I yelled at a protester today...

When I stopped for a traffic signal some guy was picketing with an anti-choice sign outside a clinic which happened to have Obama signs in its windows. I yelled at him to mind his own damn business. I don't typically do that sort of thing; but I'm sick and tired of having to defend my right to choose. :grr:

I cant stand those abortion fundies.........:grr: :hi: :hug:

like a damned mosquito waiting to strike.

:thumbsup: :pals:


I once yelled out the window at the "fetus pic" people in front of a church, and I've stood right next to em, and read from "The War on Choice" when they came to my stomping grounds. It didn't do any good, but it made me feel better.

I'll have to get a copy. Thanks for the tip!

:hi:

Hooray for telling idiots that they're idiots.

Those things are so obnoxious!

And how people like them are destroying the earth, and I ended the note with a sarcastic "The environment thanks you for your conscientous choice in vehicles."

I always want to say something to them. They piss me off.

I figure the angry note is a more constructive outlet.

impress me as being the sort of people who don't think twice about throwing rocks at people.

I used to go down and hassle the anti-choice protesters at planned parenthood. Now I just hassle them online.

:rofl:

From what I heard, more civilians recently were killed. More innocents slaughtered in a quest to find a mythical person (as if you can find someone by dropping bombs on villages...):(

"GET A JOB!!!!!!"

I always hear that when I am protesting...

:applause:

There was a guy that would drive by regularly and yell that out his window at us as he sped by...

Pathetic wimp he was, could not even get out of his vehicle, or say it while stopped at the light next to us, only while driving away...

It's perfect!!!

I may go back there tomorrow...

it is the thing to yell apparently.

But likely he was a total asshole! ;-)

Maybe he was trying for one of the jeebus brotherhoods... :D

Shit for Brains University.

I believe that was courtesy of George Carlin. :rofl:

:spray::rofl:

They were protesting one clinic and I was driving by. I just happened to throw my half-filled diet coke out the window and, my oh my it happened to hit one of the poor little protesters in the head.

I shouldn't litter.

diet coke right about now. :evilgrin:

It's one thing to view abortion as this desperate-situations-call-for-desperate-means thing. But to use a very sterile, casual word like 'choice' doesn't sit too well with me. And before you peg me as a xian fundie or something to that effect, understand that I am not staying awake all night worrying about aborted babies. I think aborted babies are eternal; they have souls. And in the realm of killing, I find it far more reprehensible to kill a toddler or infant than a fetus. Having said that, I do believe that there is too much selfishness in the world. People who procreate and then, when they sow a seed and don't want to reap what they have sown, simply try and get rid of it. And I find that very callous (at least those who seem to feel so gung-ho about it). A choice is whether to get the California roll or fried rice; this is a child. And the whole "it's my body and I can do what I want with my body" argument doesn't hold water, either. You can't decide to kill someone with YOUR BODY because you don't want to deal with them anymore. Just because you are allowed to be a vessel for another's body doesn't give you the right to annihilate it because it's convenient. And I don't want to have that rape or incest argument. I know someone who was the product of rape and is a bright light in the world. Sometimes good things come from evil conditions.

:popcorn:

RL

the more lower the post count..

And I suppose you are freaking Einstein, then? The longer one sits at a computer and yammers away, the larger the intellect.

Okay, then...whatever...(And of course you didn't bother to actually respond to my post. I guess insults are the only way to go when one has been pwned to the max...)

As long as white, christian,gop,bush supporting, daughters get knocked up by their black boyfriends..abortion will always be legal.

*No one really has the right to use their body any way they choose (you can't punch someone who pisses you off and use that argument, for example)

*The man should have some say in the pregnancy, even if he doesn't carry the baby (and I am a woman saying this!). How many women act as if the man has no right whatsoever?

*At the very least, describe abortion as something that is a very complicated, agonizing decision. Don't just act like it's a choice between vanilla and mocha.

*No one really has the right to use their body any way they choose (you can't punch someone who pisses you off and use that argument, for example)


This is an apples to oranges comparison. Punching someone is no where near carrying a pregnancy to completion. Do you have any idea what pregnancy does to a womans body? What if I was raped? By my husband? You wanna force me to carry the baby to term because YOU can't handle it? I should have that RIGHT to make my own medical choices about my own body. PERIOD.

*The man should have some say in the pregnancy, even if he doesn't carry the baby (and I am a woman saying this!). How many women act as if the man has no right whatsoever?


Are you actually saying that Men in general have no choice when it comes to pregnancy? Do you have some data to back that up? What's that percentage? My husband was very supportive and KNEW what we had to do, we made that decision together. Please, back up your claims.

*At the very least, describe abortion as something that is a very complicated, agonizing decision. Don't just act like it's a choice between vanilla and mocha.


This has got to be the dumbest part of your post. I'd like it shown where anyone said it was NOT and agonizing decision. Back it up. Provide your links between vanilla and mocha. It is an agonizing decision! No one said it wasn't. Where are you getting your info?

I await your fantastic claims. Lay it on me.

1) Are you against all abortion, except rape and incest? Of course not. So don't even go there. And for the record, whatever pregnancy does to a woman's body, it is what it is. You either believe in the pattern of life or that we live in a random, chaotic universe. I happen to believe the former.

2)I don't know the stats on men and abortion, but I have been appalled by the mentality of some women. I have heard of women who believe that the man has NO rights because he doesn't have to go through all the changes during pregnancy, give birth...

3) The word 'choice' itself is devoid of feeling. At least they should put on their little posters "agonizing choice" but then that would be too dramatic, I 'spose.

That you speak of? Where are your stats? :eyes:

Basically, you have no PROOF that these things are happening, it's just your opinion.

Your opinion is fine, but it has no affect on me and my body.

Pretty much comes down to you have a belief system that dosen't cosexist with mine. I don't really care what you think of my body. Keep you hands out of my utereus... is that hard?

if you keep your hands off your embryo/fetus, 'kay?

You do realize how patronizing and insulting it is to keep calling people "hon", don't you?

What, are you Flo on some kind of meth-fueled unholy crusade to make life as colloquially miserable and tritely cliche as possible?

a term of endearment, now is it?

What would seem trite (and rather insulting, for those who reside in rural areas), is the lumping in of Christianity, intolerance, and meth addiction. As someone who has lived in a suburban/urban area my whole life, I can tell you that drug addiction is EVERYWHERE and I care not whether it's some hick from the sticks on meth or a too-cool-for-the-room city person doing coke.

(Psst! We also have intolerant fundie xians in the big ole city, too!)

I made no mention of rural or urban.

All invented in your head.

Conversation is more fun when both sides are listening and responding to what is actually said, instead of when it's only me doing that.

Learn to read.

And my use of 'twit' was not intended to be a term of endearment, you patronizing fool.

Goodnight, my pet. You have nothing. Slap another pro-abortion sticker on your Volvo (or vulva, if you prefer). I'm outta here.

I'm sorry. Maybe I should tone it down for you, come at you at your own level.

I'm curious, though, at your own inherent bigotry - why did you immediately assume "rural person" when you read the word "meth" and the word "Flo".

I find it curious that you immediately had vision of small, unpopulated, rural areas.

You might want to look into that prejudice you are carrying around.

and for the record, you sound rather patronizing and full of your alledged intellect. Toodles!

I go the honorable route of being honest and direct, instead of hiding behind platitudes and coward shitwords like "hon" and "toots".

Do you kiss your partner with that mouth?

Bigot.

Fucking hilarious.

pro-choice? That's right...like 'beef,' instead of 'dead cow.'

Got. the. memo. Sparky.

silly.

Just sayin'...

Tombstoned.

They have a choice in the type of woman they sleep with. If you want a woman to have "your" baby and she doesn't want to, that's it. Game over. You chose wrong, sucka.

"You either believe in the pattern of life or that we live in a random, chaotic universe. I happen to believe the former."

OK, so what about people who believe in the latter? They have to do what you say because it is what you say?

Your main argument seems to be that:

a) Because you believe abortion is wrong (because you believe fetuses have souls), abortion is, therefore wrong; and
b) Oh yeah, if a is not good enough, then let us recall that men should make decisions about how women should live their lives (and let us feel sorry for them if they cannot have full control); and
c) You don't like the word "choice."

OK, so all we have to deal with is item a because b and c are not really valid (I shouldn't be able to legally prevent--and in fact I cannot legally prevent--my boyfriend from having a tumor or an inflamed appendix removed. Likewise, he should not and legally cannot determine my medical and surgical decisions. I'll ask him for help and advice if I want to, but he cannot legally restrain me from acting.).

So, as to (a): If someone else does believe that life is random, or that we don't have souls, or that we do have souls but those souls don't enter us until birth, or that souls or no souls, abortion is not a sin or a crime, or any other variant that would explain their disagreement with you, then the rest of your argument falls apart. No one who is pro-choice is forcing you or yours to have an abortion. they just want to be sure the option is there in the case of emergencies.

Don't want an abortion? Don't get one.

Don't want other people to get an abortion? You should use your powers of persuasion to talk 15 year-olds into ruining their lives and giving up their dreams of college and scholarships. I wish you all the luck in that endeavor.

However, what is not productive is to post on DU about how intolerant you are of pro-choice people. That's sort of against the point of liberty and freedom and all that stuff we're supposed to believe in.

:D

because rape victims babies can be good wonderful people when they grow up, it isn't ok for someone traumatized by rape to have an abortion.

I mean, the logic is infallible! ;)

2.....5? please post how my kids you have adopted.

I also fully support care for children OUTSIDE the womb. See, I am truly pro-life: I am a vedge, anti-war person (BOTH wars, for the record), anti-abortion, and anti-death penalty. So all the money going to both wars should be used to give out free Depo shots for those who cannot/will not take responsibility for their sexuality, as well as support state-of-the-art homes for those without parents. Adoption has become more popular these days, which is fortunate.

Bwah!

Whoo!

Mind your own damn business about what women choose to do with their own bodies.

that your body affects other bodies? And in any case, I am not out there with signs like those people who protest. It doesn't affect me but it offends the hell out of me that there are so many people who act like it's no big deal or something. So all these young women who have sex and don't really think ahead are told that it's a mere 'procedure.' I know two people who have lived with the aftermath of abortions and it wasn't that easy. At the very least it should be described as a little more complicated than a simple "choice." I mean, the man who participates in the pregnancy is often treated as not an equal partner, when he also should have some say in the matter.

And who the fuck acts like an abortion is no big deal? Nobody does, because it is surgery, it's expensive, and the recovery sucks. Anyhow, most of the people who have them aren't some stereotypical young women, they're adult women who generally already have kids and can't afford more. Also, the most common emotion described by women after abortion is relief, there's no "aftermath" for the vast majority of women, except if they are unfortunate enough to be guilted about the situation by fundamentalist nutjobs (who are the only source of this "post-abortion syndrome" bullshit.

So read something from a legitimate source, stop spouting right-wing anti-woman talking points, and mind your own fucking business.

and the woman I refer to is not of that fundie ilk in the least. She would fit in quite nicely here; she could be a regular for all I know. She just has her sensitivity chip; she actually cares about more than the 'sucky recovery' and 'expense.' Yikes!

Your damn right it's MY body and I'll be damned if someone is gonna tell me what to do with it. PERIOD.

That logic doesn't fly, hon. And it's not about someone telling you what to do. It's about looking inside yourself and seeing what is right or not. I never was indoctrinated with abortion being a sin. I even grew up when abortion was legal, but I never wanted to be in the position of having to even make such a choice and I believe it's because I knew that it's not okay to just get rid of something because it is inconvenient for you. Life is precious.

Something turned my stomach years ago. I was talking to someone whose wife was pregnant and he stated that if he found out that the kid had Downs, he'd abort it. Now some people may feel justified in that, but that is such a slippery slope (by the way, his child was born with another disability). Downs children contribute to our world in many ways; they touch our lives. I don't want a world where everyone is hybridized or whatever you call this insane way of looking at who is valuable.

Well, slightly. What's that thing where teeth and hair grow inside moles? That is some creepy shit, I had a nightmare about that once.

Do they all have teeth and hair or just some?


*I don't believe in god.

"Now, you are family. Okay. All my life, I had a lump at the back of my neck, right here. Always, a lump. Then I started menopause and the lump got bigger from the "hormonees." It started to grow. So I go to the doctor, and he did the bio... the b... the... the bios... the... b... the "bobopsy." Inside the lump he found teeth and a spinal cord. Yes. Inside the lump was my twin."

Good one, LM! :spray:

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

The logic is lacking. And as I said, I am not passionate about the abortion issue, although I did vote for Kucinich in the 2004 primary after hearing that he was REALLY pro-life: vegan, anti-abortion, against war, and against the death penalty. Everyone else is just a wannabe.

I feel sorry that so many young women are led down the primrose path believing that abortion is just a quick way of getting rid of a "problem." As I stated, I know a woman who had an abortion at a young age and after having two kids, she became more sensitized to what it really means to get pregnant and raise children. She wonders about that unborn entity...Do I look down on her for what she did? Of course not! I don't see women who have abortions as murderers! Murder implies malice and if there is anything that I can say about it, I would describe it as either insensitive, unaware, careless...

As I said above, you seem to have swallowed a lot of right wing horseshit about who has abortions and why. Most women seeking abortion are mature and parous, they know what pregnancy and motherhood are about, and are making an informed decision not to have (another) child at that time.

He USED to be anti-abortion. Thank you.

I don't care what you think about MY body.

You can make your own decisions and I'll make mine.

go ahead? :shrug:

Some people have called it a parasite; that doesn't bother me too much. But it is still a separate entity.

It is akin to that mentality I abhor in that tired phrase of some parents: "I brought you into the world and I can take you out!" The child is basically regarded as an extention of the parent; a piece of property that can be exterminated if it doesn't reflect the parent's attitudes. UGH!

It's a zygote.

Definition

noun, plural: zygotes

A cell in diploid state following fertilization or union of haploid male sex cell (e.g. sperm) and haploid female sex cell (e.g. ovum).


Supplement

To be precise, zygote is the term used to refer to the cell as a result of the fusion of two haploid nuclei during fertilization until the first cleavage. When the zygote starts to divide and multiply, it is called an embryo.


Word origin: from Greek zugōtos ‘joined’, from zugoun ‘to join’.

Related forms: zygotic (adjective).

http://www.biology-online.org/dictionary/Zygote

And 'parasite' is used to justify abortion. The argument is that an entity that is dependent upon another (host) in such a way as the embryo, is not really separate. It's interesting, but I believe in the existence of the soul, so any living entity will automatically have one.

:rofl:

So what is it supposed to be? Christian?


:rofl:

I ain't Christian honey.

and thinkin' might even be anti-Godly like and such as, so just turn that brain off and join the Creationists makin' America all Jesusy and such as.

It's a zygote, or later, a fetus.

Go to hell, or FreeRepublic. Same thing.

Asshat

RL

but you really ain't got much here in this conversation.

You have basically resorted to your opinion which dosen't mean jack shit to most of us here.

Just sayin.

I am always suspect of that...sounds like someone out of ammo to me...

In any case, if you have a different opinion, then fine! I think it's healthy for DUers to be diverse in thought, though. Too much agreement doesn't allow for much pondering of various issues.

You're wrong.

and an idiot.

RL

...and that's great. There's nothing sadder than a bunch of sheep who simply go along with some sermon they've heard.

Still, it's your opinion...it's your business.

It's not right to inflict your beliefs on others...not even your belief that it should be an agonizing decision.

And stop passing on this myth that it's just a trip to the beach or something? I mean, what's good for the goose...

You're reading way more into these posts than actually exists.

Please tell me who has said that abortion is swell? Who said it's a trip to the beach?

Take a deep breath... :hug:

Now that I know it's you, I can rest much more easily.

At least, if you think that's the right thing to do. You're the one whose life experiences are normative, not me!

Please, enlighten us further, O Normative One.

not mine.

My choice is my business; not yours.

Yes, there is too much selfishness and callousness in the world; and there are probably people who choose to abort or not abort a fetus for reasons I might consider selfish or callous. But that is neither my business nor yours.

as some great way out. At the very least, there should be talk about the pitfalls of the decision. That isn't what is going on out there very often. It's PRO-CHOICE in big letters, as if abortion is almost celebrated or something. I am not interested about making it illegal; it's between the woman, man, and Creator (and news flash: whether or not you believe in something, doesn't make it real or not). I just cannot stand the sterile, shoulder-shrug mentality of some pro-abortion types.

but no one is "pro-abortion"...No one WANTS to go go out and have an abortion, people make CHOICES about their bodies and have control over their OWN medical care.

Is this just too confusing for you?

it doesn't sound very sensitive to me. Sounds pretty self-centered. The appropriate demeanor, in my humble opinion, is to be very reluctantly in favor of it and totally agonized (and not just regarding what it does to YOU, but how it may affect the soul encased in the embryo or fetus). I mean, just to CONSIDER that it might not be something that is correct, especially when there are so many people who are aching to become parents and cannot.

So I suppose we're even.

Though we really aren't, because I will win.

And, seriously, what the hell is "whether or not you believe in something, doesn't make it real or not" supposed to mean? Your logic and Reader's Digest-level of English use would be hilarious, if it wasn't so illustrative of the casual disregard the majority of Americans - especially anti-abortionists and other fuckall rightwing Christian Zealots (who aren't very Christian) - show for our common language, even while loudly braying in their tinny, nasally, unrefined voices about how "furners" should "larn" that language that the brayers so willingly run through the barbed wire of neglect every time they open their filthy, God-insulting pieholes.

don't you, Toots? For the record, I was born into a LIBERAL Christian sect (never, ever heard about abortion, burning eternally in hell, or that other faiths were wrong). Now I find myself more in the Eastern Thought corner. So don't lump all people who believe in the existence of the soul as intolerant.

Sweet Jesus, you are a clueless joke.

(p.s. - learn to read)

...all of them.

I believe my tax dollars should be spent allowing them to make the decision they choose, whether I personally believe it's best for them or not.

I would be doing stuff like you did all the time, if those a-holes were around here.

I felt a little rude afterward; but it seemed like he needed to hear from the MYOB set.

Some fundie Catholics regularly protest outside of GBMC (Greater Baltimore Medical Center) with placards of dismembered babies. Ick. It makes me mad because I think they are judging people they don't even know. :hug:

...accuse and condemn others when they can't face their own selves and decisions they've made in their own lives.

Nothing bugs them more than people who don't feel like shit about themselves.

illegal is that it is not going to stop women from getting abortions. I prefer that if a woman has an abortion, that it is in sterile environment like a hospital or clinic than in someone's basement. Making it illegal is just going to move abortions from the clinic to the basement, again.

Sadly, that's what some people would like.

My feeling is that abortion should not be prosecuted as a crime, yet not upheld as a viable option (whether one feels this way or not). It's like drugs: don't make them a crime, yet don't sell them everywhere or advertise them (even the legal ones!). Create a red light district away from all of us and sell drugs, poontang, and alcohol/cigs, and maybe abort fetuses, if you have no problems with it.

That worked so well for the Third Reich.

Fucking Christ, you are disgusting.

It's apples and oranges, again. ("poontang" refers to prostitution, right?)

and not supported by public dollars. Wouldn't people rather see tax money used for free birth control than abortions?

And are YOU against the war in Afghanistan, that is killing innocents? Now THAT is disgusting...

"Not supported by tax dollars" = let the poor live in their own shit.

1: a quarter of a city in which Jews were formerly required to live
2: a quarter of a city in which members of a minority group live especially because of social, legal, or economic pressure
3 a: an isolated group <a geriatric ghetto> b: a situation that resembles a ghetto especially in conferring inferior status or limiting opportunity <the pink-collar ghetto>

Under 3 (a or b), your proposed "red-light district" could be a ghetto of sorts. Get your creative juices flowing. Don't be so literal.

Cheers!

get my meaning. I don't think it should be segregated at all. I think there actually should be advertisements, too. People need to know what's out there so they can make an informed decision.

And please know I wasn't intending to target my comments to you. Your conversation appears to me to be reasonable, thoughtful, and not in need of assistance from Merriam-Webster so far as I can tell. Hi!

:hi: :bounce: :hi:

:hi:

:blush:

with REAL doctors, I'm okay with it, for the most part. But there should be some way to get the word out, so women know there are SAFE abortions out there and not try to "do it themselves" with a knitting needle.

but I deplore the mentality that kind of pushes it as a political issue and gives young, confused, scared women the idea that it's not something particularly difficult, except for how it hits your pocketbook and affects your body (nothing about psychological/emotional concerns). I am actually quoting a remark on here tonight. Thanks for your thoughtful restraint. Bottle it. It's rare as gold on here right now...

It is difficult, but at least you don't want to make it illegal. You already know what I think about that...

is that you actually ACKNOWLEDGE what I wrote. The "others" blow it off and just bitch about the fact that I disagree with some of their ideas.

I am sure that you already know that.

is that you actually ACKNOWLEDGE what I wrote. The "others" blow it off and just bitch about the fact that I disagree with some of their ideas.

You don't want to stop it, you just want to make it too expensive for most to afford by denying funding, and you want to limit peoples understanding and knowledge of it because you somehow think it's being explained as something simple.

Less than six months ago, I went with a friend to an abortion clinic. Actually, it's just the Womens Hospital at the St. B, they also deliver babies and stuff. And they council you, provide you with information, and explain any risks and possible aftermath. However, I don't see how you can say it's wrong to explain it from the perspective that I see it done from (Which is, it's your choice, you have other options, choose birth control first) but somehow think it's ok to basically try to scare the crap out of people about it. Because, guess what, accidents happen. The pill isn't always effective. Condoms break. Women are sexually assaulted and raped.

I do not know a single, solitary woman who views abortion as birth control, and I live in a country where it is 100% free to every woman who lives here. I don't know how you get in to these peoples minds, but frankly, the way the law works, it doesn't matter WHY they are doing it. The fact is, there are reasons that are considered legally acceptable to make it available. You can't make it available to some and not to all. That's wrong, and goes against the law, and is discriminatory and unfair.

I think it's just as wrong to want to make it difficult, scary and financially unavailable as it is to call for making it illegal.

Each person deals with their emotional reactions to ANYTHING in their own way, and there is no right or wrong way to feel. These women are dealing with the emotional stress of an unwanted pregnancy already, I don't understand why people should try to force on them this notion that abortion scars you for life or something. That has nothing to do with the fact that it should be available, affordable and safe. How you think they should or will feel does not enter in to the picture. I have never seen an ad campaign or heard someone speaking professionally to women about abortion that has made it sound like another method of birth control, or something that is simple and fun, or is like picking an ice cream flavour. But I also appreciate that they don't try to scare the shit out of these girls and women.

So there. What you think people should feel has nothing to do with the issue. You, of course, can have your opinion, but your opinion really doesn't enter in to the meat of the issue.

"somehow think it's ok to basically try to scare the crap out of people about it. Because, guess what, accidents happen. The pill isn't always effective. Condoms break. Women are sexually assaulted and raped."

Most of the time the situation is already scary, as you have said. I think that abortions should be "guilt-free" and as safe as possible.

You have no clue.

in order to receive an abortion?

Hi everybody! :hi:

So what's the Buddhist blessing?

mothers pay tribute to their aborted child's memory at the shrine? It's not a guilt trip, it's just a way to cope with the situation.

I never heard of that before.

Works every time.

If so, what does it mean?

You did fine. I understand completely.

I chastize myself later on sometimes, because I know some of them are very emotionally invested in their protest.

It was an impulsive thing to do; but my mind was just screaming "Mind your own damn business!" and I reacted to the impulse.

It's not always a good thing to do; but I'm not sorry I said it.

signed,

late to the party

:rofl:

rolling down hill ;)

avalanche :o

Yelling out the car window at someone protesting something? My mother-in-law used to do this when the Detroit Newspaper workers went on strike{She's a repub obviously} I asked her at the time "Do you really think you changed any hearts and minds by doing that...or do you think you just made their resolve stronger to go the other way?"

:hi: