Dispelling a popular Dean/DU myth

... put out by many of the other candidates' supporters here (I, of course, won't name any handles).

This is just Day 1 of dispelling. I hope that fellow Dean supporters will chip in, in the coming days and weeks, to prove the fallacy of this popular 'meme.' We're certainly getting proof by the pounds everyday.


The DU myth I'm talking about is this: that Karl Rove and BushCo. actually WANT Dean to be the nominee because they see him as an easy candidate to beat, a wash, if you will. And that they're just pouring mounds of money into his campaign so he can beat all the others. (I never said this myth sounded reasonable did I?)


So for today's dispelling, I give you this. If they're so darned eager to get Dean nominated and are just sitting back and waiting to have him delivered on a platter to them, then why today is the RNC Chairman, Ed Gillespie, traveling to Vermont, of all places, where he'll give a speech at 7 p.m. EST in Essex Junction at the Champlain Valley Exposition, challenging Howard Dean to unseal almost five years of his administration's records? Gillespie will further challenge Dean on some policies, and defend his president, at St. Anselm's College in New Hampshire tomorrow, also at 7 p.m.



Please explain why the RNC CHAIRMAN is already challenging Dean, even COMING TO HIS HOME STATE, month(s) before even the Dem. primaries and caucuses to challenge him?

This doesn't sound like a candidate they're taking with a grain of salt.

Does it to you?

"We want Dean"---Karl Rove last summer---that's when Dean was an asterik in the polls.

Now, Dean's the frontrunner and they're taking him seriously, ha.

what if they know Dean is the candidate and have started the campaign? Dean has been busting bush for months. what if they've decide to bust back on who they perceive as the dem candidate.

sorry...but this 'de-mything' doesn't hold water.

i don't get it..we aren't waiting to wail on bush. i've been expecting them to wail back for weeks. it would make absolutly no sense for them to stand calmly by and not respond.

btw....this applies to whether dean is roves' candidate of choice or not. and imho, he might be rove's choice because he is the weakest of the field on security which is going to be a chief pubbie issue.

the economy is turning so the pubbies will own that issue. the other biggee is security so why wouldn't they want to go up against the candidate most vulnerable on that issue? makes 'rovian' sense to me.

that Rove and company actually don't know what to make of Dean. They may think he would be the easiest to beat but they just aren't sure. It is the unknown quality of the Dean campaign that baffles them imo. They know the other leading candidates are just your regular washington variety that they can mount the traditional GOP campaign against, but Dean with his fund raising prowess, internet savvy, dedicated supporters willing to beat the pavement for him, and popularity with the rank and file as well as the candidates agressive stump style I think actually puzzles Rove as to what kind of campaign they will ultimately wage against Dean and just how strong Dean really is.

I think Rove would rather take the known vs. the unknown any day.

demand respect. The last several election cycles the dems were throwing up moderates. I think it came as a surprise to even some of the democrats that resonance would be found in polarity.

attempt at finding out how Dean will respond and how he will ultimately handle his own campaign in the general election.

than they thought. I still think that they'd much rather have Dean than Clark, however.

Here's what I would do if I was Rove (it's all packaging):

Label Dean a draft-dodging abortionist flake.

There you have it. Four more years of Bushler.

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Regarding Dean: The guy doesn't have much of a track record of being a Democrat, does he? Otherwise he wouldn't have such a hard time answering a simple question. On Hardball, a student asked what could be done to improve public education. Dean said first thing is to vote for him. He went on to say his campaign was all about empowering people. Dean said zip about improving public education. That illustrates how little the guy really knows about education, let alone anything about government and its role in improving the life of all Americans.

Regarding Rove: The guy loves Dean because Dean makes the Little Turd from Crawford seem almost normal. You may not know what Rove's mentor, the late Lee Atwater, did to Michael Dukakis on behalf of Poppy. Atwater labeled Dukakis a psychiatric patient because Dukakis visited a counselor for a couple of sessions to treat depression after his brother was killed by a hit and run driver in Boston. Even Pruneface Reagan got in the act, stating he would "never pick on a mental invalid." End result: Bush the Iran-Contra criminal wins.

Just to show you how I feel about the GOP: FUCK YOU, BUSH!

He hates No Child Left Behind.

This act will close every public school within ten years, and is already having a disastrous effect on the states' education of their citizens. Basically, if they want federal funds (and they need that money), they have to test all of the students, even the special ed kids. If 100% of the kids (including the special ed kids) can't pass a test that shows they can reason at their grade level, the school is put in probation. Lesson plans are redesigned to teach only the math and English required to pass the test. If the school continues to fail the 100% goal, the feds step in, fire all the teachers and hire all new teachers, because of course it must be the teachers' fault. The end result is the destruction of the public school system in the US.

So, yeah, Dean is paying attention to education policy.

not education as a whole. So, Dean's answer is right on.

Dean already has a bunch of student volunteers participating, and right now classes on organizing are being done by several teams of Dean's paid staffers around the country. What better way to learn about the process than work within it?

Dean neither performed abortions or dodged the draft.

More likely they will use civil unions and his stance on the war against him.

You think Dean isn't prepared for this?

That's the PUBLIC stance that would come out of Bush's missing lips.

The supporters and dirty tricksters would use the ones I described, to great effect, unfortunately.

I'm sure Dean is prepared. Whether the great American middle is receptive is another matter.

The battle for the electorate's mindspace is joined.

BTW: Thans for the kind response. You must be a Democrat.

No doubt this will be an ugly, ugly election.

If it's Dean, they are going to paint him all kinds of liberal and unprepared (which is a joke, considering *'s resume).

If it's Clark, the attacks will be about his being fired, having no governing experience, and attacks from within in the military.

If it's Kerry, they will dredge out his stellar liberal voting record and paint him as just another rich northeastern liberal.

And so it goes. It will be a fight. But it's one worth fighting.

Personally I can't wait for July so we can all get back on the same page and fight for the same goal.

Won't work. Dean can point to AWOL and where he was in 1972. Dean was being honest about his deferment. He wasn't even hiding anything from Matthews last night.

http://deandefense.org/archives/000706.html

Hawkeye-X

With all DU respect, Hawkeye-X: Smirk will say he served, but Dean showed up with a note from his doctor. The backgrounds will show lots of flags and all the smiling conscripts in combat dress. The vast middle, which watches TV for most of its information, will believe their eyes, I fear.

BTW: Should he be our nominee, I'll shut up about Ho-Ho. Until then, we can agree to disagree.

I don't think Dean can use the alleged AWOL issue against Bush. It will only work with voters who are against Bush already. 9/11 and subsequent events have innoculated Bush on this issue among the broader electorate, I believe. In Bush's case, it isn't about what he did THEN it will be about what he is doing NOW.

Can't use it to fend of attacks on his vietnam deferment? Please tell me you are not in a posistion to advise any candidates.

has already started being chipped at. Noone ever expected differently, did they? Teflon for Dems comes with an expiration date.

Rejoice that Rove thinks Dean will be the nominee now. Isn't that what you wanted?

So according to BLM (who this post of course wasn't targeted at) :hi: BushCo. already KNOWS with certainty that "their man" Dean is gonna win. And furthermore, that while they "know" he's gonna be a slam dunk in the election a YEAR from now, a veritable walk in the park, they're already going out of their way (to HIS home state) to CHALLENGE him before the Democratic caucuses and primaries, an attempt that they also hope will make him seem weaker now, and thus against the other candidates?

Do I understand you BLM? Is this what you're saying?

why should they wait? why would they let the leader go without attack?

certainly not. Don't you usually address people you're talking to by name?


And thanks for saying you concur with the reasoning in the post #12. That answers tons for me :hi:

on my monitor. when i came back to the thread i realized my error and edited.

And will continue to work against Dean's nomination for the good of the party and for the better candidates to beat Bush.

There is a tradeoff for the Repubs. If the wail on Dean too soon then they risk his losing the nomination--bad. If they wait too long then Dean gets to identify himself with the electorate--also bad. The RNC is preparing the ground with some early assaults on key targets that might give them some early advantages. In this case highlighting Dean's refusal to release his records is helpful because getting Dean to release his records is going to be a theme. Ultimately, Dean is going to be forced to release his records so if he does it sooner rather than later that is better for RNC oppo researchers. If he doesn't release his records then the RNC is making this a continuing story that Dean will have to deal with. In one way, going after Dean in a mild way like this actually helps Dean in the primary because it keeps his name in the press rather than other candidates who might present a greater danger to Bush. Still, the RNC is going to hold back until they are sure Dean is the nominee and then the dam will burst.

.

...when Chimp does.

Check mate.

much better than Bush...

I'm a Clark supporter but I've never bought into the idea that Bush/Cheney 04 somehow wants to run against Howard Dean. I don't think they WANT to run against anyone...but given that this is America, they will do so.

Each candidate poses a particular set of problems for Bush/Cheney but regardless of who wins the nomination, the Democratic nominee will be tarred with the same general brush: Democrats can't defend us (code for you'll be bombed and indiscriminantly killed more), Democrats will further erode our "American values" (code for expanding civic unions and gay marriage, protecting a woman's right to choose), and Democrats will further bloat government (code for ignore how much we're spending and look at how much we're outsourcing).

It doesn't matter if you're talking about Clark, Dean, Kerry, Gep, Kucinich, Lieberman, Braun, Sharpton, or Edwards: The tactics will be the same; the only thing different will be the excuses they use to inoculate themselves from criticism ("we have to spend more, we're at war, national security is expensive").

"Davis, who spent $10 million attacking the moderate Riordan in the primary,
wasted no time in targeting Simon, the candidate who Democrats think they
have the best chance of defeating in a state where Democrats outnumber
Republicans."

Smart Politicos try and arrange for their opponent to be the weakest link.

It worked for Davis, who won, and then had the Media pretty much hand Schwartzenegger 24/7 wall to wall favorable coverage before the Recall.

it would be natural for rove to root (or worse) for the candidate they feel is most vunerable. wouldn't you?

Things have changed a lot since last January. What looked like a flash in the pan, Perot type, popular uprising has grown legs, raised money and now sits on top of the Democrat pile like a six-hundred pound gorilla. The more "legit" political types have stumbled and bumbled throught the year with one dropping out, one being vilified for good cause(yeah, Joe, I'm talking about you) and the rightful front runner seeming unable to put one foot in front of the other without stumbling. WOrse, the disarray has led my guy to jump into the race, skewing things even more.

Maybe the GOP is coming to think that they'd better get started now.

They may still think Dean will be the most vulnerable, and they may still want him to get the nomination, but I think everybody has finally wakened up to the fact that this year the common wisdom isn't going to fly.

Sauron's armies are going to have to come out from behind their walls and fight in the open.

I can't say with any certainty whether or not Rove wants Dean or Clark or Kerry or... And neither can anyone else here, though many many have their opinions on the subject. I think it is pointless to worry about who your opponent would like to face. They have no special powers of prediction, just as we here do not know how the election will play out. We can all only guess.

Rove is not likely to be honest in anything he says about any of our candidates. Is he using reverse psych? Who really knows? But more importantly, who really cares? And just be heartened by the fact that many Dems wanted to run against Reagan in 1980 rather than Bush Sr. And look at where that got us.

We can't worry about them. All that we can do is nominate one of our great candidates, and then work our tails off to make sure that s/he wins next year.

If you're the "last liberal in Texas", how do you explain the presence of the Lonestar Liberal who just posted above you? :)

Especially since there is also a Last Texas Dem here, too! I think the only answer is that our monikers give you a good idea of what it *feels* like to be a liberal in Texas. :)

A friend of mine in Texas said she was afraid to petition door-to-door! :scared:

Unfortunately...yep!

The Republicans are not used to anyone questioning them or organizing against them down here. They forget many of them were centrist Democrats not that many years ago.

Howdy lastliberalintexas! :hi:

remember, the one rove attended and yelled out after Dean had passed "that's the one. that's the guy we want to run against"
not and esact quote.

aside from the fact that it was a really weird thing to do, does anyone remember the date? iirc, Dean wasn't the front runner then
so it's not likely to be reverse psyche, unless they really feared Kerry who was the likely frontrunner at that point.

geeeezus...we'll drive ourselves nutz with this crap.

remember the 'poison scene' from the princess bride?

a couple of months ago. Michigan's Republican AG was meeting with a bunch of supporters on Mackinac Island and using Dean to scare 'em into action. Said stuff like this:

"Imagine this 'Michigan's 17 electoral votes go to Howard Dean' or 'President Dean.' Let this drive you knock on one more door, donate one more dollar and do all you can for the Republican cause."

I slapped my thigh when I read that! Using "Dean" to scare the R&F Rs! hahahahaha!!!! Delicious.

Julie

maybe they wouldn't mind him winning Michigan so much?

a long face, an easy-to-make-fun-of "French look," a pathetic, opportunistic and pro-bush war vote, and a campaign that's sinking faster than the titanic? Is that kinda what you mean?

He looks like Lurch from the Addams Family.

Lurch?: YMTC

I feel bad for laughing, but c'mon, BushCo. would have a FIELD DAY with Kerry! And the redneck Americans talking about how "French" he looks and then the whole Herman Monster thing. It'd just be so so ugly.

Do I agree with them? Of course not. I have much respect for Kerry, the Senator (with the exception of his war vote) but let's face reality, he would get HAMMERED by BushCo. and redneck America. Just HAMMERED!

and has the bearings of a naval commander and an educated, honorable man.

Precious.

It aint all about "looks" anymore. It's about what they will do, and how they will fix what was so savagely broken by the last "Looks presidential" crowd.

...in fact, Kerry has a nice smile. :)

And I'm still wondering what a "French look" is?

IMO, no personal appearance quips or attacks towards ANY Dem candidate's families.should be tolerated at this board

object of the "anger" scorn.

It's only mean when it happens to Kerry.

And I don't make personal attacks against any candidate, even Dean.

Gotcha.

You spun that into an attack on me personally. How special.

Or are you using the same xray glasses that show us what Howard Dean is thinking and what he means when he talks?

and for no plausible reason.

you've got there. No wonder you're gonna vote for the Munchkin

:eyes:

Hmmm. They made no mention of Kerry in the article. Not using him to scare the masses. Sorry.

I doubt they'd like him either though. If that's any consolation.

Julie

is that they would attack him WAY more than Clinton. The thugs would be so angry they might actually call for marshall law or civil war.

Have the Michiganites look at * and if they are R, and they like Dean, they can throw $$ his way, instead of *.

Hawkeye-X

I've signed a few of them up for my local Dem board. Recruited them to the party at a Dean meet-up. Seems the Rs whining about him and being afraid of him has gotten him some attention from those who can still think. ;-)

Julie

they know as well as anyone that any major party candidate comes in with an automatic 39 percent of the vote.

But that doesn't mean that they still know that he would be a much easier candidate to defeat than one who didn't want to raise middle class taxes, among his other weaknesses.

His visit :

1: Riles up the Deanies, which they need to do to ensure Dean's nominatin(similar to the leaked Rove memo saying Jeb was in trouble was deliberate to rile up the Florida GOP)

2: begins the campaign against who they are anticipating(still happily that he and not someone else will be the nominee

You know as well as I do that Ed is just doing this to maintain the illusion that they don't want to face Dean. It can't be obvious, after all.

Silly me :freak:

...I don't give two SHITS what Karl Rove wants.

I choose my candidate based on what I WANT, and the hacks that represent the opposition in November do NOT get to dictate what I am looking for.

If we are letting rednecks choose our guy I am out of here.

The claim that the Republicans, with all of their money-lust, would funnel significant amounts of money into Dean's campaign is silly.

Secondly, the Republicans are in attack mode with Dean, and the media has been for sometime now. That Dean has been preselected by some great conspiracy, is also a lame idea.

I will *not* dispute, however, that many Republicans see Dean as easy pick'ns. They believe they can paint him as a raving liberal maniac and marginalize him in most states. I think Dean has many strengths as a campaigner and do not know what the GOP leadership thinks, though it is indisputable that many of the Republican rank'n'file believe beating Dean will be a sinch.

If many Republicans and BushCo. think it'll be such a "sinch" as you claim, then WHY is the RNC Chair challenging Dean in his homestate a YEAR before the election? And no other candidate?

I mean, because certainly, if I were going against a candidate that I knew would be a "sinch" do you think I would be going out of my way a YEAR before the election, even before he's NOMINATED as the opposing candidate, to challenge him...moreso in his HOME STATE?

The GOP could be trying to rile Dean supporters up, like a previous poster said. They could also be doing a stunt like Dean did with the ads in Texas. Or maybe they want to make certain Dean gets some bad press ASAP.

I simply don't know. But I wouldn't make voting judgments based on what the GOP believes in anycase.

"The GOP could be trying to rile Dean supporters up"

Now THAT is a stretch! :freak:

if you are in a fight and someone is swinging on you, evenutally you decide to swing back. and why not in his home state since the issue he is using is the hiding of that state's records. where would you have him make that arguement?

come-on.....this isn't rocket science.

republicans are sending him money, because they see it as being worth more now than for Bush later.

Conspiracies aren't necessary. They know who they want nominated. Because the right/GOP is a very uniform, organized structure, at least compared the dem party, which is schizophrenic in comparison

but the idea that they are somehow contributing in a major way to his campaign is completely without any basis in fact.

Dean's average donation is less than $100. Are you suggesting that hundreds or even thousands of Americans are giving small donations to Dean? Any evidence?

I still think it was seed money, momentum building in the beginning - in fact I read direct testimonies.

Read my post below...I think they wanted to prop someone other than Kerry or Gep, and inadvertently gotten the Dean Phenomenon. Goes in the "Be careful what you wish for" category.

someone posted it here and like a dolt, i went over and read it <sigh>

they were hashing out when to give to Dean. this was month's ago and they were arguing whether to give him money then or wait until the end of the year.

1. The GOP agrees that Dean is almost certainly the Democrat frontrunner and sees no reason to keep the kid gloves on. They have been getting blasted from left and right for weeks, and have to make some sort of response. Choosing Gillespie as the spokesmodel for this phase of their campaign prevents Bush from having to spend one cent of his campaign gelt.

2. Singling Dean out for attack will actually help confirm him as the Democrat front runner with large numbers of Democrats. Clearly, if Dean wasn't "the man" the GOP would dismiss him as thoroughly as they have the rest. If the Bush League takes him seriously, then he must be a serious threat.

Nothing Gillespie does suggests they would rather face Kerry or Gephardt (or Clark) in November. Focusing on Dean so openly could easily be all the Doctor needs to win over the doubters among the Dem ranks, putting the final touches on the "Rove wants Dean" paradigm. (I know I probably misused paradigm there, but I just love the way it reads. Plus, I hate meme.)

If the Repugs wanted an easy to beat candidate, why not push Sharpton, CMB or DK?

No offense to their supporters, but these three would be easier to beat than Dean.

Why not try to get them elected?

I guess this meme is dead...

Back when Dean was a blip in the polls but obviously had some grassroots going for him, the Repubs may have pegged him as their favorite/easiest to beat. An anti-war ultra-liberal? A dream come true! After all, popular opinion back then was just starting to shift against the war, but Bush was still confident that we would win the hearts and minds and be the Great Liberators. (Remember when Rummy was suggesting that we were just getting "our hair mussed" in Iraq?)

Kerry was the presumed frontrunner at the time, and I imagine their long time hatred of John Kerry -- the whole "regime change" comment aside, he's been a thorn in their side for years -- would motivate them to prop someone else up.

I don't think they counted on Dean's huge groundswell, his support from inside and outside of the party, from new voters, young voters, old voters, liberal and moderate voters, fiscal conservatives, independents, minorities, southerners, even some Repubs who have tired of Bush.

I think their laughter has turned quite nervous when it comes to Howard Dean.

Not the first time that these jokers have miscalculated.

everyone knew from the gitgo that they didn't have a chance.

http://Blog.forclark.com/story/2003/11/22/91612/116 and the sequel here:
http://Blog.forclark.com/story/2003/11/23/93010/267

In short, when the "reselect numbers dived under 38%, Bushco blinked and decided that "pick your opponent game" gets a bit risky. A new memo was issued. The thrird magic bullet was shot by Newsweek with the Isicoff article.
I am guessing they'll save the tax raising pur la bonne bouche.

They just sent out this HILARIOUS press release!

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

December 2, 2003

RNC Chair Travels To Vermont To Attack Dean

BURLINGTON--In another sign of just how unconcerned the Republican National Committee (RNC) is of Democratic presidential candidate Governor Howard Dean, M.D., the RNC's chair, Ed Gillespie, will travel to Vermont today to preemptively attack a candidate for the Democratic presidential nomination.

In the keynote speech at the Vermont GOP's 45th Annual Fall Dinner, Gillespie will underscore how the RNC is not at all afraid to put its special interest-funded President up against the greatest grassroots campaign that presidential politics has ever seen.

While in Vermont, Gillespie is expected to study how Governor Dean managed to balance 11 budgets in a row while providing health care to nearly every child and preserving the environment—accomplishments President Bush has been unable to achieve as president or governor.

"We're pleased that Ed is coming to Vermont to learn about Governor Dean’s record of balancing budgets and providing quality health care," Campaign Manager Joe Trippi said. "Ed's political trip to Vermont to attack Governor Dean in his home state makes it abundantly clear that the Bush campaign is not at all concerned by the governor's message of taking our country back."

Details of tonight's speech are as follows:

WHO: RNC Chair Ed Gillespie

WHAT: Attacking Dean

WHERE: Champlain Valley Exposition

Blue Ribbon Pavilion

Essex Junction, Vermont

WHEN: Tuesday, December 2, 2003

Cocktails at 6 p.m.

Speeches/Dinner at 7 p.m.

-- 30 --



---

they did the story about the "secret papers in a secret warehouse" over an hour ago.

and demand that Bush also release his presidential records!

I have never bought for one second that Rove wants Dean. I also do not buy into the bushit that Rove is some fricking genius. IMHO Rove like the media does not quite know what to make of Dean and his superb grassroots movement. Rove and the repugs are using pathetic reverse psychology to try and convince us otherwise.

I think Dean is the candidate the RNC wants to run against, but this is mostly because of my opinions about Dean. I see his support as being extremely insecure and narrow, and I think it's based on a false idea of who Dean is.

And yes, I realize that the very large number of supporters contradicts this. So I very well could be wrong, but I still think it. I think that his success in the primary isn't going to carry over into the general election. I hope I'm wrong, because Dean has a very good chance at winning the nomination, and if that happens I will be working and praying for him to beat Bush.

http://www.rnc.org/Newsroom/RNCResearch/research120103.htm

They must not have gotten Rove's memo.

:crazy:

Dean gets a lot of oxygen from the idea that he's the one who takes on Bush. If Bush starts acting like the conversation is between the two of them, it will hurt the other Democrats running.

I could be wrong. It's just a theory.

circumstantial evidence, there's a ton of direct evidence that contradicts your claim, no? What about the words coming out of Rove's mouth? What about Limbaugh trying to give him advice? What about the donation from the Haliburton board member? What about the media love fest?

release? I can't find anything on the RNC site.

They are right.

I mean the NERVE.

How DARE he play this presidential race game? He should stay quiet so the RIGHT candidate, Clark, can come forward.....Darn that Dean!

It looks like it has two-fold affect. One, it could be used by the pukles to discourage people to vote for Dean if he gets the nod in July. Two, it is also probably bait for the OTHER candidates to start up a feeding frenzy yet again.

Just to mention it Closer, ONE piece of evidence doesn't dispel ANYTHING. This could in fact be used by the Bushies if Dean gets the nomination against Dean VERY easily. Did you ever consider that?

Dean is going to get the nomination, and they are very worried.
I am already seing conservatives attacking Dean here in Oregon.

I don't plan to be a shirking violet in this race!

KKKarl Rove and his kind were (may still be) pumping Dean. They started building Dean up in the summer. They were also logging on to Dean's website and giving $$$.

Republicans are already voting with their wallets for Howard Dean, logging on to Dean's official Web Site and donating various sums of cash to the left wing candidate's primary campaign. They want Dean to win the Democrat primary. The real question now emerges. Will rank and file Republicans cross over and vote in the Democrat Primary elections to help get Dean the nomination? More at link below:

http://www.washingtondispatch.com/article_6309.shtml

Now they are saying that they are scared of Dean. He's now considered a threat to Bush.

Check this...

All the top-tier Democratic challengers can beat Bush, but Dean poses the biggest threat. Republicans once hoped Dean would get the nomination to run against Bush. No longer. As Dean continues to gain support and break fund-raising records by drawing on 100,000s of supporters, the Bush brain-trust (Karl Rove) and the pro-Bush media have changed their minds. More at link below:

http://www.apj.us/20031114Hersh.html

I wish the ReThuglicans would QUIT MESSING IN OUR PRIMARY ELECTIONS. So, now they are trying to flip the script because we caught on. Make it sound like they are afraid of Dean so that will pump up support.

I guess the lesson from this story is that we should just play our game and forget about the BS.

You'll love this! The pix of KKKarl @ Deans parade in July/03 http://www.sf.indymedia.org/news/2003/07/1624957.php

I know who the real threat to Bush is. It is Wesley Clark. Why else would they have him pulled from CNN. Why else would they put a media blackout on Clark's campaign? Why else would they be making sure that the media play all Dean all the time?

Republicans have DONATED to the Clark campaign also, since he has some of their support.