Am I alone in hating almost all mainstream entertainment?

A lot of people give me shit for hating popular "musicians", movies, actors, TV shows and the like, saying I'm way too negative and blah blah blah, and I'm getting really sick of it. Why should I pretend to like stuff I find to be complete and utter lowest common denominator shit in order to have a pleasant conversation? Chances are that if someone likes Elimidate, I'm not going to get along well with said person, and its better we realize we won't get along from the outset, rather than me pretending I like Dave Matthews Band and Friends and Julia Roberts just for the sake of "getting" along. The fact of the matter is that there are far too many celebrities who don't deserve the fame and adulation they recieve, because they've done NOTHING noteworthy (reality TV contestants) or their just talentless idiots with very good marketing regimes behind them.

This whole lowest common denominator status quo is inherent in almost EVERYTHING in our culture, from our pathetic simian President all the way down to our insipid, vacuous tv shows documenting the "real" lives of other insipid, vacuous people.

I'm not saying everthing has to be all artsy fartsy, but does it all have to be horrible, tacky, annoying shit that insults everyone's intelligence?

especially towards many folks who are, on the whole, good and ethical people.

I barely turn on the TV..I listen to my own CD's in the car...Orwellian names like Reality TV for programs like Survivor which should be called SOCIAL DARWINISM FOR POSERS leaves me COLD!

I don't really give it any mind any more. "Friends" is supposed to be such a great show and yet there hasn't been a sigle time when I laughed at anything it had in it. It just isn't funny and yet its supposed to be some sort of hip teen comedy.

"Reality" shows are pretty much the same thing in my book: non-entertaining. If that's reality then I suppose porn flicks would have to be completely realistic in their depictions of the sex life for the average american male.

I think those same thoughts all the time. This culture is making us all sick. Mind you, I do have a sense of humor but what we call entertainment these days is just a bunch of attention whores with no real talent. Why in the hell do people keep celebrating them?! Makes me want to puke.

edit=terrible typist

I thought I was just some elitist misanthrope who thinks too much, or so the proles would have me believe.

Though some of my friends have made this statement, and there is some truth to it. I do tend to focus on the negative too much, as there is a lot of stuff I do like, just very little of it could be considered mainstream.

I agree with you about most entertainment today (e.g. mass media). But you chose the wrong band to pick on: Just because DMB is popular (and is liked by vapid people) doesn't change the fact that their lyrics show a great deal of awareness and conscience.

While I don't dig them, they don't really rank compared to people like Creed, Blink 182, Nelly, and about a thousand other "musicians" of nearly every genre.

The mainstream representatives of almost every music genre these days are the worst possible representatives of said genres, from country to metal to hip hop to rock and all points betwixt and between.

I tried and I tried...oh well.

I'm not sure you really hate them either but I hate their 'product'

...product. Scott Stapp clearly buys into his bullshit hype, and if allowed to stay famous, will one day out-Bono Bono.

I hate Britney Spears, though not as much as Christina Aguilera. At least the girls who idolize Britney are only wanting boob jobs, Christina alikes will become anorexics AND shitty dressers. And I hate Avril Lavigne ten times as much as both of them because she's part of this horrible co-opting of punk, and the fact that she doesn't even know who David Bowie is. She needs to be deported.

And what the fuck is up with Canada anymore anyway? You people once sent us both Joni Mitchell AND Neil Young, and now you send us Our Lady Peace and Avril? Don't let us corrupt you, dammit.

I've given this a lot of thought. Agonized about it, I guess. What's happened is that everything in the entertainment realm (not REALLY *everything*, but anything that is immediately accesible) has become "product". Mass market entertainment is produced by an industry, and it is ugly, shitty, stuff. You've got to really put some effort into finding music, movies, or literature that have meaning to you. It IS out there, though. Maybe TV is mostly a lost cause, but certainly there are musicians and movies and books that address the big important questions. I guess the trick is to try to keep perspective. Mass market stuff is shit, no question. But that's only the commercial side of things.

You nailed it. DMB...Survivor... Julia Roberts... It can all eat Coyote poop. :hurts:

Aside from his Prince hate and my Prince love, I think either I'm his evil twin, or he's mine, depending on where you fall on the whole Prince thing.

I'm still waiting for someone to explain why Julia Roberts is famous to me, and I have been since about 1993.

For someone who hates popular musicians, movies, actors, TV shows and the like, you sure spend a lot of energy posting about it.

Fortunately there is a healthy amount of things I consider "artsy fartsy" to pacify folks like you.

You have yours and the great unwashed has ours.

I'm glad I can suspend disbelief and escape the real world in some mindless entertaiment.

Honestly, you put as much energy into bashing popular culture as street corner preachers do in telling us all "the end is near."

In fact, that is what you sound like, a preacher telling all us sinners that our lifestyle is damnable.

I don't find much escapism in reality TV, I just see a bunch of vain, petty, whiny drama queens acting like complete idiots and falling all over themselves to make asses out of themselves to become "famous". Reality TV is so fucking horrid that it makes me miss the days when sitcoms were the worst thing on TV. I actually miss Wings and other shitty sitcoms like that when I see a reality TV show, because at least on sitcoms, you know the stupid people doing stupid things isn't real. The thought that the people on these reality shows are real people makes me just plain sad.

And my whole point is that I DON'T just like artsy fartsy crap, I still watch A-Team reruns and listen to the Ramones and my favorite movie of all time is They Live, for God's sake. But those are all products of the 80s, and for all the crap that was pumped out in the 80s, at least most of it at least ATTEMPTED to pretend it was something more than a glorified commercial. Today you get shit like Josey & The Pussycats, a 90 minute product-placement-a-thon "remake" of an also ran 70s cartoon that wasn't that great to begin with.

At least the A-Team was halfway original, instead of a watered down bastardization of something that was popular in the 70s.

Still with ya!

1. You will base a friendship or relationship on someone's entertainment preferences:

Chances are that if someone likes Elimidate, I'm not going to get along well with said person, and its better we realize we won't get along from the outset

2. You seem to sum up the entire spectrum of popular entertainment as "reality TV." After all, your post said "popular "musicians", movies, actors, TV shows and the like" and there is more to all of that than reality TV. THAT is still only a small part of TV programming.

3. Implying there were superior products in the 80s makes you sound like an old man gruffing over "the good old days." The 80s had their share of remakes and turkeys as anyone who is a fan of 70s, 60s, and 50s culture will tell you.

I realize its hard for you to allow me to think most mainstream entertainment is purile shit since you make your living off of an arm of it, so I'm not going to bother trying to refute your "points" again, because we'll just have another relentless flamefest where neither of us gives up any ideological ground.

And entertainment preferences aren't the only thing I base friendships on, but most times if someone is really into a lot of mainstream entertainment, chances are we clash too much to get along on any other personal terms. Why should I waste my time hanging out with someone I have nothing in common with? I'd think they'd feel the same way about me.

But if you insist on continuing to try and paint me as some elitist indie kid, go ahead, whatever floats your boat.

You post something and love the highfives you get from those who agree with you but hate it when someone disagrees or argues the point.

Why not just say, "only reply to this post if you agree with me?"

I think the overwhelming interest on DU is politics of the democratic party variety - not entertaiment.

Are you saying that THAT is a lesser reason to base a relationship than a commonality of entertainment preferences?

The only "hard-on" I have is for defending my postition in threads where you often attack them. The problem you seem to have is someone would dare disagree.

But if you want to assume some persecution complex to rationalize your painting me as "preachy", then so be it. Its not as if I came into a Charlies Angels thread or something and started flaming away, I started my own thread expressing my own opinion, and you chose to use it as a platform to launch a broadside against me out of some pent up hostility towards me for our previous encounter. If that's not what it is, please clarify your motives, but that's what it looks like to me.

As for the politics: That IS my overriding factor when deciding if I'll get along with some one. Though the art thing is always a plus, if someone is a raging freeper, that's the biggest strike possible against them, and if that variable is present, then none of the other ones are necessary in judging whether I'd get along with said person.

For example, I can tell you and I wouldn't get along in real life, because I don't particularly appreciate people trying to browbeat me into defending my social interaction guidelines, nor do I like people who try to pigeonhole me simply because they can't accept my criticism of something that you really have no connection to. What is it that bothers you so much about the fact that I think most mainstream culture is shit?

... I said you attack my position. BIG difference. You can attack my postion by starting the thread. It doesn't have to be in my thread.

You started your own thread by expressing your opinion, true, but this is a discussion board and your threads are not limited to people who agree with. If you want them to be, say so or become a mod and lock your threads so no one CAN disagree with you.

Talk about browbeating, everytime you begin a thread like this it is to belittle people's taste in entertainment who don't share yours. Then you take it personally when someone comes in and says "I disagree."

You're the one who stated a "social interaction" guideline and you have a choice whether to defend it or not.

I can accept your criticism. You obviously can't accept a differing opinion.

I have plenty of connection to it. It doesn't bother me that you think most mainstream culture is shit. I've heard it most of my adult working life from a loud minority. It does, however, seem to bother you that I don't have a problem with most mainstream culture and I tell you so.

If you had just disagreed with me, I'd have no problem, but what you did was come in here with a bunch of condescending name-calling, and projecting motives that don't exist. I am by no means attacking ANYONE who likes this stuff, and the fact that you keep taking it that way when its not addressed to you or any one else specificially is sort of telling of this persecution complex you seem to like to assume. This thread wasn't some assault on your character, it was just a venting/rant thread that ultimately hurts no one, and you decided to pick a fight. That's not my baggage, it's yours.

I have no problem with differing opinions, but what you're doing is attacking my character and not the argument, and accusing me of attacking people who like this stuff. In the Prince thread I started a couple weeks back, I didn't equate dislike of Prince as an attack on my character, and I think its kind of self-important of you to do so here.

... of me attacking your character and calling you names. ?

I love silly, trashy pop culture -- but it has to have some style and some reason for existence. American pop culture has neither.

I find more and more these days that anything I like turns out to be either British or Japanese.

Part of it is that American culture has almost entirely bought into the status quo. For example, tv drama (what's left of it) is mostly cop shows and lawyer shows. When the listings of proposed series for next fall came out, I hurried to see what science fiction was on tap -- and even that was all science fiction cop shows and science fiction lawyer shows! If you can't find subversive ideas in your science fiction, where can you find them?

The other part is that American culture currently has no heart and no soul. And that's what really makes me worry for our country.

worse and worse. Money for independent arts started drying up under Reagan/ Poppy and then under Clinton we were all too busy absorbing the new technology to care.

So, things have gotten very lax in the "entertainment" industry. Those of us who are over 40 have seen the decline in a progression. Today the "Infomercial" entertaiment is king. I worry that some folks don't know they are watching "infomercials" until I realize that maybe people are managing to do other things for entertainment and maybe TV just isn't as important in peoples lives anymore.

and I, like you, agree.

The Sopranos is still wildly popular, and I like it alot (though I wish Carmela would get whacked, as she annoys the hell out of me), and Buffy The Vampire Slayer was pretty popular during its run, and I've recently become addicted to it.

popular culture--but most popular culture is vile.

the movie,TV or professional athlete worship. But I'd die without my music.

Check these women out, I finally have tickets to see them in concert.
You might enjoy them too.

http://www.sweethoney.com/

From 1985 to 1989, about the only thing I watched on TV was PBS and Nightline, and saw no movies. I think the only current record I bought was Pink Floyd's Delicate Sounds of Thunder.

Periodically, we go through one of these suckholes. This one hasn't gotten as bad as the 80's suckhole, IMHO. Of course, I have a feeling I'm going to get flamed with "But Moonlighting and Paula Abdul were soooo cooool".

I still maintain that today's mainstream culture makes the 80s look like the Renaissance.

Some escapism is fine and dandy, but societies are partly judged on what culture they produce, and when mainstream America produces mostly glorified infomercials disguised as entertainment, I tend to judge harshly.

I still maintain that today's mainstream culture makes the 80s look like the Renaissance.

Some escapism is fine and dandy, but societies are partly judged on what culture they produce, and when mainstream America produces mostly glorified infomercials disguised as entertainment, I tend to judge harshly.

:D

I agree with you 200%.

It's a terrible time for culture.

I watch Animal Planet because people suck. I'll also tune into the BBC World News. That's about it. Awful. 500 channels and it's all dreck, and there's nothing worthwhile to draw me into the movie theaters (which are ever more overpriced, overchilled, noisy and dirty) or the record stores.

Reality TV Shows, American Idol..all the shit. We (America) are falling fast as far as our entertainment industry is concerned. An example remaking old TV shows into movies, even Cartoons into movies.

And look at a lot of the good movies coming out - they are remakes or things that have been explored before. The Pianist, a movie based on a true story and well done, didn't show me much that's new.

Just as long as you don't look down upon those like me who do enjoy some of what you don't, I'm fine with your opinion. I find things in the mainstream that I like and things I don't. In music, I think Michelle Branch, Avril Lavigne, and The Dixie Chicks are talented. Michelle and Avril continue the line of good pop music, and the Dixie Chicks are one of my favorite country artists ever - they compete with the Merles and Tammys. But Britney, Linkin Park, and Chris Cagle leave a lot to be desired. Same with indie music - I love Cindy Alexander and Alex Bach, but can't stand The Mars Volta. Just because something is different doesn't make it good. Different can be just as annoying as the latest J. Lo CD. In movies, things don't change - I couldn't sit through Godsford Park, but films such as Liar Liar are good escapism. As far as TV goes, I like Friends but don't love it - Will And Grace is high quality mainstream, as is The Simpsons. For me, highbrow comedy probably wouldn't work - I just don't want comedy to go in the gutter just for going in the gutter's sake. The Simpsons actually got better last season IMO, and even their bad shows are entertaining to me. I'm not a fan of reality shows, but Big Brother is kind of a guilty pleasure. I don't watch much TV, however. TV certainly needs more good dramas and substantive programming. Things that could teach people a bit about our world, but not be heavy handed. In reading, I enjoy Harry Potter, John Grisham, and Mary Higgins Clark tremendously.

and I've seen the previews of said movies, and I absolutely know that someone would have to pay me royally to force me to sit through that crap.

Movies with Roman numerals, remakes of old TV series (every one of which has been totally pathetic--even judging from the previews), "music" that consists of thin-voiced teenagers wailing tunelessly over a rhythm track--blech!

I stopped watching sitcoms in about 1993. Now they consist of people yelling crude insults at each other. I've never watched Survivor. The type of people who would go on such a show must have wind whistling around between their ears. And the locations--Thailand, Australia, the Marquesas--what a waste of great destinations.

Okay, you might say that this is just a normal adult talking about "these kids today," but I was 43 years old in 1993, and I listened to pop and rock music on the car radio until I sold my car that year. Now I hear commercial music on the sound system at the gym, and I'm not inspired to run out and buy any of it.

Yes, pop culture has become stupid, crude, and mean.

This is all part of a deliberate attempt to make people stupid and crude. Witness the proliferation of "wrestling" shows a couple of years ago. Those bozos are held up as pop culture heroes, and their non-"wrestling" exploits are in the newspaper gossip columns. The network execs say that they're just giving the Ameircan people what they want, but honestly, if there was a nationwide clamor for WWF wrestling or "reality" shows or bad music, I missed it.

I don't deny that overall the 50s, 60s, and 70s were a better time for music. In fact, there are very few 50s and 60s bands I don't like - besides the one hit wonders that did too many songs. The one hit wonders show that there has always been a bit too much assembling together. I also feel that previous generations tend to dismiss new music too much and don't look around in it enough based on their initial feelings.

There's way to much "Noise" everywhere and it's distracting and fills one's head with too much "stuff."

Was trying to get information on buying a new cellphone yesterday in a store and the music was so loud I couldn't read about the product and had trouble even hearing the salesperson. I couldn't concentrate on what I needed to.....so I left.

Celeberity Hype, and constant promotion and distraction are enough to make all but the most single focused of us start to get :crazy:

AND, BTW! As a person whose been told all my life to "lighten up.....because I think too much..." LOL's ...all one has to do is look at "Chimpy" and one can feel good about "thinking too much! ;-)

If it doesn't entertain me I don't watch it. If you like it then good for you. If you don't then good for you too.

The only reason I even still pay for cable is for The Wire, Adult Swim, and The Daily Show, and I feel like not only is there very little entertaining entertainment to be found, but I'm also getting screwed out of sixty odd bucks a month to watch maybe three shows a week.

The same can be said for anytime I go to a music store, or a bookstore, or Blockbuster: Unless I want to watch castoffs from Dawson's Creek star in shitty, paint by numbers "horror" movies, or mindless action movies I outgrew five years ago, I go home without anything to watch.

popular culture is just that--poplular. I have difficulty having conversations with many people because their lives center around mainstream entertainment (aka weekly tv shows) and celebrity worship. Not only have I not seen their "programs", I have no idea who the "stars" they are talking about are. I'm not being artsy-fartsy. I just don't find it interesting in the least.

David Foster Wallace of Infinite Jest fame (a 1000 page tome that one day I shall have the courage and patience to get through, endnotes and all--and it's FICTION!!) wrote an essay about why writers should NOT watch TV. I wish I could remember what it's called, it's in his anthology A Supposedly Fun Thing I Will Never Do Again. (The title essay is about his going on a Celebrity cruise for an article. Deadpan hilarious.) In the essay, however, he describes the cycle of addiction and how it can ruin a person's writing. The writer watches a t.v. program, commercials and all, sees that her life doesn't work the same way as Chandler/Monica/Fresh Prince, etc., feels crappy, wishes to buy the products that are being advertised to make her more cool, perhaps goes out and gets some Haagen-Dazs or Whoritos or whatever, and consumes the substances to become addicted to, and feels even worse.

Since I've been getting "sober", kicking my sugar/flour addiction (down 103 pounds since January--see my other thread in DU Lounge), I see there's the real me and the false me. The False Me has been the one obsessed with pop culture, and wanting to be famous, wanting all the externals. The False Me felt that I was a piece of shit if I wasn't successful doing the Great Work (ork ork...) It was hungry for recognition and attention, but ran away from it whenever it came in a form that may not have been so pretty or glamorous. The False Me looks down its nose at successful people or it tries to find some way of emphasizing how lucky other people are, and how I'm specially not. The Very Special Worm as it were. (The Hungry Caterpillar anyone?) In my writing, I'd struggle with "Is it commercial? How can I get someone to make this film/produce this play/publish this story?" How can I scam and scheme and manipulate to get what I want so I can be famous so I can be "real?" Ironic, but the sugar and flour and t.v. and other addictions kept me from seeing who I really am, and I held on to all of that, digging my claws in.

The Real Me--I can't even tell you who he is. I'm an entirely different person! Even my relationship to my writing has changed, and I've got a terminal degree from NYU! Have no idea where my life is going to lead now, because all I want to do is hang out with other compulsive eaters and recovering alcoholics, (and perhaps recovering sexual anorectics because I have that problem as well), and make my abstinent meals. I've been thinking a lot more about meadows, forests, lakes and mountains, wondering if Vermont or Canada should be my next home. It's so strange. But it's interesting to note how my life has improved not only without sugar and flour, which let's be honest practically subsidize sitcommodities and "reality" Tv-- I've not watched but one hour of TV since l'affaire Iraqaise began, and that hour was because a co-worker got a bit part on Law & Order. In kicking my sugar/flour addiction, I seem to have let go of a lot of the cultural swinage out there as well. If others want to go there, ain't none of my business. But my desire for connection is what drives me as far as entertainment goes.

That being said, I will see some entertainment. I saw Charlie's Angels 2 and Legally Blonde 2 and T3 in the past 2 weeks. But that's pretty much my pop-film quota for the entire summer. I'm probably going to see Johnny Depp's movie, but I don't think of him as entirely pop-culture. He makes loopy choices, as does Jennifer Jason Leigh. People like that who straddle that art-commerce line are interesting to me. I don't listen to much music these days--it all sounds the same to me. I do like the Dixie Chicks, as someone else mentioned on this thread. Radiohead too. I read voraciously, and will read some pop stuff, but usually not. Harry Potter--well, I am a Hogwarts addict, and my life has become unmanageable. Read the first 4 books 6 times, and the latest twice so far.

I'm getting sick of coming into the Lounge and seeing posts about how inferior I am because I don't own obscure albums by obscure bands that only 0.5% of the population of the planet has heard of. I get tired of it being insinuated that I'm somehow an idiot because of my tastes in music and entertainment. I get sick of people who bitch and moan about how a band is so underrated and everyone should listen to them, then, when they achieve any kind of success, turn around and call them "sellouts" and "mainstream trash." I mean, seriously, people, make up your minds.

It's not people's tastes that bother me, it's this I'm-better-than-everyone-else snob attitude that I really sick of around here.

I haven't watched broadcast TV primetime in about 4 months. I haven't listened to MTV, VH1, or top 40 radio for at least a year. The last "mainstream" film I saw was "Punch Drunk Love," and that's even considered "indy."

(onto the point)

I've pretty much stopped caring about all American pop culture. Last week my cd player died on a 200 mile roadtrip. I've gotten used to listening to Rob Dougan, Craig Armstrong, the Kronos Quartet and other similar artists. Strings, orchestra, soothing. Due to bordem of a long road trip I turned on the radio to cease the silence. Some guy named "50 Cents" was attempting to do...something...I'm pretty sure it wasn't actually music. More like talking in artistically vacuous lyrical ryhme to a horrible drum loop. I swear it literally gave me a headache, I had to pull over and get some Motrin. And from what I'm told by some, this dude is one of the best pop culture has to offer. Yikes. Why the hell doesn't my generation have a John Lennon?

It is tough to be a twenty year old in this country and not know what the hell everyone else is talking about with the "American Idol" thing. The only thing I remember is that some guy named after a sandwich won.

What you're talking about is rap, and I don't like that. But Missy Elliott and The Roots are a lot better.

There are a lot of good singers now, but someone as good as John Lennon might not show up for a few generations at least.