Marilyn Manson-- Love Him or Hate Him?

I'm still waiting on my star, so I can't do an official poll. I'm curious to find out from people who do hate Manson just what shaped their opinion of him. Did you listen to him and just say UGH, this guy sucks? Or did you decide based on the image he projects?

Just hungover and bored on a Saturday night, what can I say? :D

He's more than a pretty face.

Don't listen to his music, don't really like his image, but having heard him in various interviews, not the least of which was the one he did in Bowling for Columbine, I think he's a very intelligent and well spoken individual and is deserving of respect for that reason alone.

But the guy is smart. I love his attitude and his persona.

Intelligent and articulate. His whole act was based on shock value, and he just didn't shock me. So I tended to ignore him for the most part.

version of Alice Cooper (complete with female first name), but he seems both intelligent and articulate and I can at least appreciate that. Basically ambivalent about him, overall.

I like a couple of his tunes (I like the drugs but the drugs don't like me and Beautiful People) but I think he is kind of a freak as he has a prosthetic fetish. I liked what he said in Bowling For Columbine, and I did buy and read his book The Long Hard Road Out of Hell mostly to read about his drug use and celeb encounters for pure entertainment. BTW, I'm hungover and bored too!

His father was one of the pilots who sprayed Agent Orange. At one period, all the kids of these pilots and soldiers were put into "special ed" classes. So for many of Manson's early years he was surrounded by malformed kids with all sorts of prosthetic parts. It's something that left an impression on him growing up.

A prepackaged corporate product. His marketing niche is different, and the noise is a little bit louder, but it's all very calculated.

Not that I have anything against boy bands or Manson/Prodigy/Nine Inch Nails or any of the other bands selling a contrived image. It just strikes me as funny that some people think that one is more "authentic" than the other.

Marilyn is laughing all the way to the bank. And the great thing for him is, he can take out the silly contacts, wash off the makeup, take off the wig, and move about freely without being recognized.


Wish I'd have thought of that gimmick.

Funny that he was doing the same act for years before he even got a contract, huh? I can just imagine the corp lawyers in his appartment when he was trying to find gigs saying "Act more like the Anti-Christ had married Alice Cooper and you're their baby and we'll make you a millionare!"

Study his history and life. You might not like him, but it's all his own thing, not any corporate creation.

But that's all it is - a character. In interview after interview, he's as much as came out and said that his schtick is ALL about making a buck. And like I said, I don't dislike him one bit. When he concocted his little gimmick with his "Spooky Kids" back in S. Fla in the early 90's, the whole wierd, campy, Thrill Kill Kult/Wax Trax/Nine Inch Nails thing was all the rage. He took a lot of elements of that look and made the sound rock a bit harder.

Brian Warner is a dorky, stringy kid. Nobody would by records from a kid like that, and he knew that. He came up with a gimmick to sell the band and hide Brian Warner. It was all about marketing, and GETTING a contract from the beginning. He was NOT aiming to spend his life playing clubs, and he's not trying to enlighten today. He's trying to make a buck in what he considers to be a campy, fun way. His "social commentary" is on about a 16-year-old's level, again, perfect for reaching his target market. It's all pretty tame, really, devoid of any real subversiveness, except on a superficial level. Hell, Rage Against the Machine were more subversive (and in spite of the band's anarcho-socialist sympathies, even their political views were turned into a marketing gimmick, watered down to sell to little suburban teens who hadn't the foggiest of what Zach DeLaRocha was ranting about. They just thought it sounded badass.)

Don't assume that I dislike him because he is a marketing concept. I enjoy meals at Chevy's®, Chili's®, and The Olive Garden® on occasion, and there pretty much as satisfying as those I have in Mom n' Pop places. Same goes for Manson, although when you listen to him on CD alone, it's a bit less stimulating than the videos, with all their calculatedly "shocking" imagery.

My opinions are almost a mirror of yours. But, unlike many here, I bow and say "Whatever turns you on." I don't agree, but please disagree.

but I do like some of his earlier stuff. Holywood was great. He's extremely intelligent, and I think he has a lot to say - he didn't do himself justice with Golden Age, in my opinion.

I just think that he is ridiculous. His schtick was VERY old a long time ago. But as long as there are rubes...

Antichrist superstar is a great album, but unfortunately, it was his peak.

When you acknowledge that it's all just entertainment the music used to stand up for itself. Not to say Mechanical Animals was bad, I still like to listen to some of that if I'm in a shitty mood.

He's a bright guy, and he's taken the Bowie/Cooper route to success, and done it well.

If I had to pick one though, I'd have to go with Mechanical Animals. I Don't Like The Drugs, Coma White, and the Dope Show are favorites of mine.

I've been somewhat disappointed in Golden Age, but it's one of those albums that kinda grow on you. This Is The New Shit is a great song, as is Slutgarden.

The first time I saw him on TV I thought, "Isn't Alice Cooper getting a bit old for that type of stuff"

Because he sees him as being Anti-Christian. (Yep, AC is a born again now.)

given how much Alice annoyed my parents.

Do I hear Frank Zappa turning in his unmarked grave?

Oh dear!

Blech.
Geezer here.
;-)

Last I recall, he is very anti neo-con. :thumbsup:

Seriously I read before the 2000 election that he supported bush per his own comments?

Maybe that was said tongue in cheek on his part, but I distinctly remember thinking that it sounded like he was serious.

I only recall this because at the time I thought he's got a big friggin nerve considering the packaging he's presenting!

I wasn't that smitten with him to begin with, but the bush support comments from his freaky personage pushed me over to the hate category four years ago...

IMO he's just an unoriginal commercial/ knock off/combo package of the old glam rockers combined with the *devil* type bad guy rockers (Alice Coopers, Ozzy's etc) from the 70's.

On top of all that the man is damned ugly.

Where did he make supportive comments regarding Bush? :shrug:

I've only heard him speak of politics once. In "Bowling for Columbine", he made reference to Clinton's bombings of Kosovo. It was basically his defense for, at the time, being blamed for teen violence.

The original article from the NY Post isn't there now this is so old but I found the below on Democrats.com (it was linked to the article where Manson supported bush.

www.democrats.com/preview.cfm?term=George%20W.%20Bush - 101k -

__Marilyn Manson, Minister of the Chruch of Satan, Supports Bush.

Hey, forget about any criticisms of Gore for not being hard enough on Hollywood.
Marilyn Manson, the macabre rock star, is throwing his support to George W.
We'd like to see the photo op of the endorsement news conference.

if you want to get picky.

I don't believe this for a moment.

When and where did you hear this? :shrug:

http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:mTCid7sCChoJ:www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp%3FARTICLE_ID%3D20853+marilyn+manson+republican&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

Excerpts:

"A much more shocking bit of political information can be found in Talk at the end of "Marilyn Manson Has a Secret," Tucker Carlson's profile about the ghoul-rocker. Though Manson has spent his entire career thinking up successful ways to repulse and enrage adult America, it turns out that he is really a conservative, bourgeois guy with strong Republican leanings.

His complaints about America's vulgar, mindless entertainment and people who don't use good grammar make him sound like Bill Bennett. And, most shocking of all, Manson -- who says he loathes Gore and Sen. Joseph Lieberman -- tells Tucker that "If I had to pick, I'd pick Bush, and not necessarily by default."

But Manson backs Bush -- just like the conservatives at National Review do in their newest issue. Not surprisingly, the magazine that William F. Buckley Jr. started but no longer edits day-to-day would prefer a more blatantly conservative Republican. But they reject Gore as a "demagogue," and come out for Bush -- "a modest statesman" who is "aware of his own limitations and those of aggrandized government." END OF EXCERPT

:eyes:

I remember reading all of this in 2000 and it was all around the net at the time.

I see I have pissed off all the Marilyn Manson fans and if this isn't true, it's not true...end of story.

I don't have a personal ax to grind with Marilyn Manson and in fact prior to reading the stuff about the bush support I didn't have a thought one way or another about him -- I liked some of his music but wasn't a die hard "fan" per say.

If the fans here say it's BS that's fine you probably know more than I do.

My intention was not to get everyone all torqued up about this!

TRUCE! (Damn call off the dogs...PLEASE! LOL)

Citing Tucker as a source was kinda questionable, but I'll forgive ya this time :D

When it comes to the Karla Faye whoever she was issue (that whole "Please don't kill me" thing said by Herr bush to Carlson in an interview)I guess I just felt compelled to cite him again!

But seriously...if you guys know different about Manson as people who have followed his career, I will take your word for it.

I was a big Black Sabbath fan (I am regrettably old LOL)and when Ozzy appeared at that bush function with Greta Sustern, I also wrote his ass off.

Granted the man doesn't know whether he is on foot or horseback at this point...but I was still pissed.

Conversely there are artists that I couldn't stand before that I support now because they have come out against bush.

I've seen him in concert more times than any other musical act in my life. The first time was with NIN during the DOWNWARD SPIRAL tour. If I'm right, I've seen him 13 times in concert. That first concert sucked though, as I was seated behind a pillar and couldn't see most of the stage.

I've been lucky (depending on your outlook ;-) ) to have seen him in small clubs when he was still breaking bottles and slashing himself on stage. Best of all, at that time I was pressed up against the rails to the stage between a 7' Berserker and a girl who was dressed up like the Bride of Dracula...she was a Goth Nurse.

So I'm between this woman giving off "fuck me" vibes (in general, not to me) and a guy who was sending out the same "Fuck me" vibes. The bars in front of the stage remind me of bike racks.

Everyone smelled of leather, pot, booze and sweat.

After some time--and a few beers--I decided to slam.

The experience was like nothing else I've gone through before.

But...

I doubt I'll do it anymore. (I've slam danced at about 33 concerts in the past, but my joints just can't take it anymore. Yeah...sigh...I'm getting old. ;-) )

I ended up having my trench coat, tee shirt, some hair, and parts of my pants ripped off of me. My luck - I get into a mosh pit for the first time and it turns into a strip job, except I'm not getting paid for my nudity.

I will be there this time - I missed the Fragile tour, because none of my friends have any taste in music. :)

I hear from many fans that it's been a real disappointment, but I find myself liking it more and more as I keep listening.

I didn't think she was that great an actress but I just love that picture of her standing over the vent with the air blowing her dress up!

Oh, she was hot!

Oh....hang on. Wrong person.

Manson, you say?

No, I hate him. Sick bastard he his!
He should never be allowed out of prison!!!!!!!

:silly:

:spank: :spank: :spank:

I'm parched!

Don't mind the bitter taste. I thought I'd add just a pinch or two more of my "special" ingredient :evilgrin:

I reckon that deserves a thread of it's own, huh?

Hadn't even been paying attention to my post count... so what do I get for 1000 posts? Hmmmm???? :D

When you least expect it...expect it!

thanks for that. :)

Read what he actually said. He also didn't vote in the 2000 election.

---

Marilyn Manson predicts better music under Bush
Goth rocker ready to push the envelope; Dept. of Disposable Tips: Meg Ryan gets love advice from Elizabeth Taylor. Plus: Martha Stewart -- no more dirty underwear!

- - - - - - - - - - - -
By Amy Reiter

Nov. 21, 2000 | When it comes to politics, Marilyn Manson changes his mind more frequently than Britney Spears changes baby-Ts.

First Manson claimed he was a Bush man. Then a few weeks later he was stumping for Gore. And now the goth rocker tells the Toronto Sun he didn't vote in the presidential election "because I didn't think that either one was worth voting for and I didn't want to settle for one."

But he won't feel bad at all if George W. Bush takes the White House, he says. On the contrary. "I think music and all art really flourishes and becomes much more exciting under a conservative president because there's a need to react against limitations," Manson says, sounding rather Nader-esque. "If it's right-wing, it just instantly makes me want to push the envelope more."

http://archive.salon.com/people/col/reit/2000/11/21/nptues/

A LOT of Manson humor doesn't translate from his interviews. You have to watch him to know when he's leading you on. He's a master of sarcasm, but it doesn't show up well in interviews.

there are several links there to his past statements.

That sounds more like the Manson I know and love. Thanks for clearing that up for me :D

Like I said, maybe what Manson said was tongue in cheek and he's too deep for me to understand...but I'll tell you, after 3 years of this fascist I could do with hearing some shitty music for a while if it means getting bush out.

I have done enough suffering over the last four years watching asshole bush ruin the world as we knew it and at this point art for the sake of abstract isn't really my first priority!

Read the lyrics to "Holywood: In the Shadow of the Valley of Death". It's VERY political. I can't even quote some of the lyrics here online.

should watch him in "Bowling for Columbine" (sp?)

when he was on Bill Maher.

I wasn't a fan of Marilyn until my oldest daughter started listening and until then, I'd only seen the weird and wasn't all that interested. Now I'm a bigger fan of Manson than she is and I wondered just how much his image plays into whether people really listen to his music or not.

If Lieberman had blamed me for Columbine I wouldn't have voted for Gore either. That doesn't make me a Bush supporter.

And being a Nutmegger, I REALLY know what I'm talking about in that regard!

However, judging by his remarks in Michael Moore's BOWLING FOR COLOMBINE, he sounds like a man with whom I could have a lengthy and intelligent discussion about any number of topics.

I've generally thought of him as someone who deliberately tries to shock people just for the attention. Which isn't to say that, given the complacent, narcotized stupor of much of the American populace, a little shocking isn't in order. I agree, however, that he showed more brains in 3 minutes of Bowling for Columbine than most right-wing pontificators have shown in the last eight years, on the same issue.

As for his music- hey, it aint my bag. I'm an old school Deadhead, I like trippy, psychedelic music, jambands, alt country, Steve Earle, that kind of thing. The closest I get to screamin' bands is the Butthole Surfers. Gibby Hayes, baby.
But, to each his own.

I know the Dead made great music, and I'm happy they have had serious life-changing effects on their fans.

But even after seeing them live at Deer Creek (the year after the "riot") I was left with a :shrug: feeling. Good music, but nothing got into my soul except for their encore of "I fought the law and the law won". (or whatever the title is....)

I'm happy to see any band gain a following, even when I don't like the music. If I respect other people's tastes, then just maybe..maybe, someone else will respect mine.

Now I may still say so-and-so sucks, but that's a personal opinion. I, however, will never speak badly of the fans.

(Except for fundies who think LEFT BEHIND is the litteral truth, of course.)

And, again, I was really impressed with the clip of MM in Bowling for Columbine.

Gotta say, though, as far as the Dead and Dead shows- and you're talking to someone who saw them almost a hundred times- it took a few shows before the infection really "took" with me, and even then, it was never something that was guaranteed to blow you away at every show. Most 'heads recognize that the band was at times a hit or miss proposition. Some shows would be fairly weak, to the point where I would be ready to throw in the towel on the whole thing- then I would go to one where they pulled out the Vista Cruiser and completely kicked my ass and I would be completely reminded why I bothered (Vegas, 1991 was one such set of shows) ... Also, the dynamic between the crowd and the band was always more.. complex than with many other acts- if the crowd sucked or had a shitty vibe, it would completely fuck up the show. I saw some good Deer Creek shows in 1990 and 1992. Beyond that, though, the whole thing definitely slid markedly downhill, along with Jerry, around 1993, in my opinion, and by 95 I wasn't going to many shows at all.

My point in all this, however, (I go through this with my wife, all the time) is that one particular Dead show isn't really indicative of the whole thing- plus, they are like licorice.. some people like it, some dont- but the people who do, tend to like it a lot. Probably the same with MM.

Wait.. You mean "LEFT BEHIND" isn't literal truth?
Because I'm all set to steal my neighbor's minivan once he's vaporized up to heaven.

Don't hate him tho.

I like him a lot, and I really enjoyed his autobiography (Long Road Out of Hell). But I find his music boring, it lacks texture. I like hard rock, just not his version of it.

...too derivitive of Bowie and many others...

BUT.

I've seen him interviewed a few times, and he's actually quite articulate and sensible. A good Progressive thinker, who happens to understand pop marketing.

IN Bowling for columbine he reveals, for all his smarts, he doesn't understand what irony is.

n/t

never really listened to the music... the little that I heard wasn't the kind of stuff I really dig...

You prefer that loser Teddy over moi, for which I shall never forgive you... therefore, your opinion is rendered useless :P

I'm stoned tonight, I just don't have the energy for DULL... I'm in friggin slow motion :)

Un-original

He grew up around here and they were a local band around here for years... I know who the guy is.. his name is Brian Warner, he went to Taravella high school...

He used to work in a Peaches records and tapes way back in the day and I remember he was working the counter and made some smart ass comment about me buying the Beastie Boys' "Check Your Head" cassette...

I never liked the guy..

However, I never thought the dude would be famous, and he's the one who has millions of dollars and fame and I don't... so I guess the jokes on me....

The dude who played guitar with him was cool though..

They used to be called "Marylin Manson and the Spooky Kids" and used to play clubs around here with like 6 peole at the show.

Heyo

However, have you ever heard an interview with that guy?? He's incredibly intelligent, believe it or not. If I remember correctly, he said he liked reading Shakespeare. He's also got some wonderful inside into issues facinf today's world. Too many people judge a book by it's cover and he's a prime example of why we shouldn't do that.

First of all, anyone who says that Manson is "goth" is on crack! SHOCK ROCK! Thank you! End of story. Plus, I don't really think he has all that much to offer, since I have noticed over a long peroid of time that he has ripped off alot of shit from so many other artists, like the Virgin Prunes (who he interviewed when he was a music reviewer down here in South FL), the Genitorturers, Bowie, Iggy, Alice Cooper, Kiss, NIN, Black Sabbath, and on and on it goes. He even went so far at to blatantly rip off Anton LaVey's criticisms of the 7 Deadly Sins right almost VERBATIM from "The Satantic Bible" in an article published in a local free music mag...I can't remember if it was JAM or RAG. Either way, I have seen not all that much from Manson that is orignal, he appears to only be a human-Xeroxer. I do however whole-heartedly support his First Ammendment rights, which is alot more than I can say about MOST people...WELCOME TO AMERIKKKA.

Lu Cifer, reminding you that even if we had NO president, we would still be 100,000,000X better off than we are now

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