Have any prequel films not sucked?

I'd submit that Red Dragon wasn't bad, but beyond that I'm kind of stumped. Suggestions?

:-)

"My father's name was Antonio Andolini... and this is for you."

DeNiro was just perfect in that role.

Although most of the film, time-wise, was not a prequel, the prequel part of it was incredible.

Honestly, I'm not a big fan of the Godfather films, probably due in part to the inexcusable under-representation of the mafioso as a film-stereotype of Italian Americans, but that's just me! :evilgrin:

:applause:

That movie was fantastic.

One doesn't preclude the other IMO.

That novel was the first in the trilogy. Just because Silence, the movie, was made first doesn't negate the fact that Red Dragon was WRITTEN first, so not a prequel.

That's an excellent point!

was better than any of the rest of them.

But not so much a prequel as a relaunching of the character. Just like Burton's 1989 monstrosity wasn't a sequel to the 1966 film!

I say its more prequel because they hardly touched Batman's creation story, and Nolan had to go back and do the creation story the correct way...you had Batman, Batman Returns, Batman Forever, and Batman and Robin, then Batman Begins which goes back to the roots of the character(imo). But I do realize it had relaunching traits....

Batman Begins completely (and wisely!) gets rid of Burton's nonsensical The-Joker-created-The-Batman wrinkle and instead introduced the Joker off-camera in the final scenes. That alone is enough to quell any suspicions that it's a prequel. There is no continuity between the Keaton/Kilmer/Clooney films and the Bale film.


And thank goodness, I say--those four films are close to unwatchable!

there is no left overs from those films(previous 4), leaking into Batman Begins...bah, I tried!...:D BTW, the Joker creating Batman, killing his parents...that idea has been around for a while, actually(pre burton)....

There have been a few graphic novel stories, where the Joker did create the batman, by killing his parents, as well as other tangeants to the story line, but those were all else worlds, not in the Batman continuity line...but the idea has been out there for a while...and Burton took advantage of that angle and used it...although Burton pissed me off when he killed the Joker...the Joker, probably one of my top three fave villians....

On a side note, Manhunter was pretty damn good....Brian Cox, and Grissom from CSI did a good job(aka William Petersen)...

It's been a few years, but as I recall Frank Miller's 1986 The Dark Knight Returns is considered the first Elseworlds story, even if it wasn't sold that way at the time. I'm not aware of an Elseworlds between 1986 and Burton's 1989 film that contained a Joker-creates-Batman plot. But, like I said, it's been quite a while, so I could be forgetting any number of titles. My geekiness ain't what it used to be...

Are you perhaps thinking of Alan Moore's The Killing Joke, wherein the Joker shot Barbara Gordon, paralyzing her and planting the plot-seed by which she would later become the Oracle?

And Batman Begins is an excellent film IMO.

was a package of 4/5 Joker creation stories...I read it in 1990, and it was out for a while then...Else World stories, have been around forever man, they got a ton for Superman, with him having two personalites, one red, one blue...else words like "what if krypton didn't explode" back in the 50's/60's, the else world stories/or what if stories have been around for decades.....

But the Joker 4/5 story pack, I remember one, where he was an honest Joe, who's wife/child got killed in a freak accident, and he went ballistic, there was one almost to a tee, to waht Burton did in his Batman movie, except the Joker was a security guard, who fell into a vat, then became insane/Joker...

I can't recall the other stories...but I'll google surf, and see if I can find the titles....:D

It was the Killing Joke by Alan Moore

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman:_The_Killing_Joke

It came out in 1988, and was re-realeased last year, it came out one year before the release of Burtons Batman...boy, do I need to get this book...its hard to believe my memory chopped up the story, badly...but its been 17yrs since I read it.

Batman Returns was wonderful. Call the others tripe if you wish, but Returns was very thoughtful.

In addition to having the stink of Burton all over it, it's so poorly conceived that I can't believe that it was ever green-lighted. Michelle Pfeiffer's performance was good (and perhaps the only redeeming aspect of the film), but the rest was a garish and ineffectual swipe at wry campiness. Burton frequently tries and seldom (if ever) succeeds at evoking camp, but the best he can do is put unlikely costumed figures on-screen and hope that they can distract the audience long enough for the movie to end before anyone realizes what a lousy director Burton really is!

Okay, the scene when Keaton (a fine actor, by the way) places a rose at the site of his parents' death is mildly poignant, but it's lost in the swirl of ninja-clowns and armed penguins. Drek!

:rant:

I'm talking about the "duality" theme that was explored with Keaton & Pfeiffer. Burton was hired to make popcorn movies and he succeeded at going beyond that as much as he was allowed. Chris Nolan would not have been allowed to make the movie he did if the post-Burton movies hadn't stunk outright.

To be fair, Burton wouldn't have been permitted to make Batman if it weren't for the transformational success of Miller's Dark Knight (mentioned above) and Batman: Year One, which achieved a level of seriousness and respectability that Batman hadn't enjoyed in decades.

And honestly I think you go a little too far in praising Burton, who's had close to full creative autonomy for 17+ years and as a result inflicted Planet of the Apes and Charlie & the Chocolate Factory on us. Nope, at best he's a semi-proficient art designer who's had the benefit of good actors, a cult following, and lots of funding over the years.

But you're certainly right about the post-Burton films, which are so bad that they foster the illusion that Burton is reliably talented.

Reboot, in series fiction, means to discard all previous continuity in the series and start anew. Effectively, all previously-known history is declared by the writer to be null and void and the series starts over from the beginning.

Both films are quite good, however.

Studio execs won't know how to sell it without Reeves, Moss and Fishburne, so they just won't make it.

So far, at least 67% of the trilogy has been awful; the odds aren't in favor of a great prequel...

http://www.trekmovie.com/

I hope.

Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With Me

But in order for it not to have sucked, you admittedly kind of have to be a David Lynch fan...

Incidentally, I guess that I put Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom in the non-sucked category, but it wasn't really that great, either.

Prequels really -DO- almost always suck, don't they?
Fascinating.

Basically, it's about money. Studios don't often want to risk a profitable franchise on a brand-new slate of characters, so they produce a piece of crap into which younger versions of the bankable characters can be shoehorned. And obviously if a geriatric Obi-Wan dies on the Death Star, then young Obi-Wan is effectively indestructible, since we already know that he survives his youth.

The proper way to do a prequel IMO is too avoid the familiar faces as much as possible. Known historical plot elements can (must?) factor in, but if you have a new cast of characters, you're freed from the constraints of their known futures. That's why films about WWII can still be so effective; even though we know how it ends, we can still be drawn into caring about a character whose experiences are new to us.

Of course, although that's a more artistically gratifying way to go about it, I realize that it's still an uncertain wager unlikely to be underwritten by bottom-lining studio execs...

when she realized it was her dad....

Star Wars Episode 3 was awesome. 1 & 2 sucked though.

1 and 2 were like C-Span in space. #3 was all that was needed to prequel the first (1977) one.

I find most of them not terribly good, because George Lucas' dialogue is pretty corny, and because as a director he doesn't seem able to coax otherwise decent actors into (pardon the pun) stellar performances.

but I'm just drawn to episodes 4, 5, and 6 for some inexplicable reason. And I don't even like sci-fi. The closest I get to sci-fi outside of Star Wars is some sci-fi horror like Event Horizon.

I thought Phantom Menace was the best, followed by ROTS, and AOTC was worthless....but Qui Gon, and Darth Maul were great additions...

he was in it for 15 & 1/2 seconds.

they did him wrong in the movie...the whole fight at the end, he was kicking Obi Wan in the face, like a fool child....and then Obi Wan ends up killing Darth Maul, 1 vs 1? I was beyond pisssed.....Qui Gon, was awesome...best new thing in the prequels, IMO....:)

I remember, when Darth Maul busted out his double bladed lightsaber/staff weapon...I was like....HOLY Hamburgers! That was an awesome tweak on the weapon, imo. I was hoping they would make a lightsaber/pistol weapon for Mace Windu...like have a blaster as the handle part, so you could shoot energy blasts, while twirling your lightsaber around.....:)

Those waterfalls would have been deafening!

;-)

It's good to be the king!

Does that count?