I'm an animal lover but this is freaking ridiculous(RANT!!!)

I'm referring to this thread in particular:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x1999278

Particularly the first three pictures, in the first two is a purebred cat that is, while cute, prone to problems that shorten its life due to our intervention in natural cycles. The 3rd picture is pure animal abuse. For anyone who finds that cat as cute, do you find 6 year old children that weigh 250 pounds cute too?

Unless that cat has some type of genetic defect that causes it to gain that much weight, it needs a diet badly, and the owner SHOULD NOT HAVE ANIMALS PERIOD!!!!!

Taking care of pets is a serious responsibility, and should NEVER be taken lightly. To have a cat that weighs in at, by the looks of it, 30 pounds or so is abusive in the extreme. How likely is it that that cat will develop diabetes, or can run and play like other cats? What the hell is wrong with people nowadays, treating animals as if they are their personal toys to play with and then discard like rubbish, or simply treat them as little humans, with little regard to the consequences.

This is a larger issue than just that particular thread. Its not like I'm an advocate for PETA, hell I eat meat all the time, except ground up crap, that is unsanitary and disgusting, love catfish and chicken though :). However, there are limits as to what should and should not be allowed, ethically, in the treatment of animals. For example, I don't like what Dog and Cat breeders do to get purebred animals. In some cases, its a genetic defect that is then turned into a dominate trait due to our intervention, look at the munchkin breed of cat for an example of that.

What is the quality of life does an animal bred with skin defiencies, liver problems, kidney problems, and many other conditions, simply for aestetics live? This is not to say that all purebreds are this way, but many are, and this disturbs me to no end. Sheep dogs and other, older breeds serve useful purposes for humans, but usually, this doesn't decrease their quality of life in a significant way. In the case of sheep dogs, it was in our best interest to have a dog that is healthy for a long time, for it is more economical that way(self interest comes first for our species).

But think about this, even some mutts become victim to callous breeding techniques, quite by accident usually. My dog, Lucky was a mutt, rescued by the side of a highway, he was abandoned and we believe abused as well. He was also unfortunate in that he was a cross breed between a Weiner dog and a larger breed, because of this by the time he was 5, we had to give him aspirin for the arthritis in his legs, they were at least a third too short for his body size. Thankfully the pain was controllable and not debillitating, however he only lived to be 13 years old. This I found odd, because we rarely have any animals that lived less than 18 years old on average.

Just to give an example of the history of our family at having pets, my grandfather had a beagle, born about 3 months before me, he lived to see my 19th birthday party. Beagles live on average 12-15 years, he died a few months after my grandfather died. He was, technically, mine and my grandfather's dog, simply because my parents were poor and guess where we ate every weekend :). Believe me, that dog was running all the way up till the day he died, and he yelped with the best of them, I still miss him.

Cats, thankfully, haven't been bred the way dogs are until the 20th century. However, I do not view artificial breeding of any sort, especially for superficial reasons, in a good light. Cats are naturally affectionate and also are cute as can be without the need for our intervention. Cats should not be bred in the ways they are now, simply because the only ones who ultimately benefit are humans not cats.

This also brings up another point, mutilation of animals for our sake. I'm referring to declawing, I find the practice horrific and inhumane. Cutting off the first joint of a cats front paws simply for the sake of furniture is just cruel. People who are willing to do such things to animals SHOULD NOT HAVE THEM. Do the Cats a favor and give them to someone who actually cares about their best interest!

There are alternatives to declawing that are much more humane, one of them is simple training, and with persistance it pays off. Another is soft paws(I think that is the name) that covers the claws and doesn't bother the cat. I've known a couple of people who had their cats declawed, and soon afterwards, they became biters, which is much worse. Their first line of defense, their front claws, were gone, so the went to the next best thing, their teeth. Which is worse, being bitten or scratched? Both cats were put to sleep because of this horrendious practice and the change in behavior it caused, and its outlawed in more civilized countries for crying out loud.

When we got Lucky, my dog, we knew right off the bat that he was going to have problems later in life. So we strived to make it as comfortable and fulfilling as possible for him. I loved him with all my heart, but everytime I saw him try to run in the back yard, with his odd gait, or climb steps with difficulty, I felt sadness at the life he was cursed with simply because of what his parents were. I felt anger at whoever even thought about the Dachshund breed and the lack of foresight we humans so sorely lack that we take no consideration as to how those animals we love the most are so used and abused. The knuckling of his forlegs was a primary reason for his arthritis.

We look at the practices of Asia, seeing cats and dogs used as food, and point fingers at this horrendious practice. Yet, which is worse, being killed and eaten for food, or forced to suffer a decade or more, in pain and sickness due to breeding, just because you look cute? Isn't it a little hipocritical to call them out on their treatment of these animals because they view them as food, while at the same time many of us only view ours as accent pieces for the home and nothing more?

You are pointing your finger at the cruelty to animals by declawing and inbreeding and allowing an animal to become too fat (which, by the way, I agree with), but aren't you being a bit hypocritical since you are a meat eater. Check out Web sites on factory farming and you will see what I mean.

not by any means, also I don't get my chicken from KFC, I get it from local farmers, there are a few left, thank Gods. They don't have factories that torture the animals before they are slaughtered. I mostly eat that and certain fish, plus the occasional venison (yummy). I'm a courteous omnivore, similar to hunters of the past I guess, though I don't do much of that, animals need not suffer to provide food for us, it can be done cleanly and with little to no suffering. My point is that none of us, not you, nor me, can be completely guilt free where animals are concerned, but we should at least minimize their suffering.

I'm sorry, I couldn't resist rising to it. Flame or not, the choice is yours.

I ask them, they nod their head yes, then I slit their throats, making sure to say thank you afterwards. :evilgrin:

I just wanted to reply again, I didn't mean to get on a soap box of sorts and talk down to anybody through it. I do realize my own hypocracy in this and also my own faults and weaknesses as well. In my religion, the Rede states "An it harm none, do what thy wilt." This, I'm happy to say, is an impossible creed to follow, because any action we take has potential negative consequences on others, both Human and otherwise. So I interepret it as saying, Minimize the harm you do to others, and take caution in your actions and decisions, this is my creed so to speak, and I try to follow it to the best of my ability.

To give an example, Global Climate Change and Air pollution are excellent examples. We critize large corporations for dragging their feet on alternative energy or alternate means of transport. We critize SUV owners that have no practical use for such vehicles that are so wasteful. Yet most of us drive cars or trucks, are we hypocritical? It would depend on one thing, for me, as an example, I purposely drive a 4 banger to minimize the pollution, plus it saves me gas. Its only when you have a willful disregard for the consequences of your actions that you are hypocritical. I would love to use public transport, or a hybrid/electric car, or even a bike, if those were practical. But I can't, at least not all the time, I ride a bike when practical.

There are times when things a blurred, that is the time when most disagreements occur. However in the case above, I'm talking about totally needless and unusually cruel suffering perpetuated by Humans on our evolutionary cousins. We are not above the animal kingdom, but a part of it, the point being that we must minimize the impact and suffering we perpetuate, starting at the personal level, so that others will hopefully follow. I don't begrudge you your choice of diet, and in fact applaud it, but do realize that you are not the only one who cares.

:eyes:

to decry someone as not an animal lover because the eat meat is just pure insane PETA BS...

I had a fat cocker spaniel and he died of a heart attack at the age of 10! But I'm sure you aren't lumping ME in with evil animal abusers. I just couldn't resist his sweet begging eyes. But I learned my lesson and my new cocker is a perfect weight and will remain so.

Other than that, I guess I agree with your rant. :-)

A warning, reclining chairs and cats do NOT mix, at all, and be aware of the animals around you while in one. Anyways, this is what happened to one of our kitties, Zero, she was caught in a recliner while my stupid ass BIL to be was getting out of it. Needless to say, that after rushing her to hospital, and a week stay, she had a spinal cord injury, it wasn't cut, but bruised. The vet said that it is thankful she is young, that she'll recover eventually, she was about 5 months old at this time. Well, she doesn't run around the house, she gallops because she doesn't move her spine like a normal cat. Now a year and a half later, she is finally getting some of that mobility back, spinal cord injuries I would never wish on my worse enemy, either Human or Cat. It took her this long to finally relearn to jump FORWARD onto couches and stuff, and she falls all the time, but immediately gets up and tries again.

For the longest time, she would jump straight up into the air to get on the couch or chairs and stuff, she couldn't run and jump at the same time I guess. What she did was flail around her front paws till they caught the fabric so she could get up there(another reason not to declaw cats). She's not in pain, thank goodness, and she tries so hard, but unlike Lucky, we are seeing an improvment rather than a degeneration. Also, about that offending chair, we still have it, removed the stubby legs on it so no animal can ever get under it again, plus we broke the handle on the side off. Just a beat up chair she loves to sleep in now.

but I do find it a little hard to blame all of obesity in a cat on the owner. Case in point: Several of my cats are big--VERY big. One of them, Garibaldi, is a long hair tabby, and he weighs in at 18 pounds. There is hardly no "fat" on him--he just happens to be a BIG cat. My other two males (one of whom I lost last year) are/were in the 15-16 lb. range. Again--very little fat on any of them. Jessica, my "largest" female, weighed in at 14 lbs. Now, with 6 cats, there is no way that you can truly feed them differently. They have a communal dry food bowl that they can eat from all day, and I might treat them with a can of food split between them all. Jessica, unfortunately, developed diabetes and lost half her weight, and she looks emaciated. She's now on insulin.

The fact is, NONE of these cats has a diet any different than any of the others. The males are all solid muscle (Jean-Luc even looks like a miniature cougar) even though they are very large.

Sometimes--more times than not, it's a genetic factor which will make them (like humans as well!) prone to certain diseases. For instance, my biological mother died of heart disease, and was an alcoholic and a heavy smoker, as well as drank 20 cups of coffee a day. I have been a vegetarian since 1990, don't drink alcoholic beverages or coffee, smoke or do anything that would make heart disease a risk for me. And yet, I had a heart attack when I was 43. It's because we inherit some things from our parents that contribute to different diseases, and regardless of how you change your life to try and avoid those rick factors, it's probably something you can do absolutely NOTHING about.

I don't care for a lot of breeders myself, of dogs OR cats, but some of them are doing wonderful things for animals in their care. There are some breeders who save animals from the shelters, some who hand raise kittens when necessary, those who will conduct spay and neuter clinics and help with education of people in order to find a way to stem the tide of overpopulation. The real culprits are those who run puppy mills, or who will try to breed animals which are too sickly or weak to breed, thus killing them in the process. The other culprits are those who breed specialty animals like greyhounds, and then bring them out behind the barn and shoot them when they can't win races. People who look at animals as trade, stock or property often look at them that way because that's the way they've always done so. I remember an episode of Designing Women years ago when Charlene (Jeam Smart) who grew up on a farm, said they learned not to name the animals because they were intended as food, not pets. The fact is, though, that some people WILL change. My uncle used to hunt when he was young, and at a family reunion not that long ago, he said he went out hunting and couldn't shoot the deer after looking it straight in the eye. He stopped hunting.

If you are really concerned about dogs, cats and other domestic animals and how they are treated, bred and such, join a local chapter of the SPCA or anti-vivesection society, or other animal based charity near you. Trust me--I've done it. There are so many ways we CAN help, and people out there are often surprised by the facts you can give them. At the very least, perhaps volunteer at the shelter, or at a vet's (some will allow it) to help walk the dogs, feed them or in other words keep them happy. YOu will get more satisfaction in the end.

all muscle too, he was huge, but had little body fat. He's also the only cat I know who actually pounced on a bird from mid air. I walked outside, and there is this 30 foot tree in the neighbors front yard, anyways, I here a rustleing up above, so I look to the top, and I saw my cat looking down at something, it was a nest. Apparently the mother was still in it, she started flying away, he jumped down, caught her in his claws, then fell an additional 25 feet to the ground. I rushed to him, figuring that he was hurt, hell no he wasn't, he looked quite proud of himself, and damned near smashed the bird flat.

That is not bad, because that is most likely genetic, and healthy, I'm talking about like the cat in the 3rd picture of my link, where they have so much body FAT that they are nearly as large as an Adult human torso. As far as genetic diseases, it is true that our pets are just as prone as we are, but it is different for them because of extended inbreeding for purebreds. If you were forced to mate with you sibling(s) and produced a child with a birth defect, who is to blame for that? What if it happened for generations, new diseases and conditions arise out of such things. I just find it stupid to do that to animals, while there are considerate breeders, these are ones who try to widen the gene pool a little bit so that these horrid conditions do not arise in future generations. But some breeds, especially new ones, are extremely expensive, and greedy, bad, breeders try to preserve the breed any way possible including inbreeding, to the detriment of the offspring of these animals.

probably between 10 and 14, I'd guess. She looks like my step-daughter at about 11.

Pcat

I won't address the two kittens in 1 and 2 because we don't do pure-breds. (Our Siamese is an accident and a long story, but she's not pure. She just thinks she is. :-) )

Our boy cat is 13.26 pounds at last weigh-in. He's about 30 inches long from nose to tail tip at full stretch and he has that strange little belly that some male cats get after neutering; he was neutered at 6 months of age. According to the vet, he is not obese and only slightly overweight. (We can't put him on a diet without putting our girl cat on a diet, and she's the supermodel type - eats all the time and gains no weight.) The vet wants him to lose that quarter pound. In other words, if he was a human and weighted 132 pounds, the vet would like him to lose about 5 pounds. No big deal.

However, if we took a picture of our boy-cat in the same pose as #3, he'd look like the Cat that ate Chicago. That belly of his is floppy and sways when he runs. What he needs is something more on the lines of a lift and tuck than a diet.... but cosmetic surgery for cats? let's not be silly.

I'm just saying...

Pcat

I raised the two girls from kittens. They grew to 12 and 13 pounds. They're just really BIG cats. Not fat, just big. They have little bellies, but the vet said it's fine since they were spayed and that often happens. Also, They are fluffy so it makes them look fatter than they really are.

I got the boys at 10 mos. and the woman I got them from even said they were going to be BIG boys. Kenai is 14 pounds and Koda is a little over 15. They're just really big cats. Again, not fat, just big. Even when people come over they are shocked at how big they are. I was caring for two cats a few months ago and I couldn't believe the difference between a "normal" cat and my cats. Im so used to looking at them I can't see them as anything but the norm.

I own a munchkin and breeding them to obtain munchkin kittens is very difficult. You can have two munchkin cats and not get one munchkin kitten out of the whole lot. They are a natural mutation, not man made. Sure their are breeders out there that attempt to make munckins kittens but you never make any money out of it. It's not a dominate trait at all.

My munchkin is fixed because I don't even want to think I can duplicate her. No guarantees, unlike with other purebred animals where all you need them to do is breed and you get more of the same.

She will live a long and normal life because we humans didn't make them.

Here are the history of the munchkin and a link about them below:

Munchkin - History
Although the Munchkin is very new from the standpoint of the cat fancy, cats with short legs were know in England in the 1930s and four generations were described in the Veterinary Record in 1944. This line, however, seems to have disappeared during World War II. In 1983 Sandra Hochenedel, then living in Louisiana, was looking for a new cat. What she found was a pregnant black female (later named Blacberry) with short legs living under a pickup truck. In her first litter and each subsequent litter Blackberry passed the trait of short legs on to about half of her kittens. One of Blackberry's sons, Toulouse, was given to a friend named Kay LaFrance who established a colony of Munchkins on her Louisiana plantation. The present Munchkins are descendants of Blackberry and Tououse, although Munchkins have been sited throughout North America and the world.

http://www.thepetprofessor.com/cat-breeds/Munchkin-cat.html