LOTR movie question: Gandalf the Grey

Having seen all of the LOTR movies, I have to wonder: if Gandalf is a wizard, how come we don't see him doing anything magical? Like shooting fireballs from his staff or changing people into newts? Even in the battle scenes it looks like he's fighting with a sword and his staff and no magic. Know this: I haven't read any of the books, so I know nothing of Gandalf as he's portrayed in the books.

You have to agree that his magic is mostly powerful against other magic, ala the fire beast (forgot the name) in FOTR which dragged him down the interior of the mountain. His fireworks rock. He smokes 'da pipeweed', he can summon the best horse of the land, banish spiritual control over kings from other wizards, etc.

While you're right in the sense that he doesn't kill everything standing in one sweep of his staff, the 'why doesn't Keanu nuke everything but his friends in the Matrix' argument still applies, because there would be no story.

in the third movie he used it a number of times.

But the LOTR "normal" wizards are not the powerful wizards as they are in other books, ie Harry Potter....

He made light in Moria and a couple of other places.

He and Saruman did the telekinetic thing for awhile.

He exorcised Saruman's possession of the King.

He blocked the Balrog of Morgoth on the bridge.

He summoned the eagles.

"He summoned the eagles."

In the books (both LotR and The Hobbit), nobody ever calls the Eagles for help; they have this habit of turning up when you need them. Gandalf just happens to be a friend of theirs.

At least, that's how it used to be.. :eyes:

Despite numerous claims that almost all fantasy literature ultimately derives from Lord of the Rings, Gandalf and Saruman (and the other Istari, presumably) are nothing like the archetypal "wizard". Their magic is mostly mental or spiritual in nature, and they're very subtle about it. Most of a Wizard's power derives from his ability to influence and lead others.

Tolkien didn't want Gandalf to be portrayed as a Magical wand-waving fix-it-all. Gandalf had an enormous amount of magic abilities, but he kept in the background to allow the other characters of the story to struggle and accomplish things on their own, rather than rescue them all the tim.

Notice they would cry for him on a regular basis, but he was "gone". Without assistance, they had to carry on as best they could. Then, at the last second he shows up to help them.

Peter Jackson wanted to capture Gandal's "humanness" too. Notice in the 1st film when Gandalf pays a visit to Bilbo, he bonks his head on the ceiling because he's so tall. This was a deliberate attempt to show that Gandalf was not an elevated, untouchable wizard, but a fallible, vulnerable wizard.

They don't really focus on the magical part of the wizards much which is alright. Why do Gandalf,Elrond and the other wizards use their magic as lttle as possible? The books don't really go into it much as I remember but when they do use their powers it's usually quite "terrible". It could be explained that using spells and magic is a rather energy draining experience (which many fantasy novels agree with) and that they are saving it for when it may truly be needed-which is what Gandalf usually does. Plus, he's a very old man and mayhap is channeling his magical strength into his physical fighting, he kicks ass on the battlefield

Some of you might really enjoy reading the Silmirillion as well as the Lord of the Rings...

Tolkien explains that Gandalf, Sauruman and Radaghast the Brown are not human at all, but Maia spirits, sent to middle earth. Tolkien explains that the Maia are forbidden from seeking to "awe" the people of middle eart with "feats of spectacle" and are instead instructed to influence and aid, but not to coercively dominate world affairs. This is why the "magic" of the wizards is subtle and influence, not gigantic and coercive - because they are forbidden to wield it like that.

Here is another excerpt from a good resource that may help you.


The Magic of Gandalf
Tolkien at no point defines what the limits of Gandalf's magic were. As a Maia, he had many natural abilities that would seem magical to mortal races, but he also had a great store of knowledge of more 'mechanical' magic, worked through spells and incantations, and especially through the agency of his staff. It is clear that he had far greater power, especially after his return as Gandalf the White, than he ever displayed in Middle-earth.

And some history from the same resource:

Arrival in Middle-earth, c. III 1000
The Wizards arrived in Middle-earth after the end of the first millennium of the Third Age. They were sent by the Valar to aid Elves and Men, but none knew this but Círdan the Shipwright, Lord of the Grey Havens where their ships put in. Though Saruman was at that time the acknowledged leader of the Wizards, Círdan saw that Gandalf was in fact the greater, and secretly gave him the Red Ring Narya to aid him in his quest.

Exploration of Middle-earth, c. III 1000 to III 2463
For almost 1,500 years, Gandalf wandered the northern and western regions of Middle-earth, learning of its lands and cultures. He was closest in friendship with the Elves, and especially Elrond, who had learned of his origins from Círdan.

The White Council, III 2463 to III 2953
At almost the same time as Gandalf had arrived in Middle-earth, a dark power had appeared in southern Mirkwood, at the evil place known as Dol Guldur. After a thousand years of his wanderings, Gandalf went there and drove the darkness into the east for a while. Soon it returned, and in 2463 (Third Age), the greatest among Wizards and Elves formed a White Council, with Gandalf as a prominent member, to counter the growing threat.

In 2850, he revisited Dol Guldur, to find that the power that held it had grown indeed during the eight hundred years since his last visit. He recognised the dark power now as Sauron returned, and escaped to inform the White Council. Before he escaped, though, he found Thráin II broken in the pits of Dol Guldur, and though Thráin died before Gandalf could help him, he did surrender a map and a key into the Wizard's keeping.

The Year III 2941
2941 was an important year for Gandalf. Not only did he take part in the White Council's expulsion of the Necromancer from Dol Guldur, but he also arranged for a party of Dwarves, accompanied by Bilbo Baggins, to travel to their ancient home of Erebor and free it from the dragon Smaug.

His magical powers seem to be particularly associated with fire, a fact that is perhaps related to the Ring of Fire, Narya, that he bore.

http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/g/gandalf.html

Yours,
Sel (who has read the books six times now) :)

Fellowship:

1) he ignited the fireworks with his mind while riding with Frodo...
2) he ignited the fireworks by creating flame with his staff at Bilbo's party...
3) he got to Bilbo's house before he did after he used the ring...
4) he darkened the room when Bilbo pissed him off...
5) he can read languages that many can't (i.e the language of Mordor)
6) he communicated with Sauraman with his mind...
7) the staff fight with Sauraman...
8) he talked to the moth....
9) in the added scenes version, he uses a spell to ward of Borimir's attempt to touch the ring at Elrond's secret meeting...
10) he tried (unsuccessfully) to counter Sauraman's weather spell...
11) he produced light with his staff and crystal...
12) he read the dwarven text...
13) he stopped the Balrog from crossing the bridge( a) blocked his flaming sword, b) put out a pulse of light that made the balrog hesitate)

Two Towers:

1) Fought and killed the balrog...
2) came back from death...
3) when meeting Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas in the forest, deflected the arrow and axe thrown at him and super heated Aragorn's sword...
4) talked in Sauraman's voice...
5) blinded them with his light....
6) called and communicated with Shadowfax....
7) released Theodin from the spell Sauraman had him...
8) sent out a light from his staff that causes pain to evil creatures during calvary charge at end of film...


I'll stop at this point so as not to seem too much of a geek....but it is apparent that Gandalf does have powers, but he isn't overt about it...it is more subtle....

that 'wizards' didn't start shooting 'fireballs' until Gary Gygax needed a fantasy representation of artillery.

Remember, "How about a little fire, Scarecrow?"......

necessarily mean magic. The word is derived from "wise".

Gandalf is one of the wise and is not human, as noted in the previous post.

Also, knowing languages such as the language of Mordor, Dwarvish, Elven, etc. is NOT magic, it's simply knowledge. I can read Spanish and some Hebrew, doesn't make me magic :).

I think one of the main reasons that Tolkien limited the use of magic by wizards was to reinforce the concept that power corrupts.