I just watched the finale of "The Apprentice".

Randal's a dick. Sorry, but he's a dick.

Trump asked him whether he should hire Rebecca too. Randal said no - "it's The Apprentice, not The Apprenti."

He could have said it was okay. It would have taken nothing away from his victory or his position. He was just pulling up the ladder.

All the nice warm fuzzy things being said about him - forget them.

GRRR

The other apprentices didn't have to. Trump can hire her anytime he wants to. He hired the college kid from the last apprentice after the season was over.

If Trump had hired both of them, that would've diminished Randal's win.

Randal isn't the one making the hiring decisions. If Trump wanted to hire Rebecca, then he should've done it himself.

Naturally it's Trump's decision. He was asking Randal's opinion. Randal, the supposed nice guy, All American Boy, could have been generous and benevolent. Instead....

It's never been done before and if Trump wanted to hire Rebecca, with her losing record, he had the power to do it. Randall shouldn't have to share anything. This really pisses me off because Rebecca was not even in the same league with Randall and I'm quite confused as to why this was even an issue.

Randal sure isn't in the same league as Rebecca.

weasel another shot.

The same one who threw Randall under the bus a few weeks ago and almost got him fired? Yes, she's a class act.

nm

It was the episode where they produced a song for XM radio.

They had that weasily third guy working with them, who sucked up all the oxygen in the room. And their song was wrong for XM. Nowhere did I see Rebecca throw Randal to the wolves.

But we're not going to convince each other, so I'm done.

do self-proclaimed "liberals" cling to their racist subtexts with such fury? It's JUST. SO. DEPRESSING. How IS IT that you so consistently refuse to walk to another corner of the intersection to get a different perspective, all the while screaming epithets at those on that other corner pleading that you take a look from where they stand?

What other "winner" of a "reality" TV show has been subjected to such rabid disapprobation? The Donald and his producers were quite well-aware of the potential fallout but figured controversy would be good for ratings. Randal got punked as a means to an end. But you don't place responsibility on them, it's much easier to rip the "mean, selfish, greedy black monster" to shreds rather than to understand the sub-text that prompted his response.

Is it that you really don't care? You have your white privilege and dare anyone to challenge your assumptions of superiority. Randal did just that. Today his website has either been hacked or shut down due to your freep response to his outright WIN. Today I have little to NO HOPE for the land of my birth... :cry::cry::cry:

The wrong number on the poster? I worked for an ad agency once -- you would have been fired in a heartbeat if you did that. She didn't throw him under the bus,m she just brought it up, in a non-nasty way.

:woohoo: So goes the "common wisdom" in Amurika! :woohoo:

He's a man and a very accomplished man at that.

R & R were a team for a long-time, and got along very well. This really does make him look like a prick.

A thousand bucks says Rebecca would have said to hire Randall.

:eyes:

They asked to work on different projects. Wouldn't have diminished his win at all.

This was prickishness, pure and simple. Pulling up the ladder. "I got mine."

Good point.

Golly, what a swell guy. :sarcasm:

I wouldn't be surprised if he did, but that is not the point. The original poster was not talking about Trump's action, but Randall's.

If Trump had hired both of them, that would've diminished Randal's win.
No body was ever diminished by sharing a win. Randall would still have been "The Apprentice", but he would be a little bit classier. He got as far as he did by sharing the spotlight. Now its al me, me, me. Just looks selfish.

Would this discussion be taking place if Randal were white and Rebecca black? Would The Donald even dared to have asked? And if he had would anyone fault Randal for declining??? Just wondering. :shrug:

Are you kidding me? :eyes:

would have done.

It is not a black/white thing at all.

a minority. And, the moron wanted this season to be Black vs. White. No, I'm not kidding. So yes, it was a black/white thing to an extent, because I think that's how Trump sees it. He was also criticized for not hiring a woman. Now, Kendra DESERVED that win, but he stacked the final to be two women last season for a reason, I think.

taking everything into consideration, imagine the same circumstances with different people. If a 34 yr.old white woman with 5 degrees and a 3-0 performance were refusing to share her title with a bright, but inexperienced 23 yr.old black male with a 1-2 performance would there be hit pieces and outrage on forums declaring her a selfish bitch? I'm just asking you to think about it for a minute...

...were as quality a candidate as Rebecca, hell yes there would be, at least from me. It's not about race.

is that you would never judge a black male so positively with such a lack of results. We call it "stealth."

Randall was exactly right to do what he did. Why should Randall have to share the apprenticeship with her? He was clearly more qualified and I'm not sure what Trump's reasoning was for putting Randall in that position.

the other apprentices.

Just because Trump didn't give them each that option doesn't make it inappropriate for him to ask Randal's opinion this time around.

Randall was put in the position to say whether or not his accomplishment of becoming the apprentice should be shared with someone that's not even in the same league with him. I'm wondering what this was all about-- it certainly didn't have anything to do with Rebecca's record or her experience. So, I'm confused.

Randal's still the big winner. No duplication of efforts or dilution of his success.

If you have to be a dick to win, then I guess Trump made the right choice.

Randal won and he deserves to be in the spotlight by himself instead of someone who was not even as good as him.

she shamed Yahoo into giving more money to each charity than they ever would have gotten at the events. You think Yahoo did that out of the goodness of their heart?

Besides, Randall's event pissed of the Outback guy and their instructions were to meet the requirements of their sponsors AND raise money. Most events like this bring in the big money afterward.

was doing lots of PR, polishing her star despite her spotty results. Maybe she's the first-cousin once removed of a bidness crony. :evilgrin:

they don't make this shit up as they go along. The show is not so old and traditional that they can't tweak it. In one eppisode T canned a whole team of 4. In another he told Ala (sp?) to sit down and shut up.(a golden moment, IMHO)

Trump basically uses his "apprentices" as publicity tools. He always pairs the winner with someone from his organization who is really in charge of the projects.

I don't. It's almost an act of egoism applying for the show alone.

on the other foot, she would have said yes to Randal.

was due to him. None of his wins were due to her.

But would have, to Randall.

But she delivered the goods. Now if Randall had been asked to share the glory with someone like Kendra, that would have been a different story.

But I'm surprised I even feel this strongly about it. So I'm done.

Remember the Dairy Queen episode. The one where the team lost because they came up with a bad idea, but Toral got fired because she didn't want to wear that stupid costume. Rebecca could have stuck by the friend she believed in and repeated her line that she believes Toral has talent, but instead when Trump asked Rebecca who should get fired, instead of naming someone who contributed to the loss, she named Toral.

needed to perform. It was not only that she refused to wear the costume but that she hesitated about taking on the PM role. Rebecca fought for her and Toral failed her by not performing on this task, at all. Yet Rebecca didn't totally give up on her because she hired her to help on the last task.

It's fine to think Randall should have won, but Rebecca did NOT do that -- she told Trump that TOral disappointed her, and should be fired. And she SHOULD have. Ina addition, Rebecca had put her ass on the line for Toral, and Toral screwed her over.

Toral did not come up with the dumb idea, but she REFUSED to do what she was asked to, so she should have went. I've fired people for that. At least the others tried, even if it sucked. She refused to even try.

Would Rebecca have done the same thing? After seeing the way she operated the 15 weeks, Hell Yes! I would have too. I would've been like, "You hired me. If you wanted to hire both of us, you should've said so."

As a black person, I don't want to raise the race card, but if it's in the deck.....

And I know many of you will hate me for saying this, but Trump hires a person of color, and it's a split hire? When you might argue Randal (who I initially did not like because of the "hero" edit he received) is the best, most qualified Apprentice ever? When Trump hired the woman last year - sorry, forgot her name - would it not suck that he "diluted" the reward by splitting the hire instead of giving it to the best player, as he did in the previous two seasons (and sent home worthy runners-up)? He'd better hire Kwame from S1 before he hires Rebecca!
________________________________

Don't worry I said it a couple of pages ago. The Trump may think he's slick...but he's not. He probably wanted to do the double hiring, but knew that people would call foul on him not just hiring the qualified candidate who happened to be a black man...but in addition, the white woman as well. But the asshole known as Trump shifted the responsibility to the black man...because if HE (black man) decided that it was not stupid and a compromise to hire Rebecca too...Trump can't be called on his shit! Ha, ha on that asshole (Trump) that the black man wasn't playing his game.

I have no problem with what Randal did and the whole thing is just wack.

I thought when I was watching it. But, Randal was clearly the better choice and more successful in his tasks than Rebecca.

This is certain people's world and we're just livin' in it! Trump was wrong to put Randall in that position and that is that. Randall stood up for himself and the accomplishment that he earned. Like someone said on TWoP, they don't ask Oscar winners to share their awards, why should the first minority to win the Apprentice have to share that honor?

clear leader. He didn't roll over and play Mr. Nice. He stood up for himself. Go Randall.

Hmmm... Just thinking out loud... If I were to do an audition and play my 3 pieces perfectly, then be asked if I'd be willing to "share" the solo position I won with a younger, less experienced player (who aced 1 piece and had major execution problems with the other 2), I think I'd say... :rofl::wtf::rofl:

charge of the task, announced he was going to win it for her, implemented the plan, executed it, and delivered on his promise. Sure he wanted to win it so that he could face Rebecca in the finale vs. Alla. Brilliant strategy. Not so that after playing the game well for so long to share his glory with someone who routinely failed to deliver. But was very skilled at passing the blame for her losses on to others.

and this comes from a big Randal fan (until tonight).

Quit baiting.

Randal doesn't get a free "asshole pass" just because he's black.

Rebecca is the least qualified of all the runners-up ever. Why should the only black winner have to share his win with someone so clearly less qualified than himself? The biggest jerk is Trump for putting Randall in that position. Trump's plan for Randall to do his dirty work, and hire his next mistress, failed miserably.

Why do you keep going back to the race card?

I personally thought this exact situation was going to happen and made a bet with my wife it would. The only thing that was different was Randal let me down and decided he wanted the glory for himself and himself alone. Randal was clearly the best candidate but Rebecca showed some great leadership skills. Both were EXCELLENT candidates and Rebecca won't have the slightest bit of trouble finding a great job. If you don't see how good a candidate she was, some assumptions could be made about your racial and/or sex bias.

Race is not always a factor but there is always a possibility that it is a factor. Perhaps you see more in Rebecca than I was able to see. I can only go on what was presented to me through a television show and do not know Rebecca nor Randall personally. Randall was clearly heads and shoulders above Rebecca as a candidate and I don't recall another person with a losing record even making it that far, let alone being put off on the clear winner to hire. Trump has all the power in the world-- it's his company and his rules. If he wanted to hire Rebecca he could have done it tonight or waited and hired her later on. I'm still waiting for someone to tell me what Rebecca did to deserve being hired as an apprentice on the same night as Randall. It's mighty strange that the only thing different now is that Randall is black and I may be reading too much into it, but it's the world I was born in and until some more things change in my world then, to me, there's a possibility that race is a factor.

On Edit: clarify one statement

It was the black man who decided the white woman wouldn't get the job. It wasn't a white man giving the job to a white woman over a black man.

Randal wasn't descriminated against, he was the most qualified and he got the job. Both of them were some of the strongest candidates that show has ever had. Hiring Rebecca wouldn't have cost him his job, just some of his morning show glory.

He did her out of a title that she did not EARN. She failed her last task. She's no stranger to losing. She's just very good at passing the blame for her losses on to others. If Trump thinks she has potential (and I believe she does) he can offer her a regular payroll job anytime. He did not need to ask Randall to share his victory with someone who didn't earn it.

And you still haven't provided me with the facts to back that up. Is it because she broke her ankle and stayed there or because she lost 2 out of three tasks or that she failed to raise any money in the final fund-raising task? Why should Randal have been put in that position to hire a less qualified individual to share his title? You can go up and down this thread telling people not to see race, but in black America's world, race is very often a factor.

You keep boiling it down to the very basic factors and refuse to look at them as entire people. The way you've presented it Randal is black, Rebecca is white, Randal won the tasks, Rebecca was 1-2, Rebecca broke her ankle, etc and that's it. The problem is you can't boil people down to just that, they are full people.

You won't accept anything I say because I'm talking about their leadership skills and you can't put a score on that. You only see a black man and a white woman. You're falling into the same trap ACTUAL racists fall into.

Race was not a factor here. Again, it was the black man who chose not to let a white woman have a job, not the other way around. Randal would have still gotten the glory and he would have been seen as a selfless winner. He would have still gotten to position he wanted and he would have still been the obvious winner. The only thing he wouldn't have gotten was the glory all to himself. He wanted the spotlight to only be on him and that is just plain selfish, I don't care how many race cards you try to play or how you try to spin it.

Randal doesn't get a free pass on being an ass hole and he isn't a victim. I don't care what his skin color is.

Rebecca is a strong leader and deserving of the same title as Randall. But, I guess I'll be waiting a LONG time.

Did you just skip over that entire reply?

Do you have absolutely no experience managing people?

Did you not see Trump, George, and Carolyn all endorse BOTH candidates and worthy of the position?

Did you just skip over that entire reply? No

Do you have absolutely no experience managing people? I have experience managing people.

Did you not see Trump, George, and Carolyn all endorse BOTH candidates and worthy of the position? I saw them SAYING that she was qualified, but I did not SEE what they were talking about.

Do you not think there might be some bias on your part if you didn't see the qualifications that everyone else saw?

I think you just saw a black man and a white woman and let that make the decision for you.

The majority of the other players thought she wasn't nearly as qualified as Randall. You say that I just saw a black man and a white woman and I say that I saw someone who won a competition being asked to share his win with the loser. If color factors into why that was the case then I have no control over that.

Although I wouldn't call it "racist crap." Just that he's an ass, and it's reflected badly on him.

this coming from a white woman. Randal is the most qualified person to ever be on the show. I thought it was complete bush-league for Trump to do that to him. If he wants Rebecca to work for him, fine. But dont diminish Randal's success by asking him to share a title that he fully earned.

time, whereas she played nice and clean. I hope Trump goes ahead and hires her anyhow, but, out of deference to Randal, he won't (that loyalty thing). That was real BS. However, I do see how it would have been misconstrued as racism as one poster above said. Dammit! That sucks for her.

Randal, you're an ASS.

A real final two for this season would have been Randal vs. Alla. That I would have liked to have seen.

but competent.

Alla was really the only competition for Randal. Randal was correct when he said I run multi- million dollar corporation and SHE writes about it. At 23 I think Rebbecca was a great success BUT she would be eaten for breakfast in NYC on a major construction site, she simply was not ready for prime time.
As for Trumps question to Randal. This was HIS night.Randal worked for and deserved his 10 minutes of glory. If Trump wanted Rebbecca he should just hire her off the air.

old (for charity)? Clearly she's capable of running a business or whatever. I just think he threw her under the bus just like they did with that other chick last year. Grrrr!

make money at the yahoo thing? Trump was right, the client was the charity and not yahoo.

way around. For example, last night she said that Randall put too much thought into things and that he lost sight of the big picture. Excuse me Rebecca. You're the one who lost sight of what a charity function was about. You were so busy coordinating your pretty purple and white ice cubes that you lost sight of actually raising money for a charity.

I liked him up until that point.

Rumors were that Trump planned a while ago to hire both. Tonight's show was set up perfectly to make that happen. Both candidates knew hiring both was a strong possibility going into this episode.

Trump was basically saying, "The game is over. You won. But, I don't want to let a good person go. Do you agree Randal? Let's hire Rebecca too."

Randal basically replied, "No way. This is MY night."

If Trump had picked Rebecca instead, they both would be happy campers. Now that I think about it... Randal's ego probably would have exposed itself in this scenario, too. He probably would have declined.

Trump will hire her anyway, and then they'll both be working in the same organization. Awkward.

I'll bet a lot of people will think twice about wanting to work for Randal in the future.

to be a co-apprentice even though she failed last night's task? If Trump thinks so much of her he can hire her out right at any time.

Who has a way better job than that tool Kelly.

Trump would be very stupid not to hire her -- she's sm,art, articulate, has a great track record, and has immense fire in her belly.

"The show is called the APPRENTICE, not the APPRENTI?

Why take the winner glow off the WINNER only to side show it with a co-winner.

Again.. if he never asked the WHITE WINNERS, how in the heck does he ask the black one?"

http://www.tv.com/the-apprentice/show/20528/forums.html&fpage=show_messages.php&board=9565&topic=170271&page=0

I'm getting pretty sick of people calling Randall a d*ck for standing up for himself. He was the clear winner and Rebecca was labeled as the weak link in the first weeks of the show. She lost 2 out of 3 tasks and failed to raise any money on the final task (most people would call that a failure). The black man is supposed to share his prize, because that's just what black men are supposed to do. I don't think so!!!!!!!!

Perhaps it's TRUMP who should apologize to the both of them for putting them in that position. I don't think Trump is a racist, but he did make a mistake putting the onus on Randall when he had never done that with the three prior white winners.

Trump should issue an apology to Randall, Rebecca, and fans of the show.

Rebecca is very impressive for such a young woman. But she is not in the same league as Randall. He should have never been put in that position by Trump.

That was shitty.

First rule of humanity, when you can throw a lifevest to another human being, do it.

(remember the song they had to produce?)

Regardless, it's Trump's fault for this contretemps. Trump should apologize. And leave it at that.

it on for the last 10 minutes or so...

Leadership skills are nothing without human kindness IMHO.

seen plenty of human kindness in Randall. All he showed last night is that even though he is gentle and kind he's no push over. Go Randall!

nt

I think he showed much warmth towards his wife, and was a gentleman and professional to the other Apprentices, but I never saw him as really warm and kind to anybody. Nor Rebecca, either, btw.

I've been rooting for him, but he disgusted me last night with the approach of what he did. I lost all respect for him, because I think he showed a major character flaw last night. Too bad.

nothing to deserve sharing in his glory? I don't think the character flaw belongs to him.

She's a bright, promising WHITE WOMAN. It was INCUMBENT upon HIM to show deference to HER potential within the organization! AND allow The Donald to set her up her to steal his thunder!!!

:spank:

on his part to ask Randall to split his win. Just wrong.

been fired for at a real ad agency.

:eyes:

anytime he wants.

life and death situation. :eyes:

would you throw a lifevest to dubya, cheney, rumsfeld, rice, delay, frist, or santorum (among countless other repukes)or most especially (m)ann coulter if the need arose??

Speaking for (oh so human self) myself ... I don't think so!

and he was my fav going into the final episode.

He was my favorite until the very end and then acted like an asshole. If he had said yes he still would have been the winner and would have lost nothing...now he'll just be remembered as the jerk who threw Rebecca overboard because he wanted all the glory.

I told my wife he's going to hire them both. They had been making hints at it for quite a while.

Randal was a dick.

"Only in america can a black hold five serious education degrees, own five business and completely run circles around a less experienced, less educated white women and still be asked to 'share' his victory."


http://www.tv.com/the-apprentice/show/20528/forums.html&fpage=show_messages.php&board=9565&topic=170269&item_page=10&page=10

Not America, reality TV.

If they went based on education degrees 90% of the people on the show would have never been cast.

Rebecca was a good candidate. Why does the fact that she was a white woman vs a black man mean anything?

of the dynamics involved from someone who writes such posts is akin to expecting a fish to be able to describe the water in which it swims.

Randall to share his victory.

Randal is a good business owner, and may (MAY) be a better mid-level manager. But Rebecca? PERFECT apprentice.

And, having the degrees and running your own businesses does NOT make you a good employee. Compared to some of the finalists before, Randal wasn't greatly impressive. Kendra Todd, for example, would have chewed him up and spit him out. He and Rebecca were very evenly matched -- he had things she didn't, and vice versa. I believe Trump, Carolyn, and George saw this evenness.

This is not a race thing, and I wish people on all the boards would quit saying it is. It debases Randall and Rebecca.

Apprentice:

# One who is learning a trade or occupation, especially as a member of a labor union.
# A beginner; a learner.

with a 10 ft. pole to spare my nostrils...

his accomplishments on and off the show. Speaks volumes about you.

Why? Don't turn it into something it's not.

Why didn't Trump ask previous white candidates to do this? Because he never had two candidates so clearly capable of running one of his businesses. He didn't ask Randall to share because he was black, he asked him to do it because IT WAS GOOD TV (NEVER FORGET THE IMPORTANCE OF THAT) and because Rebecca was an "all-star" too.

This race card crap is for the birds.

Because she broke her ankle? Because she had a losing record? Because she raised NO money in a fund-raising task? I'm still trying to figure out why she was considered to be Randall's competition. To me, there was no competition. In fact, in the beginning weeks she was called the weakest link and was kept around because they "knew" she would be fired soon. BTW, Kwame from the first season was clearly as qualified as Bill and no one asked Bill to share his victory with Kwame.

"This race card crap is for the birds." Well, chirp, chirp!

... he would probably rake him over the coals. Trump lookeded indecisive, wishy-washy. Imagine if someone in his organization had pulled a stunt like this.

You could tell the previous week that he was hinting at hiring both of them. I even bet my wife on it. Trump does something new each season and he's been talking about the 'problem' of having 'two all-stars' for the past few episodes.

Alos, during the last board room Randal made it a point to ask the others if he should be the "only" Apprentice. If there was no hint that he would hire both, why would he include that?

I already stated in an above post that if only one is getting hired, it should be Randal.

However, are you really trying to claim that Rebecca wasn't well qualified? She has excellent leadership skills and has been referred to as an "all-star" numerous times by Trump. I'm trying to find a non-racially based reason somebody who keeps bringing a black man's race would have such a problem with a white woman but I'm having trouble doing so.

"BTW, Kwame from the first season was clearly as qualified as Bill and no one asked Bill to share his victory with Kwame."

I agree. That was also the first season, the dynamics or the entire show grow over time. Trump has done something different in every single season. Comparing anything from season one directly to season four is extremely misleading.

flew under the radar the whole show. What makes him qualified? That his grandmother died and he bravely got through it? Let's play another race card---where was the diversity in Randal's consulting firm? Maybe Randal is the racist! (really just playing---I'm sure he goes after minority set aside gov't contracts)

tasks as a project manager. He was looked up to and respected by his peers. His peers chose him as a leader. They loved him. They all want to work with and for him because of his quiet strength and his busy savvy. And before you continue to diss Randall arm yourself with knowledge. His very impressive profile is on the front page of the NBC website.

:eyes:

that Trump set Randal up for a no-win.
Too bad Katarina Witt didn't share her gold medal with Debi Thomas...

Rebecca kept getting passes even when she lost (like last night's charity event where she raised $0) because of her potential, not because she delivered the wins. The prentice has never been about "potential." It has been about what a person brings to the table right now.

I didn't see anything about Rebecca was particularly impressive.

..had called both of them all stars on numerous occasions.

Rebecca had a 1-2 record as project manager, completely failed in her final task, and hired Toral to work on her team even though everyone else recognizes that she lacks talent.

Trump says that crap to make it look like there is some suspense in the outcome, when in this case Randal was clearly the best candidate throughout the process.

Leadership cannot be judged based on a score especially a score in a reality TV show. How well you sell lemonade or put together a commercial in two days vs another team doesn't say as much about you as the way you carry yourself and interact with your employees and peers. I've always thought it was quite comical that they use those silly tasks to determine the winner and the winners all go into construction.

I just want to point out that I didn't say Rebecca should have gotten the job over Randal. Randal deserved to win and in my opinion is the highest quality winner they have ever had. I'm just saying that it was a pretty sorry move for him to make. The racial stuff has no place in this conversation and it's a shame that's probably where this is going.

BTW, not everyone recognizes that she lacks talent. In fact, it's quite alarming that you would claim she does. What is it about her that irks you so much?

I think Rebecca hasn't shown any leadership skills. She's a good follower, give her a task and she'll do it well, but she hasn't shown any ability to manage people at all, as shown by her losses.

Alla, on the other hand, got things done and generally won. Sadly, Felicia's horrendous job as PM brought Alla down with her.

I also think that the racial talk is misplaced. I just think it was a stupid stunt to pose that question to Randal on live TV in such a glib manner.

In fact having worked on large construction projects before, Alla was probably the most qualified of any of the candidates. However, that errr....ummmm.....okay I'll just say it...."bitch factor" that would make her absolutely great in large scale construction doesn't seem to fit in with the reality TV aspect of the show. I think she would have gotten more out of contractors than either of the two finalists. That's not a dig at Randal or Rebecca, contractors just tend to try to cut every corner they can unless you say on their ass. That's something I think Alla would have been able to do quite well. On the other hand, I wouldn't want her as a sales or business development rep whereas Randal would be an absolute killer in a situation like that.

My general opinion is summed up in the first article put out on the subject...

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/10485160/

What a "hit piece!" :wow:

“If you were me, would you hire Rebecca also?” he asked Randal, and we all knew what was coming next. After getting the nod from Randal, Donald Trump was going to make “Apprentice” history and hire Rebecca too.

+No objections to Rebecca here.+

“Mr. Trump, I firmly believe that this is ‘The Apprentice,’ that there is one and only one apprentice, and if you’re going to hire someone tonight, it should be one,” Randal said. “It’s not ‘The Apprenti,’ it’s ‘The Apprentice.’”

+TONIGHT+ is the operative word here. Randal objected to sharing the TITLE and the spotlight. I don't blame him one bit. But he fell into the no-win trap that was set-up for him.

on the show. For crying out loud, if the charity events were a regular task she would have been fired because she didn't raise a cent. She had a very poor record as a project manager. As a matter of fact, the only project she won was because of Randall taking the lead. No way should he have shared his glory with her.

of those who are the maddest at Randal what the results would be. This is about race, as we see incidences like this occur on a daily basis across America. Just goes to show that a black person always has to work 10 times harder just to be acknowledged in the same light as a mediocre white person. Randal would have been soo screwed if he only had 3 degrees rather than 5.

The more I waste time investigating this, the angrier I get. WHY am I so angry, you may ask. Well, I just looked at an MSNBC poll and 71% don't get it. I'm no longer concerned about Randal, having checked out his website. He can handle it and was likely not completely blind-sided as I first feared.

The BIG ISSUE is the rabid stealth racism in Amurikka. It drove me across the big pond. It fuels the support for the genocide in Iraq. It "excuses" the atrocity in NOLA. Today, millions of white folks are just downright pissed off at a black man for WINNING. Anyone reading through this l-o-n-g thread who has ever questioned their own assumptions shall be shocked and saddened by the overt racism contained herein.

The tactic of screaming "reverse racism" at the VERY FEW (for reasons this thread highlights) posters-of-color on this site is standard CYA for the character assassination of an EXTRAORDINARILY accomplished black man.

That said, were I ever to be faced by a potential employer who used the occasion of the announcement of my hire to:

a) personally humiliate me
b) subject me to the disapprobation of white Amurikkka

I would consider it a CLEAR indication of the kind of support and/or backstabbing I could expect in his organization and
TEAR UP THE CONTRACT.

Randal should be careful, I have no doubt that they will pull out all the arrows to disgrace and destroy him. I honestly wish he would have told Trump, "That's okay, you can go ahead and hire Rebecca, I can do bad all by myself!" Trump has successfully turned Randall into a monster and the only solace I get from that is that it's better than him becoming a yes-man!

America has come when a black man was judged by his peers based upon his character instead of the color of his skin. Then Trump and everybody assailing Randall had to prove me wrong. America still has a long way to go. Thanks for showing me nothing has changed. The black man won, and now since you can't assail his qualifications you assail his character. Then don't pretend to be any different against the republicans you rail against every day.

not very classy

I was shocked. He was still going to be the winner. I thought it was cold.

her final task. And who only won the only task she did win because Randall took the lead.

Someone had to win, and Randall won fair and square. But when Trump asked the open ended question, Randall had NOTHING to lose by saying "Yes, hire Rebecca too".

So yeah, I would agree that he was a dick.

But at least that fucking tweaker Felicia and the Blair from Facts of Life clone didn't win.

should have been magnamimous and said "yes"...Trump didn't have to hire her.

she should have been disqualified...Trump was being nice to her but had no intention of naming her a co-winner. They stirred up controversy/future ratings by making Randall look like a dick. This is a game, not real life. Games have winners.

:sarcasm:

to share his glory? No reason. If Trump wants to hire Rebecca, he can certainly do so without asking Randal to share his glory with his sidekick.

nt

my condolences.

Randal is getting slammed....

The only win she had was the promotion of the Shania perfume samples, where they only won by five calls. Randall stated that he would do all he could to see to it that Rebecca won this one. And he took over and delivered. Every idea about how to proceed was HIS, not hers. HE came up with hiring the temps to go out and advertise. HE came up with the plan to usurp the megaphones away from the other teams. He took total charge of the task and won it so that Rebecca could be his competition at the end. Not his co-winner. He played the game and played it well. Go Randall!

Based upon Rebecca's record how do any of you calling Randall a jerk justify asking him to share his victory with her? How???

You can't judge leadership based on selling lemonade and the piddly tasks they do on that show. The way people carry themselves and interact with people is what you are looking at.

I still don't understand why people are so against Rebecca as if she was just some scrub off the street. Trump himself mentioned they are both all stars numerous times. George was in favor of both of them. Caroline (or it is it Carolyn) was a big fan of both candidates.

It's a bit disturbing that people feel the need to bash Rebecca so much.

"It's a bit disturbing that people feel the need to bash Rebecca so much."

I cannot believe you even formed your fingers to type that! The entire thread is based on how big of a d*ck Randall is.

You are talking about two completely different things. Do you not realize that it was Randal's reply that cost Rebecca the job?

Nobody is claiming that Randal doesn't possess leadership skills. I was a HUGE fan of him until the last two minutes of the show and even now the only thing I don't like about him is how he handled this. I even stated numerous times in this thread that Randal was clearly the best of the two. However, you and the other people bashing Rebecca are bashing her leadership skills and her qualifications in general.

There's a difference there.

Stop saying he cost her job because he didn't. Trump can hire her as he can anyone else. She just won't be "the apprentice." What is the big deal?

Randal's opinion didn't cost Rebecca anything. He WON the title outright and refused to allow it to be wrested from him. ;-)

and how willing he was to stand up for himself. Go Randall.

his website forum is flooded with outraged white folks calling him all sorts of nasty names...

Randall gave her as a gift. :eyes:

all of her tasks except for the one Randall one for her. If you want to call stating a fact bashing, be my guest.

Trump looked a little uncomfortable with the whole controversy.

It was a blatant and racist AND sexist set-up of the "fair damsel in distress." WHAT? NO KNIGHT IN SHINING ARMOR TO COME TO HER RESCUE???
The OUTRAGE!!!

Randal should be feeling like a million bucks about now. Instead he's become just another demonized black man. Imus has jumped into the fray too??? :eyes: Trump owes Randal a HUGE apology.

...ever victim of true racism in the world. Playing the race card in this situation is absolutely shameful.

You know absolutely DIDDLY-SQUAT about the dynamics of racism.
Nada. Basta. Zip.

Randall should share the title that he earned with Rebecca. I'm still waiting for the reason.

:shrug: Mission Accomplished.

That girl was absolutely ripped apart during that entire special, I think her name was Jen. Personally as someone who didn't like Jen I found it amusing at first but in the end I did feel some simpathy.

I'm glad I didn't waste any time watching this season.

up by her partner. Albeit it was like the next to last challenge. Nobody asked Kelly to share his victory. If they had, I would have been outraged.

if he wants to hire Rebecca....hire her. Who's running the show anyway?

By the way...Alla is a fu&%ing bitch.

Yahoo had to bail her out! Randall had the better record and more accomplished history, and was the logical winner if you are looking at results vs. only how impressively someone carries themselves.

An EXTREMELY talented clearthinking young woman but sorry--a broken ankle only gets you so far.

Trumps dithering at the end was kind of weird, maybe he thought Randall had some greater insight having worked with her more closely.

Im really surprised at the reactions here. I wouldnt respect anyone who would say "hire" just to be nice, what if he honestly felt he was clearly the bettter candidate? If that was the case than yes it would take away from his win.

"Yahoo had to bail her out! Randall had the better record and more accomplished history, and was the logical winner if you are looking at results vs. only how impressively someone carries themselves."

Yahoo is the reason Rebecca didn't earn anything to begin with. It was their direction that Rebecca not openly ask for donations.

Regarding results vs how somebody carries themselves, there's a reason you never see a blatant scorecard on the show.

"An EXTREMELY talented clear thinking young woman but sorry--a broken ankle only gets you so far."

Why do you focus on her broken ankle? That's extremely unfair to her leadership skills.

"Trumps dithering at the end was kind of weird, maybe he thought Randall had some greater insight having worked with her more closely."

It was a staged reality TV moment. They knew this was coming and anybody in the audience who read between the lines could see it coming since the previous week. Even Randal showed sings that he knew it was going to happen earlier in the show.

"I'm really surprised at the reactions here. I wouldn't respect anyone who would say "hire" just to be nice, what if he honestly felt he was clearly the better candidate? If that was the case than yes it would take away from his win."

No, it wouldn't take away from his win, he won. He would still have the position he asked for and he would still be the winner of The Apprentice. It would only take away from his morning show glory. It showed that his priorities are with himself. It's called being selfish.

While he had every right to make the statement he did, he showed that the selfless attitude he had shown the entire show was quite misleading. It wasn't cool for Trump to pose that question to Randal but he did. Randal is the one who is responsible for his reply and what that reply says about his priorities and loyalties.

But, Rebecca brought up her broken ankle about a million times last night. I was absolutley sick of hearing about it.

Once in the board room

Once in the conversation between her and Randal when they talked about their biggest obstacles. That's when she mentioned her broken ankle and he mentioned his deceased grandmother.

boiled down to her "toughness" .... AS EXEMPLIFIED BY the ole broken ankle.

Of course she is highly talented young lady. But the wins were not there. Image only gets you so far

a heart beat because of her "potential." But she is not there yet. Randall is.

that she thought she couldn't challenge them? At very least--she needed to provide some kind of mechanism or direction to people how they were to donate. Ways to do that without begging or hitting them over the head with it.

"At very least--she needed to provide some kind of mechanism or direction to people how they were to donate."

Hence the donation cards in the bags.

Or may not have even looked at at all. Better to have given them out at beginning with place provided for them to drop off and at least some verbal instruction or visual cues.

But what does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

I still think it's funny people want to boil these candidates down to a black man vs white woman or down to one decision made at the instruction on the event sponsor.

Nobody is dogging Randal's leadership and business skills (just his decision at the end is in question) but people who have decided to make this a racial issue have felt the need to bash Rebecca who was an excellent candidate as well. Trump, George, Carolyn, and Yahoo all agreed.

Regardless, Randal didn't object to hiring her because he didn't feel she was qualified. He didn't want her hired because he wanted to be the only Apprentice. It was his greed, not her qualifications that made his decision.

quote "Regardless, Randal didn't object to hiring her because he didn't feel she was qualified. He didn't want her hired because he wanted to be the only Apprentice. It was his greed, not her qualifications that made his decision."

And you know this how? He said he wanted to be the only apprentice. Why he said that? Because he felt he was clearly the better candidate and that she wasn't up to his caliber? Doesn't honesty mean anything?

you stop making excuses for her. She lost every single task except for the Shania perfume promotion that RANDALL WON FOR HER. And you have yet to give any justification for Randall sharing his glory with her other than it would have shown he was a nice guy. For the record, Randall has shown himself to be a class act throughout the competition. What he proved at the finale is that you can be nice and humble without being a pushover. You need to just get over it. You lost this argument a long time ago and have added no new "facts" or any facts at all for that matter to justify why you have assailed the character of the clear winner of the competition.

the attendees whould have had a chance to actually SEE THEM before they went home. Duh.

she failed at both. It was her job to put on a good fundraiser, not to take orders from Yahoo. She should have convinced them that they would look good by sponsoring a successful fundraiser for a good cause. Instead, she let THEM look like selfish assholes on national TV.

She raised no money for the charity and let the sponsor look like shit. She didn't serve either client well.

Count me in as angry as hell with Trump, NBC, and the show's producers. Last night was complete bullshit, and to make matters worse, the sole Black apprentice now has a tarnished image because he was put in the uncomfortable position of having to either split his crown, or say No to Rebecca.

Trump didn't ask that of ANY of the other past winners, even though the runner ups were by far more qualified than Rebecca. I chalk this up to Rebecca being "pretty."

very young. I think even younger than Rebecca. But look at the difference between that young lady and Rebecca. Night and day. Leaving personality and image aside, the young woman last year actually won her tasks and won them decisively and impressivley. No bullshit artist, she. She actually delivered the goods--unlike Rebecca.

And a tough one at that. Fair? Who cares. Business and leadership isn't about fair. I think Trump was curious to see how Randall would act.

Do you think business is the same decisions being made every day?

Things change. That is the one constant in the universe.

He didn't read Trump at all. He didn't see that Trump felt Rebecca would be an asset to the organization, Randall was thinking of himself - not the Trump organization.

for his selfless dealings with others. I love it when folks hold others to standards they themselves could NEVER meet. Kinda like skating judges.

it is. Trump made it pretty clear he wanted to hire Rebecca. He had already hired Randall. Randall was an employee whom Trump showed respect to by asking his opinion about a hiring decision. Randall said no for a stupid non-business reason because he wanted to be the "only apprentice".

Hey, I wouldn't want to work for Trump but Randall and all these other Apprentice-wannabees did.

I can't think of a single BUSINESS reason that serves the Trump organization's interest for Randall's move.

From a business perspective, Randall showed an incredible lack of foresight. If Rebecca gets hired somewhere else, then Trump loses an outstanding candidate. Good managers don't let good people slip away. If he hires Rebecca anyway, then Randall will have to work with her as part of the Trump team. Awkward at best.

It seemed to me that the GAME was over. Randall won. The first order of business, according to Trump, was to hire Rebecca. I though Trump was perfectly clear in the set-up (e.g., saying how this is his business and not just entertainment). Randall failed to read his boss's wishes out the gate and made a decision as if he had just won a PRIZE and not as if he had just been HIRED.

But, the live format production was not really conducive to adding this twist. Bad move by Trump and NBC.

that you are blind to the dynamics of the situation. If you think for a moment that The Donald and the producers of the show were not aware of the can of worms they opened, I would also suggest you are naive or have never been intimately involved in corporate media.

Trump was not "showing respect." He was setting Randal up. Randal's NO was strictly a business decision. I'm not surprised that angle eludes you.

victory and the title. He didn't ask if he could hire Rebecca aside from the show.

to show public deference to white womanhood. He didn't and is now being demonized for it.

standards and good business sense, or let his emotions or feelings of "Oh, maybe she'll feel bad if I don't hire her" get in the way of a decision making process. Or Trump might have been testing as to whether Randall would make a good decision in realizing that the woman would be a great asset and to see if Randall could let go his ego and make a good, albeit perhaps distasteful to Randall, decision.


Personally, I think Trump looked at it both ways - it was totally a test of character, with no right or wrong answer; it was only to see what Randall would do. And personally speaking, either decision is a good decision and a damning decision, with many pros and cons each. One is not better than the other. Randall is damned either way. And that's a good lesson for a business person, and anyone in leadership, to learn.



I sometimes don't get the liberal mentality that likes to think that businesses are and should be run all fluffy nicey nicey like Teletubbies or Barney. Sure, there should be respect and a harassment free environment, but sometimes business decisions are tough and nasty, but necessary, and worrying about how people might feel about it isn't going to help a business at all.

Thank you! "Randal is damned either way." He couldn't just WIN OUTRIGHT without being called upon to defer to someone he clearly outperformed.

THAT is the point that got my knickers in a twist. It's a not-so-subtle manipulation which many high-achieving blacks deal with daily, ESPECIALLY in the corporate world.

Who knows, after having been up close and personal in working with Rebecca, is it possible he felt she really DIDN'T have the right stuff? :shrug: I just hope the guy has a rhinoceros hide...

Trump could have created the best ending ever by "Firing Randal" on the spot for his selfish classless act. Then telling Rebecca "Your Hired."

Now, the Final twist would have been super. Trump turns to Rebecca and asks, as the Apprentice, would you rehire Randall! She is so poised, well-spoken, and thoughtful in her responses, she would have undoubtedly said "yes."

And lastly, as the program ends, the other contestants walk over and bitch-slap Alla!

Oh what an ending that would have been. The viewers would have gone away happy, and each Apprentice would have gone to separate venues to work.

in favor of the girl who lost every single task including last night? :eyes:

...two groups of people...

A group of people claiming Randal was a jerk for not being a selfless leader. The only thing he was asked to share was the morning show glory. He would have still gotten the job, the title, and the position he wanted. He just wanted it all to himself.

A group of people who are claiming Randal shouldn't have been put in that spot and have chosen to play the race card because he is black.

Yet you and others prefer to blame the black man, not surprising.

Trump was offering the position to both of them. He gave Randal a chance to shine as both a winner and a selfless leader.

Randal is the one who decided that Rebecca shouldn't get a position because he wanted all the glory.

Give me an example of when, in any time in history, the winner was asked to share their prize or title with the loser? I just want an example so that I can be convinced that Randall did the absolute wrong thing here.

I guess not!

I already asked you three questions in the above tree of this thread you haven't answered.

No, I don't know a previous time that happened, what does that change? It happened this time and Randal showed how selfish a leader he is. The only thing he would have lost was some of the glory. He still would have had his job, his title, his position.

Trump never fired four people at one time. Are you claiming all those candidates should have been let back in because that wasn't done before?

The show, just like every show in TV is dynamic and changes over time. You're basing your entire argument on race and that everything should be done the way it was the years before. You refuse to look at Randal and Rebecca as people and just put them into black man vs white woman. It's shameful.

I'm laughing because your response is ridiculous!!!!!!!!!!!! Something that's never been asked of any other winner, that you or I can name, and Randal's the selfish one for objecting to it being asked of him. :eyes: I'll try to find your questions so that I can answer them.

...say she wasn't qualified. If he had said that, it would be different. He said he wanted to be the only Apprentice. He based his decision on his greed, not her qualifications. That shows where his priorities lie.

The fact that it had never been done before doesn't change the fact that it happened this time and he made the decision he did. He had a chance to shine as a selfless leader but failed.

The FACT is that no other winner has ever been asked to share their title with the loser and to me that is what is SO very wrong about this whole thing. Randal should have never been put in that position.

And Randal NEVER said that Rebecca shouldn't be hired. He just stated that there should only be one apprentice.

I agree it sucked to be put in that position but it was a great opportunity for him to show a selfless leadership that would have put him into the stratosphere.

However, the question was posed to him and he made his decision. He said that Trump shouldn't hire Rebecca there because he wanted to be the only Apprentice. He let his greed, not her qualificatins or what was best for the company he now represents make his decision.

(sorry but I'm not oging to be able to reply again, I'm not dodging, I have a flight to catch)

And BTW, welcome to DU. :hi:

If he wanted to hire Rebecca too, he should've done it. He didn't hire her, so Randal deserved to be the only apprentice.

Trump will hire her some other time.

She was offered a position by Yahoo on some morning show today.

If you can't take the heat, get out of the boardroom.

Why do you have such spite for her?

She was a great candidate and they were both endorsed by all three of the people making the decision.

She has a lot of potential, but Randal did better than her.

The business world isn't romper room where everyone has to be nice to each other and share the spotlight with the loser. There's one winner and one loser. Rebecca lost, Randal won. Randal gave his opinion and Trump accepted it. End of story.

:eyes:

It's just pretty typical of America.

should be given to everybody without any effort and without earning it.

Yet you and others prefer to blame the black man, not surprising.

were put in that spot. The Donald dealt the race card. Deal with it.

You want to call Trump a racist despite the fact that he selected one of two African Americans from a group of 16?

I think people are foregetting it was the black man who decided the white woman wouldn't get a job, not the other way around.

"I think people are foregetting it was the black man who decided the white woman wouldn't get a job, not the other way around."

I think you are forgetting that it is Donald that does the hiring, firing and decision making on that show, not the candidates. Trump asked Randal his OPINION and then HE decided what to do, so Randal did not make that decision he only gave his opinion. Trump is an ass and should never had put Randal in that position, and maybe Randal coul dhave saved face and said something like "Mr. Trump you can make the decision who you would like to work for you and I believe Rebecca would be a great addition to your organization, but I believe I should be your apprentice alone, and that I deserve it and won it fair and square"

These people need to be careful what and how they say things to Trump, remember Bradford?

This is turning insane. It has nothing to do with race. Randal acted like a pompous ass at the end of the show. Trump was an idiot leaving the decision to Randal. Alla was a roaring bitch who should have been ripped to shreds by Trump. Rebecca was the only one who acted with poise and grace. She's only 23 and I would be honored to work for someone like her. Trump should go ahead and hire her anyway.