*Deep breath* OK, Here it is a no-shit coming out thread

I'm a republican. A republican for Kerry.

That's right, THERE! I SAID IT! This may or may not surprise many of you but I am very much a republican and am also very surprised why anybody in my party could think that George Bush is actually a conservative. Take a look at the facts (something many republicans are incapable of doing these days)

Historically, conservatism in the United States has meant support for small government, balanced budgets, fiscal prudence and great skepticism about overseas adventures. THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION IS NONE OF THOSE THINGS!

A year or so ago I picked up a copy of the book "The Bush betrayal by James Bovard. In it he stunningly laid out all the facts of the matter. Don't believe me? Want specifics? I don't even know where to start, lets try some of these...

* On stifling dissent: Bush's Secret Service detail arrested or detained peaceful American protesters who made the mistake of carrying "No War for Oil" or other anti-Bush signs at Bush campaign appearances in Arizona, California, Connecticut, Michigan, New Jersey, New Mexico and Texas. As Bovard notes, the Secret Service has now apparently been relegated to suppressing "any affront to the dignity of the supreme ruler."

* On free trade: Despite claiming that he is a "fierce free trader," Bush slapped a 30 percent tariff on imported steel in 2002. One consulting firm estimated that the move destroyed eight American manufacturing jobs for every one steel-producing job it saved. But as Bovard notes, the tariff was never about fair trade -- it was about "the president's own political advantage," since some steel-producing states were up for grabs in the 2004 election.

* On education reform: Bush claimed that his No Child Left Behind (NCLB) program, which mandated standards and testing for local schools, was "the boldest plan to improve our public schools in a generation." However, Bovard notes that the law only requires schools to improve their "baseline" standards -- so most states immediately dumbed-down their existing standards so they could easily show future gains. For example, the NCLB baseline standard set in Delaware required only 33 percent of children to test at grade-level in math. NCLB also required states to identify "dangerous" schools. So, New York politicians mandated that 5 percent of a student body had to be suspended for weapons violations before a school could be declared "dangerous." Such standards, notes Bovard, "practically guarantee no school would be found guilty." Needless to say, NCLB also came with a hefty price tag. At various times, Bush boasted that he had increased federal spending on education by 36 percent or 49 percent.

* On continuing the Clinton legacy: Bush has been the #1 fan of former president Bill Clinton's AmeriCorps program, which pays people $16,000 a year in cash and benefits to "volunteer." Bush increased funding for the program -- whose employees engage in such vital civic activities as organizing gay proms at high schools, paying children a $5 bounty for toy guns, and recruiting people for food stamp programs -- by more than $120 million in 2004.

* On government subsidies: During his 2000 campaign, Bush claimed to support a "market-driven approach" to agriculture. So, when he became president, he signed a bill that earmarked an additional $50 billion in federal handouts to farmers over 10 years. The bill funneled two-thirds of that money to the richest 10 percent of farmers, and will, by one estimate, cost every American family $4,377 over the coming decade in higher taxes and inflated food costs.

* On government-run health care: In 2003, Bush pushed through Congress a $400 billion-a-year Medicare bill to provide prescription drugs to seniors. (More accurate estimates later said the annual cost would actually be $576 billion.) Bovard notes that the program is the "worst financial blow Medicare ever suffered" -- and pushed Medicare's bankruptcy forward by seven years, to 2019.

* On the government's failure to stop the 9/11 terrorist attacks: After the attacks, Bush claimed that no one "could envision flying airplanes into buildings." But Bovard notes that "in the previous few years, the CIA had issued several warnings that terrorists might fly commercial airplanes into buildings or cities."

* On spying on Americans: Bush enthusiastically endorsed the USA Patriot Act, which expanded the federal government's ability to read your e-mail, search your home without notifying you, obtain a list of the books you checked out at your local library, and subpoena information from businesses without a court order. Bush's hand-picked attorney general, John Ashcroft, explained that the USA Patriot Act protects what he called "ordered liberty." Bovard disagrees, and writes, "The only way to reconcile the Patriot Act with freedom is to assume that unjustified government intrusions into people's lives are irrelevant to freedom."

* On extra-Constitutional powers: On November 13, 2001, Bush signed an executive order giving himself the power to designate Americans as "enemy combatants" and put them on trial before secret military tribunals -- with no right to appeal. The move, which stripped Americans of their Fifth, Sixth, Seventh, and Eighth Amendment rights to a fair trial, was necessary to fight terrorism, Bush declared. In fact, Bovard counters, if Bush can, by imperial decree, deprive Americans of fundamental civil liberties at his whim, it means the president is no longer "bound by the Constitution." And that, ultimately, is more dangerous than any terrorist.

* On waging unnecessary war: Bush invaded Iraq after claiming that Saddam Hussein possessed "the most lethal weapons ever devised." After intensive postwar searches turned up no such weapons (and after more than 1,000 American soldiers where killed in an increasingly violent insurgency against the U.S. occupation), Bush backpedaled slightly and claimed the invasion was justified because of the "possibility" that Hussein might acquire weapons of mass destruction. As evidence for even that claim evaporated, Bush backpedaled further, and said the invasion was necessary because the United States has "an obligation to help the spread of freedom." In reality, Bovard notes, "Bush was determined to demagogue the American people into war" -- no matter how feeble the rationale. Bovard notes, "Bush's war against Iraq may be his greatest abuse of power."

That is just a breif snapshot of everything Bush has done to disgrace the GOP! If you'd like to hear the whole damn, sorry story (which most of you already know) I'd be more than happy to elaborate.

It was a long, painful road realizing that my party that I love so much has been hijacked by some ultra-right wing neo-con posers. Now, I'm like the precise opposite of Senator Zell Miller. Distressed by the hijacking of my party I absolutely MUST vote democrat. These years, there is flat out too much on the line in the election. The President of the United States in the next 4 years will make key decisions that will affect the course of our nation in this century. If it were a calmer, more simple time, I might simply wait to wrestle the reigns of control of my party from the madmen in the coming primaries. But today, Hell No! There is too much on the line to take such an arrogant and proud course of action. I have to join you guys and put Kerry into office for four years (Hell, I'll give him eight if I think he does a good job which I think he very well might)

It's time to rebuild our alliances. It's time to refocus our attention in the war on terror. It's time to fix the economy. The list goes on and on and on and on......

America can't take 4 more years of Bush and neither can my party. I just want a return to the days when our party was a respectable force (The pre-Nixon years of men like Eisenhower and the like. Even as far back as Teddy Roosevelt, every Republican since then has been a disgrace.)

So there DU'ers. I'm not, truly, one of you. Although I consider myself a solid Kerry supporter. I'm sort of confident that this will get me a tombstone but I just want to make sure you guys know that our party has not lost total control (we're on the brink of it) and there are some of us who realize the madness that Bush is "decisively leading" us into.

Have at me. I just decided that now, the day before the big show, it was time to lay it all out there on the line.

Always good to hear the individual stories!

I'll probabally leave after a celebration and go back to try and wrestle control back from my party (that's quite a formidable task, One that I hope like hell is not impossible)

but what is it you believe in that makes you a Republican?

I think the strength of our nation lies with the individual and that each person's dignity, freedom, ability and responsibility must be honored.I also am a solid believer in equal rights, equal justice and equal opportunity for all, regardless of race, creed, sex, age or disability (this is one reason why I am very much against a constitutional ban on gay marriage and support the right for gay couples to marry.)I think free enterprise and encouraging individual initiative have brought this nation opportunity, economic growth and prosperity.

I believe government must practice fiscal responsibility and allow individuals to keep more of the money they earn. I am sure that the proper role of government is to provide for the people only those critical functions that cannot be performed by individuals or private organizations and that the best government is that which governs least.

I believe the most effective, responsible and responsive government is government closest to the people. I believe Americans must retain the principles that have made us strong while developing new and innovative ideas to meet the challenges of changing times. I believe Americans value and should preserve our national strength and pride while working to extend peace, freedom and human rights throughout the world.

FINALLY! I believe the Republican Party is the best vehicle for translating these ideals into positive and successful principles of government. At least I used to....these days it is spiraling out of control, I know several other conservatives who are thinking along the same lines. We're desperately trying to figure out a way to escape from these last four nightmarish four years and have found that, strangely enough, in a vote for the democratic party and John Kerry.

I'll be the first to admit that I'm fairly moderate Republican. I'm pro-Gay Marriage, Pro-Abortion and Pro-Stem Cell Research (a very good friend of mine will go blind by 30 thanks to the ban on stem cell research) I support the war in Afghanistan and had we found any WMD's in Iraq, would have backed that conflict as well. Unfortunately, we did not. And no matter how the "Republicans" in power try and spin it, We won't because they have not been there in a very long time obviously. Now we have 1100 casualties and growing and another Vietnam growing, It's time to cut our losses and re-focus our attention in the war on terror where it belongs. Afghanistan.

admirable Republican principles that Dubya has dragged through the muck to sate his ideologue power-boner. I know more than a few old guard Repubs who are sick and tired of how their "small government" party is becoming the vessel for American Dominionism in the 21st century.

Sure, this forum is a meeting place for Democrats. But although I can't officially speak for the rules, I'd love for you to stay until you can feel at home again in your own party.

The best thing for the GOP now is for Bush to lose, and go down hard. Maybe that will shock the 'Cons into realizing how terribly they've erred. Good luck getting your party back.

I could not have summed it up better myself!!! It's time for Bush to get the hell out of office! Let the democrats have a couple of years (at LEAST) with control until we take back our party. I have every confidence that Kerry won't "lose the war on terror" like many predict. In fact, if he rebuilds Alliances and refocuses attention on Al-Qaeda, we could see a dramatic reversal of the war, a real change of the tides into our favor. Roosevelt was a democrat and he was a brilliant wartime leader (not too mention economic leader on the homefront) I appreciate the welcome here, anyway. Thanks.

I think the strength of our nation lies with the individual and that each person's dignity, freedom, ability and responsibility must be honored.I also am a solid believer in equal rights, equal justice and equal opportunity for all, regardless of race, creed, sex, age or disability (this is one reason why I am very much against a constitutional ban on gay marriage and support the right for gay couples to marry.)

I hear you. But here's the thing: There has always been a grim impasse between "each person's dignity, freedom, ability and responsibility" and "equal rights, equal justice and equal opportunity for all." At times in America, guaranteeing dignity and freedom was impossible, because there were no equal rights. The Federal Government was required to achieve those equal rights at bayonet-point in places, and in the land's highest office.

This is the price we pay for enjoying a multicultural nation. A lot of people are hard-wired to mistrust people not of their clan, and a lot of old racial antipathy came across the sea with the immigration wave. Let's also not forget that whole chattel slavery thing. Because of the lack of established equal rights, these tendencies and these issues became part of the national fabric. It took, and continues to take, the power and reach and distance of the Federal Government to deal with stuff like this. Can it go too far? Sure. Is there a good argument against ideas like 'Hate Crimes,' i.e. is it wise to try and legislate against how people think and feel? Sure. But the benefits outweigh the problems.

Ergo, and my own humble o, if you believe in dignity, freedom, ability and responsibility *and* in equal rights, equal justice and equal opportunity for all, *and* you find merit in my argument above, you might just be a Democrat.

I think free enterprise and encouraging individual initiative have brought this nation opportunity, economic growth and prosperity.

Do you believe the Democratic Party does not represent these things? Not to be blunt, but were you unconscious during the Clinton administration? The Democrats absolutely blew the roof off the joint; they invigorated capitalism to such a degree that a multitrillion dollar surplus was created...enough to pay for Social Security, and who knows what else.

Basically, Clinton ended the argument that started in 1934 with the election of FDR and the rise of the New Deal. Since then the Democrats and Republicans have been at war over the size and power of the Federal Government. The GOP believed social programs of that magnitude could not be sustained without taxing companies and individuals into the dust. Clinton, by saying "Save Social Security First," was actually trumpeting that you could have a booming business world *and* sustainable and fully funded social programs. He ended the argument...which, I believe, is why a lot of hardcore conservatives went after him so hard. By ending this argument, he left conservatives with no ideological reason to exist. Pretty good.

So, if you like opportunity, economic growth and prosperity, you might just be a Democrat.

I believe government must practice fiscal responsibility and allow individuals to keep more of the money they earn. I am sure that the proper role of government is to provide for the people only those critical functions that cannot be performed by individuals or private organizations and that the best government is that which governs least.

Helping people must never and can never become a for-profit industry. With the ebb and flow of the economy, with the disparity between rich and poor, with millions working for a minimum wage that in no way matches the cost of living, you cannot require people to pay for health care, child care, education, prescription drugs etc. who cannot afford to do so.

Not every poor person is a lazy 'welfare queen.' Capitalism is a system built fundamentally on the idea of winners and losers. Capitalism is about competition. If you want to have that system, you need something in place to make sure the losers don't die in the gutters...and a lot of the time, the 'losers' are old people, children, people whose lives were ripped up by fundamentally racist 'Mandatory Minimums' laws, the handicapped and so forth. There is no profit in caring for people like this, because the people I am talking about cannot pay for it. That is why a for-profit care system cannot ever become the norm.

A good Republican named Oliver Wendell Holmes once said that taxes are the price we pay for a civilized society. One cannot even approach calling this a civilized society unless these people are taken care of. This costs money...but given the aforementioned prowess Democrats have in energizing the economy, the money spent on taxes will be amply replaced. If any of this rings true, you might be a Democrat.

I believe the most effective, responsible and responsive government is government closest to the people. I believe Americans must retain the principles that have made us strong while developing new and innovative ideas to meet the challenges of changing times. I believe Americans value and should preserve our national strength and pride while working to extend peace, freedom and human rights throughout the world.

Not to be blunt again, but most of that was well-turned sloganeering. The realities are rarely this clean cut. The country can't exist without local government, so that will never go away under a Democrat. Whose principles do you speak of? Catholic, or Protestant, or Jew, or Muslim, or atheist? Northern or Southern, Eastern or Western?

Talking about principles always feels good, and it works in commercials, but when you get down to trying to nail down which principles you actually are going to stand for, you're going to wind up leaving some important stuff out, no matter which way you go. As for "extend peace, freedom and human rights throughout the world," that gets pretty dicey. You're seeing one man's version of that idea in Iraq. I'm no isolationist - I think, for example, that a lot of our troops belong in Darfur, and not Iraq, as peacekeepers and bringers of food and medicine.

FINALLY! I believe the Republican Party is the best vehicle for translating these ideals into positive and successful principles of government. At least I used to....these days it is spiraling out of control, I know several other conservatives who are thinking along the same lines. We're desperately trying to figure out a way to escape from these last four nightmarish four years and have found that, strangely enough, in a vote for the democratic party and John Kerry.

"At least I used to..."

Damn. You might just be a Democrat.

;)

you know in your heart to be true, that you're really a democrat and you just can't seem to give up the name.
Maybe a demonstration of our power will seduce you, watch as your republican party is destroyed tommorow, to be sent to the pages of history as a miserable failure
</vader>

in a lot of instances, the best thing people can do with some of the money they earn is to pool it- in order to communally purchase that which they couldn't afford individually- that's why i got to enjoy a very nice public swimming pool as I grew up, for instance.
healthcare is one of the big area where there's much more power in pooled money than in attempts at individual funding, and the current private insurance system is extremely inequitable and increasingly cumbersome and even heavy-handed.
time and again, business has proven that it needs regulation to keep it honest. WorldCom, Enron, Silverado Savings & Loan, to name but a scant few in recent memory.
Through the years as well, especially recently- republicans have had a vested interest in seeing government solutions fail, and have successfully undermined good programs, making them pre-destined to failure.

I'm not saying that government is the solution to every problem or situation, far from it- but it shouldn't be shunned in those instances where it's necessary to maintain/improve our collective quality of life.
Taxes are the price-tag of a civil society.

One of my best friends and I have almost the same views on every political topic, but he is a republican and i am a democrat - he is voting for kerry this time around.

We both lean what has been traditionally republican on most fiscal issues and left on social issues. It is just that the things where we are both on the left are more important to me than the things where we are both on the right and vice versa.

Republicans are fine - dialogue is an important part of the process - unfortunately it no longer exists with the pundits screaming hurrah for our side and ignoring any objective reality.

The Democratic party allows you to accomplish all of these things. You have your own definite views, as all of us do. You are open minded enough to not blindly follow someone just because they say they believe the same things as you.

I'm not one of them, nor do I want to start spilling names, but lots of people here are registered Republican just to vote in primaries where they live, I'm not sure that's your case but...alas I do hope you don't get tombstoned, that took a lot of guts to say regardless.

The braver thing was coming to the realization of what Bush really was. For a long time, I went into denial. I simply didn't want to hear about it...but then, I decided that this was an arrogant and extremely foolish way of going about it. I could either lie down and let them win or I could rise up and take back control of my party

AND Put a man into office who is far more capable of leading this country. In all honesty, I like Kerry. He strikes me as a man of integrity who remains true to his word and speaks from experience. In a time of war, I think you'd have to be crazy to not want a decorated combat veteran in office. This man clearly knows the issues around war and the complexities of the global situation America finds itself in. He will do a good job, call it a gut feeling...

well-oiled GOP smear machine, huh? Absolutely astounding how they worked overtime to smear John Kerry. You really need to work overtime to take your party back. I live in Wyoming, so I know many Republicans who think like you, but are blinded by Cheney's carpetbagging ways. They are not even conscious of the constant deception that their party practices upon them. You should really think about the Democratic Party, as I think the GOP is too far gone with the fundie voodoo to return to the Party you used to love.

republicans for kerry is a very strong message.

and instead I get a nomination. Thank you.

I'm just sitting here refreshing the page and half expecting to see "Your account has been banned" or whatever the explanation page is for disruptor's "who disrupted poorly"

We may disagree on certain things, but I can respect anyone who votes with their conscience. Logically, Bush should not have as much support as he does. He's been ineffective and downright destructive as President. Thank you for your post and I wish there were more like you.

also nominated - one of the more thoughtful threads ive seen in a while.

But I admire you greatly for speaking up and being counted as one who thinks independently.

The Republican parents who raised me would never in a million years have voted for this band of loonies. These people are most definitely NOT conservative. They crave only power and are willing to trash democracy and everything else we as Americans hold dear to hold onto it.

I have disagreed with paleo-Republicans on many issues, but we all came together where it counted. Alas, not any more. The so-called Republicans who hold power now use cultural wedges to divide and tear America apart in order to conquer it. It's people like you who will put an end to it.

:yourock:

On edit: :kick:

Although, like I said in a post that I made on the topic, I had to help out my dad. After a long, up-hill battle, he decided that the only smart thing to do was vote Kerry and wait for the primaries to do our absolute best to get a true Republican walking point for the party.

Not a man like Bush who disgraces the name "Republican." Keeping up the charade by tossing conservatives a bone every now and then (the gay marriage ban, although I oppose it, would be a good example) and playing on emotions (Another example being the NRA ads that desperately try and make the case that Kerry is going to "take your guns!") Preposterous Lies. More commonly known as utter bullshit. One thing I learned from my time here at DU is that there are quite a few Democrats who adamantly support the right to bear arms.

ON EDIT: Oh what the hell, I'll tack it on here as well

:kick:

The Democrats' stance on gun contol is an enormous mistake. Consider the following anecdote.

Not too long ago I was hanging around our community gun club and (surprise surprise) a discussion of politics comes up. I brace myself for a mad dash to Bush's talking points. But, surprisingly enough, everyone in the room despised the president for everything from his ham fisted foreign policy to his intentions of meddling with the Constitution--yes, this in redneck country, folks!
Except for me, everyone in the room was a registered Republican and all (like me) were frothing-at-the-mouth gun nuts. But after each man spoke, I asked the room if they would be voting for Bush in November. Every person their basically said something like "well...he's been screwing me over with his terrible economy, he's made me ashamed to be a Republican, and to top it all off he's a world class fuckwit. But I'd rather vote for him than for someone who'll take my gun."
Bush thrives among many single issue voters as the pro-gun candidate (even though he supported the useless Assault Weapon Ban).

Kerry could simply pay lip service to the gun control crowd by supporting instant background checks and enforcement of current gun laws. Voicing his intent to increase gun control is fodder for lies and distortions from the NRA, not to mention the loss of votes by disenfranchised blue collars who otherwise can't stand the president but are afraid to "go liberal."

Sorry for the thread hijack... but the gungeon has gone quiet recently and I'm close to bursting holding in my pro-gun Democratic point of view. :)

Whether or not anybody here will beleive it, lol.

I'm going to be very interested to see the next GOP Primaries. I would not be surprised to see a dramatic reversal from the right wing shift that has been the public face of our party for the last couple of years. Like you showed, Many of us are tremendously angered with Bush but don't like Kerry that much either.

So it will be interesting to see what all these people will do when they are given an alternative that, in their eyes, is not a threat to conservative ideals, in the form of a more moderate Republican. There is talk of McCain or Guliani (I would GREATLY prefer McCain, I'm not too confident about Guliani)

Anyway, It's getting late and I've had a long day (Two feats of potentially reckless bravery, Asking out an amazing girl and then revealing my true self on DU.) I wonder if I'll be tombstoned when I wake up, has not happened yet and I think the moderators would have got on me a little bit quicker if they were going too. We'll see...

We here at DU know there are thoughtful people who differ with us (although I think there is considerable common ground in your case).

It's good to know that you put country over party and are willing to give Kerry a chance. If you happened to see Grover Norquist's interview with the Spanish newspaper El Mundo, you know that he said it didn't matter who won, if it was Kerry the Republicans would just obstruct everything he attempted to do. In other words, same playbook they used on Clinton. It would be great for all of us (Americans) if our elected representatives would support or oppose legislation on its merits rather than do so in order to rack up a win for their team.

I hope you will convince other Republicans to keep an open mind if Kerry wins. If I'm honest, though, I'm expecting more smears from the get-go, and the complete Hillary-zation of Teresa. It would be great to see ordinary Republicans DEMAND civility from their side.

Anyway, I hope you will stick around. It's good to know how the other guy thinks. I wish there were more Republicans like you.

I will say though, I don't know where you got your figures for the AmeriCorps program. The stipends are closer to about $5000 per year depending on what part of the country you're assigned to, and often most of the money is in the form of grants for college or money that is applied to student loans.

an article written up on this topic by a conservative site (Believe it or not, A Trickle of Republicans are starting to wake up and there is a quiet, almost unseen, debate raging on these issues that I have outlined. Let's hope it's the seed for reform.)

Even voted for Ronnie once. But that Iran-Contra thingy really made me start to wonder what was going on in the grand old party. I started questioning things and I wasn't satisfied with the answers I was getting. So it was then register as an Independent. But after the selection of '00, I'm a registered Democrat through and through.

what we desperately need in our system is an encouraging of thoughtful serious conservatives to take back their party. End of Story. This is a well thought out, well argued thread and should be read by all.

anti-poor, you name it. I find it hard to believe only Bush could make you question wanting to support such a piece of garbage party.

I'm sure that many DUers would agree with me in saying that, regardless of political persuasion, the one characteristic that is valued here over all others is intelligence. It's more than apparent that it requires a voluntary ignorance, of sorts, to believe that the republican party of 2004 actually embraces conservative values. The thread that links us all here is that we reject that sort of ignorance, regardless of party line.

Honestly (and this is my own opinion, of course), I'd much rather talk with a reformed right-winger who is upset with the state of his party than a democrat who responds to rational conservatives with the same bile that he reserves for the extremists in this administration.

You have made a decision to do your part to reform the party from the inside, and I applaud you for your ethics and integrity.

Keep fighting the good fight, and maybe the democratic party will have some real opposition soon! ...you know, the kind of opposition that doesn't need to rely on scare-tactics to get its party mobilized and voter-fraud to ensure their party's success.

I'm fairly young, and frankly, I don't know what a true conservative is. The only Republican president I've conciously remembered is Dubya. I HATE what he has to say, so I just made myself the complete opposite. I think I am a liberal at heart, but it's hard to imagine a Republican that isn't from the same vein as Bush.

Trust me. Like others have indicated there is a growing silent majority that is disgusted by Dubya within the heart of the GOP. It's up to us now to return our party to what it used to be. Obviously, there are many here at DU that think it used to be respectable and others that have never viewed at as even remotely decent, But that is politics. I'm not gonna debate anybody about those views because 1) I'm walking a tight-rope as it is and don't need to be stepping on any toes right now and 2) I will probabally voluntarily cut short my days here on DU. I have a party to take back....

Anyway, I really am exhausted, good night everybody.

You got another nomination from me.

I am not a Republican, and I have big disagreements with several of your stated positions, but I can't see anything particularly offensive about you. It really must be hard for you to deal with the bad name Bush and his cronies have given your party. Best of luck bringing some moderation and sanity to the GOP table.

I wish you were a Democrat, but I can deal with a conservative with a conscience and some common sense. Too bad those like you are a rare breed these days. Good luck in your efforts to change that.

as long as you post thoughful comments, you probably never will.

:hi:

You mention Eisenhower and T Roosevelt as true conservatives. I would point out that both recognized the dangers of unregulated, huge corporations. Roosevelt opposed the "trusts" of his day; Eisenhower warned of the danger of the industrial-military complex.

It's for these stances that I do not count conservatives as my enemy. Out of control corporatism is my enemy. I'll support anyone who wants to reign that in; at this point in time those voices are coming almost exclusively from the far-left, so that's where I find myself standing.

Good luck purging your party; it will be difficult, but important work.

Roosevelt and Eisenhower were good men and IMHO are the true soul of conservatism. If the GOP returned to what it was in those days, Everybody would win! Cause nobody would have to face the danger of another president like * gaining control of the Oval Office.

I have some serious bones to pick with the GOP, but this isn't the time to go into that.

I'm a livelong Democrat, but I've been around long enough to see the Republican Party transform itself into something that would horrify the likes of Barry Goldwater, Dwight Eisenhower and Everett Dirksen.

In order for this country to survive, Republicans and Democrats will have to find a common ground from which to start working together. The GOP must cease trying to make the two-party system extinct. We have got to work together in this world to survive as a nation.

I thank you sincerely for looking beyond yourself to seek out the greater good, and to support the best candidate to achieve that end.

My best to you -- :toast:

You have to got to forget about partisan politics for the good of the entire nation. I realize that many of my beliefs fly in the face of everything that you guys think (hence why I am a Republican) but we're Americans first and right now the country is in trouble so I have to give my support to John Kerry, the guy who I think can lead us out of the trouble..........and who also just happens to be a democrat! It's not like I'm switching nationalities or working for "the enemy" I simply think that, THIS TIME, they will do a better job and deserve my support.

I think that the only rule here at DU is that all members are expected to support the Democratic candidate for president (and probably other offices). Seems to me that you are doing that in your post.

Democrats. The greatest need in this country is to reclaim the Republican party from the neocons and religious fanatics who have taken it over. Frankly, if these people could just count, they would figure out that they would win every election if they would just shut the frick up about social issues and run on lowering taxes but also have the plain guts to cut spending as well because of the growth of the me-first white suburban middle class. It's just common sense and it shouldn't be hard, but nobody who has ever tasted power and influence is eager to give it up. I would actually be willing to join the Republican party to help in its reclamation, but at heart, I'm a bomb-throwing longhair Trotskyite. I'd never fit in.

Regardless, I wish you luck, welcome you as a Kerry voter and hope you can stay around as a DUer.

By the way, this made the DU Blog (normally the homepage, but today is kind of a special day)

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

but they are voting for Kerry

There have been several reports that during voter registration drives -- people have been finding that they were "re-registered" as republicans

as despicable as that may be



-- the bottom line is -- it doesn't matter what party you are registered as, being a registered whatever doesn't mean you are necessarily voting for that party's candidate

In fact, one of my favorite presidents is Eisenhower, because he disengaged from Korea sensibly and did not try to undermine the powers of Congress. Too, I respected Goldwater, although I profoundly disagreed with him. I will never object to the public presence of intelligent and principled conservatives who are not blinded by dogma or set to impose their beliefs on others, even if I do not support them.

It does make me worry that when I and others vent our frustrations here, more moderate members like you may be quite offended.

Did you ever read interviews with Goldwater in the 1990s, when he blasted Falwell/Robertson and lamented the Republican party's sinking into the hands of the religious right?

:hi:

Been registered "unaffiliated" for many years. Was registered in the "R" column between ages 18 and 24. I'm not big on either party, or any of the "alternative" parties. But DU seems to tolerate me. I hain't been booted yet. Prolly 'cause nobody can tell what in the hell I'm thinking with the random blabbering that emerges from my fingertips onto these pages.

My partner, in fact, is a recovering Republican. He voted for Bush the Elder, then Ross Perot twice, and last time he voted Libertarian. It took ten years and Farenheit 9/11 to convince him to vote a straigh Dem ticket this year. Now he says he'll never vote Republican again.

One of my co-workers is a life-long Republican who even served in the Texas Air National Guard (no, he wasn't in W's alleged unit). Anyway, this is the first time he's ever voted Dem and although he feels funny about it, he can't bring himself to vote for W again.

One of my closest friends was a knee-jerk Republican during the Clinton years. We got him off hate radio in 2000 and finally, this year, he's voting for Kerry for the first time, though I think he might go off the rails and vote for Nader. The one thing he won't do is vote for W again. He says that W's screwed us economically because in betraying the trust of our allies we've disincented them to trade fairly with us.

My father actually held a local office as a Republican when I was in high school (although to be fair, the former incumbent was a Dem, so he had to run as a Rep). My mother campaigned for Reagan as Govenor of California. Both of them are Oregonians voting Kerry.

Hi, Nightowl:

I'm a Libertarian who knows my party will not win. For the reasons you voted for Kerry, I hope that Kerry wins this election.

In spite of being Libertarian, I appreciate and value the DU board, and I lurk here a lot.

Dlynne

Seems like a very respectable force and one that I could get along with. Unfortunately, I'm certain that they and their candidate (Bodnarik isn't it?) does not stand a chance in the election. I wish they would come back into the GOP, Might be the decisive blow in retaking the republican party. Thanks for comment and welcome to DU.

There are a great many Republicans for Kerry around. In fact the very reasons you mentioned, and some more, where arguements I used to persuade many Republicans to vote for Kerry in my heavily Republican precinct.

Many many of the old school Republicans are mad as hell at Bush and the Neo-Cons, and they want their party back. I don't blame them, it has been hijacked by crypto-facist scumbags who think that they are entitled to rule the world.

So hey, welcome, and thanks for your support. Together we can kick the Bush gang back to Crawford, and retake our country back from the greedheads and facists.

... because you are following your beliefs. Personally, I don't hate Republicans, only people that refuse to think.

Congratulations for thinking this whole thing through. Consider yourself more fully evolved. For me, this wasn't so much about Dems Vs. Repubs as it was about arrogance and poor judgement.

If W was a Democrat, I would feel the same way.

Never be ashamed of your political affiliation. Bipartisanship is essential for the survival of democracy.

Best of luck.

Whether your a Republican or Democrat is what really, truly matters. It is most certainly not! Political Parties were formed to serve the good of the nation, Not the other way around. I respect democrats just as much as I do my fellow, true, Republicans. Both are simply trying to do what they believe is best for the country and cooperation between the two, as you indicated, is essential if we want this democracy to survive.

I, for one, admire anyone, regardless of political stripe, who actually examines his party of choice with an intellectual, critical eye.

Sadly, the two party system isn't woeking, and both sides tend to default to emotional issues to sway voters.

Yes, the Republican Party has been hijacked. So has the Democratic Party. Both have been bought by private interests, and this election isn't so much about right versus left as it is about corporate collectivism versus the individual.

Thank you for your vote for Kerry. We'll get him in, and then we can start to work for change. '

Cheers from this non-voting Canuck.

by the radical religious right wingers. I believe the party has left YOU.

I felt I was thrown out of the party when Regan and the religious right gained control of the Republican party. There is no place for a moderate in the Republican party anymore.

I used to be a republican but now I am a democrat...100 percent dem!!!

When Reagan won, I voted Democratic and have voted that way for President ever since.

I think that is one of the things that has horrified me the most is watching the GOP turn into a party I don't even recognize from my youth.

I can respect old-school GOP, even though I may disagree with them on a lot of their issues. And though we may disagree, at least there is still reasonable dialogue, at least there is still a chance to find some sort of common ground.

The loudest voices of today's GOP? Yeegads, some of them scare the crap out of me. (Theocracy? No thanks, I'll pass!)

I sincerely hope there is a fight for the soul of the GOP after the election -- and I hope the "good" guys win. :hi:

there are parts of your message that i agree with wholeheartedly, and parts that i take issue with. a lot of those have been addressed above and i don't have the time right this minute to write a well-thought-out response, so i won't try.

the main thing i want to express is that this is what we need here - discussion about real issues, with real facts - there will always (i hope) be honest disagreement among us about what the best way is to govern this nation, and i'm glad that not everyone agrees with me, because i've been wrong before (really, lots of times).

this was the biggest pick-me-up of my day. so far. hoping for an even bigger one later.

(I didn't read your thread)
:hi:

Personally, I'd vote to let you stay, since, though I'm sure I'd disagree with many of your opinions, at least you are thoughtful enough to have your own opinions and not just muddle along like most 'conservative Republicans' nowadays.

The exact same people that bemoaned Clinton's 'nation building' in 2000 are now the biggest cheerleaders for it in 2004. And the same group that hated Democrats for being 'big spenders' now support the biggest spending spree since LBJ.

Don't know how it'll turn out here, but thanks for your vote, and best of luck to all of us!

Another thread got deleted so I can't sort of foolishly assume that the moderators STILL are not aware of my presence. I guess I have been granted a reprieve. I always found that funny too, when we went into Kosovo without a UN Mandate most Republicans let the Clinton Administration have pure hell for it. Now we go into Iraq without a UN Mandate and there is hardly a whisper of complaint from within the GOP! Oh well, We'll figure it all out in due time with the Republican Primaries. Thanks for the welcome....

that admins are aware of the thread and that you are at less than no risk of being banned.

I guess I have been spared. That's certainly good to know.

Thanks for your EXCELLENT insight into why so many Repubs are disenchanted with their party these days.

Most of my immediate family (at least those who are political) are old-fashioned "Rockefeller Republicans" who believe in the exact same things you do-- civil liberties and free enterprize. It's really unfortunate that the GOP has been taken over by religious zealots and PNAC whackos who think that the best way to "keep America safe" is to oppress the rest of the world.

Strangely enough, most of the PNAC crowd actually started out as Kennedy Liberals. They believed in a tough, pro-interventionist foreign policy to stop the spread of "communism", and spared no expense to fight the Cold War bugaboos they found everywhere.

Either way, welcome to the Big Tent. I'm sure you'll disagree with this old-fashioned Commie-Lib-Greenie-Tree-Hugging-Cultural-Elitist, but that's the fun of having a party this diverse!

:thumbsup:

Fiscally Conservative yet fairly socially liberal. Like I've indicated many times before on this thread, there are quite a few conservatives who are growing more disgusted with Bush with each and every passing day, I saw one person actually say it on a Conservative Forum "There is a fight brewing, A fight for the very soul of the GOP" Truer words were never spoken!

Thanks for the welcome to "The Big-Tent"........you commie pinko bastard ;)

Only joking!

I might not agree with many of your positions, but those are all open to debate. The position we share is our strongest bond. :thumbsup:

I once voted Independent. I don't have any problem with Republicans on this board as long as they are not disruptors (who may be of any stripe)which you obviously are not. If you stick around long enough you may change your views on more than just getting the idiot from Crawford out of our WH. Good luck on taking your party back; I'm afraid the neocons have outmanned you. No alert here.

Happy to have you here, and congratulations for having the integrity to place your country and your principles ahead of absolute loyalty to your party.:toast:

I really think that you are doing your party a favor in the long run, by helping to get rid of Bush and the neocons.

I hope that you and others like you will fight to reclaim your party from the neocons and the theocrats and make it once again, a repository of sane and responsible conservatism.

We need a two party (at least) system. We just need for all the parties to agree to the fundamental principles of a democratic system.