one honest enough to talk about
what the real story is here.
Chomsky: Boromir's an interesting case. His culture is
threatened by the Orcs in a very real way. But he's also
seen that this occupation of Orc land is engendered by his
people's own aggressive policies. So he's like an
enlightened Israeli who looks at the situation and says, "If I
were in their situation, I would be just like them."
Zinn: Boromir here is talking about the eye, and how
horrible Mordor is, which reveals the basic limitations of his
cultural situation. Boromir embodies the prejudices of his
culture, but I too think he's an interestingly problematic
figure. He's really the only one who understands... my God.
Look at this. Keep in mind that these are supposed to be
Middle Earth's enlightened people at this Council, and
they're all fighting, they all hate one another.
Chomsky: It's just so complicated, the webs of
relationships.
Zinn: Now Frodo, son of Drogo, agrees to take the ring to
Mount Doom. Something tells me that no one in Mordor
calls it Mount Doom.
Chomsky: And everyone baits Frodo into this. "You are our
agent, going on a suicide mission. You have to do it for the
Motherland."
Zinn: So is Frodo the Mohammed Atta figure in this story?
Chomsky: He's a fanatical true believer. And crazy.
Obviously, totally insane.
Zinn: And listen to what Aragorn tells Frodo: "You have my
sword."
Chomsky: So militaristic.
Zinn: Notice that no one says, "You have my diplomatic
skills." I think the only real diplomat of Middle Earth is
Gollum. He's the only one who makes any meaningful,
cross-cultural exchange with any of these people. Being a
torture victim at the hand of the Orcs, and his attempted
strangulation of the Hobbits.
Chomsky: I think of Gollum as more of a deluded madman,
one more sinned against than sinned.
Zinn: There's room for argument. And, yet again, here we
see Bilbo ravaged from the effects of pipe-weed. It's been
flushed from his system in his idyll-cum-rehab in Rivendell.
And what does he give Frodo? He gives him his sword, of
course. Sting.
Chomsky: As if to say, "You know, when you've stabbed
enough people in the back like I have, you'll need this shirt
of mithril." Hobbits are bandits. They have this little veneer
of nobility around them, but they are nothing more than
demented little thieves.
Zinn: On the way to Moria, here, we should point out the
fear that men and Elves have of the Dwarves' culture. They
refuse to enter the mines of Moria.
Chomsky: There is something very funny lingering around
the edges of the whole Moria episode. Could it be that the
Dwarves living there were starting to get different ideas
about the Orcs? Were starting to talk to the Orcs, and
establish some means of cross-cultural communication?
Perhaps Gandalf and some of his Rohan friends went there
only to find a bunch of Dwarves and Orcs talking, maybe
forming an alliance or pact. And then Gandalf massacred all
of them, and pretended as though there was some huge
battle. This would explain why Gandalf can't lead them
back there. Genocide's been committed. He hasn't yet
weaved a good enough story to explain away the evidence.
He has to pretend that Moria is this scary place.
Zinn: So few kingdoms within Middle Earth are established
with any vividness. This goes some way toward proving
your point.
Chomsky: We're encouraged to think that no one but the
Fellowship's active participants are important, but then we
go into Moria, and we realize that this was once an
incredible, deeply multicultural place. There were some
Orcs who lived there, and who are still living there. So here
we are, walking into Moria, the scene of what was possibly
a great massacre at the hands of Gandalf. And of course,
the Fellowship walks in and they see the hundreds of
bodies. Don't think for a moment that Boromir is not
suspicious about all of this.
Zinn: Earlier, Boromir says, "We make for the Gap of
Rohan." If you're correct, what he is really saying is, "Let's
back out. I need to talk to some people."
Chomsky: "I need to tell them about what I have lately
discovered."
Zinn: Now, we see in Moria that the Dwarves had a fairly
sophisticated mithril mine here. Wouldn't you say the
Dwarves are the Jew-like figures of Middle Earth?
Chomsky: They are former slaves. The comparison is apt.
Zinn: They're good at doing things with their hands. This is
something Tolkien is very adamant about. They're useful,
but they're not very educated. Ah, and this is also where we
first see Gollum. I stick to my view of Gollum as a rebel
who transgresses boundaries. In many ways he is the
heroic, empathetic conscience of this story. He's the only
one who cares about bridging the gaps between these many
cultures.
Chomsky: You could be right. I think there's possibly
something very wise about Gollum. Obviously he's
well-traveled, he's a hermit.
Zinn: I think his sexuality is questionable, and that's why
he's viewed as this hateful, awful thing. Everyone always
talks about killing him.
Chomsky: Gandalf of course likes to have as many ghosts
around him as possible. He slyly encourages Frodo in this
belief that Gollum is some kind of horrible, corrupt thing. He
neglects to say, "You know, I tortured him just a couple of
weeks ago."
Zinn: Exactly.
Chomsky: Notice that Gandalf doesn't give anybody else
the supposed Dwarf book to read. Gandalf could be passing
it off as Balin's last words. We don't know what is actually
recorded in it, though. Very cunning. It could be agreement
drawn up between the Orcs and the Dwarves. It could quite
easily be that.
Zinn: It would explain why he kept it out of Gimli's hands.
Chomsky: Sure. "No, don't worry. I'll read it. Let me read
this to you guys."
Zinn: What I think this reveals is that the Dwarves have a
very beautiful, elegant, poetic way about them.
Chomsky: Except Gandalf could be making it all up.
Zinn: That's what I mean: this is much more of a
Gandalfian, flowery language. It's hard to imagine the
Dwarves writing that way.
Chomsky: And now the terrible Orcs invade Balin's tomb.
Let's be clear about a few things here. The Orcs are
fighting a war of self-defense against the invading
Fellowship. They basically busted in on the Orcs' place
here. It's fairly clear that the Orcs are hiding there because
if they go outside they have every reason to believe that
they will be massacred by Gandalf.
Zinn: The Orcs certainly don't seem to be very good
fighters, do they? If they're such a terrible, evil, warlike
culture -
Chomsky: They can't kill even one of these little Hobbits
who just received their swords only a few days ago. One
would think that if the Orcs were as bad as the corrupt
Man-Elf coalition says, they would be a lot better at
fighting. It lends credence to the farming hypothesis - that
they were trying to scrabble out a meager existence in the
land in Mordor.
Zinn: You can see too here that the way the Hobbits fight is
highly indicative of their culture: They jump on a wounded
foe and then stab him in the neck.
Chomsky: They're very morally ambiguous characters.
There's a nasty complacency about Hobbits. One would
think that they could, easily enough, find out about all of the
things that happen in the world - all of the consequences of
their pipe-weed-growing actions. And now Middle Earth's
power structure is revealing itself, and they're a part of it.
Still, they don't question it. Worse yet, they revel in it.
Zinn: My question is how hard would the mithril have to be
to able to stop the cave troll from piercing you with his
spear? And where does this stuff come from? How would
anybody find out about it? You'd think the creators would
keep it as secret as possible.
Chomsky: Possibly mithril once served the same function in
Middle Earth culture as pipe-weed does now. After all, you
have to keep creating new industries.
Zinn: Of course. The culture of consumption is founded
upon whatever the new thing happens to be. One day it's
mithril, the next day it's pipe-weed. Perhaps tomorrow it
will be kingsfoil?
Chomsky: Here again we have the Orcs running after the
Fellowship. The Orcs, apparently, are going to slaughter
them, and in my estimation they would be well within their
rights to do so. But do they? No, they do not. They stop.
Zinn: They stop.
Chomsky: And then they run away because the Balrog
comes out. Take note of the fact that the Orcs don't appear
to like the Balrog much themselves. They're scared of it.
Zinn: I'm not sure what role the Balrog really plays in this.
Chomsky: I think it just happened to be there, guarding its
own little part of the mine.
Zinn: And look at these Orcs! Supposedly so evil and
vicious, and yet they don't do anything. They even appear to
talk it over amongst themselves.
Chomsky: Look at it from their perspective: They've been
locked up in this cave. They're frightened, they know
they're not good fighters. They're just a bunch of farmers.
Zinn: As evidenced by their long, ungainly swords.
Chomsky: Perhaps they've been radicalized a bit. But I
doubt they are true evil-doers.
Zinn: Again, I'm not sure what role the Balrog plays.
Chomsky: I, too, am uncertain on that point.
Zinn: Here, very significantly, we have the Bridge of
Khazad-Dûm. You will notice that what is destroyed is a
bridge - another potential connector.
Chomsky: On a symbolic level, that is a very good point.
Zinn: All the borders in this film are constantly being
destroyed, or overrun, or eliminated, or sealed. It's all about
fear - fearing the other. Notice, too, that the Elf Legolas
jumps across the ruined bridge first.
Chomsky: They'll cross this bridge and the bridge will
collapse, and they'll never be able to communicate with the
Balrog again, or with the Orcs inside. In fact, they're sealing
off the Orcs from ever escaping. They're leaving the Orcs in
the cave with this big Balrog. Now, again, surely, among
these Moria Orcs were some Orc radicals - aggressive,
angry, militant radicals. We shouldn't understate that.
Zinn: Well, look how the Orcs grow up. What do you
expect?
Chomsky: I mean, what other options have they?
Zinn: I dare say that, were I an Orc, I might possibly be one
of those terrorist Orcs, shooting arrows at the Fellowship
myself.
Chomsky: Here comes the Balrog. Notice Gandalf's
unilateral action. "Quick, get away, I have to fight this thing
alone!"
Zinn: Once again you see a creature that's on fire being
demonized in this movie: the flaming eye, the flaming
Balrog. As though being on fire is this terrible affliction to
have.
Chomsky: As though they can help it if they're on fire.
Zinn: After Gandalf falls, you get another view of the
so-called terrorist Orcs. You know, the regrettable side of
the Orcs does occasionally come out. The violence. It
doesn't help their cause when these distinct, individual Orcs
take it upon themselves to lash out at the inequality of the
system. But notice that even these violent Orcs don't seem
happy. They're not pleased with themselves. It's a violence
borne of necessity.
Chomsky: Sure. They're trapped in a cycle of violence.
Zinn: And now we come to Galadriel's wood, Lothlorien.
The film - inexcusably, in my view - leaves out a lot of the
things that happen to Gimli in this sequence.
Chomsky: He's forced to wear a blindfold. He is not allowed
to see the Elves. This is the apartheid system the Fellowship
serves.
Zinn: And even here the Elves hold, you know, arrows to
his head. He's completely brutalized. But of course Gimli
falls in love with Galadriel, thus perpetuating the Dwarves'
self-hatred.
Chomsky: It's somewhat similar to the method the Elves
use to ensnare people like Aragorn - to affect their Elvish
self-esteem. They want to be worshipped. It seems as
though a peculiar kind of brainwashing occurs whenever
anyone is exposed to Elf culture.
Zinn: I mean, look at how the Elves greet people - with
arrows. Is that so different from the Orcs?
Chomsky: Right. And they're supposed to be
nature-worshippers. It's sort of sickening and very
bourgeois.
Zinn: And of course we should point out that Galadriel is
wearing a ring throughout this entire scene. She has a ring -
arguably the most powerful ring. Somehow she's trusted to
wield this power responsibly. This woman who reads
people's minds without asking them.
Chomsky: That's true. She's constantly invading other
people's thoughts. Though there is one thing you have to
say for the Elves. Women's rights. But of course, we learn
here that even if you cede women these rights they become
just as morally culpable as any man. And have you taken
proper note of Galadriel's farewell gesture, when the
Fellowship sets its boats down the Silverlode? It is some
sort of Sieg Heil gesture.
Zinn: It is vaguely reminiscent of the biomechanics of
National Socialism. You'll notice, too, how clearly the
Man-Elf coalition controls all the modes of transportation in
Middle Earth. We always see the Orcs running. But
Legolas, Gimli, and Aragorn - I mean, sometimes they are
riding horses. The Orcs have nothing like any of this. The
Orcs certainly don't canoe.
Chomsky: Well they don't have these wide, beautiful rivers
to canoe on. That's part of the deprivation of their natural
resources. And just as you say, here the Orcs are, running.
A bunch of farmers, holding their clumsy weapons.
Zinn: The white hand of Saruman on the heads of the
Uruk-hai. Of course, the hand in control is white. And good
lord, these giant statues on the Anduin River. The Sentinels
of Númenor. These huge, monolithic statues that have their
hands thrust forever up. I think I can intuit what these
sentinels are saying: "Stay away, Orcs."
Chomsky: "Keep out of our land."
Zinn: "Keep out of our land. Don't come in." It is little
wonder that the Orcs are so warlike and angry.
Chomsky: And of course the sentinels are holding swords.
More monolithic images of supposedly noble militarism.
Zinn: One suspects that Orc slaves probably build the
things. I imagine there's a lot of Orc labor that gets in
through Gondor and Rohan. They want to get out of
Mordor. There are simply not a lot of economic options for
them there.
Chomsky: Picture, for a moment, the average Orc's life.
Hunted, hated, sometimes murdered. I think Jared Diamond
would be an interesting person to write about the effects of
environment and geography on all this.
Zinn: On the Orcs?
Chomsky: On Orcish culture as a whole. Of course, one of
the interesting points in Diamond's work is that you have
hunter-gathering cultures, and you have farming cultures,
developed societies. And these developed societies, these
agricultural cultures, mobilize and create large armies, and
hunter-gathering cultures are not actually very effective at
mounting large armies.
Zinn: Right. Like the Orcs.
Chomsky: This simple bunch of farmers, hastily rallied
together against these well-armed, well-equipped Elves
and men.
Zinn: Here we see the Orcs facing Aragorn for the first
time. It's not very obvious what's happening here. The Orcs
appear rather skittish.
Chomsky: Well, some of these Orcs are charging. It is fairly
easy to imagine what they are feeling. No doubt they have
seen this ranger's work before. Aragorn has so many
names, it is all but certain that he has a few Orcish names as
well. Orc-killer, perhaps. Orc-slayer. Madman. Look at all
this casual slaughter.
Zinn: Clearly the Orcs have a hand in murdering Boromir,
but Aragorn's innocence is not established by a long shot. I
think he maneuvered Boromir into that position. To get him
out of the way. After all, Boromir had a very clear claim to
Aragorn's supposed kingship.
Chomsky: That is very possible.
Zinn: I have to ask, what does this story do for the
powerful? For one, it makes them feel very good about the
kind of things they've done to less powerful societies. The
way they exploit them and the way they invent these phony
pretexts to wage wars of aggression against less powerful
people. The powerful need to tell themselves these stories.
Chomsky: And yet, as in all stories of this type, hidden
within the story are the keys to unlocking the hidden modes
of power.
Zinn: The thing is, though, that even when the dominant
culture tells itself the story, the story cannot help but include
those telltale signifiers of power that surrender the true
nature of the story.
Chomsky: It is embedded, I would say, in the language of
the story itself. No matter how often the storytellers try to
obscure the truth, the truth will out. The truth will be
betrayed through the way the story gets told.
Zinn: Thankfully, the literature of oppression can never last
because the oppression is always so obvious. It's always
about the people who are suppressed, who keep getting
more and more aware of how they're suppressed. And
once they're aware of how suppressed they are, they can -
Chomsky: Right, they're able to -
Zinn: We've got to get our conspiracy straight.
Chomsky: Not necessarily. Think of Lee Harvey Oswald.
Zinn: A patsy. A CIA agent.
Chomsky: A cold-blooded, ruthless killer.
Zinn: Right.
Chomsky: He was a good shot. He was a bad shot.
Zinn: Right. Exactly.
Chomsky: But then, I don't really believe in conspiracy
theories about JFK.
Zinn: Neither do I.
Chomsky: So.
Zinn: Isn't that funny?