Anyone here try the RAW diet?

I think the guys name is Jordano or something like that?Just curious!

Don't know what diet you're talking about specifically, but i know raw diets are great for dogs, just pretty messy and expensive.

i abhor vegetarianism.. it's just stupid IMO..

:eyes:

your cholesterol is too high, your arteries are plugged and your blood pressure is higher than a kite. Animal fat is responsible for all those conditions. Humans, who are evolved apes, are genetically vegetarian meaning that they should eat meat only occasionally. A suggestion was made that if one ate meat only on special occasions like holidays, birthdays or weddings humanity would not have those problems mentioned above.

I have been vegetarian for over a decade now and being over sixty I should be suffering from one or more of the above conditions but I don't. My grocery bill is considerably less too because animal products cost more than plant products. If I grew a lot of my food, it would be even less.

it's called moderation. To completely give up meat because of "ethical" reasons or whatever other reason you can come up with is silly, and is counterintuitive to humans as mammals in an evolutionary sense. The protien requirement for our bodies is sufficiently high to make vegetarianism impractical for many people.


The most convincing argument for the prevalence of the ailments you mention above are due to the massive amounts of processed foods, carbohydrates in particular, in the civilized world. These sugars affect insulin response and subsequently will alter the amount of food stored, as well as creating a roller coaster of available energy to any particular individual. This is a well-known phenomenon. Think of all the things that vegetarians eat that are in no way healthy or natural, yet contain no meat and tell me that they are superior somehow to someone who eats meat regularly.



In other words, i think vegetarianism is stupid.


:eyes:

Again, another enlightened response. :eyes:

I've seen some crappy posts about vegetarianism before on this board, but man, "vegetarianism is stupid"???

Many, many people have lived their lives without meat and live quite happily and healthy. It's been going on for thousands of years.

There really isn't any reason for anyone to eat meat. It's cruel and disgusting. But, hey, if you want to eat rotting animal carcass go ahead.

I don't eat "rotting animal carcass"..

You really should bring it back a notch or two.

really there is nothing funnier than a militant vegetarian.

She became so sick and emaciated she had a seizure while driving home from work. It doesn't work for everyone, and it's way overplayed as far as health benefits in my opinion.


I had a friend that said she never really ate meat because it was "disgusting" then while she was eating a bowl of jell-o i felt the need to inform her of how said bowl of jell-o recieved it's particular characteristic.. you wanna talk disgusting try jell-o..

blame on her being a vegetarian. Most vegetarians that eat healthy diets usually live to be very old.

It's dead cow. Dead chicken. Dead pig. Dead rabbit. Dead lamb. Dead fish. Dead duck. Dead calves. Do you think it just magically stays "fresh". It doesn't. It's slowly rotting. Just like any other food.

But, if you want to live in a dream world were there is "meat" and not brutalized bodies of animals, you do so. It helps it go down easier, I know. It's kind of hard to eat "meat" when you actually know what has happened to it.


Yummy!

We raised hogs and chickens when I was a kid. I've seen plenty of slaughtered animals, and I'm under no illusions about where meat comes from.

I guess it would be shocking to someone who's only experience with farm animals comes from reading Charlotte's Web or watching Babe. You can be a vegan if you want, but your condescending attitude toward people who choose to eat meat only shows your intolerance toward people with a different point of view.

By the way, what's with the horse pics. Last time I checked we don't eat that. At least I know I don't.

Must be nice to be so sure of yourself and high and mighty above others who feel that present day animal farming methods are beyond cruel, cruelty. When you come back as a cow or chicken in your next life, I hope that you remember how you felt as a carnivorous, callous, human being.

I agree that present day farming methods are cruel, there's not much i can do about it other than supporting products that obtain meat and other things from smaller operations. I occasionally drive to a meat market way out in the sticks for the quality as well as where they get their beef.



whatever.. nothing is going to get accomplished here.

of course it said to me that you were calloused and didn't care about the source of your food, but since you do make an effort, I can't fault you there. Some vegetable growing practices are just as exploitive and I try to get my food at farmer's markets when I can for the same reason.

Many people on the Atkins diet have seen their cholesterol and blood pressure drop, not rise. Also, humans have been eating meat for at least 2 million years, based on ancient spearheads and cutting tools found in fossilized habitats of Homo erectus in Africa. Heck, dogs and cats evolved from "genetically vegetarian" ancestors if you look far enough back in the fossil record. Even our closest relatives, chimpanzees, occasionally hunt other apes and monkeys for meat. Humans are genetically omnivores, not herbivores.

Killing an animal that had more value for wool or milk was done on special occasions and they were sacrificed to the gods. In hunter gatherer societies, the bulk of food stuffs comes from the gatherers, not the hunters. Incidentally, people on the Atkins diet have suffered from various side effects because of the intense protein load up. Also, the weight loss isn't permanent, like it is on a vegetarian diet. Trust me, you are better off eating meat only occasionally and fish is so much better for you than beef or pork.

Once you limit your meat consumption to once a week or even once a month, you will find it less and less attractive. You will feel much better because of the extra energy the carbs give you. I know, been there and done that.

it's true that the amount of meat in our diets has increased since the early days of agriculture, but you make it seem like much less than it actually was. The amount varied according to the region, but it would be fair to say that meat of some kind found it's way into at least one meal a day in most cases. The idea that meat was rarely eaten is simply not true in most cases

As for the hunter/gatherer, the general consensus among scientists is that the increase in protein in our diet from the significant amount of meat consumed by our ancestors (particularly bone marrow) was the catalyst for the evolution of our large brain. After that, as we spread our diet varied by region. For example, hunter/gatherers in Northern Europe had significantly more meat in their diet than hunter/gatherers in Africa. The climate dictated the diet.

There has been some speculation that people whose ancestors came from these colder climates where meat was a larger part of the diet can sometimes have a harder time eliminating meat from their diet, but that's really just speculation.

I don't have a problem with people who choose to go vegan, but to pretend that it's natural and to say that we evolved vegetarian is simply false. Going vegan is a moral stance. If the people who take that stance really believe it's morally right, then historical backing is not necessary.

I stated in my last sentence that we are omnivores. I never said we evolved to eat meat all the time, with every meal, just that we've evolved to eat it along with vegetables and grains.

I agree that the Atkins diet doesn't seem healthy in the long run, but thats why you are supposed to slowly transition to more and more carbs after you've been on it for a while. That is part of the diet, to reintroduce carbs after major weight loss is complete. Honestly, I don't think I've read any studies that tracked Atkins patients for more than 6 months at a time, so there isn't much long-term data either way on the diet's adverse effects that I'm aware of. The short-term side-effects of Atkins that I've read of, though, seem far preferable to the very real health threats that many of the obese who go on the diet already have.

As to the carbs, they never gave me much energy. I've eaten low-meat, high-carb diets and always felt drained, until I started eating meat again. I started to find meat MORE attractive (God did I start to crave a good hamburger or steak), not less, when I was only eating it once or twice every week. There is no one-size-fits-all diet; each person has to find what suits them best.

Increased demand would be one factor, but it would mainly be a matter of opportunistic greed. Being a vegetarian, you probably hadn't noticed, but it's no coincidence that meat and cheese prices have damn near doubled since the Atkins diet plan (and similar high protein clones) became popular. So if a big segment of the population went all veggie tomorrow, tofu would take a huge price jump within weeks.

Kudos to anyone who can keep the committment to vegetarianism though. I don't ever see myself going completely down that road. (And it's a little tough to be high protein-low carb and veggie at the same time (You can only eat Boca Burgers so many days in a row)

All the land that is plowed to provide feed would be used for growing soybeans and food for people instead, not cows. It's far more efficient in yield and better for the land.

to keep a cow to butchering age compared to the yield of veggies you would get from that same amount of water. The world is not, and should not, be devoted to the most efficient methods of production to the exclusion of every other form of food.


The root problem here is that there are just too many damn people on the planet, and there's too much money to be made selling food to those people. The family farm that produces meat is all but extinct.

I've done vegetarian for a short period of time and it's a pain in the ass to eat enough food to keep my high muscle mass happy..



p.s. I dont' think people that practice vegetarianism are stupid, i just think that militant, over the top proselytizing (sp?) of it is really annoying. It just doesn't work for everyone, and there are quite a few people who have issues with not getting enough protein and in the proper ratio. I don't beat people over the head for not eating meat, and post pictures of all the dead corn stalks to try and gross them out of eating corn..

www.beyondvegan.com used to have a TON of info on this, but the guy appears to be revising his page.

If memory serves: this particular expert did not recommend it - you tend to consume waay to much sugar (from fruit), have difficulty avoiding protein and calorie deficiency, and no one manages to stick with it for very long.

I've never tried it, so don't take my word for it. Fad diets are rarely a great idea - cooking your veggies allows for a vastly wider selection of foods and there's nothing that says you can't still eat plenty of raw things.

It's important for people on a raw vegan diet to make an exception to consume vitamin B12 from supplements or fortified soymilk.

Vegan women who are nursing or pregnant especially need B12 for their babies' development.

You can buy or make flaxseed meal, too.

There are just some things that should be cooked, like potatoes, beets and beans.

a potato should always be cooked :-) Preferably mashed, with some garlic :-)

The regiftee seemed to really like it

flesh. A few more years munching raw broccoli would be years in HELL!

Give me Bacon AND give me death a few years sooner!

If that's what it takes!

but so far I've dropped about 65 pounds just by exercising and going Vegan. The veganism (I switched over from vegetarianism) makes me feel alot more healthy... and exercise (I used to do cardio, but since the Vegan switch only weights)... makes me feel like gold.

Life is good. All life.

It is hard to keep up over time. I felt much better on the raw food diet, but I lost a lot of weight. I'm already thin, so it was not good for me to lose that much weight.

I still do raw food diet for a few weeks twice a year before and after a fast.

If you try it go slow. Drink lots of water at first too You will find that your body begins releasing toxins like crazy when ou go to raw foods. For the first few days you will have brutal headaches if you do not wash the toxins out of your system.

I especially eat salad stuff raw. I live by myself so that's one less chore I have to do.

Since I'm an atkins person, I eat protein and round out with fruit and veggies. As much as I love them I stay away from most starches like potatoes. The only exception is sushi. I'll eat the rice in that.

I suppose that it could work but I think that I would get too thin before I got used to it. I like raw veggies in small quantities but never can eat say a pound of carrots. I seem to be able to eat larger quantities if consumed with a vinegar and oil dressing. Is vinegar considered raw? Too many raw veggies seem to give me digestive problems besides. I don't like soy products either. Even if I could eat much raw plant material as I could of starches and meat, I still don't think that I could get in enough calories. I am on the low end of a healthy weight and don't even do regular exercise.