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Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 03:58 PM
Original message
'Stop Dean' founder a Clark Activist
Edited on Tue Dec-16-03 03:59 PM by Patriot_Spear
Marcus Mrowka....Moderator of Stop Dean 2004 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/stopdean2004/join


Listed and contributing member of the GWU Students for Clark
http://www.gwforclark.com/downloads.html

You guys make up your own mind- but this seems a little sleazy to me.

For the record, I like Clark and I'm sure he doesn't approve of this.
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
1. He must have supported Dean EARLY and then switched to Clark
Edited on Tue Dec-16-03 04:01 PM by NewYorkerfromMass
it seems pretty simple. The very low Dean ID # seems to support that theory.
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jmaier Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. He's being an
idiotic kid regardless of who he supports, once supported, etc. This is not the sort of behavior exemplified by the Clark Campaign.
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SahaleArm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Sure thing n/t
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slinkerwink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. what was the low dean ID number?
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. 1287 sounds pretty low (and early) to me.
Edited on Tue Dec-16-03 04:07 PM by NewYorkerfromMass
and that's out of 81327 total ... http://commons.deanforamerica.com/seeUser.php?memberID=1287
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slinkerwink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
2. yep, it's sleazy of that Clark supporter
what's his DU handle?
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AWD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:03 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Take your pick
There's so many to choose from!
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Rowdyboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Thanks so kindly....
I'll remember the next time I defend your candidate from irrational, non-productive bashing.
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AWD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #10
16. And who would my candidate be?
Are you aware that I have not thrown full weight behind ANY candidate at this time?

...keep in mind, I said NOTHING about "all Clark supporters", just that there are so many of them here trying to disrupt. If you are not among those, then do not be insulted, for I was not speaking of you.
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Rowdyboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #16
49. Your candidate, I assume, would be one of the
other eight Democrats. I make it a practice not to attack any of the Democrats running-including Lieberman, unless they have SERIOUSLY pissed me off.
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SahaleArm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #2
20. He's a Dean double agent sent in by #2 - Joe Trippi ;)
Edited on Tue Dec-16-03 04:17 PM by SahaleArm
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Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #20
26. LOL... pretty funny.
Bad juju- we should be working together.
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5thGenDemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:07 PM
Response to Original message
8. I surely didn't expect a "Stop Dean" founder would be a Bush activist
And there's nothing sleazy about a supporter of one candidate doing what he can within legal parameters to stop an opposing candidate.
John
That's politics.
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Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Sorry, I strongly disagree...
Promoting your candidate is one thing, trying to create an 'anti' Dem group is another.

I like all of our candidates for different reasons (except for Lieberman), I would NEVER even consider what this guy is doing.

it's just plain wrong to do the work of the republicans for them.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. You Mean The Way Dean Attacked & Slandered The Other Candidates?
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Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. I'm not interested in your flame war...
This is wrong and any reasonable person would see it that way.

Later.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 07:12 PM
Response to Reply #19
46. At This Point I Am Sick & Tired Of Hearing About
how poor little Howard is getting picked on.

I am sick and tired of being told I must denounce this or denounce that.

SOME partisans employ low handed tactics... but it's not the first time nor will it be the last.

Dean has a very poor record when it comes to attacking Democrats.

He's done it while Governor and has been doing it consistently in this Presedential Campaign.

He who campaigns by attacking gets hit by attacks and garners not very much sympathy.
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edzontar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #15
34. As a Clark supporter..you should be the first to denounce this...
It made your candidate and his supporters look bad.

And serious damage was done to the community on this site.

It is one thing to promote the case for your candidate---who has a lot going for him, in my opinion.

I like him.

It is another thing to supprt or apologize for Nixonois dirty trick tactics like Mr. Marcus.'

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Code_Name_D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #15
45. As I have said, Clarks greatist liability
are his own supporters.

This is intresting news. Hardly suprising however. But I stand vindicated none the less.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 07:13 PM
Response to Reply #45
47. Vindicated? You've Exemplified "Guilt By Association" Tactics
or maybe that is what you are alluding to?

How did you get of ignore anyway...
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edzontar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #47
50. Marcus has done more harm than good to your candidate...
Through his dishonest and disruptive tactics.

I can't understand why you are defending him.
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Code_Name_D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #47
66. I have never made that argument.
Of course, you must be refering to a an argument that I must have made in your dreams. For I have never acused Clark of guilt by asosation. His disoner and deceptions are entierly of his own making. And as I have repeatly discoverd disohnor coming from Clark himself, I am not suprised to see this very trate held by his supporters.

Time for you to put me back on ignore, so I will not have to corect your misrepresntation of my arguments in the fucher.
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HuckleB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. You might not think so, but I find it sleazy.
To start up an organization outside the campaign focused upon one opponent? Yeah, I find tha sleazy, especially with his history of mingling with the Dean campaign.
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Rose Siding Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. If it's ok, why not declare the alternative choice?
When the site info was posted yesterday, it was very specific about NOT representing anyone.
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Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #14
22. Look, it's simple- if your support you candidate, then try to win people
But smearing another Dem in order to raise your candidate is the wrong way to go.

It just turns me off Clark and strengthens my support of Dean.
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kclown Donating Member (459 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:07 PM
Response to Original message
9. There's a good chance that Dean & Clark will have to run together 
so I think they and their supporters ought to keep it as
friendly as possible.
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Larkspur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:28 PM
Original message
I hope not
I don't want Clark anywhere near Dean. Don't trust him.
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edzontar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
35. Oh please.
Dean-Clark makes sense.

Despite the inane divisiveness I see all over these threads.
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LuminousX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 08:46 AM
Response to Original message
51. I agree, Keep Clark far away from the Oval Office
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drfemoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
12. we are going to be so well informed
on the anti dean movement. :eyes:
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Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. Let's hope we can go after 'Progressive Values' next...
If I find out who those folks are, there's going to be some very hard feelings...
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demnan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
18. There are fools supporting all the campaigns
so far . . .
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
21. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. You obviously didn't read my post.
Edited on Tue Dec-16-03 04:23 PM by Patriot_Spear
I said I like Clark and I'm sure he'd disapprove. You need to tone down your fervor, clearly you're having problem with the new civility clause.
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damnraddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
23. It looks like a Repug dirty-tricks campaign.
And all too many Dems are ripe for falling for it.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Nah, Marcus is not a Rethug that's for sure...
he's been well checked out.
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edzontar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #24
32. But he acts like one--this is right out of the Nixon playbook.
Print up phoney stuff and get it distributed to disrupt a campaign--that is what the Nixonoid dirty tricksters were all about.

Whatever his motives, this Marcus is following in those inglorious footsteps.

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Cocoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #23
33. like a lot of things in this pirmary
Some of the "controversies" are so freaking stupid that I can hardly believe people are paying attention to them, let alone promoting them.

Who cares about a stupid Yahoo group?

Use your common sense, people!!!!
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HFishbine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
27. Brigar Computer Services/Brigar Mailing Services
Ring a bell, anybody?
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Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #27
31. No, clue me in. n/t
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Tinoire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 07:40 PM
Response to Reply #27
48. Clue us in please!
Printing & Promotional Materials.(Directory)
Campaigns & Elections,

BRIGAR COMPUTER SERVICES

25 Sand Creek Rd.

Albany, NY 12205

518-438-7817

FAX 518-438-0394

Maysel McGown http://www.findarticles.com/cf_dls/m2519/1_22/72891236/p2/article.jhtml?term=


People in politics and campaign trends, management and strategies ...

also direct mailing

but sorry :( not ringing much of a bell yet except that this isn't 2 kids having fun.

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HFishbine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #48
61. Seriously
I was looking for some help. Brigar Computer and Mailing Services, as you note is involved in "People in politics and campaign trends, management and strategies ..."

They have the same address as LJ Fulfilment, the people behind deanmcgovern.com. Just wondering who Brigar is working for.
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incapsulated Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:24 PM
Response to Original message
28. So it's some overzealous college kid
Edited on Tue Dec-16-03 04:25 PM by incapsulated
I doubt his little "campaign" will amount to anything other than a lot of Dean supporters joining his yahoo group to flame him. ;)
Forgetabowtit.
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
29. I thought....
... that was pretty obvious. Clark avatar and all.

Count me among those who don't think Clark would approve at all.
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edzontar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
30. The mole is revealed
And no matter who you support, you should be against this disruptor and divider.

Idiots like this are trying to divide our party and our board--for laughs, mischief, or short-term political gain, it doesn't rally matter.

As someome who has liked both Dean AND Clark, I would like to invite all of you bashers and disruptors to go and take a hike and leave the rest of us in PEACE!!!!!

Victory in 04 will not be achieved by tactics like this.

But maybe that is your true goal, after all.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #30
36. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Dookus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. as usual....
Skinner is absolutely right. It's amusing how upset people get over the goings on here. They really think a few thousand people chatting on this board will divide the entire party and bring down ruination on the country. It is to laugh.
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edzontar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #36
43. I disagree with both you and Skinner on this...
Yes there wil be charges and mudslinging.

But Marcus' "Stop Dean Movement" was and is an example of a dishonest, dirty-trick hoax.

He claimed to be trying to unite all the other candidates' supporters, and was exposed as a misguided Clark organizer.

This may be politics as usual, but it is also politics as practiced by Nixon.

And if you don't think this was disruptive, you must be visiting a different board.

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HuckleB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
38. Someone is Stopping the Stopper.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/stopmarcus2004/

;)
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Skwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
39. Just because someone donates to a campaign
doesn't mean any action he takes thereafter is at the direction of the campaign.
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ibegurpard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:17 PM
Response to Original message
40. Doesn't surprise me
After seeing the behavior of SOME of the Clark supporters on this board.
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MIMStigator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
41. Who cares. Dean starting to look like a whiny wimp
Dean is acting too delicate about hardball politics.
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HuckleB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #41
42. Yeah, sure, you betcha.
It's all about stoppage from here on out!
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #42
55. It's All About Howard Dean's Intestinal Blockage???
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LuminousX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 08:46 AM
Response to Reply #41
52. LOL
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Scott Lee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #41
54. Don't you mean FRONTRUNNER whiny wimp?
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Capn Sunshine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #41
57. I'll be sure and pass that on to Gov. Dean
After all a poster with your depth and experience of so many presidential runs always has some valuable advice.
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John_H Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-16-03 05:50 PM
Response to Original message
44. What's the big deal about his "low dean number?" I know lots of people
who have reached the conclusion that Dean blew his general election chances by bullshitting his record to win the nomination.

Dean supporters are going to have to realize that a lot of people realize the general election is going to be decided by democratic party voters.
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edzontar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #44
53. Kicking....
Edited on Wed Dec-17-03 04:08 PM by edzontar
Clark seems to have taken over the board today.

I suspect that many Dean supporters are taking a vacation after the events of Monday-Tuesday.

Maybe some of his gushing fans will take a minute to criticize their colleague's dirty tricks campaign.

Probably not, though.
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Tom Rinaldo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #53
59. It will get very pathetic
If we are all forced to take the additional time needed to attack and defend every action taken by some of the many thousands of supporters of each candidate, rather than debating the candidates themselves.

These individual supporters, or small groups of supporters, are not the ones actually running for President, and they are not the legal dependents of those who are either, hence not legally subject to their control. For the record, Marcus would NOT get my vote. I would support DEAN over MARCUS. I think Dean is much more qualified.
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edzontar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #59
64. Well, I would not expect a defense or apology for EVERYTHING...
But Marcus is bad, and what he did was dishonest, i think we can agree on that.

BTW, much of the comemntary today on Clark;s press conference seemed to be about how HANDSOME he is and how DREAMY is eyes are and stuff.

Pretty icky.

I thought I was reading some copy from Tiger Beat magazine.
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kerry-is-my-prez Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
56. I'm getting sick and tired of the McCarthyism of a few Dean supporters
I say a few because most are not like that (I hope anyways). Very unseemly. I used to be a Dean supporter (he was my #2) but I'm getting sick and tired of a few people who constantly "whine" about how their poor candidate is getting attacked.

ALL of the candidates get attacked. Kerry and Clark even more than Dean.
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Patriot_Spear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #56
60. So you think it's okay to use OBL in ads against your own party?
Edited on Wed Dec-17-03 04:18 PM by Patriot_Spear
I disagree. I find this particular ad reprehensible and cowardly.

The fact that they tried to conceal who financed it says it all.

Shame on you Dick Gephardt. And shame on those who use these kind of tactics.
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eileen_d Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
58. So when will you be coming to arrest me?
I have a couple of appointments this afternoon but I could cancel one if necessary.

Incidentally, I don't approve of "Stop Dean 2004" but I want to be prepared when you come for me.
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Northwind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
62. What a shock!
The followers of the "former" Republican acting like...welll...Republicans.
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ArkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #62
63. Bingo
.
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TexasPatriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-17-03 05:01 PM
Response to Original message
65. how many times do we have to cover this
i'll just repeat my previous post:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=929808#930150
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