If one of your kids was dating a loser would you try to break them up?

Or are you a firm believer that meddling would only drive them closer?

Or do you refuse to label anyone as a loser?

But I don't know any way of breaking someone up without driving them closer. It seems to be a strange human compulsion. ~sigh~

so conflicted because my mom NEVER told me who I could or couldn't date and I am really working on trying to loosen the apron strings with my daughter - but this guy...no, no, no.

about why/how we all evaluate people, and what I see that bothers me.

So, I guess I'd try to break them up.

How? I don't know. Check in in a decade when littlebooklover is 14...

her at 14 but I wouldn't allow her in cars with teens so that put an easy end to it...now he's back...

take them on vacation
have them go on an extended visit to a favorite aunt or uncle
send them to europe

keep redirecting their attentions...

NEVER say anything negative or derogatory about the loser

said he wanted a break and she said OK but then by the end of the night they decided they didn't. It was just sooo close and I was sooo disappointed I kind of let loose. :-(

you were distraught and not thinking clearly. it was not your intention, surely

Fifteen years ago, my mother would have called my new manfriend a loser. Not to my face, but her sentiment was crystal clear. For several years I tolerated the hints and suggestions that I seek therapy, and finally told her to cut it out.

Today she calls him her son-in-law and father of her only grandchild. She's lucky I met him.

It sucks that we have to see them in order to see our sisters but that's the way it is. Maybe one day they'll figure out that the reason we don't get together very often is because nobody can stand their husbands.

I am reluctant to label anyone a loser. And yes, I think trying to break them up would only drive them closer.

person. Of course, I'm a little biased, as my fiance called me a loser when she decided to break things off. Her father said "Fuck that loser" when he found out I had proposed to his daughter. I think I'm a decent, hardworking person, but I am not where I want to be at this point in my life. I call myself a loser a lot of the time out of frustration. But I think it's an ugly word that shouldn't be thrown around the way that it is.

"But I think it's an ugly word that shouldn't be thrown around the way that it is."

I think much of the time, the speaker is using the term to refer to someone who isn't well-off financially. Newsflash to these insensitive ostriches: life can turn on a dime.

I hated every minute of it (and thank you VERY MUCH to GoPsUx for being such a good friend and listener during some of the worst times).

There was nothing I (or anybody)could do.

I remember the hell you went through. I'm glad she wised up.

And I want to thank you for being there for me too. It helped a lot, and it meant a lot to me.

:hug:

In my experience, such meddling just drives the person to be more committed to the loser.

i wouldn't ever would get involved again, though.
It was a strange circumstance, and alot has changed since then.

changed the relationship with your offspring?

it's my business.

We were in a very strange circumstance at the time - our lives were literally turned upside-down for five years (not from whom he was dating) -- it's really too long to explain on a board, but now that all is
back to normal in our lives (what I call normal, anyway) -- I just wouldn't do it. I wouldn't have done it then either, if our entire situation wasn't so bizarre.

because ambition, or the lack thereof didn't matter at that point -- they were both too young to even consider that being an issue.
There were other reasons.

my middle son's live-in SO. I can't stand anything about her.

She wouldn't give us one minute to talk... mother to son and vice versa.

Kept hovering and hanging on his arm...literally. Nosey, imho.

He called me recently to talk and let me know he's thinking of... :scared:..*gulp* marriage.

I had to take a deep breath and say, "Oh, really? Anytime soon?"; as nonchalantly as I could!

He said he was 'just thinking about it.' I know he can do better. He's settling, imho.

I don't want to go to that wedding but I will, if it happens. :(

One of my sons has exactly the same sort of live-in girlfriend. It's heartbreaking, but what can you do?

I value free time over money. I know some guys that work had to make gobs of money. I dated the same girl for ten years. They bragged about fucking a different "bitch" every night. Motivated guys are just better at treating women like shit(if that is their style). YMMV.. Some Mormon missionaries just stopped by, I talked them into giving me a haircut if I listen to them while they do it. Bonus.

survive.

As I mentioned below, I meant ambition in the sense of getting a job not in climbing the corporate ladder.

:o

Then there are the bookish intellectual ambitious type guys...we hardly get a chance.

Motivation does not neccesserily equal assholeness, that's a whole gene unto itself.

since she's only 14 months :)

But, if she ever winds up dating a real loser, sure, I'll break him up! :evilgrin:

My father was not ambitious –he was keen just to do his job and was not interested in promotion to senior management. But yet he was a hard and dedicated worker and was quite well-liked and well-respected by many of his clients. He is also a devoted father, loving husband and a good person. Lack of ambition isn’t necessarily a bad thing –I look at the grubby backstabbing tactics of some of the people I know whose ambition overtook their sense of ethical propriety (at the expense of their clients) and I’m glad my father wasn’t like that

My maternal grandparents loved my father BTW. They always used to joke that if mum and dad got divorced, they'd keep my father

is a firefighter who has no interest in being a deputy or captain and I have no problem with that. I am 100% for people doing what they love, regardless of money.

I meant just the ambition to get a job.

On edit: Just to add, your dad sounds a lot like my husband, I'm sure you realize how fortunate you were :-). I truly appreciate the man my husband is (and yeah, I think my mom would pick him over me) and I would be happy to have my daughter date a man anything like her dad - this kid is not.

Major problems (any combination of): drugs, criminal behavior, violence, disrespecting you as the parent, influencing your child to go down a similar path.

It'll drive them closer. Kids have to live and learn. They're always smarter than you, remember? Kids never change.
Duckie

She might have already learned this one, had you let her date him earlier.

As long as he treats you, her parents, with respect that's what matters. The fact he's waited until she was of an age to be allowed to date him is a point in his favor, you know.

17 and into partying and she was way too easily influenced back then.

She'll learn from the experience. If you're right about him, and you're lucky, she'll learn sooner than later.

They're young. Really the most important thing is how he treats her.

you could be right that she needs to learn this on her own.

He had a good job, was a good earner.

He sat around on his ass, chain-smoked, and played video games while she waited on him hand and foot. Eventually she divorced him. The mixed blessing is I got a great nephew (and she, a son) out of the deal. And now she's back with an old boyfriend that we like quite well.

It would depend on the age of my child. And then it would depend on if I thought some kind of physical harm was occurring. Otherwise, I'd butt out.

the more they will stick together just to spite you.

It won't work, first of all. And it could drive them closer together. And it'll surely drive you further apart.

Kick 'em a few times to make sure they are dead, and then find a discreet body shop to repair your car. Or maybe just threaten it if he's not that big a loser.

I had two great grandmothers who were pretty good with the "If I see you again, I'll shoot you dead" approach, maybe put a bullet or two in the poor loser's car, and this, of course caused their daughters to sneak off and run far, far away with rotten scoundrels.

My great aunt's first husband was such a scoundrel, but he was also her ticket out of the house. She dumped him pretty quick when she saw what he was about, but she didn't go home again.

Her sister, my grandma, married the same sort of scoundrel, my grandpa, but he sorta straightened out after my great grandma threatened to kill him while he slept. He wasn't sure she wouldn't.

My mom never even met any of my dates until I was dating my wife. She would have scared off most of them I'm sure, but I guess I figured my wife didn't scare easy.

in a few minutes...;-)

I get your point. I just need to be patient and hope she snaps out of it.

and I'd need ages of the involved before I answered.

I was a loser once, and now I'm only KINDA a loser.

I think it's an ugly sentiment to express and it's way, way, overused x(

I've been on the receiving end quite a bit, both directly and indirectly.

I'd like to here what others here think of it.

There are people who, because of circumstance our of their control, are truly losers. For a whole bunch of reasons. And there are many more who, deep inside feel that, somehow, they are losers too. I think when they hear the word "loser" thrown about (by "winners") so carelessly, they must feel much the same hurt and dismay that black and gay people feel when the overhear the words "nigger" and "faggot".

It's a mean and ugly word. Much meaner and uglier than most realize. I just don't like it. If I had kids I'd tell them my thoughts on the matter and hope they'd see it the same. They could live perfectly happy lives without ever labeling another person a "loser".

since this one has nothing to do with a person who is involved in circumstances beyond their control. In fact, I would say that people who are in circumstances beyond their control cannot be losers.

and I apologize for cluttering up your thread. I did get off topic after my first response to your question. I only wanted to reply to those who commented on my response.

on edit: I doubt now that I will start a post on this. I can easily see it degenerate into a back and forth screaming match with no winners and everybody "losers" for having wasted their time. Flame wars are draining and usually futile. I'll leave that for someone with more skill and energy than I have.

Again, I do apologize for the seeming attempted hijacking of your thread. I mean that. If I were you, I'd probably think the same thing. It's just that I always try to acknowledge someone if they comment on something I've said. Seems to be the polite thing to do. Just as if we were all sitting at a table.

I feel confident defining a loser as someone who is not so much a victim to circumstance as one who has opportunities to rise above them, refuses them, and treats the people who offer those opportunities like shit.

is certainly deserving of a harsh description, perhaps even "loser". The problem, as I see it, is that most are not as accurate and specific as you. The guy unlucky in love is a "loser", the person without enough money is a "loser", the dork is a "loser", and on and on. I'm certainly not implying that you are so thoughtless, I think you know what a "loser" really is, but many don't, and are way to careless and casual in applying the label. In doing so, they broaden the category so the undeserving feel included with the deserving.

The argument concerning the term "trailer trash" would be little different than the one about "loser". Different, but not by much. It's another phrase I'd like to see disappear.

It can cut right to the heart in some. Even if it's not directed at them.

I don't know when it started, but the current way it's used has become a nasty, and unnecessary, part of the culture.

"I'm not going to say anything. They could always find somebody worse."

You see, she knew of several cases where the parents had pressured a son or daughter to break up a relationship they considered undesirable, and then the son or daughter went and found someone REALLY undesirable.

Sometimes people have to go through pain with people to learn what to avoid. It must be a powerless feeling to watch a child do that.

I think when a kid is down or has low esteeem that's when they gravitate toward the losers. Someone needs to remind them they deserve better in that situation. They might react badly, but I think the message will get through.

I don't have kids myself, but that's my .02.

If the 'loser' is just not academic or has a silly personality (i.e. emo), I think it's up to the kid to decide whether he or she can tolerate it.

However, if the 'loser' is a drug user, criminal, or disrespectful of my kid in any way (including academics, life goals, etc), I would completely meddle. At a minimum, I would want to understand what exactly this person is about and why my kid is drawn to that person.

leave them alone

one man's loser is another's winner, I suppose

But I'm really not all THAT bad. :D

Or so I think you said.

Are there serious chances of her marrying him? And be realistic here.

If not, let her wise up on her own. Chances are not high that this will end in marriage. And if it does, it's her mistake, not yours.

When my little sister got engaged to a real loser seven years ago, we all kept our mouths shut at my parents request. He was a drunk who just liked to party, had no education or desire to improve himself, and who once declared that "if you can remember a party, you didn't drink enough". Six years and two babies later, they were divorced. He never held a job longer than a month (no exaggeration, she added it up for the divorce papers and he'd held 47 different jobs in a 6 year period), he started hitting her when she finally started complaining about their lack of money, and he completely isolated her from the family.

Nowadays, she blames us for not saying anything. She admits that she was naive, and never considered what kind of future they would have...and none of us pointed it out to her.

we openly, and frequently, said "dump the asshole." Everytime I saw her when I was home from school, the first thing I said was "did you break up with adam yet?"

I guess it depends on whether or not they value your opinion. My sister knew that we were being honest, and she never got insulted or anything (and eventually dumped him). So, it might depend heavily on your relationship with your kid.

It's been more than 20 years, and she's still working on it. Her efforts haven't exactly endeared her to her daughter or for that matter her son-in-law.

Sometimes the best course is to let your child become an adult.