When all is said and done...wouldn't Pitt ask us to "Move On?

Inspite of what's happened could we think that one of our "Voices of the Left" might have gotten out of hand growing up on Hunter Thompson as a HERO of his youth?

Lot's of DU'ers don't have a "HERO" anymore. Most of the "late 30 Somethings and 40 Somethings have seen their HEROES die in the dust of SCANDAL/MANIPULATION by the MSM who just loves to "Pump 'em UP" and "BRING 'em DOWN!" It's whatever is good for BUISNESS and what get's you PR FAME.

I'm thinking we need to get back to looking for WHY? PAST THE SPIN....

Hunter Thompson was a "BEACON and a RADICAL ...toss SHIT IN THE FACE OF EVERYONE...kind of guy.

His time has passed....His ashes were tossed out of a CANON! Hunter was a GOOD GUY FOR HIS TIME!

But those like one of our more "famous Du'ers who is on the verge of "crash and burn" might just have not recognized that AMERICA TODAY...has little tolerance for Hunter Thompson....he's a "Ghost in the Wind."

Those wanting TRUTH...might see Hunter as a great "curmudgeon" but those EMULATING HIM...might find that there's a WHOLE NEW WORLD.

Anyone understand what I'm saying here? Trying to "make peace" .. or bridge a gap as to what happened this week with all of this shit we lived through. :shrug:

Probably it's too nuanced a post...and I had to do this not to be "DELETED." So ...I held back to something that I was trying to say to all of you...

On Edit: I'm so horrified by Pitt calling out Admins of this Board and calling us "Shit Dogs," "Fuck Wits," "Cretins" and WORSE that I'd be glad never to see him post again....because you shouldn't trash the "Safe House" that you go to and those who gave you "support."

I'm probably being too intellectual here...but at WHAT POINT could we EVER accept this kind of behavior back to DU.

Should we? Could We? I COU"LD...if I had an EXPLANATION OF THE MOTIVATION!

Until then ....it's out on the Planes Isolated......

be gone soon.

I have purposely stayed out of the shitstorm posts.. in fact if it's a "ALL CAPS>>THIS IS IT !"..I often use hide thread..

It's a sign of the times I guess.. Seems as iff most people these days sre most interested in gaining popularity for their websites/columns/tv stations...for being FIRST.. Correct is better, even if it takes a while..

Young people haven't been around long enough yet to understand that crying wolf does not pay off in the end..

throw a bone out...just because..because..

just a bone though. If you get what I'm getting at.........????

......sure

and that's why I posted. I'm not ready to throw him out with "bathwater" but close...so close...

Still..I was hoping to "bridge a gap" between Pitt Supporters and those like me who are so sick of being villified as "Cretins".."Sit Dogs" and other "Stuff."

Maybe because I'm Older..I see what happened as I would see a "Son" who was "ERRANT."

A person who was so identified with Hunter Thompson and REBELLION that they never really could understant what "IT" was about in a NEW TIME?

:shrug:

I QUALIFY...that I know that there are many of you here in the LOUNGE who are totall "conflicted" about what "Truth Out" and Pitt Did and WHY it's IMPORTANT.

But as a "Progressive Democrat" where Pitt was hired to do some posts for us ...you need to understand that I DO have a "dog in this fight."

If PITT goes DOWN...it reflects on us "PROGRESSIVES" ...so I'm trying to get where he was coming from ..PUMPING LEOPOLD!

He does need to answer this and calling DU'ers "Cretins," and worse.

Pitt maybe needs to understand that calling out folks "who supported him" as "Cretins" and saying he was the "Magic Man" does call into question his being a SPOKESPERSON FOR THE LEFT/PROGRESSIVES?

I always had "hopes" for him...

Here's how I see it:

1) Leopold posted some stuff. Some wanted to wait for confirmation. People who were TOO HOPEFUL went off the deep end (as usual). There was the usual not-so-polite horseshit that went on.

2) Pitt supported Leopold and got annoyed at the not-so-polite horseshit. Thus, venting ensued.

Honestly, I can understand why people paid attention to the story, but not why people got SO VESTED in the story like a bunch of big ol' DRAMA QUEENS.

People who have so much emotional energy to invest in these evanescent wisps of story don't have enough to do in real life, in my opinion. They need to get off their ass and go out there and walk their precinct for the Democrats and invest some real life time and energy on a campaign, instead of spending all their time on the internets getting the vapors over a story that may or may not be true. (( dons flamesuit ))

YOU think it's an "over-reaction." From Your Perspective.

But, many of us see "deeper issues here." Of FAITH AND TRUST and TRUTH!

I'm just trying to find a "meeting point" where we can find a "mid-point" of discussion.

Do you hear what I'm saying?

That's what I don't get. Here, I'm gonna tell you something super-secret but I can't tell you who told me. But trust me.

Uh, NO.

I don't care how much "cred" anyone has... anything with anonymous sources is worth taking with a big ol' grain of salt.

I see that people feel hurt but I don't get why. Seems to me anybody who's been on the internets for awhile should have learned that there's an awful lot of BS out there.

Should Pitt have posted what he did? oh no. Neither should Leopold have posted that story. But people who play "telephone" are going to get burned.

of salt."

Exactly--I expect corroboration from the biggies in the MSN and see no reason to expect less from OUR bloggers.

Why expect more from one of our bloggers than we do of Drudge?

Agree on all counts. :applause:

writing about. Is there a link so that I might be updated?

thanks

aA

was "Indicted" and the posts up to over "20" following Fitz's "Plan" for Rove? :shrug:

Hey...I don't want to confront you if you missed the "Jazz" over this...

But, do you read "DU FRONT PAGE?" :shrug:

2 stays in hospital. I've not been reading a lot. Sorry I asked.

aA

either. Jeeze it sucks ...but it save's lives... witness Tony Snow...

But it takes alot outta you...

a scope.

I spent a total of 17 days in hospital. the DU front page wasn't really a priority for me in the past weeks. Like I said. Sorry I asked.

aA

EVERYONE from age 45 SHOULD BE CHECKED. It isn't just "Family History" these days...it strikes much earlier.

But...this thread is about "Truth Out" and not my problems.

Really. Last time I dared to look it was on the 17th thread.

get better
everything else is unimportant.
go away
stop reading.
get better.

There's been a big kerfluffle about how true the "Rove's been indicted" story was on Trouthout, at least not in the way of corroboration from other sources. Will, once again, put his heart on the line about it.

I'm glad you are better now. :hug:

question in GD. :shrug:

thanks for a reasonable answer.

:hug:

aA

And I don't don't doubt his intentions.

But I think that sometimes he's still a little too impetuous; he hasn't had time to be refined in the crucible of heat as long as we have; to have the patience to see things come to fruition. And bless him, he's an intensely loyal friend too. Those are all good qualities to have, nay excellent. And with time, I have every confidence he will refine them.

As for Hunter, I don't think we can blame him. While I enjoy his writing, he never claimed to want to be anybody's role model. But his passionate adherence to the truth, ruthless searches for honesty, not just in those he interviewed but also in himself, frankly that will never go out of style. If it does, I myself might never type another word.

but the "Hounds of Hell Demons" haunt him. Just like it does many DU'ers.

And Will was the first to say to this "Newbie DU'er" that he didn't "ASK to be Annointed or CANONIZED" for what he posted." (My paraphrase...but I could go to Oldie DU Archives and dig the response out)

WILL never said to any DU'er...I WILL WORK AND BE A SAINT FOR YOU!

But, I and others DOGGED HIM to be the "SAINT" for "US."

How much are "WE" to blame for "Pitt Implosion" by giving him our "Adulation?"

How much PRESSURE do we PUT on our DEMS TO BE ROCK STARS or HERO'S for US?

And why do we pick folks that can't stand the PRESSURE?

:shrug:

WILL never said to any DU'er...I WILL WORK AND BE A SAINT FOR YOU!

But, I and others DOGGED HIM to be the "SAINT" for "US."

And sometimes readers here at DU have played into that drama, and he's reacted to it.

He's going to have to learn how to tell you all how to settle down if he wants to keep himself on an even keel about his work and keep his readership.

Note to Will if you happen to read this post: Sorry I'm talking about you like you're a 5th grader attention hog; but it's true. Love ya, but geez, quit feeding the monkeys, ya big Drama queen.

He's going to have to learn how to tell you all how to settle down if he wants to keep himself on an even keel about his work and keep his readership.

Pitt NEVER LISTENED to "others" who might have had some "wisdom." He NEVER LISTNED!

:shrug: Should he have "listened?" According to you..."NO!"

I differ. ??????

to know the difference. Does he have it yet? No. That's what I was getting at earlier.

To put it simply: He's still in his early 30s. You all over in GD are wanting him to be grizzled old Sy Hersh.

I'm saying Will's not there yet. Appreciate his enthusiasm; his passion, and his fluidity of thought. I do that too. But everybody makes mistakes, even the great ones. And he needs room to do that without that pressure you guys give him about always being the VOICE OF THE AMERICAN LEFT.

people thinking he's the voice of the american left, frankly.

Trashed it when it didn't suit him....

(Pitt) that he didn't expect or want to be "ANYBODY's ROLE MODEL." But what Pitt always failed to understand from those of us who questioned him was:

Pitt is NOT "Hunter Thompson" and should live in his OWN AGE and be a VOICE FOR HIS "OWN?"

Pitt never got that when I and Others tried to speak to him about this...:shrug:
===================
Your quote from Hunter Thompson about this:


As for Hunter, I don't think we can blame him. While I enjoy his writing, he never claimed to want to be anybody's role model. But his passionate adherence to the truth, ruthless searches for honesty, not just in those he interviewed but also in himself, frankly that will never go out of style. If it does, I myself might never type another word.

Will shouldn't be a "VOICE FOR HIS 'OWN?'" as you say, he should work at being HIS OWN VOICE. And I fail to see how anybody who admires HST could fail to miss that message.

edit: To elaborate further, you the audience can't really demand that a talented writer speak for you. To spend time thinking of what others would want you to say or do, immediately negates that which you would have created, your own authentic voice. All we can, and should do, is be an appreicative audicence and take away whatever we can from the creation when we individually interact with it. And pass him the occasional story idea. ;-).

:D...I'm trying to keep up.

and why did you lay your "REPUTATION" on the LINE and "Truth Out's" over this what to most DU'ers was a flawed and bogus article?

Why? All we want to know is WHY? And after that WHY DID YOU TRASH fellow DU'ers calling them "FUCKWITS/CRETINS/SHITDOGS?"

That was very hurtful. Many DU'ers are very angry over what you said and we SHOULD BE!!!

1) Leopold was lying and it's not true. In that case, he's trashed the rep of TO and WP in the process because they so vigorously defended him. Was that his intention? :shrug:


2) Leopold was correct. The report was extremely early. Everything could still turn out to be true and TO will look precient in retrospect.

Which is true? I don't think we know enough to know at this point. I'm saying, unless I hear otherwise, I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt.

And why put all this pressure on Will to have him be your spokesmodel? We DUers should be doing what we always do: read from multiple sources and try to suss out the truth as best we can.

many will never forget the "screen capture" of what he said to us. He thought we DU'ers were "Cretins" and worse.

It's hard to get beyond that since I don't know many DU'ers who would take that kind of "ABUSE" and not come back. :shrug:

I'm trying to move beyond this and give Pitt a break here for motivation...and it makes me wonder why I've bothered...:shrug: If you get what I'm saying, here. :eyes:

I'm sure he did. I stayed out of those threads for that reason. I didn't need to read every post like a traffic-accident zombie to get what was going down.

And no, if he used abusive language, I'm not defending that. Of course he should apologize. No question. But nutshell: you guys over in GD and Will, it's a wierd codependent relationship. Whether all of you want to work on it is up to you.

You could simply use ignore.

"you guys over in GD and Will, it's a wierd codependent relationship."

:yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :rofl:

IMO, Mr. Pitt vascillates back and forth between wanting to be "Will Pitt, Journalist" and wanting to be "just another poster" here on DU (viz. the posting under the influence). He can't have it both ways, bless him.

:D

You're right. You expressed it better than I did. :thumbsup:

at some point come here and explain some of it to us. But, it's good that we all "take a break" and examine our own motivations in our "Support or Lack Of" and figure out where we are.

Are we "GROUPIES" who will fight for Dems no matter what they DO OR SAY?

OR...will we stand for our PRINCIPLES and not be called out or trashed by "Egotist/Opportunists?"

The "Book" is still out on WRP!

I hope to hear from him...and I've tried to be fair to him, here.

I have to leave this now...but we DU'ers really need to discuss this and I hope that WRP does eventually show up and tell us "WHY" he got involved in this MESS!!!

:shrug:

The world is full of shades of gray.

How about this: Are we all adults who are human enough to recognize that we have failings too, and, while not unquestioningly accepting others, also being gracious and kind enough to cut some people some slack?

I'm not a Christian, but this has always had a ring of truth to me: "Or how can you tell your brother,'Brother, let me remove the speck of chaff that is in your eye,' when you yourself don't see the beam that is in your own eye?" --Luke 6:42

and what I was trying to post about. I guess it fell on deaf ears or was too obscure.. but..I tried...even if no one got it.

Peace....:-)'s ...

or a specific one. And screen capture? Was the post deleted or edited?

And who is a DUer? The following have been said to me at various times on DU by different DUers. So Pitt really did nothing that many or most other DUers have not done at various times, and I think it is generally accepted theory that some supposed DUers deserve abuse (i.e. the trolls and moles). Most DUers seem to have stories about when they were accused of some perfidity at various times. We get around it or make peace and also find alot of good information and/or friends here.


"That is such BS.

Boy. How pathetic. Such ignorance on DU makes my heart hurt.


Okie Dokie. Can't argue with THAT kind of supreme male "logic" so I won't even try... How fucking sad.....'


You'll detect a note of sarcasm in my post. I'm sorry, but you've given me nothing I can relate to. I just can't work up any tears right now.



I don't think you have a clue
And you sound like you've never worked in a bar either.

That's breathtakingly stupid



Why use english when you can use German like a good little Nazi?

Shut the fuck up. You have no clue about living in poverty. I'm done.

Really, you people are just full of it.

I still say you're full of shit and not telling the entire truth about your economic situation."

Ok, I agree with your point WRT Will Pitt, you are spot on there, but the fact that you have saved a collection of insults that folks have thrown at you over the years... let it go.... that's not good for you. :hug:

last Sunday and I don't find anything. I was online part of that day and I did not see any of the calling out/trashing that everyone speaks of. Do you have the screen capture? Is there a thread archived?

:thumbsup:

the article was posted last saturday, it said rove was already indicted and it would be made public in 24 hrs, then pitt altered the article to 24 "business" hours, already an ethically dubious thing to do, he said he was going out drinking, he came back and left a post calling us fuckwits

so we know two things -- that leopold lied to promote himself w. a bogus story and that pitt instead of apologizing when the lie became evident attacks the critical reader of the story

what more need we know?

perhaps pitt has come back and vowed to make changes in how he vets articles and writers, if so, good for him, but i have not seen it if he has so i can only judge him by what i did see

All these capital letters are effecting my eyesight.

:D

:shrug:

Check GD and look for "OFFICIAL TRUTHOUT / ROVE / LEOPOLD" threads. Like about 20 of em. LOL.

:-( I take it Will pulled a nutty when folks got cranky about the Leopold article?

And it's amazing how it can all be summarized in one sentence! :rofl:

too....if you want to pull it down to that.

One could say that about almost anything. It depends on the importance that "some folks" might put on the "nutty." :shrug:

i thought we were not allowed to call other DUers freepers but i guess he's special!

yeah, bitter much, i guess i am

Do you have the screen capture or link? You can PM me. Thanks.

how he moves forward and how TruthOut maintains itself.

through these very dark years before finding DU or before the downturn in Bush's poll numbers. I will continue to support them and read them no matter what comes of the Leopold article. I understand what you mean.

Discussions of this topic are happening here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

This is the link to the discussion. The link I previously posted didn't work. http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1241554