Can you be a seafood eating vegetarian...?

...or is that just cheating and totally out of line?

Just wondered--inspired by the other thread, and I've always wondered about this...

:hi:

Thanks!

A fish is not plant. A so-called "pesco-vegetarian" (or whatever :eyes: ) is an omnivore.

that's kind of what I thought, but figured it might make interesting conversation to ask. LOL!

wouldn't be a correct term, either. Omni meaning all.

I prefer the term flexitarian. If I feel like eating it at the moment, I eat it.

Please don't get me started on "flexitarian," it's just a fashionable way to say omnivore. :eyes:

but omni still means all. Probably the main thing that has kept me from totally embracing the complete vegetarian diet is the attitude of some of it's adherents. It can be downright evangelical and condescending. Kind alike this: :eyes:

That and I like a good slab of rare red meat once in awhile. :9

techy about that but there are vegetarians that do eat fish. A friend told me that her DIL is veggie but she eats fish because it doesn't break her "anything with a face" rule since she's never seen a fish with a smile. ;)

LOL! ...never seen a fish with a smile.

I've seen some rather 'passionate' conversations about vegeatarian lifestyles, etc. So I can imagine that they would be 'techy.' I also understand the ideals behind it and the desire to be true to eating nothing that could be killed, hurt, etc.

about Paul McCartney. McCartney says he'll never eat anything with a face.

"Yeah, Paul, if I did as many drugs as you did in the 60s, I wouldn't eat anything with a face, either."

I guess that left out Linda and Heather!

Not that there is anything wrong with only eating plants and fish. It's probably very healthy, and if someone wants to do that, more power to them. But they aren't vegetarians. They are people who only eat plants and fish.

I appreciate your response! :hi:

Fishies are people too. Or something.

True story (not seafood related): I was a vegetarian for 11 years, then I was in a really bad car accident and got a lot of blood transfusions. Ever since then, I've CRAVED sausage and steak. I mean, hardcore. Like, I had Bratwurst for dinner. Weird!

Do you feel guilty, for straying from the vegan lifestyle at all?

I'm kind of weird in that I try to NOT consume a lot of red-meat but will have chicken or turkey from time to time--lots of seafood. I don't really like red meat. BUT if I CRAVE something--I'll allow myself to have it. I figure if I crave it, there must be a reason why...

:shrug:

I was in the hospital, and on OxyContin, and frankly I didn't give a damn about keeping my moral high ground. They said my cravings meant I needed protein and iron. So in the hospital I started eating meat again (steak, I think. Or hamburger. Again, I was on OxyContin, it's all a little fuzzy.)

My friend's a nurse and said that taste changes and cravings like that are actually common with blood transfusions. I don't know if that's true, but I know I couldn't go meatless again. I tried, and after a week I felt like poo, even with the proper amount of protein from meatless sources. I've NEVER eaten sausage, much less spicy things, and now I love sausage and gallons of hot sauce. I put hot sauce on everything now.

Good for you, for not denying yourself what your body seemed to need at that time (after the transfusion)...

I knew of a woman (briefly) that was going through chemo--just prior to finding out she had cancer, she had become a vegetarian. But during chemo some of the meds created an iron deficiency--her docs begged her to eat a little protein, and she refused.

Or Emeril...:rofl:

(I'm a regular whole blood donor) crave kung pao tofu and seitan shepherd's pie? :bounce:

No.

. . . would never eat anything that ever had a face.

:)

:rofl:

:)

Okay. I hereby amend my rule to "No face carved by a human being with a sharp instrument."

;)

:)

1. LACTO VEGETARIANS
They eat no flesh of any kind. Their diet consists of fruit and vegetables and dairy products(vegetarian cheese only)
2. LACTO-OVO-VEGETARIANS
They eat the same as the lacto vegetarians but also include eggs in their diet.
3. VEGANS
They eat only plant food.They eat no flesh, no eggs and no dairy products. Some will eat honey but not others.
4. FRUITARIANS
They eat only fruits,nuts and seeds.(This includes the fruit of vegetables such as tomatoes and courgettes. However they never eat the roots of plants such as carrots and potatoes)



http://www.angelfire.com/stars3/larika0/index2.html

:hi:
Thank you for the information and the interesting link. Cool to know there are different types!

you don't have to stick to one type. If you go vegan, you will lose a lot of weight. But, you can over do it. When you are at a stable weight that you are comfortable with, add eggs and cheese. Also, switch to butter over margarine. You need a certain amount of fat in your diet.

but one can and should get all that fat from plant sources. It's entirely possible and generally not even an effort to maintain a healthy weight as a vegan.

I was losing an average of five pounds per week. My doctor told me about adding butter when I first went on a vegan diet. But, because I lost so much weight so fast, I then added eggs and cheese and was then able to maintain a better weight level. I guess a good diet for some is not so good for others.

I've never heard of that happening. Was it a portion issue (most vegans I know of pack away a fair amount of food) or did they run any tests for absorption disorders or send you to a nutritionist?

I've never heard of a healthy person continuing to lose weight that fast while vegan (well except on the some variations of McDougall diet, but that's rather restrictive, allowing not oils or refined starches and it's for really unhealthy people who need to shed pounds fast.)

eating quite a lot. I never got hungry. But once a week I would weigh myself and was always surprised. The weight was just falling off. I wanted to lose about ten pounds, but ended up losing twenty five. I added the eggs and cheese and gained back ten of those pounds in about four weeks. So, I stuck with that. Feel great! I just figure that every one's metabolism is different.

It's good that you gave it a shot and I'm glad you found something that works for you.

It's interesting you guys should speak of weight control and weight loss with the vegan diet.

This may be off topic a bit but it makes me think of what I've heard of macrobiotic diets. I recall I think it was Carol Alt, the model saying that she has NO problem maintaining her weight, because she eats this way. I don't think macrobiotic eaters utilize much animal protein in their diets (if any)...

It just sounded like a really healthy way to eat.

and I felt TERRIBLE.

When I went veg, I felt odd for months, had odd cravings, etc, but I went vegan for two weeks and I started craving DISGUSTING things... very high fat foods. Fell off that wagon SO HARD.

Part of the problem is that I'm allergic to tomatoes, and it's hard enough to find food anyways. I also really like food, and cheese adds a LOT of flavor to things.

For about 6 years prior to that, I ate seafood but no other flesh. I didn't call myself a vegetarian then.

was it easier for you to make the transition by eating seafood for a while?

Just curious...

I'd wanted to be a vegetarian my entire life, but thought that I could never do it. I did the seafood thing because eating seafood didn't seem quite as wrong to me as eating warm-blooded things. However, there was a piece of me that still felt that these were living beings that I was killing. I especially felt guilty when I ate something like shrimp since I had to cause so many lives to end for my all-you-can-eat shrimp dinner.

About 4 years ago, my husband wanted to try to become a vegetarian, so I stopped eating seafood as well. After a few days, he decided that it wasn't for him, but I kept with it.

Doing things cold-turkey often works well for me. It wouldn't work for everyone though.

Interestingly, many people say that they feel better or worse when they go without eating flesh. I don't feel any different.

(NOTE: I don't judge anyone else, so when I mention killing, I'm just saying how I felt about myself -- not how I feel about anyone else.)

if you put your mind to it.:)

Tell you what, I'm a vegan. I'm a die-hard, hardcore, take no prisoners mofo. If a person abstains from eating red meat, chicken and pig, yet eats seafood time and again, then no, they aren't the Webster's definition of a "vegetarian". However, if they're doing all they can, I won't argue labels. Labels are bullshit, because you see, the animals don't care, I don't think, about what you call yourself.

Matter of fact, if you abstain from eating an animal for one meal, regardless of your veg*ism commitment, I'll sing your praises from the highest of mountaintops.

There is no "out of line" nor cheating. There's only what you do.

copping the attitude, flvegan. :-)

I do my very best, honestly, to not be preachy.

Thanks for the compliment.

GC slaps forehead -- how's that again?
:rofl:
I can understand confusion over dairy and eggs but CHICKEN?

Of course, I've also had work colleagues who assumed I was a vegetarian because I ate whole grain bread, tofu and brown rice. Yeah, that'll do it.

one meat meal a day helps a tremendous lot, for both the animal kingdom, and the person's body. Our American culture has become obsessed with having meat at every single meal, and forgets that about 85% of the world's population is lucky to have meat in their diet once a week or even once a month!

It all contributes, of course, to our higher level of heart disease, and to our greater obesity rates--"Supersize Me" is just one example of how the "meat culture" encourages bad diets and health problems.

I never became a full vegetarian, but stuck to fish only added to the regular ovo-lacto diet for about 8 years. At that time, my doctor told me I needed more protein and I added poultry back in. If anything, I have "meat" in one meal a day.

Now, I rarely--almost never--eat beef although once in a great while (perhaps 4 times a year) I will. Pork I might eat twice a week in the form of breakfast sausages or bacon. My main diet now is mostly salads, fruits, vegetables in many different varieties, with ice cream tossed in for good measure. :) Can't give up ice cream.

Because I wonder if I was going about veganism all wrong or what...

Thanks. :hi:

for me is maybe a faux chicken parmigiana over spinach fettucine. Or a pad thai with tofu and brocolli. Last night, I had noodles with olive oil, herbs and sliced italian sausage (fake, of course).

I'm always willing to help. If you have veg questions, come see us in the DU veggie group, or send me a PM.

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It was worth a shot.

yes in a way. My dad says "I can only eat something that never had an awareness of itself". He doesn't eat fish, but shrimp are only bait so thats ok. :)

He only does the shrimp carnage once every other blue moon though.

that you grew up in a vegan family. :hi:

Not big on seaweed as a major veggie myself. Works as a sushi wrapper OK, but that's about it.

but I do eat seafood. So I call myself a pisco-vegetarian.

a voice of dissent--cool! Pisco-vegetarian? Is this something other vegetarians' recognize(to your knowledge)?

Just curious--seems I've heard this somewhere before...

Thank you for responding to my thread, btw. :hi:

just as is a lacto-ovo vegetarian.

...based products such as tofu.

I know quite a few. They don't eat any land animals.

is pesco-vegetarian. :)

any more than i can say i'm a man because the word "man" is included in the name of woman

i'm just sayin :-)

So though people call themselves pesco-vegetarian, they aren't veg at all (IMO).

A little info on factory-farming (where almost all meat-products come from):

Inevitably, intensive animal agriculture depletes valuable natural resources. Instead of being eaten by people, the vast majority of grain harvested in the U.S. is fed to farm animals. This wasteful and inefficient practice has forced agribusiness to exploit vast stretches of land. Forests, wetlands, and other natural ecosystems and wildlife habitats have been decimated and turned into crop and grazing land. Scarce fossil fuels, groundwater, and topsoil resources which took millenium to develop are now disappearing.

Meanwhile, the quantity of waste produced by farm animals in the U.S. is more than 130 times greater than that produced by humans. Agricultural runoff has killed millions of fish, and is the main reason why 60% of America's rivers and streams are "impaired". In states with concentrated animal agriculture, the waterways have become rife with pfiesteria bacteria. In addition to killing fish, pfiesteria causes open sores, nausea, memory loss, fatigue and disorientation in humans. Even groundwater, which takes thousands of years to restore, is being contaminated. For example, the aquifer under the San Bernadino Dairy Preserve in southern California contains more nitrates and other pollutants than water coming from sewage treatment plants.

http://www.factoryfarming.com/environment.htm

It's why I don't get why more so-called "progressives" aren't vegetarian for the environmental reasons alone (let alone the ethical and health reasons).

...whether it's cheating depends on what game you are playing.

I've met a couple pesci-vegans. It seems like a healthy choice to me.

c'mon people it is not that hard

nothing wrong w. acknowledging you can't gain sufficient muscle or whatever the issue is if you don't eat fish or another meat, we are not all the same, we can't all be vegetarians

I did that for 10 years.

to becoming vegan?

don't understand--"I" was merely asking a question, based on some answers I saw on another thread regarding vegetarian eating. This isn't about me, or my eating choices--it was a question. That's all.

My question was answered. There's no need for you guys to argue back and forth, or hold others in contempt here for how they define their choices.

Could we please lay off the answers laced with attitude. I'd like to keep this thread open to 'civil' discussion. If it turns into yet another name-calling situation, I'll personally alert on it, and have it closed.

It's interesting to me that some that are concerned about animal welfare and extending them kindness in the world, find it challenging to extend the same consideration and courtesy to one another in a mere discussion.

Thank you ALL for your responses--I sincerely appreciate the input. :hi:

edited to correct grammatical error--ooops--sorry. :blush: